The Official Panasonic HDC-TM900 Owners Thread - Page 2 - AVS Forum
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post #31 of 1366 Old 03-15-2011, 08:56 PM
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Steve: I did it again, I meant Ken!! Corrected the post. Darn.
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post #32 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 03:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Steve Cebu View Post


I think it's interesting that The Panny is better in bright light but the Sony is better in low light yet has trouble with the focus. That makes it kind of a wash. My wife prefered the TM700/900 footage everytime over the Sony even when she didn't know which camera it came from.

When mine comes in I'll check for a beep, is it possible you have a setting buried in the menu that is doing that?

What did your PS3 do when the data rate climbed?

I think Canon will be the winner for low light performance this year, they seemed to have focused on that.

Steve, no setting in the 900 would initiate a low level, rhythmic beep...unfortunately. Even disengaging the beep signal for menu changes has no effect.

If low light is an issue, it's easy to put the Sony in manual focus. So objectively I have to give the nod to Sony in that regard.

The PS3 does not play the 900 clips well at all, lots of stutter. I couldn't figure out why Mark's clips played better than mine (stuttering took longer to begin) until I saw that he edited them. Perhaps the data rate or something else changed during editing, but my clips begin stuttering within 2 seconds and Mark's take more like 15 seconds or so. I also noticed his had a bit of very brief picture breakup between each cut and that too might have been how the PS3 handled cuts. The data rate can really get surprisingly high and apparently higher than what I recall with the 700.
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post #33 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 03:48 AM
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Originally Posted by markr041 View Post

Ken: here is something I am really curious about, and I think only you now can answer this: how does the intelligent zoom on the TM900 compare with ETC mode on the Gh2. As I recall you have the GH2.

These features seem to employ the same technology, and have the same claim of extended zoom without resolution loss. I have been impressed with Intelligent Zoom on the TM900, and it appears not noticeably (that's good) in all of my videos.

Can you check this out?

I'll give it a try before I leave on a business trip this morning. It IS a good sign if you used it and I didn't notice it. I know the ETC on my GH2 is 100% visually transparent, I've tested that. I'd guess even if the 900 is 90% transparent, that's good and certainly usable in a pinch.
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post #34 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 03:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Steve, no setting in the 900 would initiate a low level, rhythmic beep...unfortunately. Even disengaging the beep signal for menu changes has no effect.

If low light is an issue, it's easy to put the Sony in manual focus. So objectively I have to give the nod to Sony in that regard.

The PS3 does not play the 900 clips well at all, lots of stutter. I couldn't figure out why Mark's clips played better than mine (stuttering took longer to begin) until I saw that he edited them. Perhaps the data rate or something else changed during editing, but my clips begin stuttering within 2 seconds and Mark's take more like 15 seconds or so. I also noticed his had a bit of very brief picture breakup between each cut and that too might have been how the PS3 handled cuts. The data rate can really get surprisingly high and apparently higher than what I recall with the 700.


Can you upload one of those clips with the high bitrate and stuttering to Vimeo for me? I'd like to see if my system also has a problem with it.
What did your PS3 say the Mbps rate was? My system has handled 38Mbps without a problem but those were TM700 clips.

I guess the beeping is a problem with the camera itself. Mine shipped yesterday but I won't see it until Friday.
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post #35 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 04:25 AM - Thread Starter
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I will try my clips on my new ps3 when I get out of work. I hope they play well because I brought back the Panasonic br player with a slot reader. I used the br player and had no issues at at. Are you guys loading the clips on the ps3 or playing off the memory card.
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post #36 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 05:37 AM
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Originally Posted by gso125 View Post

I will try my clips on my new ps3 when I get out of work. I hope they play well because I brought back the Panasonic br player with a slot reader. I used the br player and had no issues at at. Are you guys loading the clips on the ps3 or playing off the memory card.


I have done both and I ususally test both ways to see if it works from the card as well as the PS3's HDD.

The PS3 is easy to configure, mine is always connected to the Internet so I technically can upload videos from it, albeit slowly due to wireless.
The new update seems bug free so far 3.60 is the lastest one.
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post #37 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 06:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Cebu View Post

Can you upload one of those clips with the high bitrate and stuttering to Vimeo for me? I'd like to see if my system also has a problem with it.
What did your PS3 say the Mbps rate was? My system has handled 38Mbps without a problem but those were TM700 clips.

I guess the beeping is a problem with the camera itself. Mine shipped yesterday but I won't see it until Friday.

Steve, I haven't been able to upload a 900 video yet. Each time I try, I get 'failed'. I have uploaded 700 videos without much of a problem, so something must have changed in the 900 making it more difficult to encode. Judging how the PS3 plays back the 900 footage vs my old 700, it seems to provide further evidence that the files are more difficult.

