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post #31 of 68 Old 07-30-2014, 08:28 AM
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PL premium or Wood glue. PL premium is just heavy duty construction adhesive. You put it on both surfaces that you want to bond, spread it with a glue brush smooth. It takes 24 hours to cure, but it's stronger than wood glue, seals gaps better, and has a longer working time making it ideal for fixing mistakes or adjusting, screwing and drilling, etc...

Tightbond II is great too, but it's working time is short. So you would dry fit, (no glue) drill then apply the glue and screw, you only have about 5-10 minutes to get it done before glue working time is over and starts to cure. You want it set before that for maximum strength of the bond. You can add a little water to the glue to extend the working time, or use a slower cure glue like Tightbond III.

But PL premium is just a different league than wood glue. It's construction adhesive, you buy a tube and use caulk gun. It's more expensive. It's stronger, it's harder to clean up (not water soluble, it's polyurethane based) and it's thicker so it doesn't drip and stays put where you want it.

Different. both work good.

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post #32 of 68 Old 07-30-2014, 10:25 AM
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I actually use both. I test fit, then use the TiteBond II for bonding the two panels together, as well as brad nailing. After about 45 minutes to an hour of letting that set up, I then run a bead of PL along the joint inside the box and then spread it with (gloved) finger to get it all the way into the joint. Works like a charm this way and you are basically guaranteed an airtight box at that point.

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post #33 of 68 Old 07-30-2014, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post
I actually use both. I test fit, then use the TiteBond II for bonding the two panels together, as well as brad nailing. After about 45 minutes to an hour of letting that set up, I then run a bead of PL along the joint inside the box and then spread it with (gloved) finger to get it all the way into the joint. Works like a charm this way and you are basically guaranteed an airtight box at that point.
I do the same I even sometimes use 1/4 round in the corners because I am excessive
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post #34 of 68 Old 07-30-2014, 05:17 PM
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normally how much power needed for an electric brad nailer?
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post #35 of 68 Old 07-30-2014, 05:23 PM
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You mean like from the wall ?? lol not much. They run on cordless batteries no problem.

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post #36 of 68 Old 07-30-2014, 05:27 PM
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I asked because I already have one electric brad nailer with cord in 120V, but my country voltage is 240V, so I need to look for a step down transformer for it

currently building subs, considering whether use brad nailer or screws, does brad nailer has the same holding power as screws to ensure air tight?
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post #37 of 68 Old 07-30-2014, 05:32 PM
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Screws are stronger than brads easily. You would not want to build a box with brads only (no glue) but then again you would not want to build a box with screws only either (no glue)

The glue is what does the work. If I could only use one, I'd skip the screws, skip the brads and just use the glue and use a clamp or gravity (weight it down) to hold it till the glue dries.

Brads are like permanent clamps. They hold it together so the glue can dry, but you never take them out (or off). Same with screws. Pick you poison.

Brads are easier, that is why people use them. Screws are stronger but that is not important. Good wood glue is stronger and better anyways. If you use glue it won't matter.

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post #38 of 68 Old 07-30-2014, 05:35 PM
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I usually use Titebond II or III love this glue

the clamps I have now are two 36" only and few 24", I'm building box with dimension 46" W x 30" H x 23.5" D
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post #39 of 68 Old 07-30-2014, 05:37 PM
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I usually use Titebond II or III love this glue
Both are good. It's no PL premium but I like that it cleans up with water

TBII is good if you know what you are doing and work quick, TBIII is better for moisture/water exposure (like outdoors) or if you work a little slower (it has longer cure time).

TBII is usually good for speaker boxes.

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post #40 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 02:54 AM
 
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Both my air compressor and brad nail or went out yesterday. Urgg! Can anyone suggest an electric brad nailer in the sub $200 range that won't leave the brads sticking out any?
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post #41 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 04:53 AM
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Cordless ?

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post #42 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 06:21 AM
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I am surprised the ryobi is capable up to 2" brads! Has anyone tested it's firing power with the largest nail it can take? I usually go for 1.5's for speaker building, but if it really can fire an accurate 2", that is a pretty solid deal

(European models do not accept banana plugs.)

 

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post #43 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 06:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martycool007 View Post
Both my air compressor and brad nail or went out yesterday. Urgg! Can anyone suggest an electric brad nailer in the sub $200 range that won't leave the brads sticking out any?
How could both your compressor AND pnematic nailer go at the same time? Usually it's this or that. Had you been using pneumatic tool oil with your brad nailer?

