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Controlling Garage Doors - INSTALLERS PLEASE HELP!

6K views 37 replies 17 participants last post by  RonCohen 
#1 ·
Hello, I think this is my first post. I have been reading the forum for a long time, and got a lot of good information. I know there are several installlers/integraters on here and maybe they can help. My local guy charges $120/hour for this stuff, and I think I can handle this one on my own...I think. I have a complete Control4 system in my house that was professionally installed. I love it. One thing that never got hooked up though was the ability to control my garage doors. There is CAT5 cable ran from my A/V closet to all my garage door motors, and the little sensors that make sure the path is clear. I just do not know how to make the connection to either the C4 system, or the hardware in the garage. Can someone please help? Sorry if I am kind of stupid when it comes to relays and things. THANKS!
 
#2 ·
You may have to give him a call.


Just because the wire is run and just needs "plugged in", doesn't mean the system is programmed to control the doors.
 
#3 ·
This is a matter of acquiring status of som parameters (the sensors), generating logic, and then knowing how to create the commands within the platform (which I am not even sure it can do).


Call Control4 first to see if they think it can be done, then call a pro to do it.
 
#4 ·
I have a good friend who can do the programming side. He just does not know anything about how relays and things are connected. He can write the software once the connections are made. If I need to give him a call so be it, but I would like to try and tackle it with me doing the hardware part, and my friend doing the software.
 
#5 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by dhendriksen /forum/post/0


I have a good friend who is an AP Test Supervisor at Control4, and can do the programming side. He just does not know anything about how relays and things are connected. He can write the software once the connections are made. If I need to give him a call so be it, but I would like to try and tackle it with me doing the hardware part, and my friend doing the software.

Well, the little "doorbell" style button that you sometimes see garage door installers place by the house entry are connected to a simple contact closure.


If the C4 has internal relays (I have no idea), you could place the relay circuit inline (diode isolating) and just control the opener that way.


If the C4 controller does NOT have internal relays, then you could use a Xantech CC12 or CC62 contact closure interface which responds to simple IR commands that the C4 controller can definitely provide.


The issue(s) here are that the contact closure (CC) on the openers are toggle commands. If the door is open, it gets closed... If the door is closed, it gets opened...


You need to be able to sense the status and then create logic to NOT send the command of the door is already in the desired state.


The HARD way assumes a certain level of sophisticated components in other subsystems to use to call for status. If you had a higher end alarm system with robust RS-232 communication, you could poll for the status of that door's mag contact sensor... This also implies that you understand advanced programming on your control/automation platform as well as the alarm system to determine which zone and sensor to poll....


The simplest[/i] way, which also appeals to homeowners on other levels, is to place an inexpensive CCTV camera(s) in the garage facing the door(s). You can modulate them to a TV tuner over a piece of standard RG-6, and then use the TV to sense status by actually viewing the position of the doors, and then the logic is you, as you decide whether or not you need to push the button(s)...


This is not automation, but control... and for a hands-on type person, sometimes it's just as good.


The "appeal on other levels" part is that you can see what is happening in your garage real time, see if your teenagers have brought the car back home on a late night, etc. all without getting out of bed.


Buy a 2 channel mod and put a mini-dome to cover your front porch... Trust me you will love the idea of seeing who is at the door without opening the door or answering the intercom. Especially if the wife and kids are home alone often.


This is a rudimentary plan, and there are a thousand variables worth consideration, but this should get you down the path.
 
#6 ·
Just in case anyone happens to be curious....


The reason that high end integrators usually go the more elaborate route is because it ultimately keeps things simpler for the homeowners through real automation... Homeowners at this level don't want to control it, because then they still have to manually do it. They want it to do be done automatically as often as is practical.


Using your example of the garage door, we would know the status of the sensors on the alarm system, and could automatically shut the doors at a certain time each day if they have been left open.


Or,

A program could be written to automatically close the door after the car enters or leaves by sensing a driveway sensor after the car leaves and triggering a closure, or by sensing the PIR (motion) sensor and shutting the garage door after a car returns and then there is no activity in the garage for 15-20 minutes continuous (because there may still be motion for w while after the car is parked as someone unloads groceries, shopping bags, etc.)


