Biggest Bargain Big-Sensor Compact Video Camera: The EOS-M at $299 (35mm f2) or $349 (28-88mm f3.5-5.6 IS Zoom) - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 162 Old 08-08-2013, 08:02 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by thedest View Post

Im afraid that this shot wasnt a stress test for a raw file. As you can see, I can get close to it with the compressed video using my custom 32bit plugin in the 8bit video



in the left your graded video. in the right the native video with an extended dynamic range hack

im off to work now. as soon as I get home I'll play with the RAW and the native for a while to see what I can do

what I really like on that video is the organic look it has, something that cant be matched, even with a good post processing. it may be because of the ammount of color information it has. the 8bit looks like a color blob next to it


one more thing: even at 1280x544 a RAW video should be able to keep more detail than most 1080p compressed videos. I'll look at it better at night

The AVC graded now has greyish flowers, so it is not quite right. Again, sharpening is really needed for the RAW-based one. The unsharpened ooc videos the pros shoot with for editing really look bad (soft), but come to life with sharpening (and in their case) adding back in color and contrast (in 8bit, of course).
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post #92 of 162 Old 08-08-2013, 08:43 AM
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Originally Posted by thedest View Post

nope, I can import the original RAW directly to premiere pro
I'm not participating, only following with interest.

@thedest: don't you need the 800 original RAW frames direct from the camera? If you downloaded the "raw" original from Vimeo are you not getting what was processed, rendered or compressed by Vegas Pro?

What am I missing?

It seems to me that you would do your color grading in something like Lightroom (with ACR) that can sync the grading from one RAW frame to all the rest in the clip. Then, export or save as a RAW photo frames, in a lossless format like .dng or .tiff. Then, Premier Pro could knit them into a video, much like you would process timelapse.
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post #93 of 162 Old 08-08-2013, 10:34 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by bsprague View Post

I'm not participating, only following with interest.

@thedest: don't you need the 800 original RAW frames direct from the camera? If you downloaded the "raw" original from Vimeo are you not getting what was processed, rendered or compressed by Vegas Pro?

What am I missing?

It seems to me that you would do your color grading in something like Lightroom (with ACR) that can sync the grading from one RAW frame to all the rest in the clip. Then, export or save as a RAW photo frames, in a lossless format like .dng or .tiff. Then, Premier Pro could knit them into a video, much like you would process timelapse.

Look above, I posted the link to the actual original one GB RAW file to download (feel free to get that and try putting into Adobe directly). That workflow you say is similar to what I did, although I needed to break up the one RAW file into the 800 frames using a free program. Then into Lightroom, which exported 800 white-balanced tiffs. Then into Vegas for making a video from the sequences, where I could have altered things like sharpness or whatever.
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post #94 of 162 Old 08-19-2013, 01:12 PM - Thread Starter
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One guy's solution to the white lens, black EOS M mismatch:



That is not me. It is nice that his outfit matches his kit.
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post #95 of 162 Old 08-19-2013, 01:46 PM
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oh.. the beauty of portability..

A 5D would never be that pratical biggrin.gif
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post #96 of 162 Old 08-20-2013, 02:29 AM
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The mighty (mini) Canon EOSM @ work. + Canon 8-15mm L using a Sony D50 for the mics - fed into the EOSM , an a Sachler FSB6 head on HD Manfrotto CF legs

NYE fireworks this year - no clipping, so headphones on and turn it up !

2mins worth on Vimeo (all I could upload on my free account) https://vimeo.com/72700792

Full 12 mins on my Zen site (yes, it is a bit soft, blame the Zen compressor) http://arcoonastudios.zenfolio.com/p1059160074/e6c53a630

And a failed attempt to post on Youtube (auto $%#$% copyright infringement detection) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YnF8c6RqLBU no loss, as Youtube quality was poor for the 2hrs this video was up, anyhow.
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post #97 of 162 Old 08-20-2013, 05:39 AM - Thread Starter
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Excellent video, with great sound. Why is there a watermark on the video?
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post #98 of 162 Old 08-20-2013, 03:12 PM
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Thanks - the 8-15mm is perfect for fireworks @ that range.

