Small Squiggly interference lines on NEC XG 1352 ?? - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 284 Old 05-12-2006, 05:07 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Addicted Member
 
Gary Murrell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 10,927
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Guys I got my new NEC 1352 in the other day, been working on him for a few days

I have one major issue right now

the 1352 is showing faint small squiggly interference lines, sometimes they alternate between tubes, sometimes they are on all 3, the blue seems to be the worst

the lines are very small and are horizontally across the screen and at a slight angle
they travel down a inch and up a inch, very fast moving back and forth, they do not deviate from that movement

I can see them from my seating distance of 1.6 times back

sometimes they are bad, sometimes they are only faintly on the blue

Any ideas guys as to what this could be ??

I have left my sync's connected and unplugged the color lines, they are still visible on the raster with brightness cranked

I had also tried a cheater ground plug

Thanks for anyones advice or help

-Gary
Gary Murrell is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 284 Old 05-12-2006, 06:02 PM
AVS Special Member
 
CaspianM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Land of Cardinals
Posts: 5,841
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
Gary I don't know what causes that but congrats on yout new puppy.
HAve tried anothe outlet and/ reseating some of the cards. Check your input line like contact points etc.

It is all about quality...that is the picture

JVC & NEC 8" CRT with 106" wide Stewart screen. All NHT speakers driven by Pioneer Elite AVR and bluray

Custom dedicated 8 seat theater

CaspianM is offline  
post #3 of 284 Old 05-12-2006, 07:50 PM
Member
 
Robert Zuch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Armonk, NY
Posts: 65
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Gary, have you tried a power conditioner? You may have some high frequency noise on the AC line to the projector.
Robert Zuch is offline  
post #4 of 284 Old 05-12-2006, 08:36 PM
Advanced Member
 
bomrat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: chicago
Posts: 637
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
might of been the huge salad fork ups tried to insert :)

My new Company... CNG Conversions
Friends - Countrymen, lend my your Theaters :)
no theater here in Memphis :(
bomrat is offline  
post #5 of 284 Old 05-12-2006, 09:18 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Addicted Member
 
Gary Murrell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 10,927
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
no it was the forklift damage, that got the case and was within inches from destroying the unit, it seems to be in 100% perfect working condition

Caspian, I have tried 2 different outlets, one a dedicated circuit and outlet, haven't tried a conditioner yet, I think I have one around, a 400$ monster unit from a few years ago

I will try resetting all the cards, I think I did half of them already when checking the unit out after the back upper right panel had been hit

this is worse at sometimes and better at others, but it IS visible from my seating, if you know how to look for it

-Gary
Gary Murrell is offline  
post #6 of 284 Old 05-12-2006, 10:37 PM
AVS Special Member
 
deronmoped's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: San Diego, Ca.
Posts: 3,483
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
What is your input source?

Have you tried different resolutions, moving the input to another line and porches if you can adjust them? Is the phase set? Are your convergence controls within normal limits, are you using point, did you disable it?

Deron.

CRT Videophile
deronmoped is offline  
post #7 of 284 Old 05-12-2006, 10:52 PM
AVS Special Member
 
overclkr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Chicago
Posts: 7,884
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Ok, I'll take a stab at this. XG's have always been known to be noisy. My G70 has this slightly as well.

I have been told that a power conditioner can do the trick. The G70 has one built in believe it or not hence why I say it's slight.

I will ask my buddy at little guys about this. He is into this kind of stuff and when he had his XG, he ran one on his. I will find out the model.

Cliff
overclkr is offline  
post #8 of 284 Old 05-13-2006, 01:14 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Addicted Member
 
Gary Murrell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 10,927
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
thanks Cliff, Deron

Ok, it seems to get worse with higher resolutions(and worse with progressive ones at that), I am running 1920x1080i in 2.35:1 raster right now

I am using no point, I normalized all those in my memory block and didn't touch them(That darn XG convergence is a bear and I still haven't got it figured out yet :mad:)

input source is VP30 via RGBHV, my Moome DVI card is coming today so I will be using HDMI > DVI from the VP30 after it arrives(Thanks DVD Man ;))

the VP30 does have porch adjustment, I have just started learning the NEC over the past week, the shift control moves the image in the rasters, so I have adjusted that correct

I have adjusted convergence phase also

Thanks guys, I will try all these suggestions

-Gary
Gary Murrell is offline  
post #9 of 284 Old 05-13-2006, 09:14 AM
AVS Special Member
 
CaspianM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Land of Cardinals
Posts: 5,841
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
Cliff, video noise is a residual background noise. In this case there is a strong line noise. XG ver. 2 actually has a clean output.
Gary it seems there is something buzzing in a single frequency somewhere. It may not be audible. I have no idea what I am saying. I hope it works out for you.

