4K VIDEO TEST! (Samsung Galaxy Note 3 -- 4K Recording) - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 105 Old 10-22-2013, 05:08 PM - Thread Starter
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I viewed the original 4K video on my 2560x1600 monitor and it's by far the best video quality I have seen in a smartphone.
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Welcome to my 4K video test. This footage was shot using the Samsung Galaxy Note 3 (Snapdragon 800 / LTE Version) in 4K video mode. The footage is untouched, it was simply imported to Final Cut Pro X then exported at full resolution using the H.264 codec. Make sure to play back at the highest resolution possible.




2560x1600 screenshot:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7428/10430925685_1b664d433a_o.jpg

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post #2 of 105 Old 10-23-2013, 02:04 AM
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Impressive
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post #3 of 105 Old 10-23-2013, 05:02 AM
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I'm a bit confused here Jogiba. In looking at the Verizon website, the camera indicates 2K recording capability, no mention of 4K.
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post #4 of 105 Old 10-23-2013, 05:47 AM - Thread Starter
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Verizon shows video modes as Full HD (1080p) , UHD . So UHD would be 3840x2160 .
http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/device/smartphone/samsung-galaxy-note-3-black?checkedId=oneOrTwoYearPrice7194



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post #5 of 105 Old 10-23-2013, 10:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jogiba View Post

I viewed the original 4K video on my 2560x1600 monitor and it's by far the best video quality I have seen in a smartphone.
I agree! I can't wait to get this sensor + processor in a camcorder with a fast zoom lens (and hopefully h.265 encoding).
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post #6 of 105 Old 10-23-2013, 10:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jogiba View Post

Verizon shows video modes as Full HD (1080p) , UHD . So UHD would be 3840x2160 .
http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/device/smartphone/samsung-galaxy-note-3-black?checkedId=oneOrTwoYearPrice7194




they should call 4k 2160p so its less confusing
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post #7 of 105 Old 10-23-2013, 11:02 AM
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Totally missed the UHD in the specs. They must compress the hell out of it.
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post #8 of 105 Old 10-23-2013, 08:39 PM
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If new cell phones can take video like that, I expect that consumer video camera sales are going to crater.

Camera companies are going to have their work cut out for them, that's for sure.

It will be interesting to see what the next generation of prosumer cameras can do. I think the next year or two will be exciting times in the video world.
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post #9 of 105 Old 10-24-2013, 04:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fishywishy View Post

they should call 4k 2160p so its less confusing
The JVC GY-HMQ10 4K camcorder and Blackmagic Design Blackmagic Production Camera 4K also have 3840x2160 resolution.
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/839193-REG/

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◾Records 4K (3840x2160) & HD (1920x1080
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/964119-REG/blackmagic_design_blackmagic_production_camera_4k.html



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4K Ultra HD offers four times the resolution of 1080p HDTV (twice as many pixels in each direction, horizontally and vertically). The decreased pixel size of 4K Ultra-HD TVs dramatically improves picture clarity. Meanwhile, 4K Ultra HD's deeper, broader color palette makes everything you watch more vibrant and lifelike, giving you a phenomenal viewing experience.

If you're interested in an amazing home theater experience, keep reading to find out what you need to know about 4K Ultra HD.
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Home+Solutions/4K+TV+Resource+Page/pcmcat300700050011.c?id=pcmcat300700050011
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post #10 of 105 Old 10-24-2013, 07:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tugela View Post


