Doc's Sealed HST18 Build Thread - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 28 Old 02-23-2015, 06:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Doc's Sealed HST18 Build Thread

Well, after weeks of planning, studying, and asking a ton of questions I finally built my subs this weekend.

I know that I said I decided on miniMarty's, but in the end I decided they were just too big. I ended up building sealed boxes for my two HST18's with approximate internal dimensions of 21"x23"x19".

Just got them up and running with an iNuke 6000DSP driving them (Have since replaced with two Crown XLS-2000 amps)and they are plenty loud for me. EQ'ed them to fairly flat from approximately 10Hz thru 60Hz. They are crossed with my mains at 80Hz. But right now the bass management on my processor isn't working correctly. Gotta figure that out before I can get things dialed in correctly.

I had all my panels cut from 3/4" MDF by a local carpenter that I found on Craigslist. He did an excellent job - none of the panels were off by more than a 64th of an inch. I was very impressed.

I used Tightbond III to glue the outside panels. Glued, clamped, and used my pneumatic brad nailer to nail them together. Then removed the clamps and moved on to the next step. The internal bracing was glued with liquid nails since I didn't care if that got sloppy. Also siliconed the inside joints, even though it probably wasn't required.

After getting the boxes put together, we used a router to round the outside edges. Filled in any gaps and brad holes with wood filler. Then sanded the corners with 150, then the whole thing with 320. Applied a coat of lacquer-based sanding sealer, sanded with 320, applied a second coat of sanding sealer, and sanded again with 320.

Then applied a coat of Rustoleum semi-gloss enamel from a rattle can. Allowed 48 hours to dry, sanded with 320, then 800. Applied final coat of semi-gloss enamel and allowed to dry,

Finally, finished assembly and set up today. Finish isn't anywhere near perfect, but I'm happy with it! And they sounds great!

Photos:

1. After installing bracing.
2. After applying front baffle.
3. Another angle after front baffle installation.
4. After rounding corners.
5. After first coat of paint, before sanding.
6. After second coat of paint.
7. Final home for Sub 1.
8. Final home for Sub 2.
9. Closeup of Sub 2.
10. RoomEQ plot of both subs together.

Thanks again to everyone who helped me on this project.
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Last edited by pmd918; 06-08-2016 at 12:47 PM.
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post #2 of 28 Old 02-23-2015, 06:16 PM
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Nice looking enclosures and in-room response.

The look of the surrounds on the HST's never ceases to suprise me, haha.
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post #3 of 28 Old 02-23-2015, 08:36 PM
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Boxes look great. Though I don't like reflective surfaces in the way of movie watching. Either flat black or triple black velvet covering any reflective surfaces.

The inukes work well but other amps will dig deeper as I have had the inuke3000dsp. Even with a low shelf filter they trail off under 20hz in my experiece.

I bet your subs tear the house down! I need a few long throw sealed 18s..
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post #4 of 28 Old 02-23-2015, 08:42 PM
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Looks nice. I have a HST 18 on the way to go with my Maelstrom X. Nice to see more builds with these. I am also going to use a 6000DSP.

James

My theater build 2015 (Circle N theater)
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post #5 of 28 Old 02-23-2015, 09:50 PM
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Nice build......box looks really solid, and that driver looks intimidating! I've read good things about the HST.

It's nice to see a sealed build thrown into the Marty this/that crowd. Nothing wrong with a ported enclosure.....just nice to see someone rock a sealed.
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post #6 of 28 Old 02-24-2015, 05:58 AM
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Nice job! The surrounds on that thing look crazy! Can you post a chart with no more than 1/12 smoothing or no smoothing?

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post #7 of 28 Old 02-24-2015, 06:16 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the comments. Was a fun project and I'm really happy with the result.

W.R.T. the comment on the reflective surfaces, if these were anywhere near my display I would totally agree, but both are well out of view.

As far as the iNuke goes, I can't say too much about how low they drive these speakers. Definitely takes some power in sealed boxes to generate the low frequencies, but for me so far, so good. I learned yesterday that I am clearly not in the basshead crowd, as these two sealed woofers are definitely loud enough for me. And I wasn't driving the amp anywhere near clipping.

