Stereo Integrity HT-18-D4... Infinite Baffle...How Much "Safe" Power Per Driver ? - Page 3 - AVS Forum
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post #61 of 80 Old 03-22-2014, 12:52 PM
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Originally Posted by TinnEars View Post

If you're wondering why I installed 30 amp plugs everywhere it's because I don't like weak links. For instance, I like oil-filled space heaters for their efficiency but they can draw 18 amps at 110 volts and I'm uncomfortable being that close to max load on any circuit. I don't use hair dryers but if anyone does use one they can also draw up to 18 amps. Lastly, I prefer to use portable induction cook tops and portable roaster ovens vs. full-sized ranges so those sockets/circuits must supply safe 18 amp power. To me... that's really 30 amp capable from breaker to socket.


I can appreciate the overkill, and choke point concerns, really. However, the socket, or receptacle, isn't the weak point with regard to ampacity.


The receptacles are good for much more current than their rating. The ratings are for cross compatibility safety issues,... so one can't plug a high current draw appliance into a circuit that could over heat and cause personal injury or property damage.

Again, a standard 120v 20a branch circuit, with a 20a receptacle, can pass huge amounts of current*, by design. Typical weak leaks, if exposed to high currents for extended periods, are connection points. connections such as mechanical lugs, wire nut joints, screw connections at the receptacle, these are where issues typically arise.

I often suggest and am an advocate for the up-sizing of the actual wiring, so voltage drop is rendered a non-issue. But the 20a receptacle, as long as the connections are tight, etc., isn't the choke point impeding higher currents, that many think it is.

Thanks
Just trying to help, all the best



*
~60amps for about 10secs, ~30-40amps for as long as 30secs

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post #62 of 80 Old 03-22-2014, 02:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by FOH View Post

I can appreciate the overkill, and choke point concerns, really. However, the socket, or receptacle, isn't the weak point with regard to ampacity.


The receptacles are good for much more current than their rating. The ratings are for cross compatibility safety issues,... so one can't plug a high current draw appliance into a circuit that could over heat and cause personal injury or property damage.

Again, a standard 120v 20a branch circuit, with a 20a receptacle, can pass huge amounts of current*, by design. Typical weak leaks, if exposed to high currents for extended periods, are connection points. connections such as mechanical lugs, wire nut joints, screw connections at the receptacle, these are where issues typically arise.

I often suggest and am an advocate for the up-sizing of the actual wiring, so voltage drop is rendered a non-issue. But the 20a receptacle, as long as the connections are tight, etc., isn't the choke point impeding higher currents, that many think it is. Honestly, a bigger concern is the line coming to the house.biggrin.gif

Thanks
Just trying to help, all the best



*
~60amps for about 10secs, ~30-40amps for as long as 30secs

I appreciate your comments and I know you're right technically. I'm just jaded by failures of old cheap 20a sockets that eventually need replacement so I went with 30a industrial grade. Much of my wiring is 12 AWG but some is 10 AWG where I wanted more overkill. All the small ductless A/C units (none larger than 12K BTU) are wired 8 AWG at 220v and the longest run is less than 50 feet. Voltage drop will be very minimal on any circuit here.
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post #63 of 80 Old 03-22-2014, 04:07 PM
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I understand

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Active 16.8kw, 7.3 system
(3)Seaton Cat12C up front, (4)QSC K8 sides/rears
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post #64 of 80 Old 03-23-2014, 06:48 AM
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Well if you might need a hand just let me know I am in San Antonio and I pass through floresville like every other day for work. If i could help I don't mind just pm and will set something up.
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post #65 of 80 Old 03-23-2014, 07:36 AM - Thread Starter
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Well if you might need a hand just let me know I am in San Antonio and I pass through floresville like every other day for work. If i could help I don't mind just pm and will set something up.

Wow... what a generous offer. I don't like taking advantage but, when the time comes to do the install, I can pay for the help. I can't do much these days so I'd have to pay for the install anyway.smile.gif
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post #66 of 80 Old 03-23-2014, 08:39 AM
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Don't worry I don't mind helping fellow people with fellow interests just let me know and if I am off I will help as much as I can.
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post #67 of 80 Old 03-23-2014, 11:01 AM - Thread Starter
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Don't worry I don't mind helping fellow people with fellow interests just let me know and if I am off I will help as much as I can.

Thank you but I'd insist on paying for your time. It'll be a few weeks before I can put any more money into this but it'll happen soon. I'll need to buy the materials first but I wonder if I should wait until you see the building.....
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post #68 of 80 Old 03-23-2014, 12:50 PM
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are these subs any good or just cheap

xmax is large and FS low etc, but do the subs sound any good and are they reliable?