I saw peak rates in the mid to upper 30s. I'm headed to the airport now, but when I get back from my trip I'll try again. I've asked for an exchange on the cam, so I'm dropping it off for mailing prior to the airport.
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post #38 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 06:05 AM
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Originally Posted by gso125 View Post

I will try my clips on my new ps3 when I get out of work. I hope they play well because I brought back the Panasonic br player with a slot reader. I used the br player and had no issues at at. Are you guys loading the clips on the ps3 or playing off the memory card.

They play perfectly on my Panasonic BD player.
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post #39 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 06:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Steve Cebu View Post

I have done both and I ususally test both ways to see if it works from the card as well as the PS3's HDD.

The PS3 is easy to configure, mine is always connected to the Internet so I technically can upload videos from it, albeit slowly due to wireless.
The new update seems bug free so far 3.60 is the lastest one.

Were you able to play 700 clips smoothly on the PS3? I couldn't. They play OK for a bit then they begin to stutter. With the 900 the stuttering begins almost immediately.
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post #40 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 06:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markr041 View Post

Ken: here is something I am really curious about, and I think only you now can answer this: how does the intelligent zoom on the TM900 compare with ETC mode on the Gh2. As I recall you have the GH2.

These features seem to employ the same technology, and have the same claim of extended zoom without resolution loss. I have been impressed with Intelligent Zoom on the TM900, and it appears not noticeably (that's good) in all of my videos.

Can you check this out?

Mark, I did a very quick test at 20X, and there was some degradation of the image. I didn't have time to much more since I had to box the unit up for exchange.
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post #41 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Were you able to play 700 clips smoothly on the PS3? I couldn't. They play OK for a bit then they begin to stutter. With the 900 the stuttering begins almost immediately.


Hi Ken, I've not had any stuttering from any clips from the TM700, TM900 or CX560 when played on my PS3. I think you might have a setting off on your PS3.

I have no idea what's wrong with Vimeo that you can't upload to it. I'd test out mine but it's slated for delievery sometime Friday.
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post #42 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 01:56 PM
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Hi everybody, how is the TM900 compared to TM750?
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post #43 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 02:08 PM - Thread Starter
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My clips didnt have audio then changed 2 settings in video and it stutters when I play them in the ps3. What I did is leave settings default then in video settings I changed 2 audio settings to bitrate from Pcm. I have no idea what settings I should look at.
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post #44 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 02:11 PM
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Originally Posted by gso125 View Post

My clips didnt have audio then changed 2 settings in video and it stutters when I play them in the ps3. What I did is leave settings default then in video settings I changed 2 audio settings to bitrate from Pcm. I have no idea what settings I should look at.


Here is a video I made showing you how to eliminate the audio stutter in your PS3.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C98pn2c-LYc
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post #45 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 02:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Steve Cebu View Post


Hi Ken, I've not had any stuttering from any clips from the TM700, TM900 or CX560 when played on my PS3. I think you might have a setting off on your PS3.

I have no idea what's wrong with Vimeo that you can't upload to it. I'd test out mine but it's slated for delievery sometime Friday.

Mark mentioned that he too had some issues with Vimeo 900 uploads. Playback isn't a big deal since I've got a Panny BD player that plays smoothly and has a much better menu system for this kind of material.
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post #46 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 02:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Mark mentioned that he too had some issues with Vimeo 900 uploads. Playback isn't a big deal since I've got a Panny BD player that plays smoothly and has a much better menu system for this kind of material.


I wonder what it could be? I guess I'll find out on Friday if it works on my PS3 or not.
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post #47 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 02:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Steve Cebu View Post

Here is a video I made showing you how to eliminate the audio stutter in your PS3.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C98pn2c-LYc

Steve that worked great no more stutter, in your video it shows a thumb nail of your video I have looked in settings so mine would do that but it only has a list name no pic. Thanks for the quick sound fix. Both panny 700 and 900 play and sound great on the PS3. It takes a bit to navigate the menus compared to the panny br but looks great.
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post #48 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 03:16 PM
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Originally Posted by gso125 View Post

Steve that worked great no more stutter, in your video it shows a thumb nail of your video I have looked in settings so mine would do that but it only has a list name no pic. Thanks for the quick sound fix. Both panny 700 and 900 play and sound great on the PS3. It takes a bit to navigate the menus compared to the panny br but looks great.