You can get a porter cable air compressor for just $98 at amazon.
If you need just the nailer FireDust58 recommends the WEN 61720 that only costs $32.
If you're willing to do a refurbished/Factory-Reconditioned unit you can get a combo air compressor and brad nailer for $133 at amazon.

If you want electric and you're willing to spend up to $200, get the Ryobi cordless that Mfusick has. According to him that works really well.
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post #44 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 06:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post
I am surprised the ryobi is capable up to 2" brads! Has anyone tested it's firing power with the largest nail it can take? I usually go for 1.5's for speaker building, but if it really can fire an accurate 2", that is a pretty solid deal



YES. It kicks ass. 2" through 2x4 no problem. 1.5" into MDF through both sheets or from side the deep way... buries the head. There is adjustment for pressure and how deep to drive it that's easy to regulate to get the right strike on any wood. Really a nice tool to have. I would recommend it. I've used mine for all sorts of stuff. I originally bought it to make some balloon boxes, and I was getting frustrated with the noise of the air compressor and the heavy air cord. It opened my eyes. (yes wife made me make her "balloon boxes" for a gender reveal party of our twins.)

I ended up making it way bigger and over engineered than needed. I could have just used a card board box. lol. I now have 2 huge boxes for no purpose. I filled the holes with painters caulk, even sprayed them white with HVLP gun. I did not understand what I as building but afterwards I was glad I did it. Really a cool way to find the sex of your babies, better than doctors office. We had a friend fill the boxes with either pink or lue balloons; the doctor put the sex results in a sealed envelope. Only one person knew, everyone else did not. When I opened the box is when I found out, along with wife, parents, sisters/brothers and grandparents. Would recommend.
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post #45 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 06:54 AM
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Wow, yea all of my friends are at the age of baby making right now... I have not seen one that went full on with a nice box like that. All just used good ole cardboard.

(European models do not accept banana plugs.)

 

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post #46 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 06:55 AM
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BTW... if you can build a balloon box you can build a speaker box

To add to what BeastAudio said, yes 1.5" is usually the right gauge for speaker building. Assuming 3/4" MDF or PLY it' the perfect amount for going through the flat surface of one edge down into the long surface edge of the other wall. You get .75" in each peice, holds perfectly until the glue dries.

For the speakers I used smaller for the 1/2" MDF and for that 1" is better.

For my first sealed box I did I did not use the brad nailer, even though it was right there. I used the clamp method.. I actually only used the brad nailer as a weight... haha.









Worst box I ever made....


For all the others I ended up throwing the clamps to the side and just shooting brads. SO MUCH EASIER! Much better result too. Clamps are for speakers. Brads are for subs!
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post #47 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 06:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post
YES. It kicks ass. 2" through 2x4 no problem. 1.5" into MDF through both sheets or from side the deep way... buries the head. There is adjustment for pressure and how deep to drive it that's easy to regulate to get the right strike on any wood. Really a nice tool to have. I would recommend it. I've used mine for all sorts of stuff. I originally bought it to make some balloon boxes, and I was getting frustrated with the noise of the air compressor and the heavy air cord. It opened my eyes. (yes wife made me make her "balloon boxes" for a gender reveal party of our twins.)

I ended up making it way bigger and over engineered than needed. I could have just used a card board box. lol. I now have 2 huge boxes for no purpose. I filled the holes with painters caulk, even sprayed them white with HVLP gun. I did not understand what I as building but afterwards I was glad I did it. Really a cool way to find the sex of your babies, better than doctors office. We had a friend fill the boxes with either pink or lue balloons; the doctor put the sex results in a sealed envelope. Only one person knew, everyone else did not. When I opened the box is when I found out, along with wife, parents, sisters/brothers and grandparents. Would recommend.
So your wife got a party and you got a new cordless tool. I wish it always ended that way.

The party idea with the colored balloons is a cool idea imo. Sounds like you're also really happy. Congrats to you and your family!
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post #48 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 07:05 AM
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I like my little campbell hausfeld combo compressor and gun. I think I got it on sale at Lowes for a little over $100 and it suits my box building needs perfectly, is easy to carry around if needed, and puts a nail where it is supposed to be every time

http://jmcautomotiveequipment.com/ca...FZJr7AodnhoAOQ
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post #49 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 07:15 AM
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So your wife got a party and you got a new cordless tool. I wish it always ended that way.