It is all about quality...that is the picture

JVC & NEC 8" CRT with 106" wide Stewart screen. All NHT speakers driven by Pioneer Elite AVR and bluray

Custom dedicated 8 seat theater

CaspianM is offline  
post #10 of 284 Old 05-13-2006, 02:05 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Ericglo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Just below the US in South Florida
Posts: 6,322
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 127 Post(s)
Liked: 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary Murrell
no it was the forklift damage, that got the case and was within inches from destroying the unit, it seems to be in 100% perfect working condition

Why didn't you go and pick it up or meet halfway?

Ericglo

Call AVS For the Best Deals!!!


My new favorite game is Stop the Bots
Ericglo is offline  
post #11 of 284 Old 05-13-2006, 02:55 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Addicted Member
 
Gary Murrell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 10,927
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericglo
Why didn't you go and pick it up or meet halfway?

Ericglo
because I am a friggin moron and my vehicle is nut up to snuff :mad:, plus school finals etc.

Caspian it has to be something fairly simple, maybe not, it seems to be getting a little worse

I have also been told by many folks that the 1352's much cleaner, I can't tell though right now because of this issue

the lines have a halo around them and move very very rapidly up and down really fast, they aren't looping, the just move up and down a inch or two up and down

to update I removed and reinsert all the cards in the unit, no dice :(

I added a power conditioner, no dice :(

I changed my source today from RGBHV to the Moome DVI card, using it's DVI input, no dice :(

I carefully positioned the video leads from the back to the neck cards, keeping them away from everything else, no dice :(

tried cheater ground remover plug, nope :(

-Gary
Gary Murrell is offline  
post #12 of 284 Old 05-13-2006, 03:12 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Addicted Member
 
Gary Murrell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 10,927
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I found someone in the archives with my exact problem :), almost 100% identical, it changes from tube to tube and the amount as you change to different frequencies, my lines are much much smaller though

http://archive.avsforum.com/avs-vb/s...ighlight=lines

the poster never followed up though :mad:

-Gary
Gary Murrell is offline  
post #13 of 284 Old 05-13-2006, 03:54 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Mark_A_W's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 8,110
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I can ask JSP if you like - but his PKlus is dead currently - that PJ had lots of issues.

I know he had some noise issues caused by his switcher.

Loving my Electric Bike!!
Mark_A_W is offline  
post #14 of 284 Old 05-13-2006, 04:00 PM
AVS Special Member
 
CaspianM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Land of Cardinals
Posts: 5,841
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
Let me assure you that there is not such thing with my 1352 and I see no noise even at a few feet from screen. Very clean picture. Sorry that you ended up with this problem. Did Cliff had this issue or just something new?
Perhaps Doug and some other Nec's guys with experience would jump in helping you out. It could be as simple as changing a board. Good luck.

It is all about quality...that is the picture

JVC & NEC 8" CRT with 106" wide Stewart screen. All NHT speakers driven by Pioneer Elite AVR and bluray

Custom dedicated 8 seat theater

CaspianM is offline  
post #15 of 284 Old 05-13-2006, 04:01 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Jerry Arseneau's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: Neenah, WI, US
Posts: 1,106
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Gary, you might want to also try resetting your linear-balance settings to 0 since they can cause banding. There are separate settings for RED and BLUE. The GREEN one is for alignment (global) balance. You get to it by hitting CTRL-LINEAR if you are already in SERVICE mode.

Jerry
Jerry Arseneau is offline  
post #16 of 284 Old 05-13-2006, 04:30 PM
AVS Special Member
 
CZ Eddie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Austin TX, USA
Posts: 7,115
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 33 Post(s)
Liked: 16
Wait till Doug shows up before doing anything drastic. Hope you get it squared away. I never saw this issue with my 1352, but then my 1352 was never attacked by a forklift either. :(

Do you have any pics of the damaged area and the surrounding electronics?