I have been putting watermarks on anything I am particularly happy with for about a year now and recently on some videos too.

I try to make the WM as unobtrusive as posiible, ie, not noticeable @ first glance, but obvious on a closer look.

Here is a koala bellowing in my back yard (shot on a Canon 60D) http://arcoonastudios.zenfolio.com/p961270891/h6613d823#h6613d823 tried to make the WM blend into the surrounds.

and my better stills have a WM http://arcoonastudios.zenfolio.com/

Both the fireworks and koala video used a dark grey text in a 2nd layer in Adobe After Effects, layers blended 'subtractively' - this makes the text a little darker than the back ground, so in the lighter areas the WM isn't in your face.

Why ? I have sold some of my work - you can't give it all away ! - and if you do, some one else can sell it and profit from your hard work. Also for self promotion, and for my ego.
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post #99 of 162 Old 08-22-2013, 11:51 AM - Thread Starter
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I decided to give Apple a try:

https://vimeo.com/72914685
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post #100 of 162 Old 08-27-2013, 04:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markr041 View Post

I decided to give Apple a try:

https://vimeo.com/72914685
crispy apples - nice

I am going to pass this on to a mate who also has an EOSM.

The EOSM is a remarkable pocket camera !
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post #101 of 162 Old 09-06-2013, 10:26 AM - Thread Starter
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EOS M Video: Visit to NYC's High Line Park

NYC's new elevated park, formed from an old elevated freight rail line - The High Line.
Flora and photographers, loungers and construction workers, bugs and insects, strollers and sculptures, and artists at work. From 23rd Street to Gansevoort Street in Manhattan.

Canon EOS M with EF-S 18-135mm IS STM lens. 108030p, at 1/60th shutter in manual mode. Manual audio.

https://vimeo.com/73918405


YouTube version:



Select 1080p.
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post #102 of 162 Old 09-06-2013, 05:43 PM
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Mark, re "EOS M Video: Visit to NYC's High Line Park"

that video is nice and clear. I also liked the natural subject matter. Not over exposed, not sharpened to death (camcorder users take note). Nice.

And lack of music ! - yay !

I really don't know why the EOSM got such a bad rap, I mean it has the same image quality as the 7D, but fits in your pocket !

BTW, did you have the IS turned on ?

BTW2: the Vimeo version looks a whole lot clearer than the Youtube version
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post #103 of 162 Old 09-06-2013, 06:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Pepster returns View Post

Mark, re "EOS M Video: Visit to NYC's High Line Park"

that video is nice and clear. I also liked the natural subject matter. Not over exposed, not sharpened to death (camcorder users take note). Nice.

And lack of music ! - yay !

I really don't know why the EOSM got such a bad rap, I mean it has the same image quality as the 7D, but fits in your pocket !

BTW, did you have the IS turned on ?

BTW2: the Vimeo version looks a whole lot clearer than the Youtube version

It is interesting to compare the Vimeo to the Youtube versions - any difference is due to the processing each does, as I uploaded exactly the same video file to each (which can be downloaded from the Vimeo site). IS was on; some shake is due to two things: the platform I was on was shaking sometimes, and the wind - which actually moves the camera! You can see this in some shots because you hear and see the effects of the wind on the flora. Many (most) shots are at over 200mm (35mm-equivalent) handheld.

And it is true, many people do not seem to understand that the EOS M has the same innards as the top Canon APS-C big-boys and thus yields essentially the same quality output.
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post #104 of 162 Old 09-20-2013, 11:46 AM - Thread Starter
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Canon EOS M Video: Visit to the Washington University in St Louis Campus

What is of interest here, if not interested in the campus: Uses 'Neutral' Picture mode indoors and outside in bright light, night scenes, audio (chapel bells, silent rooms).

https://vimeo.com/74687073

Otherwise you see: the grounds, the student center, cafe's, the butterfly garden (yes, with butterflies (monarchs)), the library, the art museum statuary, fountains, the chapel and its bells and organ, the athletic field, soccer, and the hare (sunlit and moonlit).