The party idea with the colored balloons is a cool idea imo. Sounds like you're also really happy. Congrats to you and your family!
Yup! I'm super happy. Kids are doing great, one boy and one girl. Almost 3 months old now. It's fun. Sleep could be better though.

I ended up buying the cordless brad nailer because I needed to go fast. I did the boxes the day before the party, I promised her I would do it and then never did and got my back against the wall. Then once I went to HD I just went overboard. I used hinges on the top, Pine for the side stiles. I almost was going to make it a raised panel cabinet door front! haha... glad I did not.

$119 for the brad nailer is a no brainer. The convenience of cordless and lack of noise is so worth it. I have three compressors and two full kits of brad nailers (well my dad and I do combined) so it's not like I needed it. There is two compressors in the garage, one CAMPBELL HAUSFELD, another 2.5HP harbor Freight 21 gallon upright. Plus I have a mini portable Sears Craftman unit that is small and portable and works well for brad nailing. At the end of the day the noise of the compressor and the hassle of the cord isn't worth $119 for someone who uses it more than a couple times a year. I've used mine probably 50 times already and it's only a year old. Being able to grab it and go is the best.


Some advice: While I love harbor Freight for ridiculously low priced tools their brads suck. They bend a lot easier than the porter cable branded ones at HD which are like $1 more expensive.

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post #50 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 09:59 AM
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Cheers to that! The sleep situation does get better pretty quick but it feels like eternity before it does.

Are you happy with the HF 21 gallon upright? I want to get a second larger compressor for sand blasting and spraying and for my recently purchased HF framing gun. My small Dewalt compressor works great for my 16g and 18g nail guns but it runs too often with the new framing gun. I want to frame a workshop/shed next year and I don't want to kill my Dewalt.

I don't have a problem buying expensive tools but I also don't mind buying a HF tool for something I don't do that often and if it happens to be reasonably reliable, which is a gamble with HF a lot of times.
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post #51 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 10:31 AM
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Brads are like permanent clamps. They hold it together so the glue can dry, but you never take them out (or off). Same with screws. Pick you poison.
This. Clamps are NOT cheap. Furthermore, lots of clamps are not easy to deal with and are really not cheap. Where clamps shine is when you are dealing with pieces of material which are not "true/square/flat". Then, they give you the force you need to make a shape that works. Not's boxes were a prime example of this. If you have bad ply...well then clamps are what you need. If you have MDF then a clamp or two and a nailer go a long way to fast construction but you don't need many of them.

Just remember the glue is much stronger than the all the screws/nails by a long shot. Hell, they lifted a truck up in the air with a few drops of loctite. The only thing the a screw/nail might get you is holding together a box that has already structurally failed. Either way, its use as a speaker is over so it bought you nothing.
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post #52 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 10:54 AM
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Cheers to that! The sleep situation does get better pretty quick but it feels like eternity before it does.

Are you happy with the HF 21 gallon upright? I want to get a second larger compressor for sand blasting and spraying and for my recently purchased HF framing gun. My small Dewalt compressor works great for my 16g and 18g nail guns but it runs too often with the new framing gun. I want to frame a workshop/shed next year and I don't want to kill my Dewalt.

I don't have a problem buying expensive tools but I also don't mind buying a HF tool for something I don't do that often and if it happens to be reasonably reliable, which is a gamble with HF a lot of times.
Yeah it works really good. I think I got it for $165 ? It's cheap. My biggest concern would be the noise; it's loud. And the one of it is right in the band of frequency that is super annoying. BUT THEN AGAIN... just about all air compressors are loud. If the noise isn't a problem there is little left to hate about it.

It works for HVLP spraying, or sanding. That's pretty good for a compressor this price and only 2.5HP and 21 gallons. You could use larger.. but then they are a pain to move. This one I can put in the back of a pick up truck myself as well. I bought it because it was the biggest I could get for the lowest price and still move it around. I wanted a 120v. The big one is 240v and it's not portable.

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post #53 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 11:02 AM
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Hey Smitty,

One tip about the PL Premium 3x adhesive is to wait 'till it is nearly dry to remove the squeeze out with a sharp chisel. If you choose to use an excess amount and shape the squeeze out with your finger like caulk, then it doesn't matter and just let it dry. But if you are after a clean joint, just apply enough glue for a small amount of squeeze out and wait for it to dry until it is flexible, but not sticky. Then just slip your chisel along the edge and the squeeze out will slice right off leaving a fairly clean joint.

