Should I take my Marquee 9500 to my new house, or replace it with a 4k digital? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 62 Old 09-04-2013, 06:58 PM - Thread Starter
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I have a Marquee 9500 that is in good condition. It shows an excellent picture.

I will have to be moving soon (next few months) and am wondering if I should take this with me or sell it and go with a digital projector.

I will probably be moving to an apartment before getting a new home, so I might not be using any projector for a while.

Any opinions on whether I should keep the CRT, or just switch to a digital 4K projector? I might be willing to spend up to around $10k, depending on how my finances are looking. (I also have a digital 1080P Epson that I could use in the meantime if it might be a while before I could get a new one.)

I see that there are some Sony 4K's coming out in the (near?) future, one of which may be a bit less than $10k or a few K more. Maybe the timing of my question is not great, without being able to compare to those. But I'd still like to hear opinions of what other people would do in my situation. Thanks.
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post #2 of 62 Old 09-04-2013, 09:55 PM
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you have 10K to burn? wow, you are in the wrong forum biggrin.gif Most lurkers here wouldn't part with 100 bucks unless you prided it out of their cold dead hands (I'm joking around a little of course).smile.gif
This is not a decision anyone else can make, most here would say keep the 9500. If you have a Moome card and are watching 1080P, then there's not much to gain. I also wouldn't jump on the 4K bandwagon personally, it will drop in price after the first year by 50%, so why pay the early adopter fee. It could also die like 3D then your out 10 grand for a novelty.
Store the 9500, it has already lost the bulk of it's value from a few years ago. then after you get the new house get a feel for the lay of the land and see what your options are.

Marquee HD mod's Marquee Upgrade/re-build package
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post #3 of 62 Old 09-05-2013, 01:42 AM
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You could also improve your 9500

MP mods
Moome HDMI (should you not have it)
Lumagen Mini for CMS
C-elements

Frankenyokes should you come across a set

New tubes if needed
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post #4 of 62 Old 09-05-2013, 03:41 AM
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The Sony 4K unit will allow you a much larger screen with its significantly higher calibrated light output, not to mention a significantly sharper picture (both due to its higher resolution and digital panels). Plus it will be future-proof with its HDMI 2.0 inputs, which will support up to 4K@60fps and 32 channels of audio (not that anyone needs that many channels of audio). Unlike draganm, I do not see 4K as a "fad" - the industry has shown marked signs that it is headed in that direction. Depending on your desired screen size and seating distance, it will definitely be possible to realize visible PQ gains from a 4K projector over a 1080p one.

In terms of contrast, the most common comment I've seen from CRT users that have switched to LCoS (usually JVCs, but these comments should apply to the Sony as well) is that shadow detail on the LCoS unit is usually better. Most have indicated that those who set their CRTs up to reproduce absolute black have to trade that off for some black crush; eliminating the black crush also means raising the black floor to levels comparable to what a JVC or one of the Sony 4K units can reproduce. YMMV as this all depends on how you set up your CRT. But they have definitely indicated that the contrast gap between LCoS and CRT is much, much narrower than most who haven't seen both tend to espouse.

Ultimately if you're unsure as to your living situation in the near future, my vote would be to sell the Marquee - that's one less large object you'll have to lug around with you. Use your Epson while you're waiting to get into your next house, and then once you get to your house, see where things stand with 4K projectors and go from there.

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post #5 of 62 Old 09-05-2013, 06:07 AM - Thread Starter
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Heh... no I don't have 10K to throw away right now (recently unemployed). But this is assuming I get another good job (which would likely be the case if I'm moving to a new house, which would mostly be done in order to be close to work since I have a back problem which makes driving painful).

I do have MP mods and the Moome HDMI card in the projector now - it's great with Blu-rays. I'm not sure about the C-elements. I had not been aware of the Mini processor... it looks promising, but I'm not sure I want to throw thousands into the CRT. But maybe I will if I decide to keep it for another year. No frankenyokes here (something else I was also not aware of). I think my tubes are good.

One thing I wanted to avoid, if it made sense to switch projectors at this point, was both taking the huge CRT with me, and hanging it from the ceiling again.

It might also be a good selling point for my current home to leave the CRT with the screen for the buyer (I haven't even started the process of selling my current home yet). But I'm also thinking that might just be too much for someone to deal with, and plenty of people would probably be too intimidated seeing that thing hanging from my ceiling (which is not very high in that basement room - the PJ is at about head height). I could also leave the Epson for the next buyer, since most people of course wouldn't care that much about the quality difference. Though the Epson is something I might actually be able to use in an apartment.

Hmmm... well thanks for the thoughts and suggestions and I'm interested in anything else anyone has to say.

