HT-18 Ported - 12 ft^3 @ 20 hz ok? - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 25 Old 09-23-2017, 02:53 PM - Thread Starter
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Question Full Marty HT-18 V2 Inuke 6000 build

Hello,

Just ordered my first real try at a home audio subwoofer, a HT-18. Their website lists the recommended box size for ported at 10 ft^3 at 25 hz. If I am messing around with WinISD correctly, it looks like 12 ft^3 @ 20 hz right be "better"? I have the space to spare, is this a bad idea?

I have attached the WinISD plot.

Green: HT-18 10ft^3 @ 25
Brown: HT-18 12ft^3 @ 20.15
Red: Image Dynamics 12 1.5ft^3 @ 36 (My current laughable subwoofer setup, so bad now that I graphed it.)

My Xover on my receiver auto set to 40hz after doing it's mic check.

Thank you. This forum is extremely helpful, sorry for the noob question.
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post #2 of 25 Old 09-23-2017, 08:10 PM
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for that driver, go as large as you can.
tune for 17-19hz or so in winisd.
actual tuning will come in a couple hz lower.
full marty or equivalent would be a decent choice.
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post #3 of 25 Old 09-26-2017, 12:14 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post
for that driver, go as large as you can.
tune for 17-19hz or so in winisd.
actual tuning will come in a couple hz lower.
full marty or equivalent would be a decent choice.
Thank you LTD02 for the advice, it was really helpful. I got all the supplies to build a Full Marty tomorrow, going to give it a go. Doubt I will get very far. Feels good to not have to worry about all the enclosure specifics. Thank you again.

I have spent almost the cost of the subwoofer on the enclosure. This thing is huge, I really hope it does the job. Using my car audio subwoofer as home theater was a major disappointment.
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post #4 of 25 Old 09-26-2017, 12:57 AM
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no problem. what amp have you got to pair with it all?

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post #5 of 25 Old 09-26-2017, 01:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TweakGames View Post
Thank you LTD02 for the advice, it was really helpful. I got all the supplies to build a Full Marty tomorrow, going to give it a go. Doubt I will get very far. Feels good to not have to worry about all the enclosure specifics. Thank you again.

I have spent almost the cost of the subwoofer on the enclosure. This thing is huge, I really hope it does the job. Using my car audio subwoofer as home theater was a major disappointment.
You got this just take your time.... putting it together is like putting big puzzle together once the glue is on you have time to get the boards all lined up. Having a second set of hands around helps when brad nailing or clamping the panels together. Start with the bottom, back and sides and let the glue dry for a few hours. Once those are up everything else will fall in place.
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post #6 of 25 Old 09-26-2017, 01:57 AM - Thread Starter
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no problem. what amp have you got to pair with it all?
I'm a little embarrassed to say, I am using a car audio amplifier, with a 50 amp power supply.

Alpine MRX-M55
350 watts RMS x 1 at 4 ohms
550 watts RMS x 1 at 2 ohms
400 watts RMS x 1 at 1 ohm

Regulated 50 Amp Compact Power Supply 13.8Vdc (9-15V Adj) w/ Volt
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I have been scared to pull a trigger on an Inuke, for a couple of reasons. The fan noise really worries me, I wish I knew of an alternative that had all the features and power, but wasn't so loud. The power rating for the subwoofer is pretty low compared to others at only 600W. And I am not confident I have any idea what I am doing and have ordered the crappiest cheap subwoofer by mistake and will need to upgrade it to a $1000 subwoofer and monster amp in a couple of months. I have commitment issues.

Am I making a big mistake not getting the Inuke right now? I can order it in the morning and have it here quickly with Amazon Prime. After all this work, I would like the have a good outcome, but more importantly I am doing this in hopes of getting my wife into the home theater is good mindset. I just test fitted our new projector, an Epson Home Cinema 2150. It took a bit to get used to displaying it on the wall, but she has been in good spirits. She is still really stuck on our 7 year old plasma 46. The 100 inch screen will be here tomorrow.