I do love the way they look - definitely upped the bada$$ rating of my theater. Those surrounds are awesome! Funniest thing is how small they make my SVS CS-ultra look!

I will post a chart with no smoothing tonight when I get home.
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post #8 of 28 Old 02-24-2015, 06:23 AM
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I am a fan of the HST18. I would have bought four of them if the mounting wasn't so deep. Two of the subs needed to be slim for hiding purposes and the other two are just normal flatpacks. I bought four UXL's instead just to keep all of the drivers the same and their mounting depth is the same as the HT18's. I also have two HT18's and they sound pretty good and they are in the two slim boxes for right now until the UXL's arrive.

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post #9 of 28 Old 02-24-2015, 05:47 PM - Thread Starter
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As requested here is the non-smoothed response of the two subs.
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post #10 of 28 Old 02-24-2015, 06:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pmd918 View Post
As requested here is the non-smoothed response of the two subs.

Looks pretty good. Do you want the crossover set a 60hz or are you doing that because your subs are rolling off there? There are ways to fix that if you are having issues.

edit: went back and read that your crossover is at 80hz. Sorry, I get these threads all mixed up in my head. What do you mean by "the bass management on my processor isn't working"?

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post #11 of 28 Old 02-24-2015, 06:13 PM - Thread Starter
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Looks pretty good. Do you want the crossover set a 60hz or are you doing that because your subs are rolling off there? There are ways to fix that if you are having issues.
It's not the subs, it's the pre/pro. The bass management isn't working and I need to figure out what's wrong.

No matter what I do I can't change the crossover with the mains.

But that's a topic outside of this thread.
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post #12 of 28 Old 02-24-2015, 06:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pain Infliction View Post
Looks pretty good. Do you want the crossover set a 60hz or are you doing that because your subs are rolling off there? There are ways to fix that if you are having issues.

edit: went back and read that your crossover is at 80hz. Sorry, I get these threads all mixed up in my head. What do you mean by "the bass management on my processor isn't working"?

What pre/pro do you have?

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post #13 of 28 Old 02-24-2015, 06:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
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What pre/pro do you have?
Integra DHC-40.1
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post #14 of 28 Old 02-24-2015, 06:43 PM - Thread Starter
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. . .What do you mean by "the bass management on my processor isn't working"?
When I change the LPF on the LFE channel nothing changes. It seems to be stuck at 80 Hz, which is why the frequency response for the subs looks like it does.

When I change the crossover point for the L/R/C channels nothing happens. It seems to be stuck at 40 Hz.

Those were the settings that were chosen by Audyssey. But when I turn Audyssey off and set to either no EQ or manual EQ, nothing changes when I change the above-noted crossover settings.

Hope that isn't confusing.
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post #15 of 28 Old 02-24-2015, 06:45 PM
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No, I get it. I guess that you need to send it in for repair or try a hard reset.

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post #16 of 28 Old 02-24-2015, 06:51 PM - Thread Starter
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No, I get it. I guess that you need to send it in for repair or try a hard reset.
That's my thinking, too. Had a board replaced about a month ago.

Haven't tried to figure out how to do a hard reset yet. Was hoping to avoid that.

In the mean time I'm waiting for response from tech support.
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post #17 of 28 Old 02-24-2015, 06:59 PM
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I have heard so many bad things about people having issues with Onkyo/Integra. I hope that you get this ironed out. Good luck my friend.

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post #18 of 28 Old 02-24-2015, 10:29 PM
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nice build.


response looks great too.

Listen. It's All Good.
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post #19 of 28 Old 02-25-2015, 12:47 AM
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Looks good. Did you use any damping material? I didn't see any used in the first post.


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post #20 of 28 Old 02-25-2015, 02:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Looks good. Did you use any damping material? I didn't see any used in the first post.
Yes, I did. I used about 4 lb of poly fill in each box. Sorry I didn't mention it.
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post #21 of 28 Old 03-02-2015, 08:25 AM - Thread Starter
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Update on the pre/pro problem.

