Kodak's 1080p pocket camcorder - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 246 Old 08-10-2009, 10:53 AM - Thread Starter
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http://www.televisionbroadcast.com/article/85074
1080p30 or 720p60/p30 AIUI. And low cost. -- John

EDIT: More details at http://www.kodak.com/eknec/PageQueri...q-locale=en_US
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post #2 of 246 Old 08-10-2009, 11:59 AM
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I think that camcorders like this are only good for youtube video uploads.

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post #3 of 246 Old 08-13-2009, 04:11 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajamils View Post

I think that camcorders like this are only good for youtube video uploads.

They are getting great reviews and from what I have seen picture quality is excellent.
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post #4 of 246 Old 08-14-2009, 04:44 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dysfunction26 View Post

They are getting great reviews and from what I have seen picture quality is excellent.

It'd be interesting to see measured effective resolution comparisons between Kodak's machine and others, if anyone has captured printed resolution wedges using the same setup between camcorders. Other factors, such as noise, color, etc., of course, play a role, too. -- John
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post #5 of 246 Old 08-16-2009, 05:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajamils View Post

I think that camcorders like this are only good for youtube video uploads.

These camcorders are good for much more than just YouTube uploads, I own a Vado HD, a Flip Ultra HD and a Kodak Zi6,,,, my bigger more expensive camcorder got sold on eBay a while ago.

All the camcorders listed that I own can take some very impressive video, and when used with a tripod its hard to tell the difference between the cheaper camera's I own and way more expensive HD camcorders.

Overall, my Flip Ultra HD is the best of the bunch.

CHeers
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post #6 of 246 Old 08-19-2009, 06:22 AM
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I wonder if flipHD is planning a new 1080p pocket camcorder to compete with the new Kodak 1080p model being released mid-September??? I am very tempted to pre-order the Kodak model.
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post #7 of 246 Old 08-19-2009, 06:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fjerina View Post

I wonder if flipHD is planning a new 1080p pocket camcorder to compete with the new Kodak 1080p model being released mid-September??? I am very tempted to pre-order the Kodak model.

The new Kodak Zi8 has already been released, no pre-ordering needed, its in stock and can be ordered on Kodak.com .

I ordered my Zi8 a few days ago and it will be arriving later today via UPS,,,,,,,(just checked the UPS tracking).

I already have the Flip Ultra HD, the Vado HD and the Kodak Zi6, but I just could not resist tring out the new Zi8,,,, the 1080p, the external stereo mic input and the image stabilization were features to hard to pass up.

And yes, it will be interesting to see what Flip comes out will next.

Cheers
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post #8 of 246 Old 08-25-2009, 04:52 AM
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Ok, time for an up-date,

I have had my Zi8 for almost a week now I guess and I have to say I am very very impressed.

Did some comparison shooting between my Vado HD, Flip Ultra HD, my Zi6 and Zi8,,,,,,,, I am very supprised and shocked at how much I like the Zi8.

I guess I didnt think the Zi8 would be that good because the Zi6 is my least favorite out of all the mini camcorders I own,,, I figured at best the Zi8 would only be a slight improvement over the Zi6,,,, wow, was I wrong,, the Zi8 is a really big jump in video quality over the Zi6.

The Zi8 video quality even looks way better than my much loved Flip Ultra HD, and I was not expecting that one at all either.

Aside from the better video the Zi8 also has the others beat in the features, external stereo mic input, cheaper than the Ultra HD, image stabilation, can take still shots, bigger screen, more memory with an SDHC card and 1080p.

Some pros and cons of the shoot-out between my Flip Ultra HD and the Kodak Zi8.

My Ultra HD thoughts:
Does just a tad better in low light than the Zi8, but not by much.
A tiny bit sharper in the video quality.
Lots more video noise than the Zi8.
No motion blur when panning around.

My Zi8 thoughts:
Very little video noise.
Better skin tones and colors.
Some motion blur when panning, but not too bad.
While the Ultra HD is a bit sharper the Zi8 video is smoother and cleaner and just looks much nicer.

I think the main difference that really stood out for me was how much video noise the Ultra HD has compared to the Zi8 which has very little video noise.

My little shoot-out was done with the Zi8 set to 720p 60fps and the Ultra HD in its default 720p mode, everything I shot for the test was indoors.

