Jumped in with both feet, burned up deflection board. - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 20 Old 04-01-2010, 10:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi everybody, I'm Russell, new to the forums. I've had a natural interest in audio for the last 10+ yrs and finally built up a mediocre 7.1 Cambridge Newton T500 setup recently with Carver Silver Sevens, Pioneer elite THX (60tx or something) reciever as my pre-amp and a few other goodies that don't really fit into my 26 yr old single guy budget.

With all of this audio I maxed out my budget and have been "enjoying" my home cinema with a POS 96'' chinese digital PJ. SO a CRT front projection setup gets me all worked up!!!

I finally made the investment and purchased a Runco IDP900 with literally no phosphor use...

I unfortunately didn't do all my research and hooked up a Quadrupler (Faroudja's VP400A, another uneducated purchase) to my Runco IDP900 (NEC 6PG) 8 incher and after doing some rough convergence and focusing I learned the hard way that my new girl can't process that much love...720p and no more. Click. No more love. Fans will activate for 2-3 seconds when I try to power it back up and it shuts itself down.

1 email and 25 minutes later Curt Palme emailed me back saying is was the Horizontal deflection board. Luckily, he says it won't be a problem to fix...but it's a $200 repair. PLUS, another couple hundred for a HDF2. I feel like I'm never gonna contribute to the screen shot wars!!!

Am I heading into a bottomless $$$ pit? I've got the stamina to keep with it if you guys think this would be the right path to navigate. I sure don't want digital. Should I become another mindless Plasma/LED/LCD zombie?

Thanks guys, Russ
LL
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post #2 of 20 Old 04-02-2010, 07:36 AM
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My experience is that once set up CRTs are quite reliable. I cannot recall one failure in the various ones I have owned over the last 8 years once I got them mounted and using them regularly. Playing the surplus roulette with projectors I have had to fix them (board swap really) on many occasions when I got them but once they were going they were great.
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post #3 of 20 Old 04-02-2010, 11:41 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by secstate View Post

My experience is that once set up CRTs are quite reliable. I cannot recall one failure in the various ones I have owned over the last 8 years once I got them mounted and using them regularly. Playing the surplus roulette with projectors I have had to fix them (board swap really) on many occasions when I got them but once they were going they were great.

That's what it seems like. If you hook everything up correctly and don't push it they're plenty reliable.

Thanks for the reply.
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post #4 of 20 Old 04-03-2010, 12:15 AM
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If it motivates you at all, I installed an NEC 6 Pg today with an original 677 hours on it. No wear on the tubes, but I changed a number of parts in the unit due to age.

A multimillion dollar home, and the owner had sold it, only to realize his 10 year old Vidikron POS CRT projector died sometime in the last year while he wasn't using it. I tried repairing it, but had no info on it, and thus sold him the NEC so he could say the theater worked.

This was a 10+ year old system. One line doubler, no HD, and since the house was sold, he had no interest in upgrading it to HD.

Once I started aligning the projector, I found that the Svideo input of the doubler had also died, so all we used was composite through the doubler to the projector. While not quite HD quality of course, the 5th Element was still damn amazing for 15 year old technology, and the customer was so impressed, he's hiring me and the ISF guy to put a 9" set into the new home he's building, construction to complete in July 2011.

Customer said that no digital he'd seen came close to the 3D image he saw from a CRT, and I agree with him. In his really nicely set up HT room, the image sang.





So really... what's stopping you?

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post #5 of 20 Old 04-03-2010, 06:36 AM
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Just get the projector fixed and don't make the same mistake twice

I would also recommend setting up both 1080i and 720p on your projector. Anything 1080p/i native you should watch at 1080i and anything 720p native you should watch at 720p. You will get a much better image for 1080 material that way.

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post #6 of 20 Old 04-04-2010, 03:33 PM
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Russ

welcome to the "dark" side, and no CRTs are not bottomless money pits!!!

With a little bit of research and effort you could have avoided this little problem of yours altogether! (...and 1080i is more than adequate for your NEC!)

Just send your board in for Curt to repair/service (...or try and find someone that has spares to sell you!)

Then concentrate on setting it up properly and converging it perfection! (...then chance are that you will enjoy it for a long long time to come!)

Good luck and sorry to hear that yet another CRT was blown due to the owner trying to "overdrive" it!

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post #7 of 20 Old 04-04-2010, 06:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the replies guys!

I'll be sending them to Curt. He offered to touch up a few other boards that often have problems with age. CS has been great on his end so far. That goes a long way with me.