I did a hard reset on the unit and things are fixed. But one thing I confirmed is that the LPF on the sub channel is in effect regardless of the mode selected on the pre/pro, even direct mode. So if I want a full frequency response measurement of the subs, I will have to run them on another channel.

I'm getting an Emotiva XMC-1 next week, so this is kind of a moot point. Will update after I get the entire system reconfigured next week.

I should also add that I really don't like the iNuke 6000DSP. It is way noisier than I expected, so it gets returned to Sweetwater this week. I could have done the fan mod or located it somewhere else, but I decided to just bite the bullet and spend some more money. Going to run them on mono-bridged Crown XLS2000 amps. Will run 2100W into that 4 ohm load.
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post #22 of 28 Old 03-03-2015, 07:33 AM
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I have a integra had the same problem what it is is it does not care where you set the sub freq it goes off where you set the mains if I set my mains at 60 hz and sub at 100 it will set it at 60 in my sweep so if you set the mains at 100 do a sweep you will see the integra sets the sub with the mains no matter what you can't over lap it won't let you
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post #23 of 28 Old 11-12-2015, 04:12 PM
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Have you run REW since you moved to the crowns? I'm interested in how big (or small) the 20hz highpass is in the Crowns as its my amp of choice but I'd likely go with XLS1500s bridged...
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post #24 of 28 Old 11-13-2015, 04:14 AM
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Interesting. What was total cost including amps, etc. How do they compare to SVS as far as quality goes?

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post #25 of 28 Old 11-13-2015, 06:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Interesting. What was total cost including amps, etc. How do they compare to SVS as far as quality goes?
Total cost including the amps was ~$1,800. Quality compared to my SVS cylinder sub is equivalent in the range that the SVS plays. But one of the benefits of the sealed 18" woofers is that they play loud and low. That couldn't be achieved with SVS without spending multiples of what I spent.
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post #26 of 28 Old 11-13-2015, 09:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pmd918 View Post
Total cost including the amps was ~$1,800. Quality compared to my SVS cylinder sub is equivalent in the range that the SVS plays. But one of the benefits of the sealed 18" woofers is that they play loud and low. That couldn't be achieved with SVS without spending multiples of what I spent.
Thanks. Encouraging. i thought ported subs always played lower: my confusion for sure.

I have a SVS SB-Ultra13 and love it, but I want a second sub. Hard for me to justify a second $1700 for another Ultra13, but would love to build my own and a pair for $1800 sounds good if they are as good as the SVS. I reckon I can get at least $1000 for my mint Ultra 13

I really like the tight bass from the Ultra

How critical are the dimensions for non ported?

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post #27 of 28 Old 11-13-2015, 10:37 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MalevolentHamster View Post
Thanks. Encouraging. i thought ported subs always played lower: my confusion for sure.

I have a SVS SB-Ultra13 and love it, but I want a second sub. Hard for me to justify a second $1700 for another Ultra13, but would love to build my own and a pair for $1800 sounds good if they are as good as the SVS. I reckon I can get at least $1000 for my mint Ultra 13

I really like the tight bass from the Ultra

How critical are the dimensions for non ported?
I should mention that my project would have been $400 cheaper if I would have been willing to stick with the iNuke. But it was too noisy and I didn't want to do the fan mod.

What it boils down to is that ported are typically way louder above the tuning frequency, way bigger, and require less power. But below the tuning frequency the SPL drops off very fast.

With sealed the SPL is lower, but the frequency response is flatter. So people who go this route typically make up for the lost SPL by building multiple sealed subs and use a lot more power.

As an example, I could have gone with one ported HST-18 and gotten equivalent or greater SPL at 20Hz than my two sealed HST-18's. Would have spent half the money. Ported is definitely the king of SPL/$$. But I probably wouldn't have been near as flat down to 10Hz.

There are trade-offs no matter which way you choose to go.

And yes, the internal volume of the cabinet needs to be matched to whatever driver you choose.

Two sealed HST-18's would be way louder than two SB13-Ultra's.
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post #28 of 28 Old 11-13-2015, 10:38 AM
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Nice job! And score on that carpenter!
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