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post #91 of 133 Old 04-28-2013, 11:55 PM
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Originally Posted by jogiba View Post

The hacked GH2 is the best bang for the buck IMHO.


Pity on vimeo the film can be downloaded to judge the quality better.
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post #92 of 133 Old 04-29-2013, 08:59 AM
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Had another look at your film MT,its a pity i cant download it,as i have said my pcs wont play vimeo without jerk,i think its better than i first thought.
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post #93 of 133 Old 04-29-2013, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by flintyplus View Post

Had another look at your film MT,its a pity i cant download it,as i have said my pcs wont play vimeo without jerk,i think its better than i first thought.

Yeah, the first upload was bitten by the 264 gamma bug according to DP John Brawley. I noticed something odd from the getgo with the strange glowing highlights. That white bug vehicle was glowing all over, as was the sky. I thought it was some artistic grading decision upon first watch and thought "Ok, well, not how I'd grade it, but I could choose how I grade mine". Then I was reading the forum and someone mentioned the glowing highlights and that's when he informed everyone of the problem and re-uploaded and upon second viewing it was much better for me as well.
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post #94 of 133 Old 05-04-2013, 06:57 AM - Thread Starter
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Camerasize.com has loaded the Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera into its camera size comparison tool.

Here it is next to the Panasonic GH3. Incredibly small for the images it can produce smile.gif

Interestingly, the sensor sizes don't appear to be too different. I can't wait to get my hands on this camera!
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post #95 of 133 Old 05-04-2013, 07:24 AM
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It's not really that small since it has no EVF and has a much smaller sensor than the Panasonic G6 that has an EVF.
http://camerasize.com/compare/#455,453

Panasonic GF6 is smaller and has a larger sensor.
http://camerasize.com/compare/#452,453

APS-C E mount Sony NEX-5R vs the compact BMCC :
http://camerasize.com/compare/#369,453
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post #96 of 133 Old 05-04-2013, 02:55 PM - Thread Starter
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You're right, jogiba, the sensor size is smaller - but the real revolution is the sophistication of the algorithms and the processing power required to cram 10 bit 220mbps ProRes 422 into such a tiny camera.

220mbps and 13 stops of DR will provide image quality that is night and day to compared to an 8 bit/28mbps Panasonic G6.

I'm not disparaging the G6. I still have my even less capable GH1, with its 17mbps bit rate. But the BPCC is to 8 bit cameras what a my first film SLR was to the Instamatic it replaced 40 years ago smile.gif

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post #97 of 133 Old 05-04-2013, 03:48 PM
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ProRes 422 doesn't require any sophisticated algorithms or processing power. But it does require a high bandwidth to persistent storage (ie., the SDXC card).
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post #98 of 133 Old 05-04-2013, 07:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTyson View Post

First home movie shot with the BlackMagic Pocket Cinema Camera. Shot by John Brawley in ProRes HQ mode:

http://vimeo.com/64693161

This Blackmagic video shows that the photographer is a lot more important than the camera. It is terrible in any dimension, except dynamic range. Dynamic range is important, but it is only one dimension of many for any video.

The importance of video skill seems to be lost here, especially in the advice given to people who ask questions based on their cell phone experience.

Of course, the mediocre video does not mean the Blackmagic is not a good camera. No more than some incredibly good professionaly-shot Sony Hx9v or Panasonic FZ200 videos prove those cameras are the best.
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post #99 of 133 Old 05-04-2013, 11:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markr041 View Post

This Blackmagic video shows that the photographer is a lot more important than the camera. It is terrible in any dimension, except dynamic range. Dynamic range is important, but it is only one dimension of many for any video.

The importance of video skill seems to be lost here, especially in the advice given to people who ask questions based on their cell phone experience.

Of course, the mediocre video does not mean the Blackmagic is not a good camera. No more than some incredibly good professionaly-shot Sony Hx9v or Panasonic FZ200 videos prove those cameras are the best.

The person is a professional DP/Cinematographer for tv/film whom was hesitant to shoot another home video style video like he did for the original BMCC because certain people complain about it not being "professional enough", but lots of people also wanted to see how the camera performs in harsh uncontrolled conditions. Basically people wanted to see it do a home video shoot with this camera first. He will follow up wit professionally shot videos as he did last time.
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post #100 of 133 Old 06-17-2013, 12:23 AM
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While I would prefer to shoot digital Super 16mm can look superb. The Walking Dead is a great example of that. And Super 16mm topped the Red MX in an Alexa, Red MX and Super 16mm Dynamic Range tests. From what I've read Super 16mm was banned by BBC due to the grain causing the HD Mpeg compression to fall apart. Of course this has nothing to do with the actual quality or look of Super 16mm itself, but more the compression for broadcast used.