On a side note, video I shoot with the Zi8 set to 1080p did not look as good as the 720p 60fps video when played on my PC, not sure if its an issue with my PC or not yet, also the 1080p audio is out of sync when played on my PC,,,,, I called Kodak tech support and they told me to hook the Zi8 up to my HDTV via the HDMI out and see if I still have the problem,, I have not done that yet.


Anyhow, my new favorite,,,,,,,,,, the Kodak Zi8 !!!!!!


Cheers
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post #9 of 246 Old 08-26-2009, 07:48 AM
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I'm tempted to buy this thing. Quality seems to be good enough for my needs and it's apparently very portable and simple to use.

Though i'm wary:
  • Some early reviews talked about this high pitched hissing noise on all videos recorded with the internal mic, and i thought it was pretty bad on their sample videos. The more recent video samples on YouTube however don't have that noise anymore, and people are saying it was only a problem in the early models sent out to press. Waiting for further confirmation on this.
  • Image stability seems to be an issue in some videos, despite the stabilizer thing. Hoping it's because these people don't have steady enough hands, because it doesn't look that bad in other videos. I don't think this problem would be easy to fix in this kind of device anyways, due to how it's held.

Also: I wasn't able to find out what kind of SDHC card is needed, like what kind of speed class. At 1080p, i can't imagine just any card would hold up fine. Do you guys know anything about this?
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post #10 of 246 Old 08-30-2009, 11:39 PM
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I'm considering a purchase. I want a small sized camcorder that I can fit comfortably into my pocket. I already have a phone that shoots video at 30fps and takes fantastic 5megapixel photos.

I know the quality would be much higher with the Zi8 but it would be another device to carry around in the pocket, so it's something I have to consider.

I also thought about an Canon Vixia HF200 but size and portability are also issues for me. Carrying around an extra bag/carrying case would be problematic in my situation even though this is far better camcorder. There's also the higher price to consider.

Then there's the issue with image stability with these type of pocket cameras. Most video I plan would be from a stationary position. There would be panning, but I would not be doing much physical movement - walking, running, ect. I'm worried about videos looking terrible because of the jitters. Can this be overcomed? I know I can use tripods, but for on the fly type of recording would adding some weight at the bottom of cam with washers help? Also, I imagine this would be problematic recording from a moving vehicle. Are there any tricks to stabilizing these type of camcorders?

Any comments or suggestions would be appreciated, thanks. I'm also considering alternatives like the Sanyo Xacti models i.e. VPC 2000. It seems like they might be small enough to fit in a pocket? I don't know the video quality vs the zi8.
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post #11 of 246 Old 08-31-2009, 10:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bib Fortuna View Post

I'm tempted to buy this thing. Quality seems to be good enough for my needs and it's apparently very portable and simple to use.

Though i'm wary:
  • Some early reviews talked about this high pitched hissing noise on all videos recorded with the internal mic, and i thought it was pretty bad on their sample videos. The more recent video samples on YouTube however don't have that noise anymore, and people are saying it was only a problem in the early models sent out to press. Waiting for further confirmation on this.
  • Image stability seems to be an issue in some videos, despite the stabilizer thing. Hoping it's because these people don't have steady enough hands, because it doesn't look that bad in other videos. I don't think this problem would be easy to fix in this kind of device anyways, due to how it's held.

Also: I wasn't able to find out what kind of SDHC card is needed, like what kind of speed class. At 1080p, i can't imagine just any card would hold up fine. Do you guys know anything about this?

Bump for an answer, hopefully. I'm sure there are lots of us who would love to know if the high-pitch noise was fixed!
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post #12 of 246 Old 09-03-2009, 07:48 AM
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I've read a couple of times now that the high-pitched noise only occurs when the mic sensitivity is cranked all the way up. Could a Zi8 owner please confirm that? And is the mic still sensitive enough below the max level?
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post #13 of 246 Old 09-03-2009, 07:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bib Fortuna View Post

I've read a couple of times now that the high-pitched noise only occurs when the mic sensitivity is cranked all the way up. Could a Zi8 owner please confirm that? And is the mic still sensitive enough below the max level?

I have had no issues at all with the audio on my Zi8.

