MartySub FAQ - Page 7 - AVS Forum
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Old 08-28-2014, 07:22 AM
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SI is extremely conservative at 600 w. 1100 is fine.

That looks like you have a 30 Hz high pass filter on audyo, make sure you only have the one 21 hz one active on your amp.
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Old 08-28-2014, 07:54 PM
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I've got a receiver with two independent sub outputs and would like to run a total of two subs.

Per LTD02's post here running two Si 18 D4s with the drivers wired in parallel and connected to separate channels on the inuke nu3000dsp would run at 1000watts at 2 ohms.

Is there any useful advantage to using an inuke nu6000dsp in this setup?

Also, in the OP, chalugadp said:

Quote:
It depends on the amp. many folks run the inuke 3000dsp or the 6000dsp. the 3000dsp can handle a 2 ohm load per channel (that's really pushing it, but it can do it) and the 6000 can handle a 4 ohm load per channel (again, that's really pushing it, but it can do it).
Is it really that bad, because the wording makes me feel like it's a bit risky.
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Old 08-28-2014, 09:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chalugadp View Post
Yeah there basically the same box with different dimensions . Just follow the stonehenges dimensions .
If I build the full Marty's first, do you think I will be able to figure out how to build a 16" deep Marty?

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk
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Old 08-28-2014, 09:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wasser View Post
I've got a receiver with two independent sub outputs and would like to run a total of two subs.

Per LTD02's post here running two Si 18 D4s with the drivers wired in parallel and connected to separate channels on the inuke nu3000dsp would run at 1000watts at 2 ohms.

Is there any useful advantage to using an inuke nu6000dsp in this setup?

Also, in the OP, chalugadp said:

Is it really that bad, because the wording makes me feel like it's a bit risky.
You are better to get the 6000. Will handle load easier and when you upgrade you are not stuck selling the 3000.
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Old 08-29-2014, 11:38 AM
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Do these look OK for inuke settings for a full marty?

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Old 08-29-2014, 11:50 AM
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I have a SI 18d4 question.

This weekend I'm going to mount my subs in their cubes. I did a recessed baffle so the sub will be mounted in one 3/4 mdf piece.

I see so many ways to mount the sub. Should I put backer blocks behind each mounting hole? I thought about a whole 3/4 ring in mdf or plywood to help reinforce.

Should I use just button head screws?
Should I use 1/4 20 button head bolts?
Should I use T nuts, threaded inserts or which ones?

I have picked up a few of each style nut, bolt combo to play with but still unsure.

I would hate to get the sub mounted and can't get it out to a stripped nut or screw.
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Old 08-29-2014, 12:09 PM
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A full ring of plywood would probably be best. But you'll have to cut it in half to fit it in the box. You can make the inner cutout of the ring a little smaller than the main baffle since the speaker basket tappers. This will allow you to have some extra material on the inside edges of the screws. Doing this you won't need to use any additional hardware other than screws. And you wont have to worry about a t-nut or insert coming loose.
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Old 08-29-2014, 12:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluer101 View Post
I have a SI 18d4 question.

This weekend I'm going to mount my subs in their cubes. I did a recessed baffle so the sub will be mounted in one 3/4 mdf piece.

I see so many ways to mount the sub. Should I put backer blocks behind each mounting hole? I thought about a whole 3/4 ring in mdf or plywood to help reinforce.

Should I use just button head screws?
Should I use 1/4 20 button head bolts?
Should I use T nuts, threaded inserts or which ones?

I have picked up a few of each style nut, bolt combo to play with but still unsure.

I would hate to get the sub mounted and can't get it out to a stripped nut or screw.
I used #10 pan head sheet metal screws 1.5" but 1.25" should work fine. I was never a fan of the T nut idea, make sure you drill pilot holes first, MDF will split otherwise.
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Old 08-29-2014, 03:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lemonslush View Post
I used #10 pan head sheet metal screws 1.5" but 1.25" should work fine. I was never a fan of the T nut idea, make sure you drill pilot holes first, MDF will split otherwise.
Thanks

Yep per drill. I'm going to HD to pick up a 2x4 3/4 plywood. I'm going to cut a ring to glue to the baffle. That way it will be 1.5 inch with the bottom being ply which is stronger. Then if I have one strip later I can rotate the sub and re drill and mount.

I'm going to get #10 1.5-1.75. My acoustic grey foam came in today so I need some spray adhesive too.
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Old 08-29-2014, 07:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bassment View Post
SI is extremely conservative at 600 w. 1100 is fine.

