Screenshot War CRT vs Digital 2015-2016 - Page 11 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #301 of 340 Old 06-20-2016, 03:32 PM
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I want to see dismemberment of the limbs.
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post #302 of 340 Old 06-21-2016, 04:22 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by thewolfman View Post
I want to see dismemberment of the limbs.
Sweden is not far, better head to head eye to eye

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post #303 of 340 Old 06-21-2016, 06:47 AM
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Sweden is not far, better head to head eye to eye
Yeah, maybe. I have not finished painting the walls as it became the wrong color and not very well done either, so don't like having people over, but for this occasion, why not.

But I'm not aloud to show the boards to anyone, even if they have black cover ups on them. It's a promise I made and I intend to keep it that way. But I see your point and it would be very interesting to see that RS600 also.

Until then, we should order the movies in question and have some fun shooting! I must order them as well because I want to try out my PS4 with them and not use the PC.
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post #304 of 340 Old 06-21-2016, 09:38 AM - Thread Starter
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I don't want to put you in the spot, nor anyone from the CRT community, but on my monitor, the face of the girl on the JVC, are as green as the tiles in the background.

On the other hand, the tiles on the CRT are less similar to the face as the digital. Strange.

I'm not picking sides I am just wondering why the tiles has the same color as the face in many of the shots?

(Not the entire face of course, just a halo around the for most cheek.)

So you understand this Wolfy
A screen cap has nothing to do with a projector TV, CRT, monitor or digital at all.
It is simply how it shall look, then a frame of the Blu-ray 100% correct how the filmmaker wanted it to look. Everything else is wrong 100%.
A calibration will make your picture closer to the screen cap, and camera will not capture 100%. If it looks like the CRT picture you can like it, but is NOT how it shall look. Same with the James bond picture have a look and
read this
http://www.thebondbulletin.com/true-...rading-spectre


Therefore wrong if not yellow tint. But if it looks correct,,,, to me NO. But correct calibrated will be like this because it is meant to be shown like this in theatres, monitors, TV, and projectors. That's why we calibrate to get it true to the source.

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post #305 of 340 Old 06-21-2016, 12:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Dj Dee View Post
So you understand this Wolfy
A screen cap has nothing to do with a projector TV, CRT, monitor or digital at all.
It is simply how it shall look, then a frame of the Blu-ray 100% correct how the filmmaker wanted it to look. Everything else is wrong 100%.
A calibration will make your picture closer to the screen cap, and camera will not capture 100%. If it looks like the CRT picture you can like it, but is NOT how it shall look. Same with the James bond picture have a look and
read this
http://www.thebondbulletin.com/true-...rading-spectre


Therefore wrong if not yellow tint. But if it looks correct,,,, to me NO. But correct calibrated will be like this because it is meant to be shown like this in theatres, monitors, TV, and projectors. That's why we calibrate to get it true to the source.
I know about the screen cap and how it works.. but it looks so wrong that the girl-with-tear-shot looks to have a layer of green all over it. It even suggest that the rest of Baraka should look like that too and I find that very hard to believe.

Let's make a bet.. 100 SEK.. when you guys come on over here, and show me in person that she's really that freaken green in the face as the tiles in the background, then I would believe you.

But until then, I think that you might be doing it wrong when taking those screen caps, or something else is wrong, but there is no way in hell Baraka is suppose to look that green.

No, I think that the theory is right, with the screen caps, it's just not showing it when you post. Take a step back and think about this for a second. Do you really believe that those guys who made Barka wanted it to look that green. No way man, somethings very wrong with those images. You are going to have to prove it to me! Simpel as that as you say.

But let's not get to be enemies over this, just because I have this strong feeling that your theory is right but you're not showing it right!

Get American Psycho and we have some fun posting some seriously disturbing images. Oh it will awkward alright, oh yeah! But that's just my twisted morbid humor for you!

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post #306 of 340 Old 06-21-2016, 12:18 PM - Thread Starter
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I know that is a screen cap.. but it looks so wrong that the girl-with-tear-shot looks has a layer of green all over it. It even suggest that the rest of Baraka should look like that and I find that very hard to believe.

Let's make a bet.. 100 SEK.. when you guys come on over here, and show me in person that she 's really that freaken green in the face as the tiles background, then I would believe you. But until then, I think that you might be doing it wrong when taking those screen caps, or something else is wrong, but there is no way in hell Baraka is suppose to look that green.