EOS M with EF S 18-135mm IS STM (daytime, outside + ND filter) and EF 35mm f2 IS USM (indoors, at night). 108030p, manual video (1/60th shutter) and audio.
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post #105 of 162 Old 09-20-2013, 01:51 PM
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be careful taking pictures at a university. police are gonna taze you and say youre a pervert or terrorist eek.gif
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post #106 of 162 Old 09-20-2013, 02:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by fishywishy View Post

be careful taking pictures at a university. police are gonna taze you and say youre a pervert or terrorist eek.gif

Actually, university campuses are filled with people taking pictures.
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post #107 of 162 Old 09-25-2013, 05:40 AM - Thread Starter
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A Zoo Video using Canon's newest, just-released lens: the EF S 55-250mm IS STM (88-400mm equ.)

The new lens is made for video (quiet), and is lightweight and compact despite the reach, so it works well with the EOS M. It is also relatively cheap, for a Canon lens. A perfect zoo lens, so we naturally went to a (small) zoo:

https://vimeo.com/75364534

Tropical birds and water birds preening, feeding and cleaning; snow monkeys, cleaning and feeding; penguin feeding time; sea lions feeding time; children's zoo; snakes; turtles; and gardens. And human visitors of all ages.

The audio is interesting, as you hear the reactions of the visitors to what you are viewing, and some music. And you can see that the IS is really effective - almost all the shots were at 400mm (equ.) handheld.
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post #108 of 162 Old 09-25-2013, 07:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markr041 View Post

A Zoo Video using Canon's newest, just-released lens: the EF S 55-250mm IS STM (88-400mm equ.)

The new lens is made for video (quiet), and is lightweight and compact despite the reach, so it works well with the EOS M. It is also relatively cheap, for a Canon lens. A perfect zoo lens, so we naturally went to a (small) zoo:

https://vimeo.com/75364534

Tropical birds and water birds preening, feeding and cleaning; snow monkeys, cleaning and feeding; penguin feeding time; sea lions feeding time; children's zoo; snakes; turtles; and gardens. And human visitors of all ages.

The audio is interesting, as you hear the reactions of the visitors to what you are viewing, and some music. And you can see that the IS is really effective - almost all the shots were at 400mm (equ.) handheld.
That lens and your demonstration video put the EOS-M on my B&H official "wish list".

Bil
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post #109 of 162 Old 09-25-2013, 08:38 AM
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All handheld? Quite impressive. Good focus and very steady.
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Originally Posted by bsprague View Post

That lens and your demonstration video put the EOS-M on my B&H official "wish list".
On B&H site the EOS M is "discontinued", whether it is actually discontinued by Canon or not. Supposedly a new model is coming soon.

Correction: it is back in stock, although $50 more than the bargain price.
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post #110 of 162 Old 09-25-2013, 09:44 AM
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Well having watched footage i took yesterday with my EOS M i am very pleased,i used neutral with the color down one,on some i did not use my filter and when it was brighter i did,the NDX8,M & A are the worst part,i have had it on all cameras in video[550D/GH2 and now this camera,the GH2 was worst,if anything footage from the EOS is better than the 550D,i dont know if the sensors are the same,the color for me is far superior to the GH2,its a shame i cant show the footage but stuff i put on youtube does seem to play properly so i have been told,none of mine or others youtube films for that matter play properly on my pc or laptop now,all jerky,what can the problem be ? i have good broadband that will download very fast.

One thing i forgot i used a tripod either fixed or as a hand brace,something i will have to do to get reasonably steady footage.
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post #111 of 162 Old 09-25-2013, 09:54 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Ungermann View Post

All handheld? Quite impressive. Good focus and very steady.
On B&H site the EOS M is "discontinued", whether it is actually discontinued by Canon or not. Supposedly a new model is coming soon.