It will be interesting to see what the next generation of prosumer cameras can do. I think the next year or two will be exciting times in the video world.
I paid no attention to digital photography and videography equipment until a couple years ago. Long ago I was a film photo guy with more equipment than anybody I knew. What has happened in these last couple of years has already amazed me. 3 years ago it was relatively difficult to shoot and edit 60p HD for our flat screen TVs. Now nearly every camera can do it and all the primary NLEs can handle it. One NLE can even edit losslessly.
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post #11 of 105 Old 10-24-2013, 07:43 PM
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In consumer 4K videography, hybrid mobile devices (read phones, tablets and low-cost still cameras) will dominate the market mainly because of the reason of economy of scale. Take the Samsung Galaxy Note 3, for instance, it's 4K video pipeline consists of a 13-Megapixel Sony camera-sensor module, shared not only by its Galaxy S4 cousin but also by numerous Sony own handsets, and more than a few other brands and models. The OS is more or less off the shelf and free. The firmware that enables the Note 3's 4K video may be designed in-house but the Snapdragon 800 CPU and GPU are also shared by yet numerous brands and models. In short, the economics of insanely high-volume mobile devices allow several manufacturers to mix and match components that would never have been feasible if they had had to make on their own.

In contrast to the mobile devices sold worldwide, how many digital cameras are being sold nowadays? Though the camera manufacturers themselves have also been doing the mixing and matching of components from other suppliers as well but neither the scale nor the extent of it has not been or is ever going to be comparable to what the mobile device manufacturers have been doing.

In a few weeks we are going to have another phone to compete with the Note 3 on 4K, Acer Liquid S1, which in all likelihood will have a lower price but yet unknown 4K video quality. On the still camera side, the closest thing to consumer 4K video is maybe Canon 1DC and the soon to be released Blackmagic Production Camera. Neither of which can be called affordable nor user friendly. On the camcorder side, the only options are US$ 4,000+ JVC GY-HMQ10 and US$ 4,500 Sony FDR-AX1. Neither of which again can be called affordable nor pocketable.

I have no doubt this new Sony in particular will shoot better 4K image than any phone of this year or next will but does this really matter to the majority in the world of media consumption? One thing I can be pretty sure of is the new 4K Sony will never enjoy the popularity or sales on the level it's ground-breaking cousin HDV format HDR-FX1 did when it came out almost a decade ago at even higher prices in both then and today's dollar terms. The world has changed folks and we move on.
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post #12 of 105 Old 10-24-2013, 08:30 PM
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This will boost the 4K TV sales as well. There won't be too much 4K media available to justify the upgrade but if people start to shoot UHD using cell phones, it can be a game change for the TV industry.

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post #13 of 105 Old 10-24-2013, 09:05 PM
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I wouldn't call the FX1 a cousin to the Sony AX1. It's more a cousin to the Sony A1u. Sony is using a small single chip design (Just like the A1u) that will most likely make it's way to their consumer models. It's just that's it's very large becasue of all the extra features together with the 20x lens. Not hard to put that chip into a much smaller body size with a 10x lens and less external features. Maybe we'll see that in CES this January.
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post #14 of 105 Old 10-24-2013, 09:17 PM
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Sorry I got it wrong in my previous post it should be Acer Liquid S2 not S1.
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post #15 of 105 Old 10-25-2013, 05:07 AM - Thread Starter
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I agree, I think smartphones will be the #1 4K camera for consumers because of the huge volume and with HDMI 2.0 & H.265 coming out in 2014 4K will be big by this time next year. Amazon has had the Seika 50" 4K UHDTV for as low as $944.74 in the last month.

http://camelcamelcamel.com/Seiki-Digital-SE50UY04-50-Inch-120Hz/product/B00BXF7I9M
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post #16 of 105 Old 10-25-2013, 09:36 AM
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But let's face it, for the quality conscious buyet, smart phones won't be the 'go to' device for 4K acquisition.

I also don't see smartphone 4K footage as being any kind of significant driving force for 4K displays.
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post #17 of 105 Old 10-25-2013, 10:23 AM
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The real driving force for 4K TVs will always be the price. My point is that many people, not the AVS members, will buy a 4K capable phone to experiment a "better" video and then have a reason to choose the 4K TV if they can afford it. I would not buy a 4K TV today because there is not enough media available and it seems to be following the same 3D rational regarding which movies will be available first, cartoons and kids stuff. I would love to see The Deer Hunter in 4K but it will never happen.

