The "Official" Canon HFS10 / HFS100 Owner's Thread - Page 10 - AVS Forum
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Old 07-25-2009, 07:51 PM
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I am shooting at 24 Mbps bitrate at 60i frames per second with my HFS100. When I click on a video file I recorded, I get the following properties: 24 bits, 1920 x 1080, 16:9, 29.970 frames/sec.

Is this correct?
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Old 07-26-2009, 12:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PSUmtj112 View Post

I am shooting at 24 Mbps bitrate at 60i frames per second with my HFS100. When I click on a video file I recorded, I get the following properties: 24 bits, 1920 x 1080, 16:9, 29.970 frames/sec.

Is this correct?

AFAIK yes. If you check elsewhere in this forum (It might be earlier in this thread) it was reported that the captured video is always a 60i "container" but that the frames inside are adjusted to account for the format. (IE 30p is still 60i but each "full" frame is doubled, 24p is something like a 3:2 cadence) When transcoding your authoring software has to pull the frames out individually to get to an actual 24p/30p source.

(No I'm not exactly sure how to do that yet, but if you find out, let us know! )
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Old 07-26-2009, 01:12 AM
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After reading for days, i'm still not quite sure which cam to get. Majority of my shots will be handheld, I'll probably never use a tripod, I also want to film sports. How well does the hf s100 handle motion and panning. I know the xr520v is really good on ois but pq isnt as good? So correct me if im wrong, when panning the camera it gets blurry, but when it somewhat still it focus' really well?

Any thoughts?
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Old 07-26-2009, 02:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goks92 View Post

How well does the hf s100 handle motion and panning. I know the xr520v is really good on ois but pq isnt as good? So correct me if im wrong, when panning the camera it gets blurry, but when it somewhat still it focus' really well?

I did some panning tests in 24p, 30p and 60i. On a sunny day on automatic, 24 and 30p are "jerky" ie they need more motion blur, however the stills are razor sharp. What that tells me is that you should be able to adjust the amount of motion blur (smoothness) with the exposure time.

60i is very smooth, and the stills are still very sharp. I've been shooting all 60i since.
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Old 07-26-2009, 08:03 AM
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Thanks AbMagFab and IAM4UK.

I'm glad you both made more sense of it all for me. Now I'm not so worried about it. I did some testing and it is correct that copying the whole folder structure over instead of just the files, will allow it to recognize them. I can keep that in mind for later use.

I also realized that the PS3 can play these files back just fine. Dump them on a USB stick or card and roll! So everything's good now.

Thanks for the info/help/advice!
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Old 07-26-2009, 12:47 PM
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thanks for the reply, im just a little anxious, i got a wedding coming up in 3 weeks and I really want to get the hf s100, but the low light and ois worries me a little...I have yet to see any good videos that show motion when panning...
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Old 07-26-2009, 01:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goks92 View Post

thanks for the reply, im just a little anxious, i got a wedding coming up in 3 weeks and I really want to get the hf s100, but the low light and ois worries me a little...I have yet to see any good videos that show motion when panning...

I did some outdoor night shooting at Vegas, both at night and indoors in Cinema mode and the low light performance of that was very good. I recorded in 30p mode and the panning was not video smooth but blurry (like a fast camera pan). I suspect that's intentional. Regular 60i panning seemed to be about on par with my Sony HC3 but I didn't test that extensively.

Cinema mode also flattens the color palette somewhat. You still get good colors but not the intense saturation you can get from video.

There are also several program modes for indoors/low light situations. (IE Spotlight mode was interesting in that brightly lit objects came in perfectly at the expense of dimming out the normal background.

More simply, unless you're doing a really tricky lowlight situation (IE a candelight wedding) I don't think you'll have to worry about the camera's performance.