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post #7 of 25 Old 09-26-2017, 01:59 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by eng-399 View Post
You got this just take your time.... putting it together is like putting big puzzle together once the glue is on you have time to get the boards all lined up. Having a second set of hands around helps when brad nailing or clamping the panels together. Start with the bottom, back and sides and let the glue dry for a few hours. Once those are up everything else will fall in place.
Thanks you Eng-399, that helps with the confidence. I watched quite a few videos on how to make straight good cuts, and got a lot of tools to help me. Tons of clamps, glue, screws, huge dowels for reinforcing the box.... I am giving it my best shot!
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post #8 of 25 Old 09-26-2017, 02:36 AM
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you may be a little surprised what you end up with. that amp doesn't appear to have the beefiest power supply, but for your driver in the full marty, it works out that not a ton of current is required from about 25-45hz, which is the wheelhouse for movie bass. you may get a some clipping if pushing it all the way to max on either side of those frequencies in 1 ohm mode. subsonic filter is 4th order and in this can probably be set around 13hz or so. driver wired for 1 ohm looks like the way to go here. a little room gain should carry your extension quite low. seems fine to me. :-)
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post #9 of 25 Old 09-26-2017, 02:46 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post
you may be a little surprised what you end up with. that amp doesn't appear to have the beefiest power supply, but for your driver in the full marty, it works out that not a ton of current is required from about 25-45hz, which is the wheelhouse for movie bass. you may get a some clipping if pushing it all the way to max on either side of those frequencies in 1 ohm mode. subsonic filter is 4th order and in this can probably be set around 13hz or so. driver wired for 1 ohm looks like the way to go here. a little room gain should carry your extension quite low. seems fine to me. :-)
No, it's a weird amp for sure, just a carry over from my old car audio adventures. It has to limit itself output wise at 1 ohm to be stable, although I have never felt it get warm. Would be nice to get the normal expected 1000w output at 1 ohm. I don't even see any of the Inukes or Crown's that appear stable at 1 ohm. This amplifier does have subsonic filter, so that will be helpful. I look forward to being surprised and hopefully seeing that reluctant smile on my wives face when she realizes how her movie watching experience has changed forever!

Thank you again for the help. I will hopefully have some pictures posted up tomorrow with the progress!

I will keep an eye on Ebay for another exact amp like that, then I should be able to put one on each coil at 2 ohms for 1100 watts total.

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post #10 of 25 Old 09-26-2017, 11:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Talking

Made some good progress today!

Cut, pre-fit, and glued+screwed down the outside of the box today. Also got our 100 inch screen installed for the projector, now I need to mount the projector on the ceiling. Getting there slowly! Starting to get excited, need to find some good wife approved, home theater media prepared.

Quick question on the Full Marty box. Should I be concerned about "chuffing" or port noise with this design? Should I round the edges of the ports entrance and exit?
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post #11 of 25 Old 09-28-2017, 10:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Hey all,

Foam came in! Subwoofer should be here later today if I don't miss the Fedex guy!

Any tips on the foam? Try to cover all the wood minus blocking the port? How important is it to get every spot? I know I need the foam, but it seems so counter intuitive. I purchased 5 of these: 4 Pack- Acoustic Panels Studio Foam Convoluted 2.5" X 12" X 12" Sound Tiles "Egg Crate"
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Also, going to cut the hole for the subwoofer tonight, looks like it should be 16.7 inches diameter. Is it OK to put it all the way on the top of the face (port) side? I was thinking of making room for another 18 if I ever want to replace this subwoofer with 2 HST-18 MKII 18″ subwoofers. Looks like they need a lot less space ported:

"Ported enclosure size of 6 ft^3 tuned to 22 Hz"

Going to brace the box with the dowels in the picture. I hope I have enough, this box is quite large.

Thanks guys!
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post #12 of 25 Old 09-28-2017, 02:50 PM
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Looking great! Keep up the good work. You’ll be making noise in no time! Yeah use that foam to fill in everything minus the port.


