How does everyone measure their DIY builds and ensure they did it right, and they are perfect ? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 44 Old 05-27-2014, 01:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Advice ? Is there a sticky or thread that explains the total process for a noob ?

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post #2 of 44 Old 05-27-2014, 01:57 PM
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Rew.
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post #3 of 44 Old 05-27-2014, 01:57 PM
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I'd tell you but you're yelling at me.
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post #4 of 44 Old 05-27-2014, 02:11 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tuxedocivic View Post

I'd tell you but you're yelling at me.

Sorry biggrin.gif how's that ?

I was doing some excel sheets with all caps. wink.gif My bad smile.gif

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post #5 of 44 Old 05-27-2014, 02:30 PM
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Ha, no problem.

What are you trying to measure? Sub or speaker?
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post #6 of 44 Old 05-27-2014, 03:57 PM - Thread Starter
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Speaker

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post #7 of 44 Old 05-27-2014, 04:38 PM
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If you can go outside, then put the speaker on a 8' ladder well away from the house. Do a sweep in REW (or what ever program you like). Done.

If you can't, then place the speaker on the floor of the biggest room in the house. Keep it as far from walls as possible. Couches too. Put the mic on the floor 3ft away. Tip the speaker forward such that the tweeter is on axis with the microphone. Set the winow/gate at 5ms in your measurement program like REW. Take a sweep in REW (or what ever program you like). Now, the response will be high in the low end and sensitivity will be off. But to confirm the speaker is working/ hooked up right, this doesn't matter.

Now that you have your sweep, you could post it here and get comments. But you'll know something isn't quite right if there is a big null at the XO, or there's a sensitivity mismatch between the tweeter and woofer. Then you know something is up. Any odd peaks or dips greater than 5db above 400hz should also be considered.

Another excellent step is to measure the impedance, but not many people have this capability.

Good luck.
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post #8 of 44 Old 05-27-2014, 06:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post

Advice ? Is there a sticky or thread that explains the total process for a noob ?
To get a standard half-space result with a full range cab take it outside well away from buildings. Take a ground plane (the mic an inch off the ground) measurement from 2 meters or more distance. That gives you half-space below the baffle step frequency. Put the cab on its back, suspend the mic the same distance as before above the cab. That gives you the half-space result above the baffle step frequency. When you superimpose the two plots you'll see where they intersect in the lower midrange. Splice the two at that frequency for a full range half space result. With a sub just do ground plane, as the baffle step frequency will be above the nominal 100Hz bandwidth.

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post #9 of 44 Old 05-27-2014, 07:20 PM
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That seems overkill for a rookie just looking to confirm his wiring.
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post #10 of 44 Old 05-27-2014, 07:28 PM
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Yes. I use Bill or tux's methodology depending upon the design. I've also done some on my 2nd story verandah, speaker facing out and mic on an outrigger, so no boundaries for 15m out and about 12m to the ground. The new mains are too tall to do on the verandah so I'll do them in the yard.
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post #11 of 44 Old 05-28-2014, 02:17 AM
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The Audyssey 2EQ in an Onkyo 717 will indicate if a speaker is wired out of phase.

This video demonstrates how to test for phase using a 9v battery. I used it with the battery touching the binding posts, so I could see if the phase was correct all the way through the cross over.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIMHGkxw72o

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post #12 of 44 Old 05-28-2014, 08:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tuxedocivic View Post

If you can go outside, then put the speaker on a 8' ladder well away from the house. Do a sweep in REW (or what ever program you like). Done.

If you can't, then place the speaker on the floor of the biggest room in the house. Keep it as far from walls as possible. Couches too. Put the mic on the floor 3ft away. Tip the speaker forward such that the tweeter is on axis with the microphone. Set the winow/gate at 5ms in your measurement program like REW. Take a sweep in REW (or what ever program you like). Now, the response will be high in the low end and sensitivity will be off. But to confirm the speaker is working/ hooked up right, this doesn't matter.

Now that you have your sweep, you could post it here and get comments. But you'll know something isn't quite right if there is a big null at the XO, or there's a sensitivity mismatch between the tweeter and woofer. Then you know something is up. Any odd peaks or dips greater than 5db above 400hz should also be considered.

Another excellent step is to measure the impedance, but not many people have this capability.

Good luck.


This will work I can go outside and do the ladder thing smile.gif

I just need to learn REW and get a proper mic I guess.

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post #13 of 44 Old 05-28-2014, 08:36 AM
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I've wondered about this as well. One of the nagging concerns I have about DIY is making a wiring mistake and never knowing the difference.
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post #14 of 44 Old 05-28-2014, 08:46 AM
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Originally Posted by J_P_A View Post

I've wondered about this as well. One of the nagging concerns I have about DIY is making a wiring mistake and never knowing the difference.
If you're serious enough about your sound to be building your own you should be serious enough about it to have measuring tools. With the abundance of freeware and a USB mic coming in at $100 or so there's really no excuse not to.
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post #15 of 44 Old 05-28-2014, 09:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Fitzmaurice View Post

If you're serious enough about your sound to be building your own you should be serious enough about it to have measuring tools. With the abundance of freeware and a USB mic coming in at $100 or so there's really no excuse not to.