When comparing pneumatic vs electric brad nailers, the pneumatic guns will be lighter and easier to hold for those large sub projects requiring more brads. Then again, if your arm is too tired to hold the electric nailer, its probably time for a beer!

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post #54 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 11:46 AM
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No. The air cord and the pull of it makes the air powered brad nailer more cumbersome and feel heavier, it's harder to maneuver around and that damn cord is always in the way. The sound of the compressor will make you want to wear ear plugs too, and you can't hear your music. Truth be told I built the fusion8 for my garage because my JBL towers could't compete with the compressor. Now I can wear hearing protection and still hear my music over the air compressor and table saw

No way is a air powered brad nailer lighter feeling, sure the gun weight less but it's not as convenient. I actually stopped using the half height and ultra light lithium battery with my Ryobi in favor of the heavier larger NiCad Battery because it was too light and I like how Nicad batteries work better. The lithium just stop working suddenly when they go dead, that's annoying. But if you cared about weight a lithium battery on a cordless ryobi is way lighter feeling in reality. I thought it would be heavy, but I can use it all day without fatigue. It's so much easier to pick up the cordless, quickly position it and shoot.. BOOM .. done. It takes more effort and harder to do the same with the air compressor nailer, you need to fight the weight of the cord, pull enough slack on it, and I often miss the mark or shake a second trying to get it to land right where I want to shoot.

The easiest way I can explain it is take off that setting in windows for "enhanced mouse control" and try to click a button, you'll overshoot and wobble around the mark before you settle on it.

Cordless > Corded. Not even a contest. I have not used my brand new porter cable kit I got for Xmas since I got my cordless brad nailer, it's still new in the package.

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post #55 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 11:59 AM
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and you can't hear your music.
and you can't hear your music

and you can't hear your music

Just wanted to reiterate...

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post #56 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 12:07 PM
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and you can't hear your music

and you can't hear your music

Just wanted to reiterate...
lol. Nothing better than rocking a kick ass audio set up loud while you work and hearing it over your power tools or with hearing protection on!

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post #57 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 12:33 PM
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Can't really get away with that in my garage. I have to be pretty quiet in there, but the good news is, the backside of my house is wide-open, and the theater can be at +10 levels and you can't hear a peep outside

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post #58 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 12:58 PM
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Haha... We rock like 100db+ outdoors no problem 5 acres and cool neighbors FTW!

I literally tap out my Fusion8 with my HK stereo AVR, it flashes +8 and won't go louder haha! They love it too. I think it's only like 80 watts. It's loud though. (2) 12" and (2) 15" ported can't keep up actually. Not in a big space or outside.

My main regret is my tinnitus. I wish I took better care of my hearing in my 20's with the car audio stuff and all the guitar playing, rock concerts, motocross etc... I'm somewhat careful about further damage which kinda sucks when you are into this stuff.

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post #59 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 01:09 PM
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At first I thought, Hm, he is careful about his tinnitus, but listens at +8 levels while operating power equipment, how does that work? But then I remembered you hadear protection on

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post #60 of 68 Old 07-31-2014, 01:32 PM
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haha.. yeah. I use most of the time Klipsch S4 headphones (ear buds) they have a very excellent blockage of external sound and sound isolation so I can listen at a good level and hear clearly the music on half or less volume on my iphone even when mowing the lawn or using the table saw or air compressor. They server the double duty of blocking out the unwanted sounds. In the garage or workshop I'll wear those cheap hearing protection ear muffs from home depot which are also effective for protection, but then I just crank the Fusions and the subs to compensate over the power tools, but still wearing the hearing protection. So the effect is I am cranking, but it's not destructive to my hearing. People walk into the garage and are like "WTF!" and I just laugh. It's actually a cool effect because you hear the bass and feel it easier at those levels, but the mids and highs are reduced. So you get the effect of loud music without actually being "loud" on your ear drums. Low bass doesn't seem to bother me as much, but midrange will leave my ears ringing for days. I just bought some metal concert tickets, I need to go find a nice ear plug that lets me hear the music well without blocking out or sounding bad. I used to use some HEAROS ones that did that well when we jammed, but I forgot which. If anyone knows a good hearing protection plug that still lets you hear really good let me know.

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