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post #13 of 25 Old 09-28-2017, 02:52 PM
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Missed your question. I’m not certain on the driver placement. I would personally install it centered and build another box if you are going to get another driver down the road. That’s just my $.02


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post #14 of 25 Old 09-28-2017, 03:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Missed your question. I’m not certain on the driver placement. I would personally install it centered and build another box if you are going to get another driver down the road. That’s just my $.02


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Awesome, thank you for your help! I hope to have the bracing and foam done tonight.

Next I need to figure out how to double the front face with glue and nails? Also, how the heck I am going to get glue on the side, but still slide them in. I think I did it in the wrong order.

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post #15 of 25 Old 09-28-2017, 03:03 PM
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I individually cut the driver hole for the two baffle pieces, then glued them together. After letting it sit for a good day, I cut the holes for the driver. You can check my marty build out. It’s full of pictures and text.


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post #16 of 25 Old 09-29-2017, 11:20 AM - Thread Starter
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I caved! I bought the inuke 6000dsp. Figured I could power both the subs at the same time, I can limit the power, gives me room to grow, and I can tune it better with the dsp. Now I need to figure out the plugs.
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post #17 of 25 Old 09-30-2017, 12:21 PM - Thread Starter
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Got the circles cut, the double front holder, some foam in, and the dowels setup. Is this enough bracing guys?
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post #18 of 25 Old 09-30-2017, 05:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Alright put it all together, I hope. Feel like I forgot something, but can't really go back now!
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post #19 of 25 Old 09-30-2017, 06:01 PM - Thread Starter
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Couple more pictures.
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post #20 of 25 Old 10-02-2017, 11:15 AM - Thread Starter
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The Inuke 6000 dsp showed up and I finished the subwoofer Saturday night! Got to start testing it out yesterday. I currently don't have any HPF on the HT-18 because it seems like the Inuke's filter range only goes down to 20hz? That's a bit of a disappointment. Looks like I need to purchase a miniDSP 2x4?

I had the LPF on my receiver (Old Onkyo TX-NR509) set to 40Hz. I raised it to 50Hz as my center's rear port was really moving a ton of air at 40. The HT-18 didn't seem to mind.

(Warning: Audio noob opinion ahead) My initial reaction was that the ht-18 was extremely transparent compared to the car subwoofer tuned to 38 we were using before. It didn't seem to peak or be harsh during any of the 3 movies we watched. I even did some low volume frequency test from my PC and it was nice and smooth everywhere from 15 to 50. I definitely noticed everything new that we were missing before, the feel especially, without it being harsh or hurting our ears. Before, every time the old subwoofer was activated, it sounded like the same tone, over and over. Like a tuba playing the same note over and over. This actually had smooth, musical, range. Our 3 Pomeranians definitely did also, they got extremely scared and ran every time something happened. They will get used to it. I couldn't get a solid response from my wife sadly, and I like to think that was because it was so transparent that it's the way it "should" sound and feel, but she has never really payed attention. I will have to get a 3rd person opinion when a friend comes over.

Now with that being said, I have a couple questions that someone might be point me in the correct direction.

The Inuke 6000 is turned up to about 75%, yet it's not even blinking the first output LED. I checked inside the software and it was never getting even close to the max output or close to clipping. Is that because my Onkyo is pushing out a weak .2V subwoofer signal out the RCA? Should I upgrade receivers, or will the miniDSP fix that also?

The Inuke has a second channel, and has the DSP feature, would there be any advantage to turning the LPF on my receiver up higher to 80Hz, and putting my 12 inch car woofer in the 50-80Hz range? I think I would move it back into it's sealed enclosure if this is a good idea. My guess it it would further relieve my center (Old/cheap Polk Audio CS2 Series II) and Left/Rights (Old/cheap Polk Audio Monitor70 Series II Floorstanding) from playing the lower frequencies? I'm not sure if this is a good idea or even worth the hassle yet.

Thanks so much for all the help guys. The box recommendations and help building was greatly appreciated, and appear to be on point!