"The boom is dead, long live the bass"
CZ Eddie is offline  
post #17 of 284 Old 05-13-2006, 04:52 PM
AVS Special Member
 
CaspianM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Land of Cardinals
Posts: 5,841
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
HAve you looked at you line voltage between ground and neutral? should read about .1v. It is long shot but should do it anyway.

It is all about quality...that is the picture

JVC & NEC 8" CRT with 106" wide Stewart screen. All NHT speakers driven by Pioneer Elite AVR and bluray

Custom dedicated 8 seat theater

CaspianM is offline  
post #18 of 284 Old 05-13-2006, 05:14 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Mark_A_W's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 8,110
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
What res are you running Gary? A few of the Aussie guys are now running really high res's (like 1440x1152 at 50hx for PAL DVD) which seems to minimise the XG video noise.

Loving my Electric Bike!!
Mark_A_W is offline  
post #19 of 284 Old 05-13-2006, 10:58 PM
AVS Special Member
 
overclkr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Chicago
Posts: 7,884
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by CZ Eddie
Wait till Doug shows up before doing anything drastic. Hope you get it squared away. I never saw this issue with my 1352, but then my 1352 was never attacked by a forklift either. :(

Do you have any pics of the damaged area and the surrounding electronics?
Here ya go CZ......

http://www.stbh.org/cliff/xglc1.jpg

http://www.stbh.org/cliff/xglc2.jpg

http://www.stbh.org/cliff/xglc4.jpg

http://www.stbh.org/cliff/xglc3.jpg

http://www.stbh.org/cliff/xglc5.jpg

Looking SO MUCH FOWARD to dealing with this as well as the nightmare Bruce and I are having right now with the Marquee 9000.

Cliff

P.S.

Damn I wish I could get close up's that good!!!!
overclkr is offline  
post #20 of 284 Old 05-13-2006, 10:59 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Addicted Member
 
Gary Murrell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 10,927
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
those pics make it look worse than it is and thats a good thing ;) :D the sheet metal was just indented slightly

Guys this issue was most likely not on the PJ when Cliff had it, he was running much higher resolutions also and may have never encountered it

I am going to check some more resolutions right now and see what gives

Eddie:

the forklift attack on the pj was within inches from being drastic, but the actual damage was only the back plastic piece, I was relieved when I opened the pj up and inspected, damn UPS freight come within a fleas ass from ruining the unit :mad:

I think it was a very minor bump of the fork lift in the very top right hand corner

Mark, thanks I would love to hear if he corrected the problem, I am running 1920x1080i/60hz in a 2.35:1 sized raster, I have tried a 16:9 and even 4:3 raster, the problem is still there, I have nothing in my chain but straight from the scaler(VP30) of RGBHV or DVI, neither outputs showed anything wrong on other CRT units

the VP30 has porch settings, i tried making them smaller and larger, no help

Jerry I have deleted all the memories and started fresh, 3 or 4 times already, everytime it is still the same

I can say for sure that with 1080i the blue tube is bad and is the worst, like the archived post, it changes randomly andis different with each resolution

Caspian, please inform me how to safely do this and I will be glad to do it, me and juice for some reason don't like each other ;)

thanks guys, we will get to the bottom of this because I don't give up :)

-Gary
Gary Murrell is offline  
post #21 of 284 Old 05-13-2006, 11:05 PM
AVS Special Member
 
CaspianM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Land of Cardinals
Posts: 5,841
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
What do you mean by safely? Just use a voltmeter and read the voltage between neutral and ground out of your power outlet. Should not be more than .1v.

It is all about quality...that is the picture

JVC & NEC 8" CRT with 106" wide Stewart screen. All NHT speakers driven by Pioneer Elite AVR and bluray

Custom dedicated 8 seat theater

CaspianM is offline  
post #22 of 284 Old 05-13-2006, 11:06 PM
AVS Special Member
 
overclkr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Chicago
Posts: 7,884
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 13
I must also add this to the scenario.

I have ALWAYS shipped EVERY projector in the past literally shrink wrapped to a pallet and have NEVER had any issues as the FL driver could CLEARLY see WTF he was dealing with.

This one time, the terminal dealer INSISTED that I cover the PJ with cardboard and even though I told him that I DID NOT recommend this method of shipment, he STILL insisted on shipping in this manner. I even COVERED the entire skid with "FRAGILE" 8X11 sheet's of paper all over the damn place to make it clear that it was in fact.....

FRAGILE YOU DUMB ****!!!!!

