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Amp Gain Knob vs. AVR Level Out

3K views 12 replies 7 participants last post by  dman918 
#1 · (Edited)
I've been messing around with my new setup (Crown XLS1500, Denon X4000, and SI18). I've read several of the level setting threads and articles here and on HomeTheaterShack, and have one concept I can't get my head around even though a couple things I've read have hit on it. The threads got pretty deep, pretty quick. I guess I just need a "for dummies" version.

The root of my question - is it preferable to run a higher level on the AVR and a lower gain on the amp to achieve a given sound level or is the opposite true (lower level, higher gain)? I'll give a scenario I tried on my setup last night. At reference on the AVR, and using a 60hz 0db sine wave, I can get my amp to clip with these two scenarios.

1) AVR sub level = 0db. Gain 3 clicks from full on the XLS. Or,
2) AVR sub level = -3.5db. Gain on full.

This is a bit of a strawman scenario in isolation of other factors, but I think it gets to my question. Assuming these are my two choices, which is preferable and why? I think it's option #1 because you get a stronger signal out of the AVR and lower gain on the amp = headroom and a lower noise floor. But I've also seen #2 recommended occassionally but am a bit more fuzzy on the reasons behind it.
 
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#2 ·
I thought that option 1 was the better option, but let's see what the (knowledgable) people say.
 
#4 ·
My denon will limit the max volume 1db for every 1db you raise any of the trim levels above 0 for any channel. If you run the sub at +5, the max volume is reduced by 5db. I assume that it to prevent clipping of the outputs?

I prefer the 0db AVR setting as mentioned above to send a stronger signal to a pro amp. With a plate amp I would flip a coin.
 
#5 · (Edited)
The way I understand it is that keeping the AVR trim levels low means the outputs from the AVR won't clip, which means a clean signal sent to the separate amp.

The separate amp's gain should then be at an appropriate level to reach Reference, which I believe is easily taken care of by Audyssey's (or similar EQ program's) request for 75dB SW volume during the calibration process.

I believe that if you get your gain structure setup correctly (there's a thread on HTS on how to do it, I believe, but I've yet to get my head round it...) then your AVR SW trim will be more likely to be lower because you're maximising clean output through the rest of the signal chain.

And, therefore, if you're driving your amp and sub into clipping/distortion/failure to try and get the output you desire, you need mooooooaaaaarrrrr sub ;) :D
 
#6 · (Edited)
The separate amp's gain should then be at an appropriate level to reach Reference, which I believe is easily taken care of by Audyssey's (or similar EQ program's) request for 75dB SW volume during the calibration process.

I believe that if you get your gain structure setup correctly (there's a thread on HTS on how to do it, I believe, but I've yet to get my head round it...) then your AVR SW trim will be more likely to be lower because you're maximising clean output through the rest of the signal chain.

I did run through the Audyssey setup. It calls for 3 clicks from full when you do the calibration at 75db, and the AVR level get's set at -6db when all is done. So really, a mix of both scenarios I listed. And I don't have huge issues with the Audyssey settings - but I'm a tinkerer and I like to know how and why things work. If nothing else, I did confirm with this exercise that my AVR can drive my amp to clipping. I guess that's a win.


I suspect the thread on HTS is the same one I've read about 6 times. The test tone I was using was from it. Some of that article has soaked in, some has not.
 
#10 ·
#13 ·
Thank you. Yes stupid phone didn't link properly.
 
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