Glad it helped.
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post #49 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 03:25 PM
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Yea thanks Steve! Awesome!
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post #50 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 03:32 PM
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I posted a new thread on this. Camcorder Info just released their review on the TM900 and it's looking like the TM700 is quite a bargain at the moment.
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post #51 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 04:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

To be honest tingham, I don't have a good recollection of how the 700 performed in the same areas. I believe the 900 is less noisy, but when I shot in really low light, there was still a fair amount of noise.

The Sony did a better job, but at the same time the Sony had considerable trouble holding focus. So manual focus is a must in those situations. The 900 didn't begin to have that trouble.

We'll I really expected that anyway. Your comment on the Sony having issues with focus is surprising though. The CX550 had no prolonged issues with low-light focus in my experience with it , so I don't know why this new model would. It seems the new cams stack-up in the same way as they did in last years models.

Better low light and stabilization with the Sony. Most likely better outdoor quality with the Panny. I really can't positively comment on the Sony's outdoor quality yet as I have not seen enough native footage from that cam. What I have seen does look good though.

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post #52 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 04:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Steve Cebu View Post

Hi Ken, I've not had any stuttering from any clips from the TM700, TM900 or CX560 when played on my PS3. I think you might have a setting off on your PS3.

I have no idea what's wrong with Vimeo that you can't upload to it. I'd test out mine but it's slated for delievery sometime Friday.

What model of the PS3 do you have Steve? Is it the older style fatter one, or a newer slim model?

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post #53 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 05:09 PM
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Better low light and stabilization with the Sony. Most likely better outdoor quality with the Panny. I really can't positively comment on the Sony's outdoor quality yet as I have not seen enough native footage from that cam. What I have seen does look good though.

Hold on now. I saw no evidence that the OIS of the Sony was better than the 900. The low light yes, the OIS no. Good light PQ of the 900 was, IMO, definitely better from a sharpness, detail and color standpoint. That, to my eyes, was the biggest difference.
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post #54 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 05:33 PM
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What model of the PS3 do you have Steve? Is it the older style fatter one, or a newer slim model?
I have the older Fat model with 160GB HDD.
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post #55 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 05:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Steve Cebu

I have the older Fat model with 160GB HDD.
Haven't some said that the original was the best for playing 1080p?
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post #56 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 05:37 PM
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Haven't some said that the original was the best for playing 1080p?

That I really don't know about. Possibly but my Fat model works great. A few others in here have PS3's I wionder if those are Fat or slim?
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post #57 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 05:40 PM
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Does anyone find it odd that the CCI review had identical resolution #s for the 700 @ 900, yet they found the 900 was slightly less sharp? Now granted, technically, sharpness and resolution can mean two different things, but I wonder if that's what they meant. Of course the difference could easily be attributed to nothing more than sample to sample variation.
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post #58 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 06:22 PM - Thread Starter
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I have also just noticed that when I play the clips out of the 900 it plays really smooth but when it's playing out of the ps3 it looks good but it's shakes like I didn't have on ois. It's might be a setting in ps3, I did the new update and that's when I noticed it, the update took for ever in my crap Internet service.
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post #59 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 06:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post
Hold on now. I saw no evidence that the OIS of the Sony was better than the 900. The low light yes, the OIS no. Good light PQ of the 900 was, IMO, definitely better from a sharpness, detail and color standpoint. That, to my eyes, was the biggest difference.
Just speculating Ken. CCi states no difference in OIS from last years model. I don't know why because Panasonic states otherwise. If that is true, the Sony has better OIS. We all know the OIS on the Sony was the best last year. And from djandrea's posted videos it looks like it has not changed.

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I have the older Fat model with 160GB
HDD.
Thanks, that's interesting. I have a slim and fat, but the fat is broken due to YLOD. I was wondering why some report their PS3's play the high bitrate files with no issues and some do. My slim has issues with them if the bitrate goes above 33 to 34 Mbps. Maybe it is just the slim models that can't handle the higher bitrate files?

They did put redesigned cell processors in the slim units. I'm thinking that they might not be up to par as the original cell processor. I'm curious because it seems Ken has issues and so do I, and we both have slim models. I'm sure you will report your findings with your fat, so that would take us a step further as to what might be causing the issue. It certainly could be the newer processors.

I might get my fat fixed just so I can test files myself at some point.

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post #60 of 1366 Old 03-16-2011, 07:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tingham

Just speculating Ken. CCi states no difference in OIS from last years model. I don't know why because Panasonic states otherwise. If that is true, the Sony has better OIS. We all know the OIS on the Sony was the best last year. And from djandrea's posted videos it looks like it has not changed.
Actually, if you look at Mark's 900 clips, it does look like it's improved from the 700. Remember that Panasonic is using a hybrid OIS this year and that's new. In my handling of the two, I saw little difference. If there is one, it can't be too great.
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