Here's the Alexa, Red MX and Super 16mm Dynamic Range test: http://vimeo.com/24345144#



Hey mike having heard about this series the walking dead a lot i now have series 1 & 2 on BD,great series story wise but if you think the picture quality would not have been better shot on red or ARRIFLEX D-21 we will never agree about cameras,the grain is so intrusive,some fair color but thats it.
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post #101 of 133 Old 06-19-2013, 02:51 PM
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Hey mike having heard about this series the walking dead a lot i now have series 1 & 2 on BD,great series story wise but if you think the picture quality would not have been better shot on red or ARRIFLEX D-21 we will never agree about cameras,the grain is so intrusive,some fair color but thats it.

One of the best series around.. I'm not saying the picture wouldn't be better on the D-21 (or Red...assuming you mean Red Scarlet or Epic and not the original Red One), but then again I haven't seen enough D-21 footage to know. They went with Super 16mm for a bit of a gritty look, but there are times when I'm very pleased with the highlights and dynamic range coming from the super 16mm as well as the skin tones. Grain is there and yeah, I can always do without grain, but I've seen much worse. I'd prefer a clean image over grain. Grain is not what I like about film at all. Some film guys like it. I like film for the latitude, the highlight exposure/graceful rolloff instead of hard clipping and the color tones. It just has an organic lively look. Of course the Arri Alexa has no problem looking amazing and the new Red Epic/Scarlet Dragon should whip everyone with its new color science and 16+ stop dynamic range.

I wouldn't mind if the series were shot on the Arri Alexa or a 5D Mark III in RAW. The show would still be great.

BTW, my BlackMagic MFT Cinema Camera arrives tomorrow, but I'm seriously considering sending it back as I think the 5D Mark III shooting RAW + the Pocket Cinema would be the perfect combo to have everything I need: Great low light, Wide and Fast, Great dynamic range, 60p when needed, and much more. Would be the most versatile option for all of my needs. Sadly, the pain of sending it back will suck.
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post #102 of 133 Old 06-19-2013, 11:04 PM
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Originally Posted by MTyson View Post

One of the best series around.. I'm not saying the picture wouldn't be better on the D-21 (or Red...assuming you mean Red Scarlet or Epic and not the original Red One), but then again I haven't seen enough D-21 footage to know. They went with Super 16mm for a bit of a gritty look, but there are times when I'm very pleased with the highlights and dynamic range coming from the super 16mm as well as the skin tones. Grain is there and yeah, I can always do without grain, but I've seen much worse. I'd prefer a clean image over grain. Grain is not what I like about film at all. Some film guys like it. I like film for the latitude, the highlight exposure/graceful rolloff instead of hard clipping and the color tones. It just has an organic lively look. Of course the Arri Alexa has no problem looking amazing and the new Red Epic/Scarlet Dragon should whip everyone with its new color science and 16+ stop dynamic range.

I wouldn't mind if the series were shot on the Arri Alexa or a 5D Mark III in RAW. The show would still be great.

BTW, my BlackMagic MFT Cinema Camera arrives tomorrow, but I'm seriously considering sending it back as I think the 5D Mark III shooting RAW + the Pocket Cinema would be the perfect combo to have everything I need: Great low light, Wide and Fast, Great dynamic range, 60p when needed, and much more. Would be the most versatile option for all of my needs. Sadly, the pain of sending it back will suck.

Well i agree with your first line,and pretty much all grain spoils it a lot,on another point i never thought much of standard 16mm but this is the best i have seen https://vimeo.com/64182099
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post #103 of 133 Old 06-20-2013, 12:31 PM
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Well i agree with your first line,and pretty much all grain spoils it a lot,on another point i never thought much of standard 16mm but this is the best i have seen https://vimeo.com/64182099

The film stock used plays a huge roll; they aren't all created equal. The grain on The Walking Dead is clearly intended for a gritty look, but I've never found it to be overbearing or too objectionable. Could depend on the display though. I noticed on my LCD some things look harsher than on my JVC RS15 D-ILA projector. The video you posted is beautiful film stock; Vision 3 Kodak 50D. It has super fine grain (and some film stocks have bigger grain) as well as wonderful dynamic range, color tone, saturation and highlight roll off. If film weren't such a pain in the ass I'd love to shoot Vision 3D Kodak 50D.
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post #104 of 133 Old 06-20-2013, 07:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Blackmagic MFT now actually in stock at Omega Broadcast Systems via eBay for $2995 + $34.95 shipping!

EF model also in stock for $2995 with free shipping.

