Need more subs- 2 more si18 or 4 - 8 infinity 1262? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 59 Old 08-20-2014, 01:20 PM - Thread Starter
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Need more subs- 2 more si18 or 4 - 8 infinity 1262?

Having just finished 2 si18' marty cubes I find myself wanting more POWER. I currently have one sub in the front left and one right rear of my room. I did a sub crawl and the best place I found so far would be a nearfield on the left side wall behind my couch. My problem is I just got my attic blasted with 4" of insulation and I don't want to go up there to run wires down the wall. (hidden beams, me having no balance = bad idea). I might do some testing again tonight to see how moving my rear sub closet up would work.

I though if I used a wireless RCA to send the signal,then I throw an amp there and have the subs directly behind me. That may work*.

I was going to get 2 more si118's but wondered how they would compare to 4 or 8 1262 12"'s in a ported box. If I can get enough output form the extra subs I could forget the nearfield and throw another one up front, in the back or even the side wall as that walls all open and I could easily run a cable.

Up front the biggest I could go is 2' H x 3' W x 2' deep. Put each sub on either side of the center. (how I had my SI's originally, but moved them apart to get better dispersion). I could also go where the sub currently is, but I am limited to a 2'x2' foot print and could go pretty high if needed.



If I built something for behind the couch I could go about 30"H x 4' W x 2' Deep.



If I put something on the right side of the wall facing the couch I could go even bigger but probably not deepe than 2'.


*Down side to the nearfield would be having the sub amp next to my head and the WAF would go down a bunch. She is pretty cool with most stuff, but I don't want to go to crazy. My woodworking skills leave something to be desired so I wouldn't be able to pull of a nice looking "back of couch" end table that housed the amp.

Rooms about 3,400 cubic ft.

What would you do for subs and where would you put them?

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post #2 of 59 Old 08-20-2014, 01:49 PM
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A room that big needs a minimarty . Behind the couch at 2' by 30" by 36". Adding that should help curb your bass appetite .
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post #3 of 59 Old 08-20-2014, 02:15 PM
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Behind the couch for near field brutality, with an 18hz tune. 4 drivers, infinity 1260 (do you need all those voice coils ?)

I'll whip something up. You'll get 4 drivers in same space as 1 or 2 with those dimensions. Should work well.
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post #4 of 59 Old 08-20-2014, 02:50 PM
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one possibility could be to build a couple of units behind the couch...a nearfield wall of bass.


then disguise it with a slab or marble or something. if it were build the same height as the back of the couch, it might look right at home.

final:


grill off:



top marble layer off:



the dimensions of the cabs could be worked out depending on how much space you have, but back of envelope suggests something like 3'x3'x2' foot cabs would work fine.
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post #5 of 59 Old 08-20-2014, 03:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post
Behind the couch for near field brutality, with an 18hz tune. 4 drivers, infinity 1260 (do you need all those voice coils ?)

I'll whip something up. You'll get 4 drivers in same space as 1 or 2 with those dimensions. Should work well.

Awesome looking forward to checking it out.
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post #6 of 59 Old 08-20-2014, 03:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post
one possibility could be to build a couple of units behind the couch...a nearfield wall of bass.


then disguise it with a slab or marble or something. if it were build the same height as the back of the couch, it might look right at home.

final:


grill off:



top marble layer off:



the dimensions of the cabs could be worked out depending on how much space you have, but back of envelope suggests something like 3'x3'x2' foot cabs would work fine.
I love the mock up, and the wall of subs idea.

So a bunch of 12's over 18's then?

I spent the past hour, pushing one of my 18s around the room with a 25' cable. Tried every possiable position, the two places I have it are the best along with the near field. Then front right of the Tv would be acceptable as well. Oddly enough having it directly to my right ear sounded softer than having it behind me several more feet.
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post #7 of 59 Old 08-20-2014, 03:26 PM - Thread Starter
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I had another idea. I could just put a small rug down on the floor and run the cable to the nearfield subs under it. I asked my wife how she would feel about that, she said "its your room, do whatever you want". So that's an option instead of leaving the amp in the corner.
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post #8 of 59 Old 08-20-2014, 03:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lemonslush View Post
I had another idea. I could just put a small rug down on the floor and run the cable to the nearfield subs under it. I asked my wife how she would feel about that, she said "its your room, do whatever you want". So that's an option instead of leaving the amp in the corner.
Too bad everyone's wife isn't that flexible
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post #9 of 59 Old 08-20-2014, 03:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by chalugadp View Post
Too bad everyone's wife isn't that flexible
Don't get me wrong. She may not have been totally psyched about it, but hey if shes fine with it I can be. Totally a keeper.