John
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post #6 of 62 Old 09-05-2013, 08:48 AM
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When I sold my previous house in 2011, I left my Carada Masquerade CIH masking system and DIY SW4500 AT screen as part of the house, and it actually generated quite a bit of interest. It was only an 84" wide screen, and I was worried that people would be disinterested in dealing with a theater, but most of the feedback was positive. And I didn't even leave my projector...if you left the Marquee too, mounted and already set up, ready to connect to a source, I think most people would see that as value added.

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post #7 of 62 Old 09-13-2013, 08:49 AM
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Dewd you can pull 4k off with a 9500 ... It's been done with a 8500!!!! You got yourself a kickarse machine that lots would love just do the maintaine/ mods stash a set of tubes and you got a machine that will go for many years after many have been retired... For the unit just get yourself a tiny digital... They are fun and bright but nothing like a calibrated 9500 in a dark room ! They beam a nice picture
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post #8 of 62 Old 09-14-2013, 08:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HogPilot View Post


Ultimately if you're unsure as to your living situation in the near future, my vote would be to sell the Marquee - that's one less large object you'll have to lug around with you. Use your Epson while you're waiting to get into your next house, and then once you get to your house, see where things stand with 4K projectors and go from there.

This is good advice, but with the caveat of if you are a CRT fanboy. If you really like CRT and its superior motion resolution and ultimate on/off cr, then you might want to keep it. If not, then dump it. For me, JVC already has enough on/off cr to keep me satisfied.

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post #9 of 62 Old 09-15-2013, 10:25 PM
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Those jvc's are dam good for a flashlight projector!!! ATM if I was to go digital would definany be very high up on my list
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post #10 of 62 Old 09-16-2013, 02:13 PM - Thread Starter
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I don't have allegiance to any particular technology - I just want a good picture, and of course I'd prefer to have a smaller/lighter PJ that requires less maintenance and calibration, and is safe to use for video games (not something I do now, but I have used my digital for PC racing games in the past). I guess for now I'll leave the Epson digital with the house unless the new owners don't want a theater, put the Marquee in storage, and then see how things are when I eventually move into a new home.
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post #11 of 62 Old 09-16-2013, 06:44 PM
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Time can be very valuable -- factor in the inevitable upcoming failures, wife acceptance factors, etc -- make sure you have enough spare parts and a parts dealer (e.g. Curt Palme) continue to have parts in stock.

I enjoyed my NEC XG135 CRT back in the day, but I do think it's time to go digital.

There are ways to massively increase motion resolution with digital too, such as using 120Hz + black frame insertion, if you want to have excellent motion resolution for sports, games, HTPC, etc. This requires a lot of research though, especially if you want interpolation-free methods of increasing motion resolution...

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post #12 of 62 Old 09-18-2013, 07:50 AM
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Mark,
Any websites that you can direct us to for improving motion resolution on a digital pj?

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post #13 of 62 Old 09-20-2013, 06:49 AM
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Mark,
Any websites that you can direct us to for improving motion resolution on a digital pj?
There are none.

Well, except for my Blur Busters website, which is researching which displays that has high-efficiency low-latency interpolation-free motion blur reduction compatible with computer and game use (e.g. nVidia's LightBoost, Sony's low-lag Motionflow "Impulse", Eizo's new 240Hz LCD computer monitor strobe backlight, BENQ GT720 projector "3D Mode", etc). I'm the world's first website that caters to people who need motion blur reduction without input lag, for computer use, so I have only tested out one projector to date; but have read that there are others (waiting to be tested). Alas -- really good motion resolution testing is not currently being done by any home theater magazine -- and the current blu-ray motion resolution tests are generally inadequate for the computer/gaming use cases.

If motion resolution in a projector is very, very important to you for any reason -- then generally, you want to find a projector that has either a documented or undocumented black frame insertion mode. Usually, these are DLP projectors. (Undocumented black frame insertion mode is usually the "3D mode" and at 120Hz native input from a computer -- since a black period between refreshes also serves to reduce 3D crosstalk). All forms of black frame insertion tend to dim the image and add flicker (similar to plasma or CRT), but increases motion resolution. Official black frame insertion modes should work with external 60Hz sources (e.g. set top boxes, consoles, etc) The quality of black frame insertion varies widely from display to display, the best I've seen roughly quadruples motion resolution (or better), making motion truly resemble more like a CRT than a LCD/DLP. The worst black frame insertion I've seen only improve motion resolution by a few percent or imperceptibly. The computer use case is a bigger motion blur standout than television/movies, so the differences are far more dramatic here than when viewing video. Unfortunately there's no comparison chart at this time (yet).

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post #14 of 62 Old 09-22-2013, 01:06 PM
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I'd take it with me, and simply floor mount it in a spare room, and just enjoy it.

Bank the $10K . It takes time and energy to create that $10K too.
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post #15 of 62 Old 10-03-2013, 04:42 PM
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4K all the Way!

