MEC/Ehome tubes rebuilt really cheap! - Page 7 - AVS Forum
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post #181 of 227 Old 03-05-2003, 02:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by sly
I think I am not asking this right..

what I want to know it how does a 8 inch VDC ES compare to a 8 inch VDC EM..

if i took out a CRT out of my Electrome 8000 and put in a 8 inch VDC ES what what would I expect. (circuit /neck mods aside)

what I want to know is with both types of CRT's in the same PJ
what is the difference in them??


For example lets say.

If new CRT's the EM is say %5 sharper (just made number that up) then ES.
And VDC make ES at 100% but makes EM at 95% of new( I making up the numbers dont flame)
then they would be the same.
now I just made up the numbers . but what I want to know
is how does a VDC ES vs a VDC ES compare to each other.
Or has no one ever compared then??
I don't know the answer, but I think I know the question. I think Sly is asking:

1) Can he replace the EM focus tubes in his Electrohome 8000 with ES focus VDC rebuilds? (because ES rebuilds are much cheaper than EM rebuilds)

2) Can anyone quantify the performance decrease from such a change?

I'm not sure it is an appropriate question for this thread, but since he has posted the question several times here...

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post #182 of 227 Old 03-05-2003, 06:22 PM
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No, you cannot interchange an ES and an EM focus tubes, they are totally different.

My comment was (from my limited understanding of CRT rebuilding technology) that ES tubes are easier to rebuild than EM focus tubes.

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post #183 of 227 Old 03-05-2003, 06:44 PM
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So.. Should I even bother to pay a cent for the 75 09MX tubes? Should I let them be destroyed? Or should I load them up in a van, at my expense..etc.

Will VDC take a crack at them, if they had 75 to play with?

Ken Hotte

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post #184 of 227 Old 03-05-2003, 07:16 PM
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"they are totally different"
I would not go that far, there a bit different.
Pin out different and ES needs the focus voltage.
and like I said circuit mods aside

CRT's are consumables and I do not see any reason why a ES could not be installed in a EM system with the right mods to the circuits
But would it be worth the trouble to do it?

If rebuilt ES are just as good as a rebuilt EM it might be worth it..
If there was a ES tube that was very close same HV voltage and control and all that was needed was to add a focus voltage.. it would not be hard at all.

I know that you cant just plop one in.
all I want to know is how would a VDC ES compare to a VDC EM if everything else was the same..

I am just thinking if there is a way to save cash in the long run.

after all this thread is about cheap CRTs;)


It seems clear that no one knows how a VDC ES compares to a VDC EM

I guess the only way to know is to do an experiment.
Like 2 greens in the same PJ one ES and one EM
and compare the two.
But that is for another time.
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post #185 of 227 Old 03-06-2003, 12:10 AM
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If you don't go and get them you will most likely be Kicking your self in the A$$ later. The was one statement from a person at videodisplayprojection
The 07MFP2 is another 07MP equivalent. Unfortunately the 07MP tubes
are
not rebuildable "at this point" so once Barco and a few other dealers
run
out of these CRT only used tubes will be available.
I wonder what at this point means?


Darin
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post #186 of 227 Old 03-06-2003, 02:33 AM
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It means I am stuck with a projector thats good at red images....
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post #187 of 227 Old 03-06-2003, 09:33 AM
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Sly, if you take the time and trouble to show me pictures of an ES tube working in an EM set or vice versa, I'll send you $100.00.

It's gotta have good color balance and focus, and work as well as the original tubes in the set.

You can turn a bicycle into a car too I guess, but is it worth it?..;-)

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post #188 of 227 Old 03-06-2003, 10:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Curt Palme
You can turn a bicycle into a car too I guess, but is it worth it?..;-)
In this case though (going from EM to ES), it would be like turning a car into a bicycle! Completely useless! (Unless you're trying to save the environment or something like that.....) :)

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post #189 of 227 Old 03-06-2003, 04:18 PM
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HEH don't tempt me I might just speed a grand to get that $100;)

I have never seen a ES projector thats why I asked about how a ES compares to EM.

Way back in HS I did take a EM TV and use a ES tube
and I did that on the cheap. I had to get the focus voltage off the HV to I soldered something like 100 resistors then put in in shrink tubing. (too cheap to buy a HV resistor)
but it worked out..

On a small flat screen like this I think the focus voltage needs to be modulated. Due to the lack of a curved screen.

Now I am getting car vs bicycle is a ES that bad??
or are ES CRT's just put in junk PJ?? on the direct view CRT's the ES was a lot sharper then the old EM but there more to it then just that.

