Ceiling mounted surround speakers are coming, (I think). So what is the collective wisdom of this group on the lowest possible profile DIY speaker we can hang up there and get the benefit of the Atmos system? Not someting we can recess but something we can hang from our double 5/8 drywall ceilings without cutting holes to leak the sound.
So it's on it's way to HT Big? Glad to hear this as I've been saying for over a year that this needed to make its way to our homes. Large rooms will benefit greatly I assume. This will be so close to 4D!
Ready for a follow Big installing Atmos thread then I guess?
I am guessing that for home use, it will require two ceiling mounted speakers. I have a pair of JBL Pro 8340's sitting, waiting for this or use them as front height speakers. I am hoping that I can do Atmos with a standard 9.1 system, plus two ceiling mounted speakers.
I don't understand the Atmos or ceiling speakers purpose enough to even understand if a directional speaker like a waveguide with a focused dispersion pattern would work better or worse than something like a coaxial.
I'd guess a coaxial with a MDF backer box might fit the bill, but I think you are looking for a more advanced answer. I'm "in" for answer too.
I don't understand the Atmos or ceiling speakers purpose enough to even understand if a directional speaker like a waveguide with a focused dispersion pattern would work better or worse than something like a coaxial.
Same as for any speaker location, CD (controlled directivity) speakers toed in appropriately to take advantage of time/intensity trading will give more even coverage.
When Sdurani and fookoo2010 stopped to listen to "SUBMAXIMUS" last thrusday, one part of the discussion turned to exactly that topic and the ensuing wetdream for me was to add 2 mid- sides and 4 on the ceiling. its only 8 feet so a low profile/wide dispersion only makes sense.
Discuss!
there is a great 7 minute video on the DOLBY site you will want to watch
In this interview with Willfried Van Baelen (Auro 3D inventor), he says that for a home theater the overhead channels aren't necessary (starting at 14:02).
Well certainly a tall ceiling would help in this situation I believe. 9ft or 10ft. 8ft ceilings put the listers to close, causing uneven coverage unless this is a small HT with only a few seats. But I know you do a lot of big theatres with multiple rows. My mind immediately races to coaxials, for the same reason it often does for surrounds. But perhaps in the 8" rather than 10 or 12" sizes. I also immediately think of a heavy duty dome tweeter that can cross over to a 5" Peerless woofer at 1500hz if smoother response is desired. Something good in a 15L sealed box. And the box, that's the key to this whole thing I think. The box shape would be very shallow. And would have a baffle not much larger than the driver. Then it would have sloping sides at maybe 20 degrees that extend down (up) to the ceiling. This would allow the response to be quite free of diffraction, and also lack any baffle step issues (half space). The final dimensions would line up with joist spacing if fortunate enough. Difficult to construct certainly. The SPL goals are 6db lower than most are used to, so this is nice. And with the lack of baffle step losses and short listening distance, SPL certainly wouldn't be the focus. The focus is uniform and wide coverage.
Think desktop speaker goals with a little higher SPL requirement than that.
My first thought was an 8" as well. The main problem will be the height like you mentioned and even some of us that have high ceilings don't have that luxury in the back rows where the risers are higher off the floor. A stepped ceiling would have been a nice addition to many of our theaters in hindsight lol.
At the very moment I am considering purchasing eight Volt10's from Erich. Although there is supposedly an upgraded one in the works, or a better one. I'm not sure.
The Volt's sound fantastic as is. I know there will be more expensive models at some point, and to each their own, but for me the Volt 10's will be incredible surround speakers. I've been using them as mains for a month or so now until I can build my 1099 LCR's.
If you have the ceiling height, I think the Volt 8's or 10's would be killer.
I just used some of the JTR low profile 8 inch coaxial speakers for surrounds in a project. They are only 7 inches deep. The Volts are 9 1/2 deep, So how about a slimmed down version of the Volts or it's successor as a DIY alternative. Width is not an issue it is the depth for a ceiling intall. Flat pack please.
Ah yeah those a lil smaller than the Volt10. Not sure about the 8's. There is a slanted version available and that will have a slightly narrower depth but it is an angle so there's that. Maybe just build the regular version and take that sucker to a band saw. I guess it could be modified in that way though. That's a pretty affordable option. Or just straight up DIY the cab and buy the kit with no flatpack.
Btw, I definitely want to meet up with you at CEDIA if you are going.
Seems like Dolby is keeping a pretty tight lid kn Atmos info until CEDIA. I am waiting to see what it will require from ceiling mounted speakers. The Volt's or a modified Beyma like Beastaudio uses should have potential.
I think there's an inductor out of stock on the V-10 that Parts Express will have in this week.
MTG90 and I had discussed putting the V-8 in a shallow box which wouldn't be any problem at all. Getting a 14" x 14" baffle for that model is easy. The box would barely be worth flat packing because it's just a 6.25" deep box at 14" x 14" before the baffle. Could be done though.
But it sounds like we should be looking for the 6.5" coaxials. There was a design done quite a while ago for one of those but the designer and I weren't 100% sure what we were going to do with it.
I heard them in my living room and they sounded great. Plenty loud enough even for surround sound in larger rooms. The only problem was that it was quite a bit more than the Volt models, which is why we weren't sure if the DIY guys would want to spend more for a smaller model.
Double DW should hold a speaker's weight no sweat. Just pick a speaker that isn't too heavy. That is the easy part IMO. I think hiding the wire or snaking it, and preserving your sound proofing is more the challenge.
I just used some of the JTR low profile 8 inch coaxial speakers for surrounds in a project. They are only 7 inches deep. The Volts are 9 1/2 deep, So how about a slimmed down version of the Volts or it's successor as a DIY alternative. Width is not an issue it is the depth for a ceiling intall. Flat pack please.
Being a neo magnet driver, and a true performer that continues to impress me, even with the STOCK crossover, the Beyma 8" coaxial would be an incredible option for this. You get a lightweight, very slim depth driver that you could easily stick just about anywhere easily Custom crossover shouldn't be too much longer and will really make it shine Pretty good lookin driver too if you ask me.
Shading is used to widen the vertical coverage and I think for the great majority of rooms this wouldn't be a problem. These can be scaled depending on how much output is needed. I have 4" drivers with either 3/4" or 1" domes that I've combined and also a new ribbon tweeter that could be used.
my first flash for a "low profile" ceiling arrangement was a Fusion 4 quad 4 from DIY soundgroup, it states a depth of about 8 1/4 inches, not too much unlike a line array, along the line of some of the SLA over at the BF website . .just thinking out loud
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