That looks like you have a 30 Hz high pass filter on audyo, make sure you only have the one 21 hz one active on your amp.
Yeah that's what it looks like but the HPF is set at 21Hz in the miniDSP. My setup= AV receiver > miniDSP (only set HPF) > Cleanbox Pro II > EP4000 out to two Martycubes. Anything wrong here?

I don't know why, but even with EQ, it doesn't feel like they are digging even as deep as my old PB-2000.
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Old 08-29-2014, 08:19 PM
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set-up sounds good. Maybe the sub volume is just overall lower? Have you tried raising the level a few dB?
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Old 08-29-2014, 08:56 PM
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Yep tried that. They certainly are loud, but just cant get the same depth from them. I might have to just build some full marty's or something to get the lower extension?
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Old 08-29-2014, 09:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AudyoVidyo View Post
Yep tried that. They certainly are loud, but just cant get the same depth from them. I might have to just build some full marty's or something to get the lower extension?
You have something not setup right. Twin martycubes will hit hard to 18hz. Below that it drops hard. Your hpf should be 20 with 6db butterworth slope. Put a 2db peq at 20hz.
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Old 08-29-2014, 09:07 PM
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full marty is a few hz lower extension but it's not a big difference. your measurement doesn't look right at all, there is something set up wrong. check your ep4000's switches it really looks like you have a high pass filter crossover enabled at 30 hz. I have an ep4000 and with the crossover enabled it sounds exactly like what is happening to you, when you flip the switch it will blow you away.
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Old 08-29-2014, 09:39 PM
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Ok here it is WITH eq with HPF set at 20Hz.

EQ:
6dB boost at 23Hz,
4dB boost at 19Hz,
2dB boost at 100Hz,
-6dB at 45Hz (room mode)
-3dB at 35Hz (room mode)
9dB boost with a high Q at 90Hz due to room mode

But I have to run it safe as it models xmax at 700W with WinISD.

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Old 08-29-2014, 09:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AudyoVidyo View Post
Ok here it is WITH eq with HPF set at 20Hz.

EQ:
6dB boost at 23Hz,
4dB boost at 19Hz,
2dB boost at 100Hz,
-6dB at 45Hz (room mode)
-3dB at 35Hz (room mode)
9dB boost with a high Q at 90Hz due to room mode

But I have to run it safe as it models xmax at 700W with WinISD.


Is that with any smoothing applied?
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Old 08-30-2014, 03:05 AM
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No smoothing applied to that graph.
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Old 08-30-2014, 04:23 PM
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This should be a 'sticky'. Also, it would be nice is someone did this with the horn builds.
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Old 08-30-2014, 11:09 PM
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"Do these look OK for inuke settings for a full marty?"


looks good to me.

Listen. It's All Good.
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Old 08-30-2014, 11:18 PM
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"EQ:
6dB boost at 23Hz,
4dB boost at 19Hz, "


unless the q of those filters is very high, they will overlap quite a bit, so you are more than likely seeing about 10db of boost around 20hz. there is nothing inherently wrong with that, but 10db is ten times power. so if 100 watts is going to the upper bass, 1000 will be going to the low end. just be aware...

Listen. It's All Good.
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Old 08-30-2014, 11:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post
"EQ:
6dB boost at 23Hz,
4dB boost at 19Hz, "


unless the q of those filters is very high, they will overlap quite a bit, so you are more than likely seeing about 10db of boost around 20hz. there is nothing inherently wrong with that, but 10db is ten times power. so if 100 watts is going to the upper bass, 1000 will be going to the low end. just be aware...
Thanks LTD. I always check my settings with the filters in WinISD to make sure I am running it safely.

One question I do have though with the EP4000 is:
If I am running 4ohms per channel, gains all the way up, this gives me my max output up to 1400W/ch yes? So if I set the gain knobs to halfway, is that effectively attenuating the output signal so I get only a max output of 700W/ch?
Forgive me if this is a stupid question.

Last edited by AudyoVidyo; 08-31-2014 at 12:17 AM.
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Old 08-30-2014, 11:43 PM
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have you checked your high pass filter on the ep4000, that amount of boost shouldn't be required to be flat to 20 hz.
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Old 08-31-2014, 12:16 AM
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Yes the HPF is off on both channels. It seems that I just don't benefit at all from any room gain.

I say this because the un-EQ'd graph seems similar to the graph I get straight from WinISD with the martycube parameters.
Keep in mind this is the TM graph. Not SPL.

