SCORE - just picked up 3 nec xg1100LC for $200 - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 31 Old 10-11-2010, 07:15 AM - Thread Starter
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Incredible! I have been so pissed off with my ampro4600 that I have been randomly searching the local CL and just came across a deal of a life time. Got 3 NEC XG1101LC with 2 wireless remotes, ceiling mount bracket, and a custom coffee table (for floor mounting) for $200. Two of the units are perfectly working with less than 2000 hours and the other is a parts unit. Funny cause prior to my ampro4600 I had a NEC XG75 (non LC) which I thought had a great picture - maybe that is why I was so pissed with the ampro cause I came from the best and thus the 9" ampro was just a big dinosaur unable to compete.

Anyway, anyone know roughly what my ampro is worth - it will come with a custom coffee table (for floor mounting) and the wired remote.

Also at this time I'm not sure what I'll do with the other working unit, but it will likely also go on the auction block - anyone know what a XG1101LC is worth?

Thanks
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post #2 of 31 Old 10-11-2010, 07:46 AM
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That is really nice. LC and a great NEC to boot.

I would keep at least two, one for parts.

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post #3 of 31 Old 10-11-2010, 11:36 AM
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sell one for 300 and buy the xg 1.3 hdmi card to add to the one you keep
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post #4 of 31 Old 10-11-2010, 02:40 PM
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That is interesting, because a well set up and working 4600 should put out a very nice picture and be better than any 8".

Good score on the NEC.

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post #5 of 31 Old 10-11-2010, 03:54 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericglo View Post

That is interesting, because a well set up and working 4600 should put out a very nice picture and be better than any 8".

Good score on the NEC.

As per Curts Projector Rating guide, that is not true. Projectors are ranked, and the NEC XG LC is quite a bit better than the ampro4600. The ampro4600 is slightly higher ranked than the nec XG non-LC (which I used to have) but I will say that the ampro is barely (if at all) better than the non LC. That is why I'm so disappointed with it - it is a monster (double the size of a NEC XG) but really no better. For its size (and ugly appearance) I was expecting something awesome - the ampro is not that.

Thanks
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post #6 of 31 Old 10-11-2010, 05:18 PM
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I bet money a XG LC I setup with some TLC would look better than a Ampro 4600

get the external moome V2 unit with MP mods over the input card

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post #7 of 31 Old 10-12-2010, 05:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary Murrell View Post

get the external moome V2 unit with MP mods over the input card

-Gary

If you can still get the input card, I would certainly buy that instead of the external box. The input card passes full 1080p 60Hz very cleanly and is better filtered than the external. Ask Moome if he still has any new input cards.

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post #8 of 31 Old 10-12-2010, 08:01 PM
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Craig, the HDMI 1.3 internal for the XG was one of the first developed and doesn't have any of the updates or improvements that the Sony/Ehome internal cards offer, it is a old design unlike the latest amazing internals for the Sony/Ehome, moome needs to make a new design NEC card(unless he has and I am not aware of it)

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post #9 of 31 Old 10-12-2010, 08:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dna_alexoov View Post

the 9" ampro was just a big dinosaur unable to compete.

Anyway, anyone know roughly what my ampro is worth - it will come with a custom coffee table (for floor mounting) and the wired remote.

Also at this time I'm not sure what I'll do with the other working unit, but it will likely also go on the auction block - anyone know what a XG1101LC is worth?

Thanks

The Ampro dinosaur that can't compete ? Worth about a dollar, maybe less to the right person, and you just bought the XGLC for, what, $66. ? What makes them worth MORE than that all of a sudden ?

Just for comparison the last NEC's I BOUGHT (a couple of 852's and a 1352LC) were $50. each, and the last NEC I GOT were free...

PS: Good luck getting an NEC to do 1080p. It's impossible without an outboard scaler capable of custom porches...
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post #10 of 31 Old 10-12-2010, 09:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dna_alexoov View Post

As per Curts Projector Rating guide, that is not true. Projectors are ranked, and the NEC XG LC is quite a bit better than the ampro4600. The ampro4600 is slightly higher ranked than the nec XG non-LC (which I used to have) but I will say that the ampro is barely (if at all) better than the non LC. That is why I'm so disappointed with it - it is a monster (double the size of a NEC XG) but really no better. For its size (and ugly appearance) I was expecting something awesome - the ampro is not that.