Correction: it is back in stock, although $50 more than the bargain price.

The $299 price was almost always for the 22mm lens combo, a lens without IS and not very useful for video (though otherwise excellent). The price with the kit IS zoom is $349, just what I paid when I got it:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=&sku=898072&is=REG&Q=&A=details
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post #112 of 162 Old 09-25-2013, 09:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Ungermann View Post

.....although $50 more than the bargain price.
What's $50 when B&H does not charge sales tax and ships if for free? (grin) Would you please buy one and post your opinion? (another grin)

For my video and photo habits the camera is too big. I like my RX100 pocket camera a lot. But, I like the EOS-M focus control a lot. Telephoto wildlife shooting is not possible with the RX100. When I get the next camera it will have the ability to reach the small birds and big elk. (I had a lot of fun with an old Nikon film camera and a 500mm mirror reflex lens.) A new camera will be either a one like the EOS-M or a "bridge/ megazoom" like the Canon SX50 or Panasonic FZ200.
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post #113 of 162 Old 09-25-2013, 10:52 AM
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Would you please buy one and post your opinion? (another grin)
Not sure that I can buy new cameras - and lenses - at a pace some others do. In any case, I have too many cameras already. Just sold the TM900 that I did not use much. To get the EOS M I would have to sell the D3200. If I did not have it I probably would jump for the Canon. As for opinion, I think I know enough about it to assess its strengths and weaknesses.
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For my video and photo habits the camera is too big. I like my RX100 pocket camera a lot. But, I like the EOS-M focus control a lot. Telephoto wildlife shooting is not possible with the RX100. When I get the next camera it will have the ability to reach the small birds and big elk. (I had a lot of fun with an old Nikon film camera and a 500mm mirror reflex lens.) A new camera will be either a one like the EOS-M or a "bridge/ megazoom" like the Canon SX50 or Panasonic FZ200.
I looked at the RX100 II, it has some nice features like 24p in addition to 60p. Its sensor size is reasonably large. It has tilting screen. But its diaphragm gets too small on the long end, defeating the purpose of the large sensor to obtain blurred background. There is no mic input besides through the shoe. And there is no focus ring despite that it has a ring, but not for focus! Argh.
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post #114 of 162 Old 09-25-2013, 11:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ungermann View Post

.....And there is no focus ring despite that it has a ring, but not for focus! Argh.
My RX100 can be set so that the ring is for focus. It is awkward, but can be used for "pull focus" shots.
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post #115 of 162 Old 09-25-2013, 11:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bsprague View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ungermann View Post

.....And there is no focus ring despite that it has a ring, but not for focus! Argh.
My RX100 can be set so that the ring is for focus. It is awkward, but can be used for "pull focus" shots.
Ok then, I take it back - one cannot learn everything just based on specs and reviews. How awkward is it? Is it smooth or kind of notchy? Can you rotate the ring without noticeable shake?

Hmm, did I miss it from the review? -- http://www.cameralabs.com/reviews/Sony_Cyber-shot_RX100_II/
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As on the RX100, the lens ring, used mainly for exposure control in PASM modes can also take on a multitude of other roles. In the PAS modes the rear control wheel mimics the function of the lens-mounted ring, which is a bit of a waste. It would be handy to be able to customise the control wheel function so that that it could be used for exposure compensation. Switch to manual mode and things behave more sensibly with the ring used for aperture selection and the wheel for shutter speed.

The lens ring is customisable and you can assign it to one of a number of functions including White balance, Creative style, Picture effect, Shutter speed or Aperture, in which case it obviously no longer adopts an exposure control role appropriate to the currently selected shooting mode. You can also use it as an alternative zoom control and a new step zoom feature allows you to configure it so that, rather than the usual smooth zoom, it automatically zooms to a fixed point, with stops at 35, 50, 70 and 100mm.