Last edited by AudyoVidyo; 08-31-2014 at 12:21 AM.
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Old 08-31-2014, 12:38 AM - Thread Starter
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The martycube doesn't need 10dbs of boost at 20hz. Your room has a huge null, leak in cab , or amp setting issue. Your spl will be hampered cause most of the power is being used by boost.
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Old 08-31-2014, 12:44 AM
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I agree, the martycube may not need 10dB's of boost. But my room is definitely coming into play here somehow. The cabs are fine no air leaks.

I will try taking some more measurements with the settings as suggested. 20Hz HPF, 2dB boost at 20Hz and let you know how I go.
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Old 08-31-2014, 01:20 AM
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"One question I do have though with the EP4000 is:
If I am running 4ohms per channel, gains all the way up, this gives me my max output up to 1400W/ch yes? So if I set the gain knobs to halfway, is that effectively attenuating the output signal so I get only a max output of 700W/ch?
Forgive me if this is a stupid question."


it is a good question.


first of all, the ep4000 won't put out 1400 watts per channel into 4 ohms for more than a millisecond. real world output is more like half that.


second, on pro amps, the gain knob doesn't indicate % power. the way it works is your pre amp send a voltage to the pro amp input. the pro amp then multiplies that by some factor and outputs that to the subs. the "input sensitivity" is the minimum voltage that is required to hit max power with the gains all the way up. however, if the input signal is very strong, the amp may still hit max power even with the gain knob set half way up. it is a little tricky and why pro amps have clip lights. most folks simply monitor the clip lights and adjust the gains up or down without trying to figure out input voltage/multipliers/ or any of the rest of it. consumer amps don't have clip lights because consumers would be upset if they knew how frequently their amps were clipping!

Listen. It's All Good.
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Old 08-31-2014, 02:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post
"One question I do have though with the EP4000 is:
If I am running 4ohms per channel, gains all the way up, this gives me my max output up to 1400W/ch yes? So if I set the gain knobs to halfway, is that effectively attenuating the output signal so I get only a max output of 700W/ch?
Forgive me if this is a stupid question."


it is a good question.


first of all, the ep4000 won't put out 1400 watts per channel into 4 ohms for more than a millisecond. real world output is more like half that.


second, on pro amps, the gain knob doesn't indicate % power. the way it works is your pre amp send a voltage to the pro amp input. the pro amp then multiplies that by some factor and outputs that to the subs. the "input sensitivity" is the minimum voltage that is required to hit max power with the gains all the way up. however, if the input signal is very strong, the amp may still hit max power even with the gain knob set half way up. it is a little tricky and why pro amps have clip lights. most folks simply monitor the clip lights and adjust the gains up or down without trying to figure out input voltage/multipliers/ or any of the rest of it. consumer amps don't have clip lights because consumers would be upset if they knew how frequently their amps were clipping!
Thanks LTD. Your answers are always so insightful.

That makes sense. It makes it easy to vary my input signal as I am using a Cleanbox Pro II in line as well fortunately so that is an easy one. I also run the gain on the EP at full now, and just play with the cleanbox to get the right input signal.

So I have my clip limiters on both channels set to 'off' currently. I haven't seen the clip lights ever come on. Should I have the clip limiters 'on' then? Is that the only way I will know if it is clipping?
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Old 08-31-2014, 09:53 AM
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the clip lights will flash if it is clipping.


one test that can be performed is to UNHOOK the sub and play a bass heavy passage. keep turning the volume up (even though nothing is making any sound) until the clip lights blink a bit. if they can't be made to blink even when volume is turned all the way up, sufficient input signal to the amp may not be getting there. it is ALMOST always the case that extreme bass passages should at least tickle the clip lights.

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Old 08-31-2014, 05:40 PM
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Never use Rustoleum Flat Black acrylic latex for a base coat on your cube.

I used this today ( at least I only tried one cube ) http://m.homedepot.com/p/Rust-Oleum-...502/100172539/ to give the cube a black base before duratex. I filled brad nails with drywall spackle per duratex instructions but the Rustoleum bubbled and did not stick to the spackle areas. So needless to say I spent the next 2 1/2 hours sanding back to mdf.

So now I have a really nice sanded cube. Should I just use the duratex without a base coat of black? I'm trying to get the duratex with very little texture too so I thought a base of black would work. Maybe hit it with 99 cent black spray bombs.

Here is a photo before the disaster. I first sanded the spackle smooth and applied the Rustoleum.



Oh and I built a detachable base for my cube's to give it a flare.

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Old 08-31-2014, 08:16 PM
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So after double checking things with my cab before I start bracing I noticed a discrepancy between two cut lists. Here is the one I followed.



What will the extra 6" of port cause vs the image on page 1?
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