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post #1 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 06:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Inuke questions and music sounds like garbage on my setup

So I thought I had this optimally setup and not too sure now from reading more on the Inuke manual.

So I set the input knobs as per ChalugaDP's post on setting the gains. One channel is like 1 o clock and the other is like 12 to keep them somewhat matching. At reference volume, it seems I can light all the lights up on super loud scenes and just barely touch the clip, so that seems ok.

Now the manual says that is only for input voltage and to adjust the sub gain in the software for output. I played with the gains a little last night and seemed to have made no difference at all in output.
Do the front lights show input voltage and you can only see the output clip from inside the software?

So a few questions to clarify:
1. I Should I be playing with the gains in the Xover screen where you set the Xover freqs correct?
2. On the EQ screen, I set EQ1 as the -4db for the 16hz highpass. I read that this will cause you to bump the gain back up +4DB approximately to get that loss back? Is this correct? So I should set those gains at the Xover screen at +4 right off the bat to start at a 0gain and then move up from there?
3. All the frequencies defaulted at -5db across the board. Any reason this sets at negative than 0 scale?
4. How do I know how to set the delay and threshold for the subs? I initially set them for the actual distance from MLP.
5. Normal to have to set the gains to a diff degree per sub to get the lights/output to match? I see this with the inputs too
6. Is it normal to see only barely a light or so on normal scenes with a little bass and then jump up considerably with heavy notes? Or is that more of the eq lacking (-5db) causing that?

I ordered a UMIK-1 from Cross spectrum last night and a stand with boom so I can tune next week as I really think there is something up with this room. I can hit what I think are low notes, pretty loud, but it doesnt seem like anything else in the freq range is there. All music sounds like garbage uptil about 3 feet from the subs or so, and even then underwhelming.
Another thing to add, I built my MiniMarty's from the original plans with the 53" or so ports, so they might be ported at like 14-15hz. I used my SPL app on my phone last night and most stuff is about mid 90's SPL until it hits low notes. Once the lights start lighting up, I have seen about 110db max.

Any suggestions?


Last edited by PM-Performance; 08-21-2014 at 06:13 AM.
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post #2 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 07:51 AM
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SPL apps are useless. Wait for the umik to arrive.

What output db do you get to (screenshot?)

Post screenshots here of all the inuke setting's pages.

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Last edited by BassThatHz; 08-21-2014 at 08:45 AM.
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post #3 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 08:01 AM - Thread Starter
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Its hard to take a screenshot of the input/output lights on the software real time. I guess unless I play test tones or take videos and post the light activity.

Weird part is I could barely get one light on at reference on my BD player playing any music, Bass cd even. Blurays were so so for the tests I did and I dont recall the lights getting too far either. I tried a couple clips from Dark Knight and Hulk and Transformers. Stepdaughter watched LionKing last night though and my damn sofa was vibrating a floor above and shook the whole house though and that was on BD.
Could my BD player be limiting somehow?

Playing through my Apple TV though on a few movies I have, I could get the lights to light up pretty good on the front panel, but again it seemed more so of a certain bass tone that rumbled like crazy.

I moved the subs around in about a 4 ft area in each direction and no audible difference really.

I will add screenshots later. Ill run home for lunch and grab them off the laptop i was gonna use for audio stuff.

I know the SPL app was useless, but just used as a reference until i got the mic.


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post #4 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 08:50 AM
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If you are using HDMI to the disc player it isn't the disc player it is your AVR/DAC.
If you use analog outs on a disc player, then it would be the player.

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post #5 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 08:55 AM - Thread Starter
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All my stuff is HDMI. I will check to make sure the levels are the same on all HDMI inputs. I dont remember changing them for any of the inputs, but I think I saw the option before. Any other idea other than input level adjustment for HDMI ports on the AVR?

I am leaving now to run home quick for screenshots and will check the levels on the AVR

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post #6 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 09:27 AM - Thread Starter
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ok here are my screenshots. I confirmed that before setting the 16hz xover, it indeed sets the levels back to zero across the board.
So not sure if that is my first issue?
I could not find anything bumped by input on my avr. just does by analog or digital. not by invidual hdmi

Here are links to showing the lights.

First is a damn bass heavy song. You can see the lights on the software and the Inuke

Now this is compared to a movie on my Apple TV
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post #7 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 10:02 AM
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Shouldn't that be in dual mono mode and not Bi-amp mode? You are running two subs off of this correct? Not a sub and mains.
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post #8 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 10:14 AM - Thread Starter
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Here is the gains on the amp too. I just noticed from the screenshots I never changed the channel b to hs-12. but not sure that is the issue. Maybe has to do with why channel B seems to run a tad hotter though.