No argument there. My only concern is not knowing everything at the beginning. I'm afraid I will measure my speakers, but have errors either in my speaker connections, my measurement setup, or in my measurement interpretation because I'm still learning. The last of those can be handled by simply posting my results here and asking for help. The other two I'm still concerned could cause problems that will be more difficult to uncover.

Learning is part of the fun, and I'm certainly planning to build, measure (I have a calibrated mic, already), tweak, verify, etc. But I have concerns none the less.

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post #16 of 44 Old 05-28-2014, 12:10 PM
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With a little caution in regards to connecting your amp to a shorted load and driving a tweeter with no high pass, you're safe. The rest of it is more subtle and can be worked out posting here and comparing to the designer's measurements. You won't be able to have opposing faults that accidentally result in linear response, so real problems will be evident.
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post #17 of 44 Old 05-28-2014, 06:33 PM
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I just started making measurements myself and am learning by doing, so far I have only done in room measurements and am satisfied with the results. If you built a crossover that someone else designed have some one else double check your wiring or post pics with the schematic. But if they sound good to you, just enjoy
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post #18 of 44 Old 07-22-2014, 10:13 AM - Thread Starter
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I'm still a little nooby at understand REW. Is there a good tips and cheats list or thread?

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post #19 of 44 Old 07-22-2014, 10:45 AM
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Here's an easy guide to follow. The basics of REW is really not that difficult. https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...101%20v3.7.pdf


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post #20 of 44 Old 07-22-2014, 11:51 AM
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Here's an easy guide to follow. The basics of REW is really not that difficult. https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...101%20v3.7.pdf
what is a good mic for testing? Also will the mic work for both speakers and sub testing?
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post #21 of 44 Old 07-22-2014, 11:56 AM
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what is a good mic for testing? Also will the mic work for both speakers and sub testing?
Dayton UMM-6 or miniDSP umik. Works for both speaker and sub measurements.


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post #22 of 44 Old 07-22-2014, 04:33 PM
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IMO the hardest part of rew was getting the asio driver to send multichannel sound to the avr. It took quite a bit of tinkering with the PC sound settings and relaunching rew to get it to stick. Other than that, if you can operate this forum rew will be simple.
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post #23 of 44 Old 07-22-2014, 05:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samps View Post
IMO the hardest part of rew was getting the asio driver to send multichannel sound to the avr. It took quite a bit of tinkering with the PC sound settings and relaunching rew to get it to stick. Other than that, if you can operate this forum rew will be simple.
You get the sub today ?
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post #24 of 44 Old 07-22-2014, 05:28 PM
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Dayton UMM-6 or miniDSP umik. Works for both speaker and sub measurements.
umik1 from csl, imo


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post #25 of 44 Old 07-22-2014, 05:40 PM
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You get the sub today ?
Tracking says tomorrow. Hoping my wife stays home to sign for it. I'll keep you updated.


I Agree on the umik1. Hooked it up and worked straight out of the box with the cal file on a flash drive.

Wish it had a longer cord though. Finding long hdmi cables is tough. I'd rather use a 6 foot hdmi and a long USB.
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post #26 of 44 Old 07-22-2014, 05:57 PM
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Not too long ago I had similar cabling/positioning issues.
Kbarnes suggested that up to a 10' extension on the usb cable for the mike was acceptable.
problem solved.
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post #27 of 44 Old 07-22-2014, 07:37 PM
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How does the role of a calibrated sound level meter such as the Galaxy Audio CM-140 differ from the role of a calibrated microphone such as the MiniDSP UMIK-1 for testing speakers and rooms? I'm ready to take the next step and improve my measurement skills and purchase the right tools for the job.

Mike
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post #28 of 44 Old 07-22-2014, 08:01 PM
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How does the role of a calibrated sound level meter such as the Galaxy Audio CM-140 differ from the role of a calibrated microphone such as the MiniDSP UMIK-1 for testing speakers and rooms? I'm ready to take the next step and improve my measurement skills and purchase the right tools for the job.

Mike
something like umik1 doesn't need to go through audio interfaces which may have rolloff or other issues. Also, very simple to setup and work with.


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post #29 of 44 Old 07-22-2014, 08:16 PM
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So if I get a CSL-calibrated miniDSP UMIK-1 microphone, I won't need a sound level meter?
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post #30 of 44 Old 07-22-2014, 08:46 PM
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So if I get a CSL-calibrated miniDSP UMIK-1 microphone, I won't need a sound level meter?
If you want the spl levels to be accurate, yes, you'll need an spl meter to calibrate the level. The other solution is to get an omnimic kit.


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