I Humbly INSURED the shipment in hopes that it would arrive safely.

As you can see, well, bummer.......

Now I have to deal with MOUNTAINS of paperwork and personal time on the phone.

It's to my hopes that it will be resolved in a agreeable state between Gary, The repairer of the equipment, and me.........

Cliff
overclkr is offline  
post #23 of 284 Old 05-13-2006, 11:12 PM
AVS Special Member
 
overclkr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Chicago
Posts: 7,884
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 13
BTW, GARY,

Stop ph****ing around with 1080i and feed that bad boy a rez it deserves!!!!!! :D :cool: :D ;)
overclkr is offline  
post #24 of 284 Old 05-13-2006, 11:18 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Addicted Member
 
Gary Murrell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 10,927
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I am off to try 720p in 2.35:1 raster ;)

-Gary
Gary Murrell is offline  
post #25 of 284 Old 05-13-2006, 11:22 PM
AVS Special Member
 
overclkr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Chicago
Posts: 7,884
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary Murrell
I am off to try 720p in 2.35:1 raster ;)

-Gary
Thank you!

And thank yourself afterward! :)

Make sure you spend some time TWEAKING the focus! ;)

Cliff
overclkr is offline  
post #26 of 284 Old 05-13-2006, 11:27 PM
AVS Special Member
 
overclkr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Chicago
Posts: 7,884
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 13
ALSO!!!!

KEN IS A MUST FOR YOU!

You my friend are a VIDEOPHILE. Admit it, suck it up, and have KEN SET YOU UP! :^)

Cliff
overclkr is offline  
post #27 of 284 Old 05-14-2006, 12:13 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Addicted Member
 
Gary Murrell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 10,927
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Cliff, I sent Ken a email last night ;)

-Gary
Gary Murrell is offline  
post #28 of 284 Old 05-14-2006, 12:45 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Addicted Member
 
Gary Murrell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 10,927
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Cliff the 720p was worse with these squiggly lines :mad:, I have got to get this figured out

I tried 1080i and 720p at 72.928 hz from my DVDO VP30 scaler, the lines got much much better in intensity(lower) and were not nearly as visible, this has got to be something like a board

I should have started a thread dedicated to me discussing my new 1352, that would have been fun as heck

I am having another issue here, I am fighting the optical focus like mad, it seems I cannot get a proper phosphur grain pulled in :mad:, does anyone have any info on the HD-134M lenses?? I know those are regarded as awesome lenses so something is a miss on my setup?? or they might not work on my setup ?? could it be my expanded raster that I like so much ?? I have heard that Nec's don't like the expanded raster, but with my 2.35:1 screen I was going for more raster width, I know that the throw distance calculator for my screen size and the 1352 was like 25" off(farther back), I need a pjcalc for the HD-134m lenses and I need a pro here :D I know this NEC is capable of something special and I just can't hit it right now

-Gary
Gary Murrell is offline  
post #29 of 284 Old 05-14-2006, 07:16 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Addicted Member
 
Gary Murrell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 10,927
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
ah ha, I found a post from Doug where he talked about the LC unit and how physical setup is very important and throw distance etc, he say if it isn't the lenses will fight each other

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...&&#post5479989

that is exactly what is happening to me right now

my Green tube is showing perfect sharp phosphur grain, as a matter of fact, it is the best I have ever seen, the 134's are unreal, BUT my red and blue tubes are ****, I cannot get the phosphur grain to come in at all, it is very very visible on the top 1 inch or so on my screen from the blue and red tubes, the flapping adjustments do not move this down my screen, so it is most certainly a lens issue related to something in my setup, it's not the lenses themselves because I have perfect grain on my green tube

oh the joy! :mad:

the 1352 manual I have gives 123" from center of green lens to center of screen, I am at 103" right now :eek:, that could very well be my problem

-Gary
Gary Murrell is offline  
post #30 of 284 Old 05-14-2006, 07:55 AM
AVS Special Member
 
CaspianM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Land of Cardinals
Posts: 5,841
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
I have mine 119" for a 100" wide so I would think it is not the throw.
You can swap the red& blue with green lens for a test.

It is all about quality...that is the picture

JVC & NEC 8" CRT with 106" wide Stewart screen. All NHT speakers driven by Pioneer Elite AVR and bluray

Custom dedicated 8 seat theater

CaspianM is offline  
Closed Thread CRT Projectors

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off