Thanks

That ranking list is highly subjective.

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post #11 of 31 Old 10-12-2010, 09:51 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by none74 View Post

and you just bought the XGLC for, what, $66. ? What makes them worth MORE than that all of a sudden ?

Ebay, Videogon and CL (and of course Curts website) makes them worth MORE all of a sudden. Finding a great condition NEC XG for $66 (or your $50 or free) is a deal of a life-time. For someone looking for a nice crt, they can either wait to see if they ever 'win' the lottery or buy at market value. Market value says a great condition XGLC is easily worth $500. The XGLC is rated in the middle range of the high-end porojectors - if you are trying to suggest they are worth a buck then you are saying any/all crt are worth nothing.
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post #12 of 31 Old 10-12-2010, 09:54 PM
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I honestly wish you the BEST of luck selling them for anything close to that, really, good luck, your advertisement here is your best bet, but there's a really slim outside chance that someone *might* buy one via C or videogon, post back here if you sell one, I'd be interested to see that happen...

PS: And yes, my personal opinion is that CRT projectors are essentially worthless now...I wish it were 5 years ago and you could turn your $200. into $2000. without doing anything, but its not...
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post #13 of 31 Old 10-13-2010, 09:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dna_alexoov View Post

Ebay, Videogon and CL (and of course Curts website) makes them worth MORE all of a sudden. Finding a great condition NEC XG for $66 (or your $50 or free) is a deal of a life-time. For someone looking for a nice crt, they can either wait to see if they ever 'win' the lottery or buy at market value. Market value says a great condition XGLC is easily worth $500. The XGLC is rated in the middle range of the high-end porojectors - if you are trying to suggest they are worth a buck then you are saying any/all crt are worth nothing.

I agree none74 might be a bit extreme but unless you are a reseller or get lucky I think $500 is about the max for an 8" set these days. Curt and a few others get prices that no regular person can. Many of the projectors on CL and Ebay are obscenely over priced and don't sell. On CL if the projector doesn't sell in the first week or less it is probably overpriced. You got a great deal no doubt about it but it is not quite as exceptional as you might think these days. I got too late model Barco 1209s (Runco clones) last year for $100/ apiece and I have seen quite a few other 9" projectors in the sub $1000 range over the last year on Ebay, Videgon and CL. Winning the CRT lottery these days is a whole lot easier. If I were you I'd start high and see what you get, you may get lucky or you may not but I do think your sense of value is a bit inflated.
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post #14 of 31 Old 10-19-2010, 04:34 PM
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I would be interested in that set for a fair price. I have been looking for a LC Nec. You can PM me here if you like.

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post #15 of 31 Old 10-30-2010, 10:01 AM
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He might not need to sell the NEC's if he sells the 4600 on e-bay which doesn't have all the original boards, needs the coolant changed in all three tubes, not even a green c-element and used someone elses screen shot for the add

Current owner of the last/best AmPro on the planet. The mighty 4600HD, and it's still running...better than Barco's, especially southern ones.
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post #16 of 31 Old 10-30-2010, 12:57 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stefuel View Post

He might not need to sell the NEC's if he sells the 4600 on e-bay which doesn't have all the original boards, needs the coolant changed in all three tubes, not even a green c-element and used someone elses screen shot for the add

The tubes do not need coolant changed. Yes I did find some drops of liquid under the case when I moved it, but I checked it over daily since and there is no signs of liquid inside anywhere. I took off the lenses and the CRT look excellent in terms of zero burn in. And when fired up, there is no sign of any issues with the CRTs. The CRT has all the boards needed - if you did your research you would see that the 4600 shared many boards of other Ampros - just cause some may be from another model means nothing - **** I bet your car has some after market parts - does that change the make/model??? As for the picture I used, I explained in the ad that this was an example of what the unit was capable of - I explained that I myself could never get an awesome picture out of it, at least not what I'd expect from 9" machines.