I certainly hope this means that the Pocket Cinema Cams will be shipping soon!

Bill
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post #105 of 133 Old 06-21-2013, 01:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brunerww View Post

Blackmagic MFT now actually in stock at Omega Broadcast Systems via eBay for $2995 + $34.95 shipping!

EF model also in stock for $2995 with free shipping.

I certainly hope this means that the Pocket Cinema Cams will be shipping soon!

Bill
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I got mine yesterday. It's WAY heavier than my Canon T2i. It'll where you out holding this thing by the body for extended periods of time, especially with a heavy lens like the Rokinon's. It's very solid and also very very simple to use and operate. The menus are very simple and straight-forward. The touch screen is very fast and responsive. The screen size increase is a big difference. Though may need a clear matte cover to reduce sheen when bright lights are present. I'm still considering sending it back for the Mark III simple because the the Mark III now that it shoots RAW has too many pros and very few cons.




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post #106 of 133 Old 06-22-2013, 01:53 AM
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Originally Posted by MTyson View Post

I got mine yesterday. It's WAY heavier than my Canon T2i. It'll where you out holding this thing by the body for extended periods of time, especially with a heavy lens like the Rokinon's. It's very solid and also very very simple to use and operate. The menus are very simple and straight-forward. The touch screen is very fast and responsive. The screen size increase is a big difference. Though may need a clear matte cover to reduce sheen when bright lights are present. I'm still considering sending it back for the Mark III simple because the the Mark III now that it shoots RAW has too many pros and very few cons.






If i was going to start shooting raw i would go for the 5DMKIII,from all the footage i have seen it holds its own with the Black Magic and like you say its more user friendly,good luck which way you go and send us some film.
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post #107 of 133 Old 07-25-2013, 06:35 PM
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Both cameras will get delayed.
http://www.eoshd.com/comments/topic/3131-blackmagic-4k-production-camera-now-due-in-september/?p=39245

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post #108 of 133 Old 07-25-2013, 11:37 PM - Thread Starter
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No. The Production camera is delayed. The Pocket camera ships in a few days.

From nofilmschool.com: "...at Blackmagic’s LA event earlier today, the company announced that the Pocket Cinema Camera would begin to ship within 3-4 days in limited quantities and that the 4K Production Camera still needed more work before it begins to ship."
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post #109 of 133 Old 07-26-2013, 06:23 PM
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The big retailers should have had some stock on the 25th and since they wont even get any of the pocket unit until some days later, I consider it also delayed. Both are delayed.

As for the Global 4K version, Black Magic is sort of rushing it anyway with that technology into that kind of price tag. Sony was able to easily get similar technology into the F55 but that's a far more expensive camera.

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post #110 of 133 Old 07-26-2013, 07:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Compared to how long people have waited for the Panasonic G6 (which was supposed to be in stock in June, and is just now becoming available at $50 over list) - or how long I had to wait for my GH2 and GH3, a few days after the 25th is nothing smile.gif

Not to mention how long people waited for the RED Scarlet or other cameras.

I've been on Adorama's Pocket Cinema Camera pre-order list since April, so I'm hoping to get one of the first units, but if I have to wait until the middle of August, I'll count myself lucky compared to the folks who have waited over a year for a Digital Bolex smile.gif.
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post #111 of 133 Old 07-26-2013, 08:44 PM
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We'll, I'm one of the biggest complainers of Panasonic's habit of not giving people enough supply of their top cameras especially in the US. As a word of advice, I'd suggest everyone to call up a local dealer because you could get lucky.

As far as Black Magic is concerned, they better hope it wont take long to get the pocket cameras into people's hands. I didn't think it was wise for them to get exact dates out to people knowing how slow the 2.5K cameras got released. They should have said something like by around August and not give out a date. It wouldn't surprise me if they are working on a 4K 60p version and hopefully they'll give a ball park date for that than an exact date.

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post #112 of 133 Old 07-29-2013, 02:46 PM
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The pocket blackmagic is a nice first step to a new era, but its not an easy camera. It will probably be good for professionals, but it wont be a nice camera for run and gun. Are we going to see sony and panasonic making new consumer/prosumer camcorders with similar DR/encoding/image quality soon?

I dont know how was the transition in the stills department. How was the transition between jpeg's and RAW's? Did it take too much time to get to consumer cameras?
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post #113 of 133 Old 07-30-2013, 06:30 AM - Thread Starter
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How was the transition between jpeg's and RAW's? Did it take too much time to get to consumer cameras?