No, I think that the theory is right, with the screen caps, it's just that showing it when you post. Take a step back and think about this for a second. Do you really believe that those guys who made Barka wanted it to look that green. No way man, somethings very wrong with those images. You are going to have to prove it to me! Simpel as that as you say.

But let's not get to be enemies over this, just because I have this strong feeling that your theory is right but you are not showing it right!

Get American Psycho and we have some fun posting some seriously disturbing images. Oh it will awkward alright, oh yeah! But that's just my twisted morbid humor for you!

I'm finished with screenshots and I ill never be a enemy specially with you
This is not theory its FACT 100% i say to you.
Screen cap is a frame form the BD and cant be wrong. You can manipulate color, gamma, brightness does not help. Its straight form the frame of the mastered BD REC709 D65. And that you get on the Screen cap cant be manipulated, then you have to do that after.
Like I have said, if you don't like it how it suppose to look, calibrate by eye or don't calibrate at all. But then another movie will be total wrong because of this.
I'm just telling you, what is fact and what is wrong. What you or me mean does not count here at all. Fact is fact.


http://www.thebondbulletin.com/true-...rading-spectre

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post #307 of 340 Old 06-21-2016, 12:49 PM
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I'm finished with screenshots and I ill never be a enemy specially with you
This is not theory its FACT 100% i say to you.
Screen cap is a frame form the BD and cant be wrong. You can manipulate color, gamma, brightness does not help. Its straight form the frame of the mastered BD REC709 D65. And that you get on the Screen cap cant be manipulated, then you have to do that after.
Like I have said, if you don't like it how it suppose to look, calibrate by eye or don't calibrate at all. But then another movie will be total wrong because of this.
I'm just telling you, what is fact and what is wrong. What you or me mean does not count here at all. Fact is fact.


http://www.thebondbulletin.com/true-...rading-spectre
I believe you on the Bond movies. But still have a hard time seeing that Baraka is suppose to be that green tinted like posted.

But where going nowhere with this, so it must be a meet to show in person, or some other way if convincing me that Baraka should look that green.. who would have thought. If I was a consec, over at whatever movie-company who made Baraka, I would have fired the color-rendering guy, but only after I kicked him in the nuts first, making HIM green in the face! I would have.
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post #308 of 340 Old 06-21-2016, 02:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by thewolfman View Post
I believe you on the Bond movies. But still have a hard time seeing that Baraka is suppose to be that green tinted like posted.

But where going nowhere with this, so it must be a meet to show in person, or some other way if convincing me that Baraka should look that green.. who would have thought. If I was a consec, over at whatever movie-company who made Baraka, I would have fired the color-rendering guy, but only after I kicked him in the nuts first, making HIM green in the face! I would have.
Does not matter, that is how it is. End of story hehe
You and me were not there, can be the light. Or in the mastering process from film to digital. One thing for shore the screen cap is correct if we like it or not
Everything else is WRONG its just to except, but to like it another thing. hehe
Then you understand how this will effect every other film if its not green like you say. What will then happen on another film if not calibrated correct to how it was meant to be shown? You know the answer.

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post #309 of 340 Old 06-22-2016, 12:25 PM
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Does not matter, that is how it is. End of story hehe
You and me were not there, can be the light. Or in the mastering process from film to digital. One thing for shore the screen cap is correct if we like it or not
Everything else is WRONG its just to except, but to like it another thing. hehe
Then you understand how this will effect every other film if its not green like you say. What will then happen on another film if not calibrated correct to how it was meant to be shown? You know the answer.
Yeah, end of story on this. I must accept the fact that's the way it should look. But so bloody hell awful its scary.

Anyways, I saw today the new EPSON Faux K machines that will be out in August. Look like a JVC killer in term of price.. very affordable so that even I can buy one. But trusting the CR for what claim.. I don't know. But they can't be that far off the mark and probably gain back some lost territory to JVC over the years. EPSON used to be the s_hit back in the day.
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post #310 of 340 Old 06-22-2016, 10:54 PM
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Originally Posted by thewolfman View Post
I don't want to put you in the spot, nor anyone from the CRT community, but on my monitor, the face of the girl on the JVC, are as green as the tiles in the background.

On the other hand, the tiles on the CRT are less similar to the face as the digital. Strange.

I'm not picking sides I am just wondering why the tiles has the same color as the face in many of the shots?