Cheers
Davyo
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post #14 of 246 Old 09-07-2009, 07:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Has anyone come across test-pattern comparisons for all consumer/prosumer camcorders claiming 1080 resolution? Don't follow reviews that closely, but articles a few years back indicated effective resolution (resolvable detail) for 1440X1080 prosumer camcorders was quite modest. Of course, sampled test pattern resolutions, involving reconstruction filtering and Kell-factor reductions, shouldn't be expected to match the full format resolution. Seems a well-lit wall resolution chart and a known full-res 1080i/p display would be adequate for testing. For motion testing, it appears that the ATSC HD approval committee in the mid-'90s used rotating test patterns and obtained the results in these tables , including 15-rpm motion results (dynamic). -- John
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post #15 of 246 Old 09-07-2009, 11:56 AM
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I know this thread is about the Zi8, but I just picked up the Zi6 and have the same issue, a loud high-pitched hiss / whirring on all recordings. Not sure if Kodak just has really bad quality control or what, but it's really annoying because otherwise it's perfect for my needs.

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post #16 of 246 Old 09-16-2009, 03:39 PM
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Is is possible to put 1080p h.264 videos in a MOV container back onto the Kodak Zi8, so the camcorder can double as an HD player?

With a 16 GB SDHC card and HDMI out, it would be pretty awesome if this camcorder could act as a quick and dirty Popcorn Hour-like media player. I'll bet some fiddling with Handbrake or QuickTime Pro would yield results...

If somebody like davyo can't answer this, I'll probably try it myself when my Zi8 arrives next week.
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post #17 of 246 Old 09-16-2009, 07:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Karyudo View Post

Is is possible to put 1080p h.264 videos in a MOV container back onto the Kodak Zi8, so the camcorder can double as an HD player?

With a 16 GB SDHC card and HDMI out, it would be pretty awesome if this camcorder could act as a quick and dirty Popcorn Hour-like media player. I'll bet some fiddling with Handbrake or QuickTime Pro would yield results...

If somebody like davyo can't answer this, I'll probably try it myself when my Zi8 arrives next week.

Might be easier to hook-up a card reader to your PC, load the video on to the SDHC card with your PC in a MOV format, put the card into the Zi8 and hit play.

Would that work ???

Cheers
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post #18 of 246 Old 09-17-2009, 10:11 AM
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You tell me! (heh, heh)

But yeah, that's what I'd expect to do: pull the card, put the video on, put it back in the Zi8. I just wonder if it's possible to put a (well, an appropriate) video file on the Zi8 and have it be recognized and play.

If I/we/somebody figures this out, it'll sorta be like having a Zune HD that can shoot HD video, too...
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post #19 of 246 Old 09-17-2009, 12:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Karyudo View Post

You tell me! (heh, heh)

But yeah, that's what I'd expect to do: pull the card, put the video on, put it back in the Zi8. I just wonder if it's possible to put a (well, an appropriate) video file on the Zi8 and have it be recognized and play.

If I/we/somebody figures this out, it'll sorta be like having a Zune HD that can shoot HD video, too...

Do let us know if you figure it out! That would be pretty sweet! For some reason, I feel like playback from the camera won't be as smooth as if ripped onto a DVD, so I'm curious what you find out .
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post #20 of 246 Old 09-18-2009, 04:44 PM
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Could someone recommend a good SDHC card to get to use on the Zi8? Do I need a class 6 card???
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post #21 of 246 Old 09-19-2009, 12:51 PM
 
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I really want to order the Zi8, but apparently it is impossible to do. I can't find a site that has it in stock and I need it within the next 18 days. We are vacationing in New England and I need it for the trip.
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post #22 of 246 Old 09-19-2009, 01:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dysfunction26 View Post

I really want to order the Zi8, but apparently it is impossible to do. I can't find a site that has it in stock and I need it within the next 18 days. We are vacationing in New England and I need it for the trip.

Kodak.com has them in stock in black,,,,,,,,, and I think the other colors as well.

I got my Zi8 from Kodak and had them ship 2 or 3 day (I forget),,,,and it didnt cost that much more for the extra fast shipping.

Cheers
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http://store.kodak.com/store/ekconsu...ctID.156585800
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post #23 of 246 Old 09-19-2009, 02:43 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davyo View Post

Kodak.com has them in stock in black,,,,,,,,, and I think the other colors as well.

I got my Zi8 from Kodak and had them ship 2 or 3 day (I forget),,,,and it didnt cost that much more for the extra fast shipping.