Here are a couple pictures of things in their temp testing locations. I got the subwoofer in the corner to the right of the couch, and the Inuke had to go into another room for now.
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post #21 of 25 Old 10-02-2017, 11:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TweakGames View Post
The Inuke 6000 dsp showed up and I finished the subwoofer Saturday night! Got to start testing it out yesterday. I currently don't have any HPF on the HT-18 because it seems like the Inuke's filter range only goes down to 20hz? That's a bit of a disappointment. Looks like I need to purchase a miniDSP 2x4? ...

No need for a MiniDSP. That's why you bought the iNuke.


Set the High Pass to 20 Hz (12 dB Butterworth) and on the Parametric EQ tab set a High Shelf (HS12) for 20 Hz at -3.5 dB. This will effectively push your High Pass below 20 Hz to about 18 Hz.

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post #22 of 25 Old 10-02-2017, 02:45 PM - Thread Starter
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No need for a MiniDSP. That's why you bought the iNuke.


Set the High Pass to 20 Hz (12 dB Butterworth) and on the Parametric EQ tab set a High Shelf (HS12) for 20 Hz at -3.5 dB. This will effectively push your High Pass below 20 Hz to about 18 Hz.
Thank you Augerhandle! Saved me from wasting a [̲̅$̲̅(̲̅ιοο̲̅)̲̅$̲̅]! Went ahead and set it up like you mentioned, seems to be working great.

I also wired up my second sub as the dedicated 40-100Hz subwoofer. Used an RCA splitter to send the subwoofer signal to both channels. Is there a way to not have to use that splitter?

After some testing I picked the most aggressive slope or else both subwoofers were active almost all the time. I have no clue is this is the correct way to do it, but it seems to work. If anybody has any advise on doing this better, please let me know.

Thank you all again!

Below are the settings I have in the software.
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post #23 of 25 Old 10-02-2017, 04:03 PM - Thread Starter
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Thank you Augerhandle! Saved me from wasting a [̲̅$̲̅(̲̅ιοο̲̅)̲̅$̲̅]! Went ahead and set it up like you mentioned, seems to be working great.

I also wired up my second sub as the dedicated 40-100Hz subwoofer. Used an RCA splitter to send the subwoofer signal to both channels. Is there a way to not have to use that splitter?

After some testing I picked the most aggressive slope or else both subwoofers were active almost all the time. I have no clue is this is the correct way to do it, but it seems to work. If anybody has any advise on doing this better, please let me know.

Thank you all again!

Below are the settings I have in the software.

Ok, strike that. Dedicated subwoofer from 40-100hz gave me a headache to the point of being nauseous after about 15 minutes. Not sure why, I double checked the phase on the subs and speakers, they are all correct. After some individual speaker testing with my ear meter and a tone generator website, my center/mains easily go down past 50hz, and the subwoofer seems to respond well after 80hz. I set my crossover at 50 for now, and am just going to stop messing with it.
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post #24 of 25 Old 10-04-2017, 05:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Double strike that! I took the day to try a few more things with the double subwoofer setup.

I ended up moving the 12 inch subwoofer from the ported enclosure to a sealed, moved the receiver's LPF to 70hz, and changed the subwoofers crossover type to a much smoother butterworth 28 crossing at 55 hz. Have listened to it for 3 hours now trying all different sorts of content. Movies, TV, commercials, pop music, country, rap, ... they all sound smooth and balanced. Also, didn't get a hint of a headache.

Raised the volume to as loud as my windows would allow before they started shaking and everything still sounded great. The house next to me's dogs started barking though, so I think I found the limit on that! My wife would never allow that in the house, so I think I am good for a bit.

My future plans now are to ditch the main floorstanding speakers for some smaller bookshelves mounted to the wall, and get a new clearer center.

Thank all for all your help. Mission successful as far as I am concerned!

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post #25 of 25 Old 10-07-2017, 11:49 AM
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Check out the mtg90 subwoofer integration thread in my sig. Depending on how far apart the subs are you may need to delay them separately. Also, I think you can run one wire to the iNuke and use bi-amp1 to split the signal inside the amp. Congrats!
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