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Ken Ross's Avatar Ken Ross 06:11 PM 11-18-2013
Jogiba, I saw a couple of reviews on that set and they weren't too good. Aside from the 4K resolution, the unit didn't perform nearly as well as good quality conventional HDTVs.

I guess there's only so much quality you can expect from a 4K UHD TV at that price.

jogiba's Avatar jogiba 06:33 PM 11-18-2013
Ken Ross's Avatar Ken Ross 06:41 PM 11-18-2013
^ That's good news! Now we need compliance with the new HDMI 2.0 standard. Current 4K sets can't do 60p at full 4K resolution, but I'm sure the next crop will and prices will probably be lower still!
Paulo Teixeira's Avatar Paulo Teixeira 09:50 PM 11-18-2013
Their are some TVs like the Sony 55X850 55" speaker-less screen for a little under $3,000 is already fully HDMI 2.0. In the past Sony said the 55X900 with the high tech speakers for $3,500 will be upgradeable to 2.0. The new Panasonic screens are also fully HDMI 2.0.
Ken Ross's Avatar Ken Ross 09:57 PM 11-18-2013
Paulo, it was my impression that there was no guarantee of total compliance with 2.0 since these sets were released prior to the finalization of 2.0. I could be wrong.
Paulo Teixeira's Avatar Paulo Teixeira 10:19 PM 11-18-2013
55X900 for $3,500 street:
http://store.sony.com/55-class-54.6-diag-xbr-4k-ultra-hd-tv-zid27-XBR55X900A/cat-27-catid-Collections-55-Inch-XBR-TVs
"HDMI® 2.0 support for next 4K video formats (Free upgrade)"

55X850 for $3,000 street:
http://store.sony.com/sony-55-class-54.6-diag-4k-ultra-hd-tv-zid27-XBR55X850A/cat-27-catid-Collections-55-Inch-XBR-TVs
"HDMI® 2.0 support for next 4K video formats (Free upgrade)"

So I guess it's both sets that needs the upgrade. I thought the 850 sets already had the free upgrade out of the box. Maybe the newest sets out of the factory for both TVs are already with the new firmware update.
Ken Ross's Avatar Ken Ross 07:59 AM 11-19-2013
Thanks Paulo. Yeah, I didn't think they conformed since the 2.0 standard hadn't been finalized at production. I'd bet the Samsung sets with the "Evolution" hardware also have a good chance of getting an upgrade to HDMI 2.0 since the hardware can be pretty easily swapped out.
brunerww's Avatar brunerww 04:48 AM 12-21-2013
ProRes video sample from the Super 35 sensor 4K Blackmagic Production Camera. Blackmagic guru and camera tester Captain Hook (of Captain Hook LUT fame) took it out on a music video shoot as the "B" cam to a RED MX.

The director liked the images so much that the BMPC was promoted to the "A" cam.

4K Hollywood quality home movies for $3995 - less than the price of a 1080p Canon 5D Mark III with a 24-70 lens on it:



I can't wait to see RAW from this camera.


I find myself looking around my little studio thinking, "how many of these cameras would I need to sell to scrape together four thousand bucks?" smile.gif


Bill
Hybrid Camera Revolution
MTyson's Avatar MTyson 02:58 PM 12-22-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by brunerww View Post

ProRes video sample from the Super 35 sensor 4K Blackmagic Production Camera. Blackmagic guru and camera tester Captain Hook (of Captain Hook LUT fame) took it out on a music video shoot as the "B" cam to a RED MX.

The director liked the images so much that the BMPC was promoted to the "A" cam.

4K Hollywood quality home movies for $3995 - less than the price of a 1080p Canon 5D Mark III with a 24-70 lens on it:



I can't wait to see RAW from this camera.


I find myself looking around my little studio thinking, "how many of these cameras would I need to sell to scrape together four thousand bucks?" smile.gif


Bill
Hybrid Camera Revolution

Saw this over at BMCUSer, but it's stunning! It's pretty awesome to know that a Red MX camera got demoted to B-Camera to a $3,995 4k Camera. Love the Global shutter. Rolling shutter is evil! biggrin.gif
Tugela's Avatar Tugela 09:17 PM 12-22-2013
Well, the Red MX is technology that is at least three years old, so it damned well had better be an improvement.
brunerww's Avatar brunerww 05:29 AM 12-23-2013
Somebody needs to tell Hollywood that their "three year old" MXs are outdated because they're still shooting features with them.

Newer or not, it is amazing that a camera body that costs less than $4000 is even mentioned in the same sentence as RED smile.gif

In my view, this camera is going to cost RED (and Sony and Canon and Arri) a lot of sales.

Best of the season,

Bill
Hybrid Camera Revolution
Tugela's Avatar Tugela 10:02 PM 12-23-2013
Because they are still using them doesn't mean that there isn't newer technology being developed out there. They will use the equipment they have.

Fact is that the MX sensor is based on technology that dates back at least 3 years or more. You would expect any new cameras that come out to have more current technology, so they should outperform older stuff.

Assuming the Red are still developing new sensors (or more accurately, their suppliers are developing new sensors) then you would expect those would outperform the ones used in BMs cameras. The same thing would apply to all the other camera manufacturers - they will all probably be introducing new sensor tech at some point in 2014 as it becomes available, and then it will be BM's turn to be behind the curve.
MTyson's Avatar MTyson 12:03 PM 12-29-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tugela View Post

Because they are still using them doesn't mean that there isn't newer technology being developed out there. They will use the equipment they have.

Fact is that the MX sensor is based on technology that dates back at least 3 years or more. You would expect any new cameras that come out to have more current technology, so they should outperform older stuff.

Assuming the Red are still developing new sensors (or more accurately, their suppliers are developing new sensors) then you would expect those would outperform the ones used in BMs cameras. The same thing would apply to all the other camera manufacturers - they will all probably be introducing new sensor tech at some point in 2014 as it becomes available, and then it will be BM's turn to be behind the curve.

Red is still developing. The new 6k Dragon sensor upgrade camera out. It's the first digital sensor to exceed the dynamic range of even Super 65 film and has16.5+ stops of native dynamic range, new improved color science and even said to have an even better highlight roll off than 35mm film. Of course, despite the super high native dynamic range it still also includes the HDR-x Mode if you want upto about 21 stops of dynamic range. Base ISO of 2000 (cleaner than MX's 800), so it's also a low light beast. Scarlet can be upgraded to Dragon for $9,500, which gives on access to 5k resolution at 1-60fps, 4k at up to 75fps, 3k at up to 100fps, 2k at up to 150fps, 16.5+ stops of native dynamic range & the new color science..

Most likely BMD is already looking into the next sensor they'll use for an upcoming camera. I'd be surprised if they announced anymore cameras in 2014 after doing so two years in a row, but now I think nothing they do will surprise me. I'd say 2015 though they will have new cameras by then for sure. Regardless, BMD putting out a 4k camera at all on par with a $15,000 Scarlet for $3,995 and no rolling shutter is very impressive. BMD will most likely remain behind the curve. They are simply using off the shelf sensors with good specs, not developing new state of the art sensors like Red, but there's also a massive price differential between the two. Expect Red to stay ahead in features and overall quality, but a HUGE premium over new BMD cameras and expect BMD to come in under the radar with some very respectable specs at a fraction of the price by 2015.
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