Editing degrades video quality - AVS Forum
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Old 02-10-2014, 07:14 PM - Thread Starter
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I use Power Director 11.0 and noticed that as soon as I changed anything in the original file, video quality goes down to the drain.
Here is the example. Video 1080 60p @28mbs and rendered to exactly the same specs.
First part is original and then just to show the problem I added 2% of Saturation, Contrast and Brightness to the second part.
You can see how video quality degraded. Just look at the shovel handle at the left corner.
Original can be downloaded.

Is this PD problem or I do something wrong?

https://vimeo.com/86375328
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Old 02-10-2014, 08:14 PM
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I'm not familiar with Power Director, but Sony Vegas has something called "project properties" where you set things such as deinterlace method, frame rate, quality, etc. for the project/separate from the render settings. Perhaps PD has something similar.

You may want to ask at the CyberLink forum:
http://forum.cyberlink.com/forum/forums/show/110.page
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Old 02-10-2014, 08:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Yes it does. By default this matches input file and I keep it that way.
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Old 02-10-2014, 08:41 PM
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Project properties usually determine what you see when you are editing, not what is output.

My guess is that you are outputting the file with the wrong type. Certainly there is something very wrong with the second part of your video. Although you get loss of quality when rendering, it should not be anywhere close to that bad.

The second part looks like SD footage - if I were to guess I would say that the program is rendering a 1080p version of your proxy files (which are probably at SD resolution).
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Old 02-11-2014, 06:51 AM - Thread Starter
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Both clips rendered exactly the same way in the same pass. Seems like if there is no SVR, editor uses a different algorithm.
I had a chance to try Sony Movie studio 11 last night and did not see significant changes in the output.
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Old 02-11-2014, 01:59 PM
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No, the second clip should not look like that. The degradation is not from compression, it looks like upscaling from a lower resolution, which is why I suggested the possibility that it is rendering the proxy files rather than the actual files.
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Old 02-11-2014, 02:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tugela View Post

No, the second clip should not look like that. The degradation is not from compression, it looks like upscaling from a lower resolution, which is why I suggested the possibility that it is rendering the proxy files rather than the actual files.

"No, the second clip should not look like that" - that is exactly my point
Here is the flow. I put two copies of the same clip to the time line. Did nothing with the first and just a little correction in the second.
Then I rendered whole project with the same profile. 1080 60p 28mbs AVCHD.
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Old 02-12-2014, 09:51 AM
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FWIW, I've seen the same thing sometimes in Premier Elements 11. Specifically, increasing the brightness or a "gama" correction in a clip will induce grainy noise. I don't know why. Nor, do I know if it is a built in limitation to AVCHD footage. On my system, I suspect it is worse with interlaced footage, but have not done any controlled testing.

The question for me is whether I should upgrade my software to a more expensive "pro" version. I am tempted to experiment with a trial of Sony's Home Studio 13 first.
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Old 02-12-2014, 10:27 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bsprague View Post

FWIW, I've seen the same thing sometimes in Premier Elements 11. Specifically, increasing the brightness or a "gama" correction in a clip will induce grainy noise. I don't know why. Nor, do I know if it is a built in limitation to AVCHD footage. On my system, I suspect it is worse with interlaced footage, but have not done any controlled testing.

The question for me is whether I should upgrade my software to a more expensive "pro" version. I am tempted to experiment with a trial of Sony's Home Studio 13 first.

I am on the same boat. I am currently playing with Sony Movie Studio Platinum 13. I did not see any quality degradation after rendering short edited clip, but software froze rendering 2 min. 1080 60p clip frown.gif
I have I7, 32G memory and 4G NVidia card - more than enough ...
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Old 02-12-2014, 10:43 AM
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There are many that like Sony Home Studio. Two or three versions ago I picked it as my primary NLE and went to work. I admit that I picked it because of a Fry's promotion where, with a Sony promotion, I got it for about $15. It ran great on a Toshiba i5 laptop with 8 gigs of RAM. After about 6 weeks, it refused to load. It kicked out errors about "permissions". I worked on it for a month with multiple installs, downloads and googled for answers. I tried contact with Sony with no response. In desperation, I gave up and bought Adobe Premier Elements 9 and started learning it. I was, and still am, thrilled with all the great learning resourses and integration with Photoshop Elements and Lightroom.

A month of Premier Elements use went by and I got a email response from Sony saying I needed to "change users" or "create a new user" on my computer and re-install. It may have worked, but I never tried it. It seemed weird that I would have to log on as a new user every time I wanted to run one program!

The real temptation now, assuming version 13 would work better on my new i7 computer, is to see what the CUDA/nVIDIA performance would be like.

Bill
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Old 02-12-2014, 02:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bsprague View Post

There are many that like Sony Home Studio. Two or three versions ago I picked it as my primary NLE and went to work. I admit that I picked it because of a Fry's promotion where, with a Sony promotion, I got it for about $15. It ran great on a Toshiba i5 laptop with 8 gigs of RAM. After about 6 weeks, it refused to load. It kicked out errors about "permissions". I worked on it for a month with multiple installs, downloads and googled for answers. I tried contact with Sony with no response. In desperation, I gave up and bought Adobe Premier Elements 9 and started learning it. I was, and still am, thrilled with all the great learning resourses and integration with Photoshop Elements and Lightroom.

A month of Premier Elements use went by and I got a email response from Sony saying I needed to "change users" or "create a new user" on my computer and re-install. It may have worked, but I never tried it. It seemed weird that I would have to log on as a new user every time I wanted to run one program!

The real temptation now, assuming version 13 would work better on my new i7 computer, is to see what the CUDA/nVIDIA performance would be like.

Bill

I just rendered another clip. There is an option to render 1080 60p is XAVC or XVAC-S codec with 70+Mbps.
The good thing is - the output quality is fantastic. The other good thing - Sony Blu-Ray can play it perfectly fine.
Keep digging....
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Old 02-13-2014, 08:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobk77 View Post

I just rendered another clip. There is an option to render 1080 60p is XAVC or XVAC-S codec with 70+Mbps.
The good thing is - the output quality is fantastic. The other good thing - Sony Blu-Ray can play it perfectly fine.
Keep digging....
Premier Elements 11 seems stuck on "MainConcept H.264". But, I'll keep at it.

Bill
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Old 02-13-2014, 08:18 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bsprague View Post

Premier Elements 11 seems stuck on "MainConcept H.264". But, I'll keep at it.

Bill

I just wanted to see if Blue-Ray (via USB) plays video with that high bit rate. I am not planninig to render 60p higher that original 28Mbps.
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Old 02-13-2014, 09:49 AM
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BD is nominally rated up to 40 Mbit/s. AVCHD discs (AVCHD on DVD media) are legal up to 18 Mbit/s. I tried producing AVCHD discs with bitrate up to low 30-ies Mbit/s, the rate of success is spotty, depends on particular media and player.

While I would not render 70 Mbit/s (which is pointless considering my source files), 40 Mbit/s on BD media is perfectly fine, but then again, pointless unless your source is 40+ Mbit/s. Um, then again, Canon DSLRs are about 45 Mbit/s, but effective resolution is quite low, so their video can be compressed at least twofold without visual degradation.
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