I want the room to look nice as well but I think I could live with a random black rug on top of carpet...Trashy? Maybe.

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post #10 of 59 Old 08-20-2014, 04:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lemonslush View Post
I though if I used a wireless RCA to send the signal,then I throw an amp there and have the subs directly behind me. That may work*.

I wouldn't recommend the wireless route. I have seen some posts on AVS about problems with subs and the cause turned out to be a wireless signal. Maybe it was because they weren't using a quality wireless device, but I doubt it. Hopefully some of the experts here can chime in and confirm if it's a good idea or not.
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post #11 of 59 Old 08-20-2014, 04:39 PM - Thread Starter
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I have the Dayton one svs sells on their site. I use it for one of my downstairs subs and it works great. I also have a art clean box laying around I could use if the wireless thing didn't have enlightened juice. But I am thinking more. The wire under a area rug trick.

Need to decide on going with an 18 there or 4 x12s

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post #12 of 59 Old 08-20-2014, 07:11 PM
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double insulated line could also be run under the carpet just before the tack strip along the walls.


as for the driver go for whatever you like, with an eye toward matching the impedance of the final load to your amp(s).

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post #13 of 59 Old 08-20-2014, 08:13 PM - Thread Starter
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I was thinking inuke3k? That might not match great with the 1262. Unless I ran 4 off one amp and then it would be over powered. SI would be easy, or get a 6kdsp incase I need more subs later. I don't have a minidsp so a non dsp amp might be out of the running.

Also thinking of box size and cost. Maybe go 1 18 behind the couch and another up front, or a 4 pack of 12s behind the couch and who knows up front. I hope to figure it out by Friday so I can start getting my wood cut.
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post #14 of 59 Old 08-20-2014, 08:39 PM
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hi, I've seen these 1262's around, they go for little money. but could 8 push as much as 2x siht18 ?
how do they compare in the 18-30hz region ?
it would be nice if someone could model this, 8 infinity vs 2 18"....

very curious ! great renders too !!
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post #15 of 59 Old 08-21-2014, 02:51 AM
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I too would be curious as to how four of the Infinity 1262's would compare to one or two SI 18HT's. Right now I am searching for a horn sub design that I can use as a riser. I have been seriously eyeing Oklahoma Wolf's SDX-10 riser, can't recall the name at the moment, or whether or not that driver is still available. If I went that route, I would go with two of them to span the width of my 14ft room.

The other possibility that I am considering is to run four or eight of the Infinity 1260's in a riser that would be 14ft wide by 5ft deep, unsure of the optimal height. Will start a thread when I get closer to that point. Gotta finish up my LCR build first!
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post #16 of 59 Old 08-21-2014, 07:12 AM
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My vote is what LTD suggested. 8 infinity behind the couch would be awesome, nearfield subs add so much to bass. I'd go with the 1260w though, and get an inuke 6000 to power it. 4 infinity for a 4 ohm load on each channel.
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post #17 of 59 Old 08-21-2014, 07:29 AM
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8 infinity 1260 (green) with an inuke 6000 vs 2 si 18 d4 (orange) with an inuke 3000 in the same 2x3x3 box with assumed 12 cu ft internal volume, both tuned to 17 hz and high passed at 15 hz 3rd order.

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post #18 of 59 Old 08-21-2014, 07:38 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
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8 infinity 1260 (green) with an inuke 6000 vs 2 si 18 d4 (orange) with an inuke 3000 in the same 2x3x3 box with assumed 12 cu ft internal volume, both tuned to 17 hz and high passed at 15 hz 3rd order.

Awesome comparison @Bassment !

I did some measurements of behind my couch. Not sure I could fit all 8 behind the couch and still be able to walk in and out easily. Would 4 12's in that one box still beat 1x 18 in the same size configuration? Assuming I would want the box 30" high, I could make it a tad longer to accommodate that extra volume.



Does that look about right 4 cubic feet per sub and a port length of only 11"?
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post #19 of 59 Old 08-21-2014, 08:01 AM
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The SI's are a bit disadvantaged in that size box, as they would like to be in their own 12 cu ft enclosure's each. 4 infinity in 6 cu ft is better than an SI in 6 cu ft, but remember it needs a whole inuke 3000 to power the 4 infinity and only one channel of an inuke 3000 to power the SI. The BEST bang for your buck would be SI's in 2x2x4 ft enclosures.
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post #20 of 59 Old 08-21-2014, 08:50 AM - Thread Starter
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The SI's are a bit disadvantaged in that size box, as they would like to be in their own 12 cu ft enclosure's each. 4 infinity in 6 cu ft is better than an SI in 6 cu ft, but remember it needs a whole inuke 3000 to power the 4 infinity and only one channel of an inuke 3000 to power the SI. The BEST bang for your buck would be SI's in 2x2x4 ft enclosures.

