DIY: Build the SumpSub Ported Passive Subwoofer - Page 3 - AVS Forum
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post #61 of 79 Old 06-03-2014, 06:44 PM
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Originally Posted by iontyre View Post

For some reason, that picture of the four of them causes me to keep thinking the phrase 'Exterminate!" in my head... Just add a plunger sticking out the front and you got some nice functional Doctor Who props for a themed theater space!


Honestly, you should feature them and have different themes.  Have some friends over for a theme movie, Star Wars, Dr. Who, and dress them accordingly.  Would they make a good Cousin It with some long hair and a hat?

 

 

 

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post #62 of 79 Old 06-04-2014, 11:50 AM
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It seems very clear to me that you are either not married or have one of the coolest spouses ever. Nice job...
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post #63 of 79 Old 06-05-2014, 10:23 AM
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Not really sure if this is kosher, but if some of you are looking for good drivers for this project at a reasonable price, I'm trying to unload some here http://www.avsforum.com/t/1534582/boston-acoustics-12-subwoofer-drivers

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post #64 of 79 Old 06-05-2014, 02:26 PM
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Newbie question: How are you powering this? Do you need something special? All I have is a receiver. So I assume I'd need a separate amp for it.

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post #65 of 79 Old 06-05-2014, 02:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xanadu376 View Post
 

Newbie question: How are you powering this? Do you need something special? All I have is a receiver. So I assume I'd need a separate amp for it.

 

Yes it is a passive sub design with no built-in crossover, therefor it requires an external amp. I use a Crown XTi-2002.


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post #66 of 79 Old 06-05-2014, 03:28 PM
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Originally Posted by imagic View Post

Regarding resonance, here's RTA of a 16Hz sine wave playing through four SumpSubs, from my main listening position...

little late here, but might want to use hann windowing.
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post #67 of 79 Old 06-05-2014, 03:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post

Regarding resonance, here's RTA of a 16Hz sine wave playing through four SumpSubs, from my main listening position...

little late here, but might want to use hann windowing.

 

The learning process continues... thank you.


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post #68 of 79 Old 06-05-2014, 03:39 PM
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The learning process continues... thank you.

np, just gives you a flatter output. You'll see immediately when you toggle.
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post #69 of 79 Old 06-05-2014, 05:41 PM
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Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post

i'm kind of surprised by your comment ds-21. maybe the resonances that you were picking up were not the port, but internal standing waves.

Doubtful. i've never built or been involved with a sub that wasn't properly damped. At the time it was fiberglass (polyfill, as Ken Kantor showed, isn't worth much) but today I use Ultratouch because it works about as well and doesn't make me itch.
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ithere are countless folks running subs with port resonances in the range that you say would be a "fail" and i can't recall even a single instance of anybody identifying it as a problem.

I've personally heard it in a several instances. I've also heard it go away with the same driver, same cabinet size, and PRs instead of a port.
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maybe the issue is a combination effect where you won't want the subwoofer tuned low AND playing in the passband where the first port resonance is?

Or just avoid the issue altogether by either staying sealed or using passive radiators.

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post #70 of 79 Old 06-06-2014, 08:28 AM
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passive radiators? is that like a driver but not hooked up? I think I saww that some where but can not remember where.
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post #71 of 79 Old 06-06-2014, 09:03 AM
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passive radiators? is that like a driver but not hooked up? I think I saww that some where but can not remember where.

Same as a driver, minus the voice coil and magnet assembly. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Passive_radiator_(speaker)

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post #72 of 79 Old 06-06-2014, 09:13 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cw5billwade View Post

passive radiators? is that like a driver but not hooked up? I think I saww that some where but can not remember where.

Same as a driver, minus the voice coil and magnet assembly. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Passive_radiator_(speaker)

 

...and usually tuneable by adding/removing weights...


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post #73 of 79 Old 06-08-2014, 10:19 AM
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Originally Posted by DS-21 View Post

Really cool idea, Mark!

Four points:

1) One mistake people often make in simulations is not including the effect of vent resonances. Large vent resonances an octave or two above the sub's nominal passband are an issue with EBS (or, as sometimes referred to in forums, "LLT") alignments, and they are IMO very deleterious. (For music, at least. For movies one can probably get away with an EBS alignment.) If the software you use isn't sophisticated enough to simulate vent resonances, I'd recommend using the tried and true (and free) Unibox sheets for MS Excel. (As an aside, the lack of such resonances is a big reason why subs in EBS alignments generally sound better when tuned with passive radiators instead of ports. PR's don't help here, because where would they go? Also, good - long throw, high Qm - passive radiators are expensive.)

2) I'd highly recommend any new builders ditch the binding posts and use a better speaker connector. The Neutrik SpeakOn is simply superior to consumer-style binding posts in every single way: they're sealed, positive-locking, quick disconnect, insulated, etc. And...they're generally cheaper than binding posts and bananas, too! Available at any pro audio shop, Parts Express, Amazon, etc.