I was thinking it was more like putting a Chevy V8 in a in a Mercedes. it is still a car with a v8
just that a Chevy is a lot cheaper. And that you cant run it at the red-line all day long..
And you cant just plop it in ether. There is other stuff that has to be changed.

I know if I wanted to take the time to do I could but I could only get it to be as sharp as a ES CRT is.

That is why I wanted to know how sharp a ES is vs a EM after both being rebuilt.
If after the rebuild the EM no longer has an advantage over the ES and the cost of the EM is a lot more I thought it might be worth making a mod to retrofit a EM PJ but if the EM still is a lot better then it is not..

But with the car vs bicycle thing is sounds like the ES is so unsharp that it can't even be used for 640x480.
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post #190 of 227 Old 03-06-2003, 08:04 PM
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Sly, meet KBK, KBK, meet Sly..:D

(KBK is the only other forum member nuts enough to modify the heck out of projector to interchange tubes..:-)

And I mean that in the nicest of ways..:)

Have you ever seen a Sony 10XX, 12XX, Barco 400,500,600, Electrohome ECP series? Those all are ES focus sets. AS are AmPRo 2000, 3000, 4000, BArco 1000, 1001, 1500, 1600...

ES are not crap, that was the tube standard until about 1993 (1996 for Sony)

The tubes at 0-2000 hours would focus about as well as an EM focus set (OK, not quite), but then the focus would drop off slightly and eventualy get noticeably bad at about 9000 hours.

EM focus gave much better control over the focus of the set over a much longer period of time.

Both the ES and EM focus tubes that I've had rebuilt by VDC have been awesome. Thing is, sets using ES focus tubes are generally not run at as high a resolution as EM focus sets...

Curt

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post #191 of 227 Old 03-07-2003, 07:10 AM - Thread Starter
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:(

Need I say more? I'm pissed. Not that it couldn't be done, but because I was lied to.

Came into the office this morning, and there's a box...with my CRT! YEAH!

Obviously I was overjoyed. But, upon removal, the tube still has the piece of toast in it. Still has the liquid coolign in the front chamber. IT HAS NEVER BEEN TAKEN APART!!! The invoice states "Dud being returned to customer. Can not be repaired."

That's why I'm mad...last time I talked to Art at PATX (and BTW, I always have to call him...he has never responded to my emails or returned my phone calls) he told me that the tube was apart, had been cleaned, new phosphor put on, and that it had been to engineering to be measured. He also told me that they were just waiting on the cathode to finish up.

Obviously I'm dissapointed, but I guess it was one of those things that was too good to be true. I just wish the communication was better. I didn't mind being the guinea pig, I just wish that I would have known going in. Again, I also wish they communucated better. Oh well...back to saving up for a VDC for me I guess!

Hell, I've never even done business with VDC and I'm ready to sing their praises :)

Thanks a million...Good luck...Let us know... Whichever is appropriate this time! jmwj03 at hotmail dot com
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post #192 of 227 Old 03-07-2003, 07:14 AM
 
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Jay, I would be equally ticked off. There is one thing to say little and another to say a lot in that 'a lot' being a mouth full of lies. I would CC this thread to the guy and see how he feels about being known as a liar in the professional sense.
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post #193 of 227 Old 03-07-2003, 08:09 AM
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The Milton Luban of tube rebuilders !
At LEAST they returned your tube in one piece(I know, its a VERY small consolation).
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post #194 of 227 Old 03-07-2003, 08:33 AM
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My impersonation of VDC after reading this thread



:D :) :D :) :p :D
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post #195 of 227 Old 03-07-2003, 08:45 AM
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I don't think yours is the one that got repaired!!

Who else sent in there tube?
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post #196 of 227 Old 03-07-2003, 08:46 AM
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I've already called them (VDC) and informed them of the news. scottatl, your post pretty much summed it up!

Jay, I'm not sure I understand your summary of the rebuild. You're saying it's, ummmm, ...less than perfect?...:p

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post #197 of 227 Old 03-07-2003, 09:05 AM
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Is this a blow for "cheapness"? :)
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post #198 of 227 Old 03-07-2003, 09:06 AM
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Jay,
My comment wasnt directed at you and Curt pretty much cleared that up.

Vendors that we use should know their product, if we are selling that to a member its has to be the best we can provide, in rebuilds Charles and VDC has pretty much worked with us to get that quality and has earned our support.

Theres going to come a time when we need that (like 4 months ago) I have unhappy clients waiting for new factory tubes and most do wait, others dont so I need to refund, but why. Im almost at the point of giving them that option because the quality is there now.

Anything that slows that quality process down is what I was concerned about because it reflects on to many things other then the screen that ends up costing the end user time and money (technical labor).