Of course,... I can't dream of owning a 4K projector just now.

But I love the way projectors drop in price. 30,000 first year,..10,000 next year, ... 5,000 next year, $2500 <---Bingo!
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post #16 of 62 Old 10-04-2013, 10:12 PM
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Originally Posted by draganm View Post

I also wouldn't jump on the 4K bandwagon personally, it will drop in price after the first year by 50%, so why pay the early adopter fee. It could also die like 3D then your out 10 grand for a novelty.

And it did, from 50K-70K for Sony, it went up to 80-120K with the introduction of 4K DLP, it went down to 20K last year for the small Sony 1000 and now to 10K for the new even smaller Sony 500/600. For €9K, there's also the CTHOUCH version of the LG4K LCD panel, this is an 84" 4K touchpanel display.
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post #17 of 62 Old 10-05-2013, 12:21 AM
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JKlenk: now that the Sony VW600 specs and pricing information has been released (or at least the MSRP has been released), is that changing your decision-making process at all?

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post #18 of 62 Old 10-05-2013, 07:50 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by HogPilot View Post

JKlenk: now that the Sony VW600 specs and pricing information has been released (or at least the MSRP has been released), is that changing your decision-making process at all?

If it's $15k like I saw when I just did a web search on it, that is out of my range. I think even $10k is more than I want to spend for the time being.

I've decided to take the Marquee to my new home, and I'm leaving the Epson 1080UB digital. I hope the whole setup gets me at least another $4k-$5k for the house, since that's about the value of the speakers, projector, and a couple of other things. In the brief meeting I had with my realtor she thought it would be a good idea to leave the theater setup.

Soon I hope I can start seriously thinking about making a really awesome theater room in whatever new home I get, instead of my current setup at one end of my townhouse's rec-room, where I had to use in-ceiling speakers for the surrounds. I'm thinking maybe have the new room all black. I guess one of my first questions will be which screen to get - hopefully something that will be great for the CRT as well as a 4K down the road. Lots of reading ahead for me.
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post #19 of 62 Old 02-18-2014, 10:55 AM
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You should have a look at the jvcX500 best buy for the money.
And when you like CRT this is the next generation for you.
Much sharper images, much better ansicintrast , native contrast 60000:1.
Much brighter images.

I have the VW1000 and going to upgrade to VW1100, but that PJ is when money is no option.
And I have the JVC X500 for the kids in the same cinema. That is a fantastic PJ and worth every penny.
I have had many CRTs and when I went digital many years ago there's NO way back. And the natural picture that I also sayed, is not even close to what you get from
The VW500 or the VW1000 or the JVC x500 or X700. All these new digital PJ the sony and the JVC, the pixels are nearly visible and therefore more analog feeling but much better in my appinion. If you done a side by side test like often do, you see.
And 4K will need to grow bigger, and it will take time before it gets comersional. And blue ray on the sonys and jvcs today are more than good enough.

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post #20 of 62 Old 03-16-2014, 12:22 PM
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As someone who used to by very active in this forum, and cut my teeth on the XG's. It's hard to say. This particular XG1351 has been on the ceiling for 9 years now, and has gone from 750 tube hours (when I bought it) to 3700 now, in this 9 year span I have touched up grayscale once, and it gets about 5 minutes of convergence work three times a year.
In the last two years I have setup two JVCs, a X95 and X75. While they are both nice projectors, and easy to setup with a decent grayscale out of the box. (IT still needs to be calibrated) I will still take my XG1351 with Moome card, Darbee, and all glass lenses, which brings this units sharpness very close to a stock JVC. The deal breaker for me is no longer Black Level and shadow detail (the top JVC is on par here) it's now the motion. The digitals just don't look natural in many scenes, and it takes me right out of the mood. I can't really put my finger on it, and I haven't done any research (just not impressed enough to seriously consider the change) but with the addition of the Darbee, and the OPPO 105 as a source my XG's picture is still on par with the best digitals. To top it off, I have new parts setting in boxes, but it's been rock solid. (power conditioning has allot to do with that)
The ownly real draw back is not having a set of NOS tubes for it.
Your 9500 is still a great display that'll match any digital, it all comes down to you and your needs and wants. I can see both sides of it, and from my view, one is not necessarily better than the other...except for that motion thing, which one of my friends didn't even notice until I pointed it out.
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post #21 of 62 Old 03-16-2014, 12:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Yeah, I think I'm going to just stick with my Marquee for now. Part of that is because I'm going to be moving locally (closer to my new job) instead of out-of-state as I had previously thought, so I'll have access to someone to help me get it set up again.

I've been using my secondary PJ for about 4 months now (Epson 1080UB) since I took down my Marquee in preparation for the move, and I'll be very happy to get back to the much better picture later this year when everything is set up again (ugh... gotta do all that work getting the screen/masking/audio set up again).