3) Your comment about "boxy" sound from cube subs is without basis in reality. If a small cube sub sounds boxy, that is probably because it has too high a Q. The shape of the sub has basically no impact on its performance. Obviously, in any loudspeaker one will want to damp the internal reflections with foam as you did here, or recycled denim insulation (my preference), fiberglass insulation (the most effective, but a pain to use), etc.

4) One should be aware that horizontal mounting (or even storage!) significantly shortens the lifespan of a driver. I've seen Klippel measurements of drivers that have been used horizontally for a long time. The compliance curves look very different from the same drivers new. In a sealed sub, that's not a huge issue. The upper bass with get a little more plummy (higher Q) and the overall output limits will lower over time. But in a vented sub, that means the cabinet will likely be mistuned if it is used for a long time. So if possible, if one is using SumpSubs, Sono-subs, etc. behind a screen, it's better to lay them down than stand them up.

My goal is to someday understand what in the heck all the above means. And oddly enough my friends call me the electronics/home theater wizard...

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post #74 of 79 Old 06-10-2014, 02:07 PM
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User name change..... iMagic to iMacGyver biggrin.gif

Interesting project. Love the ingenuity....would be nervous about the WAF.

Great reference!

 

I was thinking along the same lines... The MacGyverSub


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post #75 of 79 Old 06-17-2014, 06:16 AM
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I am curious if there is a way to take this well documented DIY, thanks for the infor, to have the sub inside of the box to be buried for outside application to add some oomph to my pool music. This is the first DIY I have seen that uses materials for the enclosure that would actually work. Thoughts, can this build be adjusted to somehow put the sub in the enclosure?
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post #76 of 79 Old 06-17-2014, 03:56 PM
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I am curious if there is a way to take this well documented DIY, thanks for the infor, to have the sub inside of the box to be buried for outside application to add some oomph to my pool music. This is the first DIY I have seen that uses materials for the enclosure that would actually work. Thoughts, can this build be adjusted to somehow put the sub in the enclosure?
There is the compound/band pass design that puts the speaker inside the enclosure.

Also I've seen Transmission Line (aka Boss Wave {no they didn't invent it}) designs that also put the speaker inside rather than outside in a kind of compound/band pass design combined with a Transmission Line design.

Back when I was DIYing my own speakers Old Colony Sound Labs had a publication called Speaker Builder which was a great resource. What has replaced that?

Another great resource I used was the Loudspeaker Design Cookbook, not sure it it's as well regarded as it was but I don't consider most any resource all encompassing so...it's still around on Amazon.

Cheers
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post #77 of 79 Old 06-21-2014, 05:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Augerhandle View Post
Quote:Originally Posted by TMcG 

User name change..... iMagic to iMacGyver

Interesting project. Love the ingenuity....would be nervous about the WAF.

Great reference!
 
I was thinking along the same lines... The MacGyverSub
If WAF is an issue, it's a perfect excuse to pitch an acoustically-transparent front projector screen rig!

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post #78 of 79 Old 06-21-2014, 05:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dsully444 View Post
I am curious if there is a way to take this well documented DIY, thanks for the infor, to have the sub inside of the box to be buried for outside application to add some oomph to my pool music. This is the first DIY I have seen that uses materials for the enclosure that would actually work. Thoughts, can this build be adjusted to somehow put the sub in the enclosure?
I'm curious too, I'll look into it. It would have to be some kind of bandpass/T-line sub design, as @dnoonie mentioned. The main challenge is finding a plastic disc that fits between the two halves.

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post #79 of 79 Old 06-23-2014, 11:31 AM
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This just came up on my side bar adds on this forum, http://www.amazon.com/dp/B004MUFHUM/...5f97aba2c9cbda

I was looking for some inexpensive plastic that might work but the ad 'bots found it before I could, go figure.

If I understand your dimensions correctly....The .118 24" x 24" is $20, .236 24"x24" is $30. Not too bad but it requires cutting. I've free hand cut quit a few speakers spacers from MDF with a jig saw, towards the end I got a nice circle cutting device, now they have great circle cutting devices (jigs with holders and everything) that attach to a hand drill.

This is not as simple as finding something already the right shape. Sometimes it works best to just wander through the hardware store, or maybe the sump pump industry has some handy shapes to help out...How about a basin cover, http://www.sumppumpsdirect.com/pumps...in-covers.html, http://www.sumppumpsdirect.com/TOPP-C18WPE/p13769.html, I'd have to look at it. If you're lucky it could bolt through both basins with the basin cover in the middle.

Cheers

Last edited by dnoonie; 06-23-2014 at 04:44 PM.
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