moome card/HD-A1 fiasco - Page 15 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Baselworld is only a few weeks away. Getting the latest news is easy, Click Here for info on how to join the newsletter list. Follow our team for updates featuring event coverage, new product unveilings, watch industry news & more!

Forum Jump: 
Closed Thread
Thread Tools
post #421 of 426 Old 12-10-2006, 07:00 AM
AVS Special Member
JonFo's Avatar
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Big Canoe, GA, USA
Posts: 1,380
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 58 Post(s)
Liked: 44
Looking at the EDID dump, it does not seem optimized to a Sony G70 / G90 class display.

It specifies timings that are sub par, I’m sure the color points are correct, etc. etc.

No wonder some devices mess up when talking to this. The EDID should be tuned to the true capabilities of the display device. This looks like a baseline EDID for some LCD, not a CRT device, it does not even specify interlaced capabilities (that I can tell).

Cleary it works to some extent, but seems like there is plenty of room for improvement.

What changes would the true video gurus suggest a Sony G series oriented EDID would need?
JonFo is online now  
Sponsored Links
post #422 of 426 Old 12-10-2006, 07:41 AM
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 15,993
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1361 Post(s)
Liked: 684
Send a message via Skype™ to CINERAMAX
Originally Posted by JonFo
Looking at the EDID dump, it does not seem optimized to a Sony G70 / G90 class display.

It specifies timings that are sub par, I’m sure the color points are correct, etc. etc.

What changes would the true video gurus suggest a Sony G series oriented EDID would need?
If this is correct then it explains the instability of the card. Mine went back will the new HDMI card have the same timing defficiencies?

Jon Fo give me an example of the subpar timings and what they should be for a G-90, that youu know of.
CINERAMAX is online now  
post #423 of 426 Old 12-10-2006, 10:16 AM
disking's Avatar
Join Date: May 2004
Location: London Ont. CANADA
Posts: 61
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
OK I think I need to put this all in laymans terms for you all.
EDID came about in the late 90s.
It was designed to talk to the new batch of video cards with smart chips on to let them know what res. and frequency they where to run at.
The format was set back then as cells 1 to 53.
We can now ignore most of that stuff for the new HDMI/DVI format. ( this stuff still has to be there for padding only ). cells 18/19 tell the device that it is EDID 1.3 . cell 20 tells it it is a digital device not analog. cells 21/22 also tell it it is digital with no aspect ratio and to use the frequency the work out the aspect ratio. cell 23 is not used with HDMI as this is set by the chip set later. all the rest are also ignored.
So this brings us to cell 54. This is where we can make a difference.
cells 54-71 Detailed timing / Descriptor Block 1.
In the above example we have :-
(54-71) Detailed Timing / Descriptor Block 1:
1280x720 Pixel Clock: 74.25 MHz
____________________________________________________________ __________
Horizontal Image Size: 708 mm Vertical Image Size: 230 mm
Refreshed Mode: Non-Interlaced Normal Display - No Stereo

Active Time: 1280 pixels Blanking Time: 370 pixels
Sync Offset: 110 pixels Sync Pulse Width: 40 pixels
Border: 0 pixels Frequency: 45.00 KHz

Active Time: 720 lines Blanking Time: 30 lines
Sync Offset: 5 lines Sync Pulse Width: 5 lines
Border: 0 lines Frequency: 60.00 Hz

Digital Separate, Horizontal Polarity (+) Vertical Polarity (+)

This is telling the HDMI complyant DVD player or Video output card that the device preferred res. is 1280 X 720P 60Hz.
Most HDMI source units stop there and if it can, outputs that res.
If it can not output that res. then it will switch to the next lowest one, this may be 50Hz for our PAL users.
But this is only for people that have fully HDMI complyant units.
This is where it get into a gray area.
For all Sony HD and SD up converting players we have to set this cell block to the res. we will like to display. So 1920 X 1080i or 1280 X 720p as they will only output what is in this cell block.
Toshiba HD and SD players will read this block and with the old software will switch to this res. With the new software will switch to any res. that is outlined in cell block 108-125.
They being the Min and Max settings.
Now another problem we have is that HDMI/DVI and EDID have two channels of communication.
We will look at Sony first.
Sony DVD players first look for the EDID chip to receive there info.
They then look at the HDMI unit chipset to see if it is secure and complyant.
Once this is done video is sent and tokens exchanged via the HDMI secured channel.
If we interrupt this exchang. Then the DVD player stops video and again askes the EDID chip what res. it likes.
It will then hand shake with HDMI and display video once again.
Now another problem exists here in that the EDID chip is powed from the DVI bus and the HDMI chip set is powed by the display device.
So with Sony DVD players, the display device this to be powed first followed by the DVD player soon after.
Toshiba units are a little different in that once it is working the EDID chip is still polled and if it changes in any way, the Video link is stopped and a power down is needed.
So both unit should be powed up as follows.

PJ first.
DVD player second and within a few seconds of the PJ.
With Toshiba units if you change the res. on the DVD player you have to do a power off and restart all of it.

disking is offline  
post #424 of 426 Old 12-11-2006, 12:14 AM
jeffwp's Avatar
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: melbourne australia
Posts: 179
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Liked: 13
So .....if i understand correctly we need confirmation that moomes latest edid chip change occuring about august 06 allowed the tosh hd players to read cell block 108-125 and not limit the resolutions.
Quote "with the new software, switch to any res in cell block 108-125, ie min-max settings" can i paraphrase.... it will pass all practical resolutions... is that correct?

YONEXSP......... is your card a modified one after AUG 06? jeff melbourne
jeffwp is offline  
post #425 of 426 Old 12-11-2006, 12:29 AM
AVS Special Member
Mark_A_W's Avatar
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 8,105
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Ken, your EDID looks the same as the new EDID rom I got an EE at work to swap over.

Version 1, revision 3. It includes 1920x1080.

Sorry for the delay, been away on holidays - down the Great Ocean Rd a bit (there's a remote chance you have heard of it, it's pretty famous).


Loving my Electric Bike!!
Mark_A_W is offline  
post #426 of 426 Old 12-11-2006, 06:22 AM
AVS Special Member
YONEXSP's Avatar
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Newmarket, Ontario Canada
Posts: 2,505
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Liked: 12
I bought my card in September. the problem I havce is not resolution as 1080i wroks great. the problem I have is that I have to reboot the Card averytime I want to use it. I.e. the Card does not reset itself automatically.

Mark, isn't that that small Fish Farm you fellas have up north right ;)
YONEXSP is offline  
Sponsored Links
Closed Thread CRT Projectors

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page

Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off