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post #18 of 105 Old 10-25-2013, 04:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slimoli View Post

The real driving force for 4K TVs will always be the price. My point is that many people, not the AVS members, will buy a 4K capable phone to experiment a "better" video and then have a reason to choose the 4K TV if they can afford it. I would not buy a 4K TV today because there is not enough media available and it seems to be following the same 3D rational regarding which movies will be available first, cartoons and kids stuff. I would love to see The Deer Hunter in 4K but it will never happen.
I think a movie like Deer Hunter that won Best Picture in 1979 along with awards for Christopher Walken and Michael Cimino (Best Director) plus nominations for Meryl Streep , Robert De Niro and Vilmos Zsigmond will be available in 4K in a few years. BTW I have the Blu-Ray version .
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post #19 of 105 Old 10-26-2013, 03:45 PM - Thread Starter
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DPR posted a 4K frame grab in their review ( click on bottom link).

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The Note 3 is one of the first phones capable of shooting 4K video, with a resolution of 3840 x 2160. This is a huge resolution jump over standard full HD video: an HD video frame is 2 megapixels, while a 4K frame is more than 8 megapixels.

At the moment, very few people have 4K-capable TVs or computer screens, so this feature is probably more interesting as “future proofing” than anything else (you may also have trouble playing it back, even at normal HD resolution, on older hardware because the processing demands are substantial). You can already upload and view 4K content to YouTube, but the compression takes a big bite out of quality as usual. The frame grabs below give a better sense of how much more visual information 4K video carries.

The Note 3 caps 4K recordings at five minutes, and digital video stabilization isn’t an option at the higher resolution (we didn’t see much evidence of it working at normal HD resolutions anyway).
http://connect.dpreview.com/post/3690994318/samsung-galaxy-note3-first-look-review?utm_campaign=internal-link&utm_source=news-list&utm_medium=text&ref=title_0_0

This frame grab from the Note 3’s normal HD (1920 x 1080) video mode looks good …


… but it’s nothing compared to the detail in this frame from the 4K mode (3849 x 2160).


click here for 2560x1600 screenshot
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post #20 of 105 Old 10-27-2013, 05:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Samsung Note 3 4k vs Blackmagic Cinema Camera 2.5k RAW resolution chart comparison :
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post #21 of 105 Old 10-27-2013, 09:14 PM
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Wow the Samsung destroys the BMCC on that resolution chart.
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post #22 of 105 Old 10-29-2013, 07:12 PM
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That's the luxury of being 4K (or in the Note 3's case, not quite 4K at 3840x2160). The footage can be easily down sampled by most players and NLEs for viewing at 1080p to fit most of the displays available in the market today and look superior to native 1080p footage captured by similar devices. By "similar devices" here I mean cel phones, compact cameras and camcorders and even most higher-end DSLRs. Not the Alexa or Sony F35's 1080p footage. When you watch the Note 3's 4k clips on a 4K display with a proper CPU and GPU you'll see quite a lot of artifacts but once that same clips are down sampled, either by an NLE to in post production or realtime in a good player to 1080p, those same artifacts become a lot harder to see.
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post #23 of 105 Old 10-29-2013, 07:36 PM
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^ I'm not so sure that the Note's video will look superior to that produced by compact cameras, camcorders and most high-end DSLRs. You're 'focusing' on only one aspect of PQ, resolution. There are far far more ingredients that go int o PQ than just resolution. I seriously doubt the dynamic range of the Note can compare to higher end DSLRs. It most certainly will not have much control over DOF, ability to provide optical zoom nor will it have the ability to adjust shooting parameters like other cameras. Its sound quality will also not be comparable to high end DSLRs or camcorders.

Of course I'm not even talking about the lack of ergonomics while shooting with something as awkward as a phone.

But yes, in terms of resolution, this is a real achievement. Many more devices, with better options, to come in the not too distant future. smile.gif
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post #24 of 105 Old 10-29-2013, 07:41 PM
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I looked at the footage on youtube in "Original" resolution, and the Samsung goes to 14 on the trumpets whereas the BMCC only makes it to 8.
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post #25 of 105 Old 10-29-2013, 11:11 PM
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Nice.