Anyway, it is for sale and the price is fair. The hd10gt17 lenses alone sell for $400 (check out videogon) - the remote sells between $50 to $100 - the extron I'm including sells for $50. I'm sure the small incremental difference is well worth a fully functioning unit is what appears as great shape.
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post #17 of 31 Old 10-31-2010, 09:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dna_alexoov View Post

The tubes do not need coolant changed. Yes I did find some drops of liquid under the case when I moved it, but I checked it over daily since and there is no signs of liquid inside anywhere.

I think stufel might be referring to the fact that the coolant looks pretty yellow in the shots though this could just as easily be an artifact of the photo taking. Also one minor nit since you aren't willing to package or take to shipper (I don't blame you) you really should have local pickup only and not freight in your shipping option. Also since you won't be shipping, keep in mind that Paypal is going to be high risk for you. If you don't have a tracking number the person purchasing can do an item not received (INR) and they'll get all their money back from Paypal who will then come after you for it. It doesn't matter if you have a picture of them picking up the projector and a letter from them saying how much the love it with no tracking number it is an automatic win for the buyer. The odds of this happening are probably low but not 0.
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post #18 of 31 Old 11-05-2010, 09:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dna_alexoov View Post

Anyway, it is for sale and the price is fair. The hd10gt17 lenses alone sell for $400 (check out videogon) - the remote sells between $50 to $100 - the extron I'm including sells for $50. I'm sure the small incremental difference is well worth a fully functioning unit is what appears as great shape.

As the auction may have indicated (it didn't sell) the parts for many CRTs are worth more than the whole. I am not saying you price wasn't fair just that the market is pretty much dead except for high end 9" sets (the Ampro rightly or wrongly isn't normally considered a high end 9") unless you get lucky with a local buyer. You might be better off parting out sad though it may be. 9" tubes and the lenses still have a fair amount of value potentially. I am not familiar with Ampro's but some of the boards probably have value as well.
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post #19 of 31 Old 11-05-2010, 09:13 AM
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what tubes does this ampro have/use ?
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post #20 of 31 Old 11-05-2010, 03:53 PM
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It should have some form of the MEC p19/PT22 9" tube in it. It might even have the higher res 9" tubes which would be even more desirable. Those higher res tubes came with later model Barcos and Amrpos. You can tell if you have them by the white ceramic insulators around the gun. Basically they should swap into any 9" set that came with MEC tubes though you would need to swap the hardware and, at least on the Marquee mod the neckboard I believe.
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post #21 of 31 Old 11-05-2010, 06:34 PM
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I'm not saying this is the case...but I once owned an Ampro 4600 which had over 40,000 hours on the tubes, and they looked exactly like the tubes in the Ampro that was on ebay....no sign of wear AT ALL, the only clue the hour meter in the Ampro I owned was totally accurate was the fact that the image was dimmer than it should have been for 9" tubes, and poorly focused, impossible to "dial in"....

If tube hours are unknown(scrambled hour counter, etc.), then without some kind of objective emission test, its impossible to gauge a tubes true usefulness by just looking at the phosphor. I've also owned a Marquee 9500LC with pure white tubes that produced virtually NO light output. They were filament burned, even though when I blindly got into the service menu and turned the drive up all the way so I could faintly make out the internal menus, it showed less than 2000 hours of use on the tubes...
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post #22 of 31 Old 11-05-2010, 07:17 PM
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Good point I had forgotten about the corrupted hour count.
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post #23 of 31 Old 11-05-2010, 07:41 PM - Thread Starter
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You may have a point, as I could never get the focus to where I thought a 9" should be, and I did have to fiddle with the G2 to get the colors right. Even with G2 adjustments, I find the colors on my NEC XG way better.

On the other hand, I bought the Ampro from a literally rich guy in Vancouver - the guys house was easily 7 million. I can't see why he would have tried to screw me for a few extra hun. Further Curt knew the guy and actually knows this projector very well (talking with Curt he has serviced this unit). In fact the day I bought it Curt was planning to come the next day to buy it too (I beat him to the punch). After I bought it Curt told me he would pay me the exact amount I bought for it if I ever wanted to sell it (no questions asked). So I doubt the hours are anywhere near 80,000 or anywhere near a condition where they are dead. I guess I could take Curt up on the offer except I now live in Calgary and shipping now makes it more complex.

I am seriously considering parting it out. This weekend I will put it back on ebay, and try a few more times (I will however drop to $650 which will be the lowest). If I do not sell in the next few weeks I will take every screw off the unit and sell it all (even the screws

So if anyone needs parts, start sending me PM along with what you feel is a fair/good deal.