(Not the entire face of course, just a halo around the for most cheek.)
I think i maybe able to answer this question, assuming calibration of the crt is correct, it could be a problem due to the wear in the green crt tube. Unless you have a brand new pristine green tube which i doubt so, all tube will age and when the green tube wears, it will cast a magenta shade on the screen which can never be corrected. This is the trouble with CRT once the tube wears no matter how slight.
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post #311 of 340 Old 06-25-2016, 07:46 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by tanwn1 View Post
I think i maybe able to answer this question, assuming calibration of the crt is correct, it could be a problem due to the wear in the green crt tube. Unless you have a brand new pristine green tube which i doubt so, all tube will age and when the green tube wears, it will cast a magenta shade on the screen which can never be corrected. This is the trouble with CRT once the tube wears no matter how slight.
Correct

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post #312 of 340 Old 05-27-2017, 05:33 AM - Thread Starter
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Here's a comparison where I can only say that CRT looks very good ,if this is real pictures without any photo shopping. The CRT picture is not far away what I can remember of the G90 perfectly set up.
The differences here will be big compared side by side in real. Also have to remember pictures can be extremely different just with different exposure or shutter . Also very scary that I see a picture of CRT that is so close to screencap. Can just say good work with camera and setup the CRT.
This is the last compartment in this thread from me. We are now in 2017.




Here a screen cap.



Here a CRT 9 inch



Here a JVC RS520


Under side by side, From the left Screencap, CRT, JVC RS520 estimated difference at 90 inch screen


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post #313 of 340 Old 05-28-2017, 01:54 PM
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Here's a comparison where I can only say that CRT looks very good ,if this is real pictures without any photo shopping. The CRT picture is not far away what I can remember of the G90 perfectly set up.
The differences here will be big compared side by side in real. Also have to remember pictures can be extremely different just with different exposure or shutter . Also very scary that I see a picture of CRT that is so close to screencap. Can just say good work with camera and setup the CRT.
This is the last compartment in this thread from me. We are now in 2017.
Looks quite blurry to me, good to see that I wasn't just imagining things back when I was tweaking my own crt and was constantly told that it can look as detailed as a digital.
Now that I'm moving on to 4k I guess there isn't much of a comparison at all. All I can say is the people who still own crts are obviously doing it mainly because they enjoy tinkering, and there's nothing wrong with that as long as we are honest with ourselves and others regarding performance that can be expected.
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post #314 of 340 Old 05-29-2017, 02:01 PM
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I can assure you, a G90 can be sharper than the CRT image two posts above this one. But I don't have photos to prove it.
I have enough G90s and Marquees that I'm pretty sure about that. I can compare any of them side by side with my RS45 and
the G90 has a sharpness advantage that a Marquee can't match.

I am still with CRT because I'm way beyond being merely "well stocked". My CRT inventory of new condition tubes numbers
in the dozens of sets. So I have absolutely no issues with tube wear and can always have a machine on my ceiling which is in
absolutely top form, WITHOUT spending any money.

4K, OK, I can't match that, but how much native 4K content do you have to watch yet? It's not enough yet to make for a very
compelling argument.
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post #315 of 340 Old 05-30-2017, 01:51 AM - Thread Starter
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I can assure you, a G90 can be sharper than the CRT image two posts above this one. But I don't have photos to prove it.
I have enough G90s and Marquees that I'm pretty sure about that. I can compare any of them side by side with my RS45 and
the G90 has a sharpness advantage that a Marquee can't match.

I am still with CRT because I'm way beyond being merely "well stocked". My CRT inventory of new condition tubes numbers
in the dozens of sets. So I have absolutely no issues with tube wear and can always have a machine on my ceiling which is in
absolutely top form, WITHOUT spending any money.

4K, OK, I can't match that, but how much native 4K content do you have to watch yet? It's not enough yet to make for a very
compelling argument.

Prove it! you won't even be close
Click the links and have a look.


http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/211287


http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/211294

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post #316 of 340 Old 05-30-2017, 10:21 PM
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I can assure you, a G90 can be sharper than the CRT image two posts above this one. But I don't have photos to prove it.
Lack of photographic evidence puts you at a big disadvantage. Simply asserting something instead of showing visual evidence of something inherently visual doesn't suffice.
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post #317 of 340 Old 05-31-2017, 02:15 AM - Thread Starter
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Point of this is, photo of screen will NEVER show how your image really is. Also because manipulation have been proved by some users that are not longer here, and still have the best CRT pictures on net for shore. Then after buying a bunch from 20-150 dollar pr. unit marquees and hoped for a goldmine I would say major bummer . Therefore must try to drag everything else down, then todays tec also manipulate pictures of the CRT to get attention.


