1080p camcorder vs 1080p digital camera? - AVS Forum
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Old 04-18-2011, 07:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Ok, this is something that's been on my mind. What exactly are the advantages of a 1080p camcorder over a digital camera that ALSO does 1080p videos?

It's a fact that the digital camera will take much better still images but does the camcorder actually take better video than the digital camera? (granted, lets say they are shot at the same res, same FPS, and both with similar shake stabilizer)

Here are 2 just for an example FlipMinoHD vs Panasonic FX700

The price is relatively the same (yes, my budget is low...) but if I want both great video AND great photos, which should I go for?

And if you say the digital camera, then why would anyone buy the camcorder?

Thanks!
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Old 04-18-2011, 09:49 PM
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Originally Posted by DenOutside View Post
Ok, this is something that's been on my mind. What exactly are the advantages of a 1080p camcorder over a digital camera that ALSO does 1080p videos?

It's a fact that the digital camera will take much better still images but does the camcorder actually take better video than the digital camera? (granted, lets say they are shot at the same res, same FPS, and both with similar shake stabilizer)

Here are 2 just for an example FlipMinoHD vs Panasonic FX700

The price is relatively the same (yes, my budget is low...) but if I want both great video AND great photos, which should I go for?
And if you say the digital camera, then why would anyone buy the camcorder?

Thanks!

Different animals, You can take your Porsche 911 down rutted back roads and you can take your Jeep on a race track. But neither is preferable.
If you just do a little bit of video and mostly Stills then buy a DSLR and if you mainly shoot video and rarely take stills buy a camcorder. You have to manually adjust the focus on a DSLR shooting video for example.
Camcorders even really good ones will not even be close to a decent P&S camera nevermind a DSLR and video will overheat a DSLR after a short while and even worse on a hot day.
I have used a Canon 870is and it does decent still pics and ok video for YouTube.
If you want a compromise camera get a Canon S95, yes it's more money but it's also very decent and Panasonic makes a similar model.
You can learn about these here.

http://www.dpreview.com/

Everything you want to know about still cameras. They cover everything you could want to know

This site is good for reviews on camcorders.
http://www.camcorderinfo.com/

Hope this helps a bit.
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Old 04-18-2011, 10:48 PM
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putting porches and dslr cameras aside, the truth is that the OPs question addresses a key element in the camcorder market. Marketing.

These tiny sensor camcorders, with no optical image stabilization, no optical zoom, crammed full of pixels to further aid marketing, and tiny lens with very small aperture openings and no wide angle...well...they are nothing at all compared to a good camera.

The cameras have larger sensors-thus despite having more megapixels dedicated to photo, they still have more for video than many of these base model camcorders-larger lenses, better processing engines, better stabilization and zoom, and obviously far superior still pictures.

To not buy the camera is only because you have fallen for marketing hype, plain and simple.

Once you reach the mid range camcorder it begins to be more of a debate-except they want 600 dollars for midrange camcorders, making them total crap too. Better to just get the camera until you can reach the flagship models, IMHO.
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Old 04-18-2011, 11:57 PM
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battery life
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Old 04-19-2011, 01:45 PM
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DSLRs have much better DOF controle, descent low light performence and much more film-like results. But they need manual focus (otherwise audible), no IS (non fonctional in video mode), no/very few sound controles, get hot within sevral minutes (thus has to stop) and much less battery life in live view/video mode.

So, yes they can do amazing videos, they can not replace camcoders, not yet.
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Old 04-19-2011, 03:47 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Steve Cebu View Post
If you want a compromise camera get a Canon S95, yes it's more money but it's also very decent and Panasonic makes a similar model.
You can learn about these here.
That's a nice camera. A tad expensive...I plan on taking videos and photos in abandoned buildings and such. A lotta climbing, jumping, dust, etc...


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Originally Posted by workinghard View Post
putting porches and dslr cameras aside, the truth is that the OPs question addresses a key element in the camcorder market. Marketing.

These tiny sensor camcorders, with no optical image stabilization, no optical zoom, crammed full of pixels to further aid marketing, and tiny lens with very small aperture openings and no wide angle...well...they are nothing at all compared to a good camera.
Hmm, so all the products from Flip are just hype? I do somewhat agree.

What about this? It has zoom (10X Dual Range Zoom, not sure what that means...digital or optical?) Sanyo VPC-GH4

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battery life
Which usually has better battery life?
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Old 04-19-2011, 04:50 PM
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That's a nice camera. A tad expensive...I plan on taking videos and photos in abandoned buildings and such. A lotta climbing, jumping, dust, etc...

Then buy a GoPro then dust becomes a non-issue as does water or anything else and they cost $250 on sale on Amazon.com
True you have no control over the camera at all but as long as you have decent light they take decent video. No zoom, or anything just press the On button and that's it. It's an action cam but your detail will have a slight fisheye effect. I've put my 870is through damn near everything and it's still chugging along. here is a video from this 3 year old Canon and it's been through a lot and was even destroyed once and rebuilt.
Cost a lot to fix it but I really like it. You can't buy it anymore and it's not an HD camera but for YouTube it's ok.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9uUBRE7vsRU
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Old 04-19-2011, 07:08 PM
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Then buy a GoPro then dust becomes a non-issue as does water or anything else and they cost $250 on sale on Amazon.com
True you have no control over the camera at all but as long as you have decent light they take decent video. No zoom, or anything just press the On button and that's it. It's an action cam but your detail will have a slight fisheye effect. I've put my 870is through damn near everything and it's still chugging along. here is a video from this 3 year old Canon and it's been through a lot and was even destroyed once and rebuilt.
Cost a lot to fix it but I really like it. You can't buy it anymore and it's not an HD camera but for YouTube it's ok.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9uUBRE7vsRU

there are a variety of cameras that are relatively dust proof for reasonable prices that will output video superior to the mini flip models and with far more functionality for his application than a gopro. Unless he plans from jumping off these tall buildings.