I thought Biamp 1 was for independant sub control from all the other posts. Correct just two subs.
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post #9 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 11:15 AM
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I haven't used an amp with built in DSP so you're probably right.
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post #10 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 11:24 AM
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In Bi-Amp 1 mode, Output A routes low frequencies to a low-range speaker, while Output B connects to a high-frequency transducer.

Dual Mono mode routes each channel input, A and B, through completely separate parallel signal paths with independent outputs for each channel. Each channel may be processed with its own unique filter, equalization, delay, and limiter settings. The Delay and Limit modules for A and B can be linked and programmed with identical settings by clicking on the Channel Link button below the Mode window.
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post #11 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 11:30 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mystigiandoll View Post
In Bi-Amp 1 mode, Output A routes low frequencies to a low-range speaker, while Output B connects to a high-frequency transducer.

Dual Mono mode routes each channel input, A and B, through completely separate parallel signal paths with independent outputs for each channel. Each channel may be processed with its own unique filter, equalization, delay, and limiter settings. The Delay and Limit modules for A and B can be linked and programmed with identical settings by clicking on the Channel Link button below the Mode window.
I have only one TRS plug coming in from my AVR. I was told BiAMp1 was the correct option for this since not using both inputs

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post #12 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 11:38 AM
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ya don't use bi-amp mode, that is for splitting a single signal into a subwoofer and a speaker. You want mono.


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post #13 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 11:42 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bassment View Post
ya don't use bi-amp mode, that is for splitting a single signal into a subwoofer and a speaker. You want mono.
Ill try that, but I was going off other threads where Splotten and LTD01 reccomended this. Doesnt Dual Mono need two inputs wired though? I only have one of them wired.


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post #14 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 12:02 PM
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On my inuke I didnt like biamp mode so i got a xlr Y cable to split so i could run stereo mode and control each channel by itself.
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post #15 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 12:02 PM
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no, mono is 1 input, 2 output, hence "mono". stereo is 2 input 2 output. bridged is one input one output, using both channels. Maybe you thought they meant bi-amp when they were talking about bridging?

You have 2 subs running off 2 channels, with 1 input, right? You'll want mono. You will notice a huge difference, as bi-amp is basically cutting all the bass from one of your channels.


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post #16 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 12:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bassment View Post
no, mono is 1 input, 2 output, hence "mono". stereo is 2 input 2 output. bridged is one input one output, using both channels. Maybe you thought they meant bi-amp when they were talking about bridging?

You have 2 subs running off 2 channels, with 1 input, right? You'll want mono. You will notice a huge difference, as bi-amp is basically cutting all the bass from one of your channels.
They deffinately reccomended Biamp. Interesting. Even with the crossovers set properly it will still be filtering out? I thought it would only filter out frequencies with crossover settings?
Will both the inputs light up and be controlled by the dials on the amp in Mono? Or will only one input be controlled by the dials and light up?

Man, if that is really the case with Biamp, that would be awesome. Both subs are moving quite a bit of air though which makes this more confusing. But maybe its only playing a real small range of frequency and cutting the rest of the range out?


Soooo confusing. . . .

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post #17 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 12:25 PM
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edit: nevermind after reading the manual more there isn't a "mono" mode specifically. Only dual mono where you need 2 input signals. So I guess bi-amp is the only way to split a signal into 2 amplifiers, other than using a y-splitter on the cable and doing dual mono. For bi-amping did you specify the filters so that both get the LFE?

Ignore what I said in post 12 and 15, that's only true for the non-dsp models

It's weird the DSP models don't have a mono mode like the non-dsp models.


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post #18 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 12:29 PM - Thread Starter
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EDIT: now that I see you edited to be in line with what I was saying. . .
Yes, as seen from the screenshots attached, I turned off the low pass filters and just let my AVR handle the 120hz lp. I did have it set in the Inuke too for the same value, but didnt really sound any different.

Only thing I see I screwed up was not setting channel B slopes correctly for the 16hz filter to match channel a. I will try first with just the 20hz filter and see if it makes much of a difference in output, but my guess is that it may not, but then again being down -5db all across the freq range isnt helping output.


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post #19 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 12:43 PM
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It will help when you can get a measurement so we can see the frequency response. You might have a huge null or something.