It didn't take long. The first real DSLR, the 2.7MP Nikon D1, introduced in 2000, shot RAW. At its $5000 introductory price, I don't know if you could call it a consumer camera, though smile.gif

RAW video is a little tougher challenge than stills (unless you're one of the geniuses at Magic Lantern), but 10 bit 4:2:2 ProRes would be a good intermediate step for Sony/Panasonic - or even Canon/Nikon.

To be honest, I'm buying the Blackmagic Pocket for 220mbps ProRes, not for RAW. I figure it will intercut pretty well with 50mbps .MOV from my GH3. I'm a PC/Linux guy, but shooters who cut on Macs should absolutely love that workflow. We'll see.

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post #114 of 133 Old 10-05-2013, 07:41 PM - Thread Starter
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My Pocket Cinema Camera is finally here! (it only took 6 months smile.gif)




And yes, my "rig" is copied from Professor Tu's EOS M interview setup: http://vimeo.com/75630564

Parts list here.


Bill
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post #115 of 133 Old 10-06-2013, 05:52 AM
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Bill, what lenses are you going to use with the BM? You should create a topic about it to share your experience. I have lots of doubts about his camera!
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post #116 of 133 Old 10-06-2013, 08:26 AM - Thread Starter
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Starting out with my favorite lens, the Olympus 11-22 f2.8-3.5 (too expensive new, so I got it used on eBay).

Haven't shot anything yet, but the field of view at 11mm looks good through the LCD so far. I will post my impressions and results here and on the blog.

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post #117 of 133 Old 10-06-2013, 08:49 AM
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Great! Im trying to spec a decent kit for the BMPCC, but I looks like to be able to work with it you have to spend at least 3k, and thats too much money.

I also want to know whats the lowest aperture in the BMPCC to get a decent low light performance. Watching some videos on vimeo I saw great performance @ f 2.0. If thats true, I can save a lot of money buying an f1.4, 1.7 or 1.8 lens instead of an expensive (and soft) f0.95 prime.

I also want to know about shallow dof. I wonder if a 20mm @ f1.7 is able to do some decent out of focus background. That way I can save 100 bucks avoiding the leica 1.4.

And I also want to know about handheld, since a lot of m43 lenses dont have OIS. Whats the maximum focal lenght that you can shoot handheld without shaking a lot? I know that my limits in my NEX is 100mm (35mm equiv). I wonder if 75mm (35mm equiv) works handheld without OIS.
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post #118 of 133 Old 10-14-2013, 05:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Not done with my review yet (I'm on vacation, trying to shoot a review and keep the wife happy is tough smile.gif) - but wanted to share this review from Pro Video Coalition. Thought the community here might find it interesting: A Broadcaster's Perspective by Brian Hallett.

Here is a short "story" Brian shot for the review:


http://vimeo.com/76290973


A great example of how to shoot high quality narrative video on the "down low" with the Pocket Cinema Camera smile.gif


And here is his second piece - a more traditional "walk about" camera test (love the dynamic range - the shots of the sky remind me why I bought this camera):


http://vimeo.com/76614769

Here is what this professional thinks of the Pocket as a run 'n gun camera:

Quote:
...This is a fantastic little camera that packs a punch. If I was a photojournalist or someone who was out running and gunning a ton.. then this camera would be in my pocket. ACTUALLY, I am one of these types and I'll very likely buy one soon! It may not be my “A” camera but will definitely be my “B” camera. The BMPCC will make for a great second camera on shoots and interviews. I think we'll see photographers carry this camera around as an accessory to help them grab additional angles as they shoot their stories...


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post #119 of 133 Old 11-17-2013, 12:31 PM
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The 4K Cinema cameras "should" be heading out to dealers within 30 days. We'll see.
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post #120 of 133 Old 11-18-2013, 04:50 PM
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If you want a 4K UHD TV at a 1080p price Amazon dropped the price on the Seiki Digital SE50UY04 50-Inch 4K UHD 120Hz LED HDTV today to $791.98 with free shipping !
http://www.amazon.com/Seiki-Digital-SE50UY04-50-Inch-120Hz/dp/B00BXF7I9M/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1384821042&sr=8-3&keywords=4k


Update :
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They are available RIGHT NOW online at SEARS 39" for $520, the 50" for $722 and the 55" for $825. The only catch is you have to sign up for "FRIENDS & FAMILY" (there is no charge for doing this). - THIS DEAL ENDS TUESDAY - You can get immediate in-store pickup if the Sears you choose has them in stock
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1469063/seiki-se50uy04-50-4k-display/90#post_23966017


http://www.sears.com/seiki-50-8221-class-4k-2160p-120hz-led-hdtv/p-05771591000P?prdNo=1&blockNo=1&blockType=G1
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