Stabliization, on the other hand... If you're not moving the OIS works well to stabilize camera shake (unless you're tightly zoomed in), if you're walking while shooting, forget it. The OIS will try to compensate but it just can't and seems to give up. Otherwise, steady arm/hand movements are handled well.
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Old 07-26-2009, 02:26 PM
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skywise, thanks that really helps. Now that i think of it, im very rarely going to be walking and filming, most be will holding the camera and panning like that. Thanks a lot for all of your input. I think im going to just buy the hfs100 and demo it for a few days to see how i like it....
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Old 07-27-2009, 07:52 AM
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The cure for shooting imagery while walking is a SteadiCam mount, I would think. There's a reason that won a special award from AMPAS.

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Old 07-27-2009, 11:09 AM
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Originally Posted by IAM4UK View Post

The cure for shooting imagery while walking is a SteadiCam mount, I would think. There's a reason that won a special award from AMPAS.

True. But there's a distinct difference in "bounce" between a Sony camcorder and the Canon one. The Sony being much smoother. (They both bounce though) It's also one of the major complaints of the Canon HFS reviews. (See camcorderinfo.com) Before I purchased it I was concerned about that because the reviews imply it's next to useless, which isn't the case.
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Old 07-27-2009, 12:37 PM
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I turn OIS off anyway, since it compromises image quality as a matter of course. Perhaps that's why the consensus is that the Sonys have better OIS and the Canons have better image quality...

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Old 07-27-2009, 01:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IAM4UK View Post

I turn OIS off anyway, since it compromises image quality as a matter of course. Perhaps that's why the consensus is that the Sonys have better OIS and the Canons have better image quality...

It's optical, not digital. Why do you think it sacrifices any image quality? Only digital IS is supposed to do that, right?

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Old 07-27-2009, 03:33 PM
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You may be correct, AbMagFab, and I may have a misperception.

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Old 07-29-2009, 07:28 AM
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Hey guys, I too am not happy with the OIS with the HFS100 / 10. I went ahead and purchased a steadicam style stabilizer and VERY happy with the results. This is a quick test of the U3X Longbow Steadicam (ebay vendor, copy of the merlin). I'm clearly not taking this device everywhere I go, but planned shoots I think this does almost a professional job keeping the camcorder steady. I was walking throughout this shot and did not post process stabilize the footage.

http://www.vimeo.com/5811533
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Old 07-29-2009, 07:49 AM
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stripedrex, that's some good footage with the longbow; thanks for posting it!

Qs: 60i, 30p or 24p?
Program, CineMode, Shutter Priority or Aperture Priority settings?
Which "Magic Bullet Look" did you apply in Vegas Pro 9?

BTW, your wife and future sister-in-law are quite photogenic.

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Old 07-29-2009, 07:52 AM
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Originally Posted by stripedrex View Post

Hey guys, I too am not happy with the OIS with the HFS100 / 10. I went ahead and purchased a steadicam style stabilizer and VERY happy with the results. This is a quick test of the U3X Longbow Steadicam (ebay vendor, copy of the merlin). I'm clearly not taking this device everywhere I go, but planned shoots I think this does almost a professional job keeping the camcorder steady. I was walking throughout this shot and did not post process stabilize the footage.

http://www.vimeo.com/5811533

Out of curiosity does Sony Vegas do post process stabilizing? Is it any good?
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Old 07-29-2009, 04:27 PM
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Originally Posted by IAM4UK View Post

stripedrex, that's some good footage with the longbow; thanks for posting it!

Qs: 60i, 30p or 24p?
Program, CineMode, Shutter Priority or Aperture Priority settings?
Which "Magic Bullet Look" did you apply in Vegas Pro 9?

BTW, your wife and future sister-in-law are quite photogenic.

Shot in 60i program ae (full auto) - Had to convert it down to 720p for Vimeo though. Used the color reversal look (original showed a bit more detail, I wanted colors to pop a bit more)

And thanks, I think they make for good filming as well =).
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Old 07-29-2009, 04:28 PM
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Originally Posted by the_Skywise View Post

Out of curiosity does Sony Vegas do post process stabilizing? Is it any good?