How many discussions have I had because I said calibrate, and compare with a screen cap to get better photos on other forums or here?


But like shown here form the start, have and will be the fact. Does it matter? NO It is just how it is.


Like many here feel also my selves, "I wasn't just imagining things back when I was tweaking my own CRT and was constantly told that it can look as detailed as a digital." The compare here might be much bigger in real with side by side, because of screen size. The bigger the bigger difference.
CRT have limitations on MTF, lenses, Ansi Contrast, brightness, resolution, also video chain, and much more. But again I will say that BW higher than what's needed on HD will not make a revolution like many say in picture quality. I will say just to promote sales of high bandwidth mod. Many have tried to take pictures of improvements and not possible to capture it on photo. So I will say SMALL improvements for a lot of money. I saw that easy on a perfect adjusted G90 not so long time ago. I bet it will be equal or better than a modded CRT, because of many other stuff that can **** up. What's important on CRT for a great image ? great tubes low runtime about the same runtime on each, to get something else is stupid, the best lenses for your room HFQ900 great, and a good HDMI card connected in the projector. And not to big screen 80-100 inch for best image quality. And most important ,,,skills to operate the CRT to performance.


Would I like to have a great CRT 9 inch today, yes I might, if I have the room for it and time, but will I say to anyone that its better than todays technology NO, because then I will be telling a big fantasy.


Click the links and have a look.


http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/211287


http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/211294
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post #318 of 340 Old 05-31-2017, 03:49 AM
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I'll make screen shots when I get around to it, that's the best I can offer.

I don't even know HOW to use photoshop. Anything I may post will be right out of the camera, the camera being a 36 MP Nikon D800 or D810. (I have both.)
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post #319 of 340 Old 05-31-2017, 06:19 AM - Thread Starter
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I'll make screen shots when I get around to it, that's the best I can offer.

I don't even know HOW to use photoshop. Anything I may post will be right out of the camera, the camera being a 36 MP Nikon D800 or D810. (I have both.)
Great , looking forward to it.


You are the one calming you can get it better cmjohnson

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post #320 of 340 Old 05-31-2017, 04:18 PM
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I'm only saying that the G90 is sharper than a Marquee with stock magnetics.

Since I own an absurd number of both kinds of projector, I think I'm well qualified to make that statement.

I'll post pics, when I'm ready. But there is no rushing me. I'll do it when I'm good and ready.

I need to go get Apocalypto just to have the same reference as most people are using.
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post #321 of 340 Old 06-02-2017, 01:25 PM - Thread Starter
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"""I can assure you, a G90 can be sharper than the CRT image two posts above this one.....""" your own words. Far form what you write in the next post.


The picture of the Marquee I posted are the best CRT picture/photo I have ever seen of a CRT. Most likely manipulated some, or extremely small screen. You see that easy from his disciples pictures, they are not good compared. So take your photo, I be surprised if you're even close.


"Since I own an absurd number of both kinds of projector, I think I'm well qualified to make that statement. " Have you done side by side test of them calibrated to same standard.
Just wonder. Or is it done without knowing the light output , or measured gamma. and might calibrated by eye

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post #322 of 340 Old 06-02-2017, 07:27 PM
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When the light output is similar to the eye, conditions are similar enough to determine by eye if one unit is sharper than the other.
This is hardly news to anybody with CRT experience.

Exact calibration is NOT necessary to see which unit is sharper. Do you actually think that's a requirement?

I'm waiting for the right deal on the right luminance meter to come before I spend money on a calibration system.
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post #323 of 340 Old 06-03-2017, 01:03 AM - Thread Starter
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Here you claim that you can make a better photo than this photo shown of the marquee the same frame in the film, because you see that a G90 is sharper at your home? really???
Take the picture and show that you can beat a fully photo manipulated , calibrated and modded marquee with your eye calibrated G90. Use the screen cap that is uploaded if you don't have the film.
Also see that my best friend posted @ another forum a super black crushed picture of the same frame with just more contrast, it was also 0,01% better lol But if you know what is done, not any better at all.
Only some contrast manipulation in camera or photoshop like always.

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post #324 of 340 Old 06-03-2017, 12:24 PM - Thread Starter
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Since no one fixes a G90 shot quick I have fixed that today from a friend.