Cheers
Davyo

http://store.kodak.com/store/ekconsu...ctID.156585800

When I add it to the cart it says it is not in stock. I called and they said 2 weeks until they get them in and then another few days to ship.
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post #24 of 246 Old 09-19-2009, 02:51 PM
 
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I have an old Panasonic PV-DV102D Mini DV camera, how much of an improvement will the Zi8 be over that, if any? Here is a link to the specs:

Key Features:

* TypeDigital
* Optical Zoom10x
* Recording FormatMini DV
* Recording SystemNTSC
* CCD Quantity1
* Memory Still Resolution1.23 Megapixels



CCD:

* CCD Size1/4"
* CCD Pixels680K pixels
* LCD / Viewfinder
* LCD Panel Size2.5 in.
* LCD DisplayWith LCD Display
* Color ViewfinderWithout Color Viewfinder



Lens:

* Digital Zoom700X
* Lens Focal Length3.6 - 36 mm
* Filter Diameter43 mm
* Video Modes
* Recording SpeedLP · SP
* Image StabilizerWith Image Stabilizer
* Low Lux5 Lux



Audio:

* Audio Format12/16 Bit PCM Digital Stereo/Audio Dub
* Memory Photography
* Memory Card TypeSD Card · Multimedia Card (MMC)
* Digital Still Shot ModeWith Still Shot Capability
* Max Still Image Size1280 x 960
* MPEG Movie ModeWith MPEG Movie Mode



Interfaces:

* Microphone TypeInternal
* Output InterfacesUSB · Composite (Video) · Audio (RCA) · FireWire / DV / i.Link
* Input InterfacesFireWire / DV / iLink



Power Supply:

* Battery TypeProprietary Lithium



Dimensions:

* Depth7.4 in.
* Width3.5 in.
* Weight1.28 lb.
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post #25 of 246 Old 09-21-2009, 11:27 AM
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I've read all great but the hissing noise as well (which seems to be luck of the draw from what I've seen). Gonna take a chance....

Question: my understanding is that I need to buy a memory card for this (Which I believe is not true for the Flip). Question is, how much of a card do I need to be able to record about 2 hours of video? Is 8GB about right (4gb/hr)?

Any recommendations on cards?

It's a bit deceiving, b/c the need for a card makes the unit price compared to the Flip a bit deceiving, no?

Thanks!
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post #26 of 246 Old 09-21-2009, 11:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jweisler View Post

It's a bit deceiving, b/c the need for a card makes the unit price compared to the Flip a bit deceiving, no?

Maybe you could ask Flip how much it costs to increase the storage space on their camera to match the Zi8 with a card of your choice, and do the comparison that way?

I actually don't mind that the Zi8 comes with no card, because the first thing I will do (have already done, actually) is buy the card I really want (size, speed, brand) for it. If I got charged for some tiny little 256MB card, I'd feel offended.
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post #27 of 246 Old 09-22-2009, 08:09 AM
 
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I just ordered mine in black, they are back in stock! It was about $160, can't complain about that. I am using this for our New England vacation, I hope it works well!
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post #28 of 246 Old 09-23-2009, 04:16 PM
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First try: I put an MOV movie trailer (Ninja Assassin, if you must know), which is 1920 x less than 1080 MOV at 24 fps, with AVC encoding and 48k AAC stereo audio, on an SD card. The Zi8 ignored it. I changed the name so it was what the next-in-line video file would be, and this time the Zi8 locked up. Had to remove the battery to get it back.

Next thing I want to try is something that's 1920x1080, at 29.97 fps. Same MOV container with AVC (h.264) encoding, stereo 48k AAC audio. Anyone got links to a good sample?
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post #29 of 246 Old 09-24-2009, 10:01 AM
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A guy on the Amazon board claims that Kodak is sending out Firmware 1.03 if you ask them for it. It supposedly fixes the discussed high-pitch whine noise some people have been complaining about.

Can anyone confirm this? If it's true, that would be great news.

edit:

Wow, that was fast. Kodak responded to me on Twitter; the new firmware is actually already downloadable on their site.

Will try it once i get the Zi8 in a few days.
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post #30 of 246 Old 09-24-2009, 10:52 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bib Fortuna View Post

A guy on the Amazon board claims that Kodak is sending out Firmware 1.03 if you ask them for it. It supposedly fixes the discussed high-pitch whine noise some people have been complaining about.

Can anyone confirm this? If it's true, that would be great news.

edit:

Wow, that was fast. Kodak responded to me on Twitter; the new firmware is actually already downloadable on their site.

Will try it once i get the Zi8 in a few days.


Do you know how to check which version of firmware you currently have? Mine will be here on Monday.
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