Thanks


So if anyone
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post #24 of 31 Old 11-05-2010, 07:46 PM
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From what you say, there is more likelihood that the tubes are either dead or used up, without a reliable hour meter, you can't know how long it was used, it could have been run 24/7 with a screen saver loop of video so it was always ready to go for the former rich owner...

If you get $650. for it whole, you'd be doing EXTREMELY well, imho...

I just parted out a Marquee 8500LC with tubes that I installed myself from new from VDC, it got parted out with less than 1000 verifiable hours on the new tubes because I didn't receive a single offer to buy it whole, and I would have taken $500. for it whole, just to sell it as a working projector for someone to enjoy...

Curt sells ALL OVER THE WORLD, ask him how many projectors he's sold in the last 6 months, I'd bet its less than 6 in total...
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post #25 of 31 Old 11-06-2010, 03:53 AM
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Having looked at the ad, If I were a betting man, I'd say the tubes are good. As far as color reproduction goes, going from a NEC to any LC without green and red c-elements is a justifiable complaint. In my opinion, NEC sets the standard for color reproduction. Now if you add new fluid and colored c-elements to a good condition 4600 you can come damn close to that color reproduction. I know as I have both.

Electronic focus can be a bit of a issue as not all focus adustments are menu driven and are board level adjustments but once set can provide very tight focus from edge to edge as long as you don't get to close to the tubes edge.

Mechanical focus is the biggest problem with the AmPro LC's. It's a coupling design flaw that is most noticable with a 4:3 aspect ratio where if it's ceiling mounted will result in poor optical focus on the bottom of the screen and visa'versa if table mounted. If you are projecting a widescreen aspect ratio, the problem is way reduced as you are getting away from the problem area.

In the right hands, a 4600 can produce a stunning image when used for home theater. If however you are looking for a PC monitor for graphics displays, you are looking at the wrong projector.

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post #26 of 31 Old 11-06-2010, 04:04 AM
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Here is a screen shot from a stock 4600 with only a green c-element. It is standard DVD upscaled to 1080P from a TAW Rock scaler on a 100 inch wide screen in my shop. I did not have a HD feed to my shop at that time.
LL

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post #27 of 31 Old 11-06-2010, 10:54 AM
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A good way to tell if the tubes are high hour or not is to look at the glass around the gun, deposits built up there over time on the inside. The clearer that area is the better. If you do decide to break up the set take a photo of that area that might help sellers determine they are decent tubes. Also don't forget if your tubes have both ceramic insulators that are white then you have high res 9" tubes and these are a significant step up over the standard res tubes. It might help your sale of the whole projector for that matter.
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post #28 of 31 Old 11-08-2010, 07:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by none74 View Post


Curt sells ALL OVER THE WORLD, ask him how many projectors he's sold in the last 6 months, I'd bet its less than 6 in total...

No, actually about 20, otherwise I wouldn't still be here. Most sales now are to corporations though, that still use CRT due to blacks and reliability. I'd say 6-7 went into HT applications.

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post #29 of 31 Old 11-08-2010, 07:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Curt Palme View Post

No, actually about 20, otherwise I wouldn't still be here. Most sales now are to corporations though, that still use CRT due to blacks and reliability. I'd say 6-7 went into HT applications.

So I was pretty much right.

SIX PEOPLE in the entire world bought crt projectors from you to use in their home theater....wow...its a gold rush !
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post #30 of 31 Old 11-08-2010, 11:10 AM
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to lazy to upload CIE diagrams

NEC LC color:

red is .007 xy from reference (oversaturated)
green is .008 xy from reference (towards yellow)
blue is .011 xy from reference (towards magenta)
magenta is .010 xy from reference (towards red)

my Barco 1209s with LUGs and Runco red/green elements:

red is .0005 xy from reference(as perfect as possible)
green is .001 xy from reference
blue is .003 xy from reference (undersaturated)
magenta is .002 xy from reference (towards red)

100% same identical system, just PJ's swapped in and out

Nec LC color is awesome but not exactly accurate, the Barco is nearly spot on perfect and is lovely, much better after you get used to it

-Gary
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