Here just a side by side with the best super modded Marquee against a un-modded G90 zoomed inn to see differences. Color different because different camera settings.


G90 picture on the LEFT Marquee 95** on the RIGHJT in both pictures.
Also the G90 have no over scan the Marquee has. Screen 110" on the G90 so larger than the Marquee.




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post #325 of 340 Old 06-03-2017, 01:41 PM - Thread Starter
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See on another forum that a banned member here is saying that G90 is the marquee shown here. Just for info this s totally wrong.
G90 is on the left, Marquee on the right. Remember G90 not modded and no overscan. Also 3 pictures was taken of the G90, I picked out the best that I liked the best for side by side picture check.
Also have to say that the differences are minor. And pictures don't show how good a projector is. Specially when sale is a factor


One of the 3 pictures from G90. Then just a screencap of picture and details below.












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post #326 of 340 Old 06-04-2017, 12:09 AM - Thread Starter
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So again, this is the real reality when doing a side by side switch With new digitals and CRT.
Just like AVMB says look blurry to me. Compared a CRT side by side will look very blurry and many other stuff will be shown , but this is just because all the factors I have written many times and many years ago combined together, and will show like this against new tec.


You get use to the difference quick and forget reality, But if you think HD is to sharp , and detailed its just to adjust the digital way out of focus
But still you get the advantage of high ansi-contrast combined with great real on off. So the total image will always be way way ahead of a old CRT tec. And closer to the source HD for shore.
If you say other vice you are blinded by a fantasy not a reality and will come with stupid excuses.
Also I know that the G90 photo is real and not tampered with.


So shown here will be close to how " in real" it will look side by side.



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post #327 of 340 Old 06-04-2017, 05:11 AM
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I can confirm that the G90 screenshots in the posts from Dj Dee are genuine. They came from the G90 I owned last year. No overscan.

But I will comment that people should be careful to draw any conclusions out of screenshots. They are for fun and should not be judged, because it is to many factors that determines the end result.

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post #328 of 340 Old 06-04-2017, 06:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Per Johnny View Post
I can confirm that the G90 screenshots in the posts from Dj Dee are genuine. They came from the G90 I owned last year. No overscan.

But I will comment that people should be careful to draw any conclusions out of screenshots. They are for fun and should not be judged, because it is to many factors that determines the end result.
This is just funny. My point with this is that differences are small between different good CRTs. Like you say Per to scream out that the G90 is horrible by zooming inn on zoomed pictures, compared with a full picture file .. Again from a picture is just lol. And remember that if the G90 picture have some artifacts, its not there in real. We both know that.
Also claimed that the G90 shot was the Marquee at one point. So close close close, but have to see it like I zoomed them in.
That is the point, yes you see that the marquee run at 72Hz and the G90 run at 60Hz. In real would be minor in side by side.

Last edited by Dj Dee; 06-04-2017 at 08:00 AM.
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post #329 of 340 Old 06-04-2017, 07:50 AM
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What I'm getting out of this is that a stock G90 is sharper than even a heavily modified Marquee, based on the photos YOU have posted.

Which is all I've said that I expect. For all the mods you can put into a Marquee, which can give it the best greyscale and the best video chain to be found in a CRT projector, you're still limited by the stock Thomson magnetics on a Marquee's CRTs. They will ALWAYS be a limitation because they were designed for the Thomson tubes that Electrohome stopped using in the early 90s. Electrohome chose NOT to reinvest in a better magnetics system when they switched to Panasonic tubes. Every OTHER manufacturer chose Panasonic's partner magnetics company, Kanto-Denshi, for their focus yokes, and all but AmPro chose K-D for deflection yokes as well.

So, not surprisingly, the projectors that feature magnetics DESIGNED FOR THE TUBES BEING USED are all sharper focusing than the Marquee which has the WRONG magnetics for the tube type. Electrohome knew this but since the Marquee still met the goals of their
primary customers (flight simulation) they just went with it.

Oh, FYI, I have not made any claims at all about how good a photo I can post. I have some very good camera equipment, truly professional
grade stuff, actually, but as for actually using it to photograph a projected image, I make no claims as I haven't put any effort into that.
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post #330 of 340 Old 06-04-2017, 08:15 AM - Thread Starter
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I did not disagree with you on that a stock G90 is sharper than a Marquee, but I wanted you to post it. And felt that you misunderstood that the pictures were zoomed in at.
To take pictures is not easy of a CRT I have figured that out, and for shore there are many factors involved.

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