I'm excited to get this going!
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post #8 of 20 Old 04-04-2010, 06:56 PM
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Russ

I am pretty certain that you will not be disappointed with the end results (PQ wise!) ...once everything is setup and you're enjoying your first CRT movie!

Martin
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post #9 of 20 Old 04-04-2010, 11:16 PM
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I don't want to be the minority here............but here is my two cents.
I had a very nice front projector, an NEC 10PG setup meticulously, professionally, by none other than Mr. Doug Baisey. Doug and I became good friends from his frequent trips to my house to fix the NEC for a number of things.........several boards, tube replaced for a glycol leak.......anyway. The story ended sadly. I couldnt afford to keep spending money on the beast. If you aren't the type of guy who can get in there and repair things without occasionally messing up every once in a while ( fix it and leave it alone) I believe was the term Doug used quite often...........well, you should carefuly consider things.... No doubt I miss my CRT, but it going down during movie nights, or when I had company in town......kinda sucks. If I had a lemon, Doug never told me it was, so it's kind of hard for anyone here to self assure you that things will work out...........there are no guarantees with these monsters. It's just not that way sometimes......bottom line is I would have some money set aside when things don't go quite the way you hope. I don't remember how much I spent all toll getting it up and running.......but it was more than I care to admit.......and I don't make that much to begin with.

One last thing, no offense guys, CRT's are awesome for many of you..........but CRT's aren't always reliable............I'm just trying to be honest with the guy here since he asked.
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post #10 of 20 Old 04-04-2010, 11:44 PM
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Scopeboy

I will be the first to admit that CRTs are not for everyone, and I am also sorry that you got yourself a lemon as your first CRT experience!!!

Here is a case in point:

My first marquee 8500 that I got locally for less than 500 bucks is still running as a spare pj in my brothers bedroom at his house! ...and it has been close to five years since I got it and the only money that I have ever spent on it was to get a first gen Moome card when they first came out! ...that is it!

So if you do get something that is in a good shape to begin with then chances are that it will "live" a lot longer than any so called "digital" that I know of! ...and with the least amount of maintenance!

My second CRT was a Barco 801s and that one is also working! (I sold it to a neighbor of mine, so I guess once in a while you do get a device that is just problematic to begin with, but you should not be looking at all CRTs based on that one messed up experience!)

Anyhow the OP will do what he thinks is best for him anyway! (...we can yap all we want but chances are the if he is going to be sending in his boards for servicing, then he is planning to keep his CRT for a while longer, specially if it has pristine tubes to begin with!)

Anyhow good luck to all of you (CRT'er or not!!!)

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post #11 of 20 Old 04-05-2010, 12:29 AM
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Don't get me wrong..............nothing made me happier than when I was watching movies on that projector...........nothing except my baby girl anyway......and I wouldn't have traded those times no matter what the cost, b/c for me, it was all worth it. Its just that I spent a lot of money for that happiness is what I was trying to point out. I agree though, CRT's are brilliant at what they do. It's a shame that when they do go down.........ouch, hurts the pocketbook. But he realizes that now already obviously.
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post #12 of 20 Old 04-05-2010, 06:32 AM
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Scopeboy, no question some chassis seem to fail more than others. That's why I'm offering to do some cap upgrades to other boards in his set. I've done that with sets for years now, do a bunch of preventative maintenance of parts that commonly fail. I've only recently started doing it with NEC PG chassis, as up to recently I didn't really notice a trend with component failures of certain parts. I believe in your case that Doug may not have done that, and I'll also say that I've NEVER heard of a glycol leak in a 10PG, so that's rare indeed.

You are right, with digitals, you do not do repairs. You throw them out, and spend $1000-5000 for a new one. I can do a whooooole messload of repairs for $1000 on any projector.

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post #13 of 20 Old 04-05-2010, 10:13 AM - Thread Starter
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This is great getting opinions from both sides. I was sure I was gonna hear a horror story or two.

I called my local high end HT shop and they tried to "scare" me into a digital as well. I'm no rocket scientist, but I know when someone feeds me a line. Also, as Curt pointed out, a repair is a hell of a lot cheaper than a new digital (especially one that is on par with what I've got). AND these tubes are very low hours and pretty much perfect.

I think I'll sell my quadrupler to help offset the repair costs. It too is in mint condition.