Earlier years it would take twice as long to set up the rebuilds and as quality was increased that time has gone down considerably.

Thats something that affects all of us one way or another, if your doing your own retube you will surely know. Doug
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post #199 of 227 Old 03-07-2003, 09:49 AM
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Im confused by all your disappointment in this company. When you post replies most of you don't fill in the details expecting the rest of us to remember in detail what you posted previously. Originally this company out of Texas says that they can rebuild ElectraHome projector tubes. They now can't do this?? I know some of you sent them other brands hoping they can handle them. But thats no concern to me what so ever. My friend and I both have Marquee 8500's. We do want to have our tubes rebuilt. So, can this company rebuilt these tubes successfully or not?

*Analog fans may be blind but Digital fans are deaf*
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post #200 of 227 Old 03-07-2003, 10:14 AM
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stylinlp,
Click on the start of the thread for details. If its important e-mail that page to yourself and then store to 'Important tube stuff I need to remember' Doug
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post #201 of 227 Old 03-07-2003, 10:19 AM
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Does anyone know why Sony won't sell their tube mfrg'ing equipment so others can rebuild Sony tubes?
:confused:

True bravery is arriving home late after a boy's night out, being assaulted by your wife with a broom, and still having the guts to ask: Are you still cleaning, or are you flying somewhere?
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post #202 of 227 Old 03-07-2003, 11:45 AM
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most likely because they have a wharehouse full of lcd units
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post #203 of 227 Old 03-07-2003, 12:03 PM
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"Does anyone know why Sony won't sell their tube mfrg'ing equipment so others can rebuild Sony tubes?
"

I think it is because every time they have sold something it gos to Kora,China etc and then the crank them out by the truckload. Japan lost the DRAM market just this way.
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post #204 of 227 Old 03-07-2003, 12:49 PM
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What would it matter since Sony isn't making crt's anymore?


"Does anyone know why Sony won't sell their tube mfrg'ing equipment so others can rebuild Sony tubes?
"

I think it is because every time they have sold something it gos to Kora,China etc and then the crank them out by the truckload. Japan lost the DRAM market just this way.
[/quote]

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post #205 of 227 Old 03-07-2003, 06:54 PM
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They still make displays of some sort don't they
with the DRAM japan sold a old system for RAM that they were not making anymore. But they used the system to make the newer type of RAM and under sold japan
now Japan almost no longer makes RAM.
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post #206 of 227 Old 03-07-2003, 09:47 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally posted by WanMan
Jay, I would be equally ticked off. There is one thing to say little and another to say a lot in that 'a lot' being a mouth full of lies. I would CC this thread to the guy and see how he feels about being known as a liar in the professional sense.
I'll answer theses one at a time:

I think that Mr. Stanley of Tritronics is still reading this thread (I hope). I'll let him hear us all vent so that he can see how unhappy we are. That's probably better to let it stew rather than pointing it out :)

Thanks a million...Good luck...Let us know... Whichever is appropriate this time! jmwj03 at hotmail dot com
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post #207 of 227 Old 03-07-2003, 09:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally posted by gn2
The Milton Luban of tube rebuilders !
At LEAST they returned your tube in one piece(I know, its a VERY small consolation).
Actually it is Paul. At least now I have a dud to send to VDC...Otherwise I was going to buy yours to use as a dud. :)

Thanks a million...Good luck...Let us know... Whichever is appropriate this time! jmwj03 at hotmail dot com
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post #208 of 227 Old 03-07-2003, 09:50 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally posted by scottatl
My impersonation of VDC after reading this thread



:D :) :D :) :p :D
100%!

I agree!

Thanks a million...Good luck...Let us know... Whichever is appropriate this time! jmwj03 at hotmail dot com
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post #209 of 227 Old 03-07-2003, 09:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally posted by NTHEZONE
I don't think yours is the one that got repaired!!

Who else sent in there tube?
Ummm...whatever gave you that idea? :)

I am infact the one who found this company, reported on it, and sent my tube in. To my knowledge, I am the only one who sent a tube in. I don't think they ever accepted any of Curts's tubes.

Thanks a million...Good luck...Let us know... Whichever is appropriate this time! jmwj03 at hotmail dot com
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post #210 of 227 Old 03-07-2003, 09:55 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally posted by Curt Palme
I've already called them (VDC) and informed them of the news. scottatl, your post pretty much summed it up!

Jay, I'm not sure I understand your summary of the rebuild. You're saying it's, ummmm, ...less than perfect?...:p

Curt
No, you don't understand. The rebuild was perfect....considering they didn't do it :D

Thanks a million...Good luck...Let us know... Whichever is appropriate this time! jmwj03 at hotmail dot com
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