As to the marketing again...why would anybody pay 10000 dollars for a hand bag, when the exact same materials and craftsmanship can be had for significantly less elsewhere? In fact, often times superior quality can be had for significantly less. It is all because the brand became cute or popular or a status symbol.

Is the enjoyment of that same person using the more expensive brand name the same as when using the lower quality brand? Certainly not, on average.

Thus, we see that it is a common occurrence.

BUT, in video there is a big upside. If you think it is super cute, or sexy, or a marvel of modern technology for some reason, then you are more inclined to use it and watch it. Making it, truly, a more valuable tool.
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Old 04-19-2011, 07:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by virtuehero View Post

DSLRs have much better DOF controle, descent low light performence and much more film-like results. But they need manual focus (otherwise audible), no IS (non fonctional in video mode), no/very few sound controles, get hot within sevral minutes (thus has to stop) and much less battery life in live view/video mode.

So, yes they can do amazing videos, they can not replace camcoders, not yet.

You might want to check out the Panasonic GH1 here then. The latest version is the GH2, but the GH1 can still be found. The GH1 is an amazing camera and takes truly amazing 1080p video. Is it expensive? Yes. But well worth every penny, because you get a virtually quiet 14-140mm lens which works wonderfully well for auto-focusing during shooting.

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Old 04-19-2011, 08:30 PM
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The Sony Hx9v will take better still photos than any of the camcorders and has top of the line specs for video rivalling the top camcorders (the latter is not true for any Canon camera, like the S95).

The Sony Hx9v has for video:

1/2.3" sensor, 16x optical power zoom, optical stabilization+active mode, Dolby digital stereo, 108060p@28Mbps, 1/2 lb, 3" 921k dots LCD. $349.

Example video (original downloadable):

http://www.vimeo.com/22535092

do not be misled: The 1080p from the Panasonic GH1 recommended above is 24p not 60p, and will look awful when there is movement, and generally jerky for most people interested in video. That camera has no power zoom, a worse stabilizer, a worse picture in video (aliasing). It's autofocus is also far less good - it's slow and hunts. I own the GH1. I have extensively used the Hx9v for video.
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Old 04-19-2011, 08:47 PM
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I was thinking to buy a panasonic gh2 but later changed my mind to go for a camcorder. I like the smaller size of camcorder, easily to operate especially while handhelding. Imaging shooting handheld using a DSLR together with a long zoom len compaired with holding a handy Sony CX560. I know somebody will say shooting Video with L lens on Canon 5DII is fantastic but think how big and heavy it is. I have them but sometimes too lazy to carry it around but my sony can be put in pocket
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Old 04-19-2011, 09:20 PM
 
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I was thinking to buy a panasonic gh2 but later changed my mind to go for a camcorder. I like the smaller size of camcorder, easily to operate especially while handhelding. Imaging shooting handheld using a DSLR together with a long zoom len compaired with holding a handy Sony CX560. I know somebody will say shooting Video with L lens on Canon 5DII is fantastic but think how big and heavy it is. I have them but sometimes too lazy to carry it around but my sony can be put in pocket

Before I got my Sony XR550. I use my Nikon 300s to take picture and video. I took my Nikon to my son's recital and start taking video. The Nikon excelent DOF blur my son's entire recital and stayed focus on the audience's head in front of me.

I also bought a Sony Nex Vg10, Panny Tm700. Sony VG10 is heavy and big. So it stays home most of the time.

Sony excellent for indoor, while Panny excellent for outdoor video.

I am new to video and shoot everything indoor and auto mode. So I use my sony most of the time.
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Old 04-20-2011, 08:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DenOutside View Post

That's a nice camera. A tad expensive...I plan on taking videos and photos in abandoned buildings and such. A lotta climbing, jumping, dust, etc...




Hmm, so all the products from Flip are just hype? I do somewhat agree.

What about this? It has zoom (10X Dual Range Zoom, not sure what that means...digital or optical?) Sanyo VPC-GH4


Which usually has better battery life?

the flip over digital cameras
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Old 04-20-2011, 09:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CatKing View Post

I was thinking to buy a panasonic gh2 but later changed my mind to go for a camcorder. I like the smaller size of camcorder, easily to operate especially while handhelding. Imaging shooting handheld using a DSLR together with a long zoom len compaired with holding a handy Sony CX560. I know somebody will say shooting Video with L lens on Canon 5DII is fantastic but think how big and heavy it is. I have them but sometimes too lazy to carry it around but my sony can be put in pocket

Cameras like the GH2 are not meant for hand held use,but to say the quality is poor like what has been said is crap,they are harder work for sure in some ways
but are capable of producing great footage like this guys film shot in 24P
http://vimeo.com/22015314
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Old 04-22-2011, 10:56 AM
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[quote=flintyplus;20330878]Cameras like the GH2 are not meant for hand held use

That's the reason I changed my mind at last.

btw I still feel itchy by the GH2, It does make good video and still picture
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