I am still on the lookout for one device that has everything built in. (This whole convergence thing is certainly taking its time.)
Stand alone GPS, Phone and really good pocket camera/video cam in one. Leaning towards the Lumia 1020 and up line for my new phone.

I hadn't even thought about 4K in my pocket up until this point.
(Wait that doesn't sound right... yeah 4K in my pocket would be great... money wise.)

But prying my dedicated camcorder out of my hands is going to take some doing. I stand to be impressed with any future tech that can change my mind.
I have long since given up on dedicated cameras from my film days.. so I guess I am half way there already as a consumer.

For Pro work that's another story you guys know all too well.
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post #26 of 105 Old 10-31-2013, 05:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Philip Bloom's 4K video with the Note 3 !
Quote:
It records in H.264 MP4s at roughly 48mbits per second. That’s not very high for four times the resolution of HD. It needs to be a much less compressed recording or ideally a newer, stronger, more efficient and 4K centric codec. H264 is not really it.

I recorded in 30p. There may well be a 25p or 24p option. I didn’t have time to look for it. Doesn’t matter though, as I shot 30p and brought it into the computer via the rather lovely full size USB 3 port at the bottom of the phone, and then converted to ProRes HQ with MPEG Streamclip and then conformed to 23.98p in Cinema Tools, giving me a slightly stronger image and slightly slower but now much nice filmic movement. I really like 30p recording slowed to 24p or 25p. It’s a lovely “not slow motion but not normal motion” look.
http://philipbloom.net/2013/10/24/note4k/

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post #27 of 105 Old 11-01-2013, 04:16 AM
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No IS? As Bloom implies, that makes the Note 3 practically unusable, as it's almost impossible to get footage without significant shaking. Anyone that's used a cellphone to record normal HD without some form of stabilization knows how bad that can be. Maybe that's why the 4K capability of the Note is almost a secret.

Maybe if they had included a tripod socket? ;-)

But hey, it is kind of cool that this capability even exists in a mobile device that's so capable for the things it's really designed to do.

Hopefully the rumors are true and we'll see the GH4 with 4K capability. But even there I bet the first iteration will not have 60p.
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post #28 of 105 Old 11-01-2013, 05:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Anyone who is into shooting videos should learn how to get a camera stable when shooting handheld. I have a myriad of products like the Steadicam Merlin, Polaroid Video Chest Stabilizer Support System and bipod with trigger grip.







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post #29 of 105 Old 11-01-2013, 07:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slimoli View Post

The real driving force for 4K TVs will always be the price.

Chinese manufacturers have broken the $1000 price barrier for 4K (and are killing Japanese TV manufacturers in the TV business overall).

Panasonic has shut down its Plasma TV factory and Sony is hemorrhaging money in its TV business.

Seiki 50" 4K - $1177.67

TCL 50" 4K - $999.99

Seiki 39" 4K - $699

Just in time for Christmas smile.gif

Bill
High Def TV Revolution
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post #30 of 105 Old 11-01-2013, 08:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brunerww View Post

Chinese manufacturers have broken the $1000 price barrier for 4K (and are killing Japanese TV manufacturers in the TV business overall).

Panasonic has shut down its Plasma TV factory and Sony is hemorrhaging money in its TV business.

Seiki 50" 4K - $1177.67

TCL 50" 4K - $999.99

Seiki 39" 4K - $699

Just in time for Christmas smile.gif

Bill
High Def TV Revolution

Those prices with a Sansung, Sony or Panasonic badge can create a real market, not so from un Unknown Chinese brand. Americans are very sensitive to names they don't know and don't see on TV commercials. There are cheap Chinese cars, very cheap indeed, but I doubt they can succeed here. We accept the "made in China" supervised by a Japanese company but the only Chinese brand I like is the Oppo.

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