In my head I though it would be 4 infinities, 12 cubic feet per box and I would need 2 boxes. Could I fit 4 infinities in 6 cubic feet space?

Well, if I did the 4 infinity behind the couch I could power another SI or two with the 6000. I could also use the 6000 to power my two existing subs and sell off my 3000 if I don't need it anymore.

To bad I cant run 4 infinities on the 3000, would make life a lot easier.
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post #21 of 59 Old 08-21-2014, 08:56 AM
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The graph I posted was 8 infinities in 12 cubic foot box, and 2 SI in a 12 cubic foot box. So yes 4 infinity in 6 cubic foot is just 6 dB lower than the graph I posted. I didn't realize LTD's boxes were TWO 3x3x2.

4 infinity is perfect power from an inuke 3000. The 6000 was for 8 infinity.
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post #22 of 59 Old 08-21-2014, 09:01 AM - Thread Starter
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The graph I posted was 8 infinities in 12 cubic foot box, and 2 SI in a 12 cubic foot box. So yes 4 infinity in 6 cubic foot is just 6 dB lower than the graph I posted. I didn't realize LTD's boxes were TWO 3x3x2.

4 infinity is perfect power from an inuke 3000. The 6000 was for 8 infinity.
The 4 infinities would save on space a bunch. Would one 18 in a 8-10cubic foot box beat out the 4 12's in that 6 foot enclosure then?
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post #23 of 59 Old 08-21-2014, 09:02 AM
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Yellow is two SI 18's in a 24 cu ft box. Pink is 8 infinity in a 24 cu ft box. Green is 8 infinity in a 12 cu ft box.

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post #24 of 59 Old 08-21-2014, 09:05 AM
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one SI 18 in 10 cu ft box in yellow, powered from one channel of an inuke 3000. Four infinity 1260w in 6 cu ft box in green, powered from two channels of an inuke 3000.

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post #25 of 59 Old 08-21-2014, 10:06 AM
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You can increase box volume on infinity too, and get a boost. That's not unique to the SI. Most ported subs behave like that.

If you are limited on space then look at the bass to space ratio.
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post #26 of 59 Old 08-21-2014, 10:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post
You can increase box volume on infinity too, and get a boost. That's not unique to the SI. Most ported subs behave like that.

If you are limited on space then look at the bass to space ratio.
There's a picture of that in post 23
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post #27 of 59 Old 08-21-2014, 11:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bassment View Post
My vote is what LTD suggested. 8 infinity behind the couch would be awesome, nearfield subs add so much to bass. I'd go with the 1260w though, and get an inuke 6000 to power it. 4 infinity for a 4 ohm load on each channel.
Great minds think alike...

This was my thinking originally. He had contacted me via PM, but I have not had a chance to really reply yet here. I was going to do the same winISD model you did.. haha. I guess I do not have to do that anymore

I like LTD02's idea with the granite top on it. That would be sweet! It would look right at home and absolutely pound near field.

Plus I am assuming he is keeping his current two marty subs right ? So that is two marty + the 8 infinity near field. That's nice. Plenty of bass me thinks.

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post #28 of 59 Old 08-21-2014, 11:27 AM
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Yep - and I think a black box with a nice granite top like that behind the couch would actually improve the looks of the room, and be quite useful for holding food, drinks, whatever.
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post #29 of 59 Old 08-21-2014, 02:48 PM
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I like where this is going, now I just need to figure out how to power it with the cheap crown amps I just bought.

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post #30 of 59 Old 08-21-2014, 04:14 PM - Thread Starter
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A crown x4000 could power 8 of those 1262.How vital would it be to NO get a minidsp with it?


I think I have figured out a box design for each a single 18 or 4 infinities. I figured having two boxes makes moving things around easier. Do I need to use two layers of MDF for the front face? If not I can make a single box with just one peice of 4x8 mdf.



cut list for 4x 12's give you a few inches between the subs top to botton and a inch between each sub side to side. Made the port vent so low because theres only 2 inches from the bottom of the box to the sub.

2x 36" x 30" front back
2x 36" x 12" top bottom)
1x 10.5" X 26.75 Ported side
1x 10.5 x 28.5 non ported side
1 10.5" x 8.5" Top of port
1x 1" x 8.5" port rail

I figure the box is so shallow you could cut a bunch of strips that are 10.5" wide and add them all over, or grab some wood dowels and cut them down to that.

The more I think about it, I like the extra DB's the 12's give you but the extra cost and less flexibility make me lean more towards the SI's.
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