One thing to check, when playing music, you're in stereo on your AVR, so make sure the subwoofer output is the same level as it is when you're in surround mode. Maybe it's way too low or something.

Make sure there are no low-passes set up on your inuke.


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post #20 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 01:11 PM - Thread Starter
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I wasnt playing in stereo. It was in surround mode as I know I would get more bass in 2 channel + subs because of my towers.
Honestly my towers sound way more impressive at full range than these do with music.

Again, I shut off the low pass as shown in the screenshots. With them on or off, same thing.

Could very well be nulls, but strange that certain things are significantly hotter than others, unless those hotter tracks happen to be at the frequency I think I have peaks on.

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post #21 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 02:02 PM
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maybe the amps broken


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post #22 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 02:15 PM - Thread Starter
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I very doubt it
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post #23 of 214 Old 08-21-2014, 03:31 PM - Thread Starter
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I played with it more when I got home and matched the gains on the inputs and bumped them to 2:00 and played a bass wave to set the clip lights.
I set the subs to 85 db on my spl app ( I know it's not accurate, but for a baseline for now) and that made the software gains at 4 for each.

I set the crossovers back to 20hz hp and set all the eq gains back to zero and still little change.
I can see the input voltage going up and sticking higher longer, but I must be having a room problem.

I guess once I get the mic I will know for sure and then see what I can do.
I guess I will try phase again with my app awhile to see if it makes a diff but I don't think it will.
I am fussing room modes though because I went closer to my back wall behind the seats and my shirt was shaking and dancing from the bass and seemed fuller.Also doing some sine wave sweeps from an old bass disc, I got some fairly rediculous output at certain frequencies like I have gains and not so loud at some indicating nulls.

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post #24 of 214 Old 08-22-2014, 05:57 AM
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yea if it's doing all that it must be placement/phase/room. You will be able to fix lots of that when you get your mic and EQ. Do you have multiple placement options? Did you do the sub crawl?


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post #25 of 214 Old 08-22-2014, 07:14 AM
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So your subs are set at 85db.

Just to confirm....

What are your speakers calibrated to?


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post #26 of 214 Old 08-22-2014, 07:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Again, not scientific because I set with the app for now, but all speakers set to about 75db and subs set to 85.
Now that I think of it, that's really hot and should not be needed that hot to get required output.

I did a sub crawl when I had my svs and back of the room was pretty hot and front by my mains was completely dead.
I went to front corners and seemed to have a nice In between output.

I moved them all around the front already where they would fit and same response.

Not enough wire to get them to the back and not sure they would fit anyway.

I hope tuning fixes all this.
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post #27 of 214 Old 08-22-2014, 11:11 AM
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I don't see any problem in the videos, your music was -10db too low it looks like, you need to find a way to boost that if that is beefy bass, and you might benefit from more power, such as a 6000DSP.
If it sounds bad and weak, other than room nulls, you may need a more powerful subwoofer.

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post #28 of 214 Old 08-22-2014, 11:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BassThatHz View Post
I don't see any problem in the videos, your music was -10db too low it looks like, you need to find a way to boost that if that is beefy bass, and you might benefit from more power, such as a 6000DSP.
If it sounds bad and weak, other than room nulls, you may need a more powerful subwoofer.
I guess I will see next week then when I mic it. I did redo the gains as mentioned above, but I have a hard time believing that dual 18's and 3000dsp is not enough with almost 10ft3 for each of them.

I am hoping just nulls and gains. I just dont get why CD's would play at a lower response than BD and BD seems lower than Apple TV. Unless it just happens to be the freq range the music is playing is a null at that given range, and the effects from the movies that are big hits happen to be peaks at that frequency

Come to think of it though, I guess in general I have never been overly happy with my setup with music. I always had to turn the volume up significantly louder than with movies. Never really understood why that was. I would normally listen to movies at -15 and music would need to be at 0 or even higher to match volume. Any thoughts on that?

Any issue with them being far apart? Distance related? They are each about 17ft from MLP and probably about 35-38ft from each other. Should delay be ft from each other? or ft from MLP?


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post #29 of 214 Old 08-22-2014, 12:02 PM
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3000 dsp is the optimum power if you have d4's and they're wired for 2 ohm load per channel.


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post #30 of 214 Old 08-22-2014, 12:10 PM
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Pm,
Don't know what's wrong. Don't think anyone else has had problems you have. Once you post measurements hopefully we could figure it out.
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