If you're going to use the ring to zoom, this is the way to do it, not least because in the standard mode it takes several turns of the ring to get from one end of the zoom range to the other. The big disappointment is the step zoom function only works in stills shooting modes. You can use the ring to zoom for movies, but only in standard mode. And while it's easier to avoid accidentally using the digital zoom if you use the lens ring rather than the zoom rocker, you end up with the equally frustrating problem of not being able to cover the full range with a single twist. I'd say zooming is one of the worst aspects of the RX100 II's handling and while the new step zoom feature is a plus, its a shame to see Sony ignore the more fundamental problems.

...

The RX100 II retains the focus peaking system which highlights in-focus high contrast edges. Manual focusing on any compact is something of a challenge and anything that makes it easier is to be welcomed. The other manually assisted focusing option on offer is DMF which stands for Direct Manual Focussing and allows you to manually fine tune the focus having first used AF to acquire it.
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post #116 of 162 Old 09-25-2013, 12:10 PM
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It is smooth, but takes a lot of rotation to get the focus to change. I can't do it without a lot of camera movement when hand held. The camera is too small to get a good one hand grip and make the other hand available to twist the ring. I can make it work well on a tripod or monopod. I don't know if the RX100 II works the same. They may have left the focus choice off the manual ring.

As I've said before, the RX100 is not a great video camera while it is an amazing stills camera for travel. I do use it for a lot of travel video clips and think the picture quality of the clips is excellant. Don't buy it unless you like stills, Photoshop, Lightroom and prints to hang on the wall. If you do like that stuff, buy one.

Bill
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post #117 of 162 Old 09-25-2013, 06:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markr041 View Post

The $299 price was almost always for the 22mm lens combo, a lens without IS and not very useful for video (though otherwise excellent). The price with the kit IS zoom is $349, just what I paid when I got it:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=&sku=898072&is=REG&Q=&A=details

The 22mm is great for video, but requires a tripod or some other form of external stabilization.

I understand you already know this - just clarifying on usefulness vs. portability.
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post #118 of 162 Old 09-25-2013, 06:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xfws View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by markr041 View Post

The $299 price was almost always for the 22mm lens combo, a lens without IS and not very useful for video (though otherwise excellent). The price with the kit IS zoom is $349, just what I paid when I got it:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=&sku=898072&is=REG&Q=&A=details

The 22mm is great for video, but requires a tripod or some other form of external stabilization.

I understand you already know this - just clarifying on usefulness vs. portability.
NewEgg's $309 was for the camera + 18-55 zoom.
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post #119 of 162 Old 09-27-2013, 10:59 PM
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Was re-reading this thread... So the 55-200 is EF-S, not EF-M. This is a disappointment. So I need an adapter as well. This gets too bulky. I wonder if I buy the EOS M now, will Canon release 5x-2xx lens in EF-M format soon, or is this form-factor DOA?
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post #120 of 162 Old 09-28-2013, 03:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bsprague View Post

What's $50 when B&H does not charge sales tax and ships if for free? (grin) Would you please buy one and post your opinion? (another grin)

For my video and photo habits the camera is too big. I like my RX100 pocket camera a lot. But, I like the EOS-M focus control a lot. Telephoto wildlife shooting is not possible with the RX100. When I get the next camera it will have the ability to reach the small birds and big elk. (I had a lot of fun with an old Nikon film camera and a 500mm mirror reflex lens.) A new camera will be either a one like the EOS-M or a "bridge/ megazoom" like the Canon SX50 or Panasonic FZ200.

Hi Bill - Rokinon/Samyang/Bower make a compact mirror lens that mounts directly on the EOS-M without an adapter - so a relatively expensive solution for large-sensor wildlife shooting would be:

EOS-M body, $237.39 (2 left at Amazon as of this post)

Rokinon 300mm mirror lens, $299.

Cheers,

Bill
Hybrid Camera Revolution
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