No it doesn't =(. I've purchased the ProDAD Mercalli stabilization software for Vegas which I'm very happy with. I used it to stabilize the other video on my vimeo profile (with the bees).
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Old 07-31-2009, 01:19 PM
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I just purchased the hfs10 - can you guys recommend settings for low light with a lot of motion, My wedding reception. I will be filming at 24mbs for sure... Thanks
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Old 07-31-2009, 02:31 PM
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Originally Posted by goks92 View Post

I just purchased the hfs10 - can you guys recommend settings for low light with a lot of motion, My wedding reception. I will be filming at 24mbs for sure... Thanks

Try cinema mode, 60i or 30p. 30p may help with the lighting but large motion will get blurred. 60i may be a little darker but the motion should be tracked a little better.
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Old 07-31-2009, 02:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goks92 View Post

I just purchased the hfs10 - can you guys recommend settings for low light with a lot of motion, My wedding reception. I will be filming at 24mbs for sure... Thanks

60i, Shutter Priority Mode (Tv) set fairly low (15 or 30 might work well, depending on the light), with Aperture/Exposure on the Custom knob. Tripod, or steadicam mount if moving camera is required.

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Old 07-31-2009, 10:34 PM
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You could also try the "Night" mode and see how it looks for you.
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Old 08-01-2009, 03:31 PM
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sorry in advance if this question was asked before but i could find it.
i just got my hf s100 and i got an extra 3 hour battery with it. the stock battery it came with works fine. when i turn the camera on with the 3 hour battery it says the camera cant communicate with the battery and asks if i still want to use it. I click yes and everything works fine but where the battery meter is it just has a question mark instead of telling me how much time i have left.
its not a big deal but it would be nice to know how much time i have left on the battery. does anyone know if i can fix this?
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Old 08-01-2009, 05:44 PM
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its not a big deal but it would be nice to know how much time i have left on the battery. does anyone know if i can fix this?

Not unless you get an original Canon "smart" battery. What you have there is an after-market clone. It'll still work, but you'll have to do a few tests to find out how much time you actually have on that battery.
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Old 08-02-2009, 11:03 AM
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Not unless you get an original Canon "smart" battery. What you have there is an after-market clone. It'll still work, but you'll have to do a few tests to find out how much time you actually have on that battery.


ok I thought thats what it was be like the website i ordered the camera from suckered me into buying it but i think it will be worth it
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Old 08-02-2009, 08:42 PM
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Would you guys recommend sony vegas or Final Cut E or P??? I have heard those software comes with some good stablizing filters. I have an imac core2 extreme so I should be able to run either...
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Old 08-03-2009, 04:02 PM
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Vegas is my editor-of-choice, goks. You can try it before you buy.

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Old 08-03-2009, 07:10 PM
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Vegas is my editor-of-choice, goks. You can try it before you buy.

Vegas Studio or Vegas Pro?
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Old 08-03-2009, 07:56 PM
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Vegas Studio or Vegas Pro?

You can try both one after the other, giving you sixty days.

Movie Studio is out. It doesn't do HD.

Movie Studio Platinum WILL do HD and a whole lot more, especially if you get the Pro Pack version (what I have) with all the NewBlue effects including the Color Fixer which has quickly saved my imbalanced shots more than once.

The main drawback with the Platinum edition is that it limits you to four audio tracks and four video tracks. It's not a problem for me since all those extra tracks will make it more likely that I'll screw up the editing by losing "track" of all the tracks.

Vegas Pro (do not confuse with Platinum Pro Pack) has unlimited audio and video tracks, plus higher audio resolution support (Platinum stops at 48K/16 bits). But it's four times the price! I simply couldn't justify the cost.

Love the software though. Vegas will function with your original material with no need to convert it beforehand. And if you ever reorganize your hard drive and Vegas can't find the files, it'll ask you where it can find the first missing file, and search for the remaining files from the same location, even if your main location change is a subdirectory in the middle of the path!

This is extremely smart software!
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Old 08-04-2009, 09:33 AM
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Vegas Pro 9.0a 64-bit is what I use.

But I would never have paid full price for Vegas; I got it bundled (when it was Sonic Foundry's product, rather than Sony's) with vid-capture hardware several years ago, and have upgraded about every-other-version since. See if you can find a deal or an upgrade path, if you want the full-featured Vegas Pro.

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