Thanks everyone for the advice!
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post #22 of 62 Old 03-16-2014, 12:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KennyG View Post

As someone who used to by very active in this forum, and cut my teeth on the XG's. It's hard to say. This particular XG1351 has been on the ceiling for 9 years now, and has gone from 750 tube hours (when I bought it) to 3700 now, in this 9 year span I have touched up grayscale once, and it gets about 5 minutes of convergence work three times a year.
In the last two years I have setup two JVCs, a X95 and X75. While they are both nice projectors, and easy to setup with a decent grayscale out of the box. (IT still needs to be calibrated) I will still take my XG1351 with Moome card, Darbee, and all glass lenses, which brings this units sharpness very close to a stock JVC. The deal breaker for me is no longer Black Level and shadow detail (the top JVC is on par here) it's now the motion. The digitals just don't look natural in many scenes, and it takes me right out of the mood. I can't really put my finger on it, and I haven't done any research (just not impressed enough to seriously consider the change) but with the addition of the Darbee, and the OPPO 105 as a source my XG's picture is still on par with the best digitals. To top it off, I have new parts setting in boxes, but it's been rock solid. (power conditioning has allot to do with that)
The ownly real draw back is not having a set of NOS tubes for it.
Your 9500 is still a great display that'll match any digital, it all comes down to you and your needs and wants. I can see both sides of it, and from my view, one is not necessarily better than the other...except for that motion thing, which one of my friends didn't even notice until I pointed it out.

We like what we like and when you talk about motion I have tested this side by side in film movie blueray.
And a 2014 jvc or Sony digital is better, I tested the Sony hw55 But I suppose you haven't tested this side by side just what you think most here do.
For me the old jvc models up to x55 and older had bad poor motion in movie compared with the sony models and epson.
But now in 2014 the jvc is on par with the Sonys. And if you think that one scene don't look good do a side by side with the CRT just old think fact. I did not like the old jvc models when e-shift came, but the new PJ the Sony and jvc in 2014 have no problem with motion it's just as god or better. The Sony vw1000 uses 96 hz prosessing in 24 hz film. The motion resolution on a CRT is better, but not visible in movie blueray content. Maybe with bad office PJ you are right. In simulators the innputlag is important and there the dlp digital is better, but CRT still king in this area. Fact tested many times .
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post #23 of 62 Old 03-16-2014, 12:45 PM
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But your marquee is not a shame to own😉
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post #24 of 62 Old 03-16-2014, 02:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dj Dee View Post

We like what we like and when you talk about motion I have tested this side by side in film movie blueray.
And a 2014 jvc or Sony digital is better, I tested the Sony hw55 But I suppose you haven't tested this side by side just what you think most here do.
For me the old jvc models up to x55 and older had bad poor motion in movie compared with the sony models and epson.
But now in 2014 the jvc is on par with the Sonys. And if you think that one scene don't look good do a side by side with the CRT just old think fact. I did not like the old jvc models when e-shift came, but the new PJ the Sony and jvc in 2014 have no problem with motion it's just as god or better. The Sony vw1000 uses 96 hz prosessing in 24 hz film. The motion resolution on a CRT is better, but not visible in movie blueray content. Maybe with bad office PJ you are right. In simulators the innputlag is important and there the dlp digital is better, but CRT still king in this area. Fact tested many times .

Good to know, and I will check out the lastest top of the line JVC
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post #25 of 62 Old 03-16-2014, 04:17 PM
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Good to know, and I will check out the lastest top of the line JVC

You do they are fantastic and if you like CRT you love it.
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post #26 of 62 Old 03-17-2014, 05:31 AM
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Has the best digital caught up with absolute black or low key contrast scene of CRT or am I missing something.
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post #27 of 62 Old 03-17-2014, 08:29 AM
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I was at a friend's house with a JVC. We were watching Gravity. I thought the blacks looked very good, far better than I used to see with digitals several years ago. I didn't see an "all black" scene, so I don't know if it could match CRT in that regard. I did notice that with the projector on and no signal, the screen image was gray, not black.
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post #28 of 62 Old 03-18-2014, 01:21 PM
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Has the best digital caught up with absolute black or low key contrast scene of CRT or am I missing something.

Do not have to say more chech out the jvc x500
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post #29 of 62 Old 03-18-2014, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by RobertR View Post

I was at a friend's house with a JVC. We were watching Gravity. I thought the blacks looked very good, far better than I used to see with digitals several years ago. I didn't see an "all black" scene, so I don't know if it could match CRT in that regard. I did notice that with the projector on and no signal, the screen image was gray, not black.

Not grey at all, all the new models from jvc this year. And it even have deeper black than a CRT.
Have a look😉
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post #30 of 62 Old 03-18-2014, 01:27 PM
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Remember models from jvc x500 and upp to x900
Not the x35.
😎
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