I'm looking forward to this projectors fun quibbles and adjustments. I'm a pretty handy guy, I installed HT (basic whole home audio with zone switches, pre-amps, a couple tube amps with some nice balanced interconnects, a few digital PJs, no CRT, I'm a young'n) for a few years and now make my living restoring old 911's. I don't mind pulling the boards and figuring out how this thing is put together. Seems straight forward (unlike redundant German 12v electrical) and plug and play. I'll just need to keep doing my homework before I get my hands dirty under this hood

BTW, Prehjan, A Marquee 8500 for under $500! I hate you Especially since I paid for shipping on this one too...not cheap. I wanna get this up and going so I can start enjoying movies again. I find that I don't want to watch (and waste) my favorites on my POS digital. I'll save them for the CRT. I can barely see through my screen door!
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post #14 of 20 Old 04-05-2010, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Curt Palme View Post


Customer said that no digital he'd seen came close to the 3D image he saw from a CRT, and I agree with him.

So really... what's stopping you?

3D image from Digital Projectors will change alot this year I bet.

=Brian
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post #15 of 20 Old 04-05-2010, 10:48 AM
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hehehehe

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post #16 of 20 Old 04-05-2010, 03:53 PM
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Despite all the hype about 3D, I'll bet it's a flash in the pan, and will be virtually (pun intended!) non existent in 2-3 years.

www.curtpalme.com - CRT tech info

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post #17 of 20 Old 04-05-2010, 04:29 PM
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I hope you are wrong Curt. There is finally something my CRT cannot do (or do well enough), and I will ditch it if need be. I never had a reason before, it's 13 years old, fully HD capable, reliable and looks awesome.

But it doesn't help that they do rushed 3D conversions like Clash of the Titans (or so I've read). 3D needs to be crafted in carefully from the start, not slapped on afterwoods.

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post #18 of 20 Old 04-05-2010, 05:43 PM
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Well, I personally don't care either way, as I have a lazy eye and can never see the 3D effect anyways, either from a Viewmaster (remember those?), TV or film, regardless of what type.

Still, well over 1/2 of the AV installers I talk to say it's going to be a waste of time and money, and the rest of the installers don't dare say that for fear of losing sales.

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post #19 of 20 Old 04-05-2010, 07:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Russ993TT View Post

This is great getting opinions from both sides. I was sure I was gonna hear a horror story or two.

I called my local high end HT shop and they tried to "scare" me into a digital as well. I'm no rocket scientist, but I know when someone feeds me a line. Also, as Curt pointed out, a repair is a hell of a lot cheaper than a new digital (especially one that is on par with what I've got). AND these tubes are very low hours and pretty much perfect.

I think I'll sell my quadrupler to help offset the repair costs. It too is in mint condition.

I'm looking forward to this projectors fun quibbles and adjustments. I'm a pretty handy guy, I installed HT (basic whole home audio with zone switches, pre-amps, a couple tube amps with some nice balanced interconnects, a few digital PJs, no CRT, I'm a young'n) for a few years and now make my living restoring old 911's. I don't mind pulling the boards and figuring out how this thing is put together. Seems straight forward (unlike redundant German 12v electrical) and plug and play. I'll just need to keep doing my homework before I get my hands dirty under this hood

BTW, Prehjan, A Marquee 8500 for under $500! I hate you Especially since I paid for shipping on this one too...not cheap. I wanna get this up and going so I can start enjoying movies again. I find that I don't want to watch (and waste) my favorites on my POS digital. I'll save them for the CRT. I can barely see through my screen door!

Well..........you sound like the kind of guy that DOESN'T mind getting his fingers dirty a little bit............I say go for it!! Honestly, if I was technically proficient enough,I would have learned to set it up myself. But, I'm not as smart with that as I thought, and so I paid Doug to do it for me.........it just takes time, and for most of us nowadays........that is worth paying for. Now I'm dealing with all the pitfalls of plasma............and I'm about to throw my San Diego Chargers mini-helmet through the damned thing already.........looooong story. I hope you get a solid unit, and I know Curt will take care of you.......he's been here helping newbies for a looong time so you are in good hands. I have a 2 year old now..........so my time is limited to mess with CRT, no matter how great it was.
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post #20 of 20 Old 04-05-2010, 07:52 PM
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3d is kinda like something that comes out ahead of its time and usually dies right afterwards!

Personally I don't think that its time has come, and it has been said that it has been "coming" so many times before! (...since the 40's and 50's. maybe even before that time, and we still don't have it!!!)

Remember the 3d LEDs that were selling for ridiculous amounts of cash a couple of years ago? where are they now?


Short of us having the tech/ability to do holo suite type things and virtual stuff there is not going to be any 3d revolution, period!!!

Martin
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