 

i'm thinking of buying some, (2) or the 15"s but there are so many other good subs and pro audio bass speakers for not that much more

so is very hard to decide

 

and has anyone had any experience or heard the JL Fathoms and Gotham's how do they compare with those

im not looking for insane bass, just nice bass, with some QSC amps

 

any advice would be appreciated,

thanks

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post #69 of 80 Old 03-23-2014, 02:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by WR1325 View Post

are these subs any good or just cheap
xmax is large and FS low etc, but do the subs sound any good and are they reliable?

i'm thinking of buying some, (2) or the 15"s but there are so many other good subs and pro audio bass speakers for not that much more
so is very hard to decide

and has anyone had any experience or heard the JL Fathoms and Gotham's how do they compare with those
im not looking for insane bass, just nice bass, with some QSC amps

any advice would be appreciated,
thanks

Stereo Integrity has stopped production of these drivers. However, all I've read indicates these are quite good. I'm no expert but from what I understand pro audio drivers are usually not the best for home audio.
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post #70 of 80 Old 03-23-2014, 02:00 PM - Thread Starter
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* double post *
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post #71 of 80 Old 03-24-2014, 08:05 PM - Thread Starter
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I received a belated email reply from Stereo Integrity. The sender states that their HT-18-D4 will handle 600 watts from 20 Hz up in IB configuration. How does this translate to 10 Hz? About half that... or 300 watts? Even if that's correct would that be pushing them too close to catastrophic failure?
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post #72 of 80 Old 03-24-2014, 09:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TinnEars View Post

I received a belated email reply from Stereo Integrity. The sender states that their HT-18-D4 will handle 600 watts from 20 Hz up in IB configuration. How does this translate to 10 Hz? About half that... or 300 watts? Even if that's correct would that be pushing them too close to catastrophic failure?

Winisd shows the driver at 42mm excursion at 10 Hz with 500 watts in an infinite baffle. The xmech is stated at 43mm, so you will be very close to bottoming the driver at that level. Sub 10 Hz content could put it past its limits with 500 watts. At 500 watts it is at 23mm at 20 Hz so already 1mm past xmax. 150 watts is enough to push it to xmax at 10 Hz. That is per driver. If you want to keep distortion to a minimum then you probably want to keep it under 200 watts per driver. Just like overkill on the amplifier, it is probably best to not push the drivers to their limits for the best sound.
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post #73 of 80 Old 03-24-2014, 09:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TinnEars View Post

I received a belated email reply from Stereo Integrity. The sender states that their HT-18-D4 will handle 600 watts from 20 Hz up in IB configuration. How does this translate to 10 Hz? About half that... or 300 watts? Even if that's correct would that be pushing them too close to catastrophic failure?

a subsonic / high pass filter is often recommended

alternately a high power amp, can keep a speaker under control

possibly doubling the power to the sub (or any sub)

but don't blame me if you blow it up

 

i tried a few car DVC subs last wk in the house that were only rated at 300w and another 750w with a 2K Yamaha P7000

and they had no problem, in fact hardly moved and could easily of taken more so the extra power must have some effect

but the P7000 may have an inbuilt sub filter not sure, some amps do

 

its commonly said its easier to blow subs or any speaker with less power than more, but depends how ruthless folks are

and how much low bass they are playing, most music wont be that low, but some movies and test tones will be

 

i agree about the pro audio, it seems harder to find good pro audio speakers that are n't 130db and made for concerts

the Voids are ok - but better for folded Horns and the Precision devices also, but seem a bit hard sounding

originally i was going to buy some CW folded horns or a Looney bin or two, but they are just too loud

so is back to car type subs, and SI's possibly seem to fit the bill, its just a pity they are n't rated at 1000w

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post #74 of 80 Old 03-24-2014, 10:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Excellent... smile.gif As has been suggested several times I'll set the iNuke amp power limit to 200 watts per driver. I didn't intend to express any doubts. That email from SI just threw me off a bit.
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post #75 of 80 Old 03-25-2014, 12:05 AM
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Originally Posted by TinnEars View Post

I appreciate your comments and I know you're right technically. I'm just jaded by failures of old cheap 20a sockets that eventually need replacement so I went with 30a industrial grade. Much of my wiring is 12 AWG but some is 10 AWG where I wanted more overkill. All the small ductless A/C units (none larger than 12K BTU) are wired 8 AWG at 220v and the longest run is less than 50 feet. Voltage drop will be very minimal on any circuit here.

Why not just use something like this. Think of it as a capacitor like we used to run in our car systems but for home.

Class D amps running on battery backup power.

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post #76 of 80 Old 03-25-2014, 10:47 AM - Thread Starter
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Why not just use something like this. Think of it as a capacitor like we used to run in our car systems but for home.

Class D amps running on battery backup power.

(video link removed)

I wonder if that guy measured the voltage drop at the amp inputs. Did he measure the continuous and peak current usage?
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post #77 of 80 Old 03-25-2014, 07:12 PM
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Running two Inuke 6000s under full load on one apc and yanks the power cord. eek.gif

That's as brown out as it gets. Output voltage stayed rock steady at 119v to120v. This guy is no brainiac but the demonstration intrigued me enough to look further into this model apc. I was curious if it was smooth power and wouldn't damage my equipment. Sure enough it does produce sin-wave alternating current. Most don't. That's as far as I looked into this friend. smile.gif
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post #78 of 80 Old 03-26-2014, 06:55 AM - Thread Starter
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I would've thought a good sized vehicle battery would be needed to provide that much power. Hmm...
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post #79 of 80 Old 03-26-2014, 07:57 PM
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Originally Posted by The Red Baron View Post

Running two Inuke 6000s under full load on one apc and yanks the power cord. eek.gif

That's as brown out as it gets. Output voltage stayed rock steady at 119v to120v
For how long? Battery power via inverter for high powered amps is a large and expensive folly.
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post #80 of 80 Old 03-26-2014, 08:06 PM
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The meter jumps from 40 to 20-25 minutes then stables out at 20ish. This is not for running for long periods by any means. I looked at it to stabilize volts and amps during peak power demands.
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