The sky is the limit on what could be done... it's all imagination and programming time.


THIS is why people hire professionals....
 
#7 ·
Cinemascope, thanks for the in depth reply. The reason I want it setup this way, is when I put my house in "night mode", it makes turns of all the interior lights, turns on motion sensors in different areas to trigger certain lights based on motion (ie: when i get up and walk out my bedroom it turns on the hall lights to 40%, and turns on the under cabinet lighting), etc... I just have a bad habit of forgetting to close the garage doors, and being that I never lock the doors in to the house from the garages, it leaves me wide open to burglary. I want to be able to press the button on the six button switch by my bed, and have it make sure they are closed. If anyone can tell me in lamens terms how to make the physical connections, we can do the programming. I just need to know how to make that connection using CAT5. Hell, maybe I just need to pay the local dealer to come do it.


All your help is appreciated, I really mean that!
 
#8 ·
Oh, and the C4 does have internal relays. A LOT of them.
 
#9 ·
I do a similar thing with my security system. I saw that the button was a toggle. I got around this by placing a normally open contact switch (on the garage door) in series with relay output. So..you could trigger the relay all you wanted to, but it wouldn't actually work if the garage door is already closed.

It is not entirely foolproof. If the garage is in the middle of movement and the relay kicks in...it will stop.


Hope this helps

Scott
 
#10 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by bcrawfo2 /forum/post/0


I do a similar thing with my security system. I saw that the button was a toggle. I got around this by placing a normally open contact switch (on the garage door) in series with relay output. So..you could trigger the relay all you wanted to, but it wouldn't actually work if the garage door is already closed.

It is not entirely foolproof. If the garage is in the middle of movement and the relay kicks in...it will stop.


Hope this helps

Scott

This is a huge help. No all I need you to do is explain to me in lamens terms how to hook up a relay, and where I can buy one. I also need to know how to hook it up to my garage doors. Thanks, I sent you a PM. Further detail/instructions would be greatly appreciated.
 
#11 ·
I installed a mag contact on my garage door and connected it to my security system as an auxillary zone; this allows me to determine if the door is open or closed. I then ran a wire from a relay to the push button in the garage; all one needs to do is "pulse" the relay and the system behaves as if some one pushed the button on the wall.


So if I want to close the garage door and the mag contact indicates that the door is open (zone is not ready), I just pulse the relay that the button is hooked up to.


Some things I do with this setup (1) at night when I arm my alarm system, I can close the garage door. (2) when you arm the alarm system to "away", I kick off a 15 minute timer. When the timer trips and the alarm system is still armed "away", it assumes you forgot to close the garage door and does it for you.
 
#12 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by dhendriksen /forum/post/0


The reason I want it setup this way, is when I put my house in "night mode", it makes sure the pool cover is closed, turns of all the interior lights, turns on motion sensors in different areas to trigger certain lights based on motion


Closing a pool cover sounds like a liabilty issue, w have a client that wants us to automate his lap pool cover and we said no due to if someone was in the pool and he did his away or night mode the cover closed...ok lets say someone is in the pool and now the coves closes them in...who is responsible for the death??? the guy in the pool?? the home owner? or the installer..maybe all 3?


we have also said no to controlling alarm systems and forced arms to bypass any open zones...if you left the front door open and force armed the system with the automation system with the door open and a burgler came in killed a family member..again whos ar fault
 
#13 ·
Jkv hit the nail on the head. Have a magnet on the door end so that it knows if its open or closed, then add the connection from the motor to the relay in your distribution panel. Do the programming to boot. jkv said he does his to the switch i believe but both do the same it all depends where your installer did his prewire to.


Just be careful with some systems (HAI) if a certain zone isn't secure then it will still arm the system (auto bypass) and when that door becomes closed it then arms into the system. I don't know how c4 works in that sense.

Good luck
 
#14 ·
dhendriksen,


You already have control4? I am assuming either an HTC or Media Controller correct? From the sounds of it you already have CAT5 running to the garage door opener, correct?


Now, if your CAT5 runs from garage door opener to the HTC/MC and if you have an available relay on either the HTC/MC you can control your garage door very easily. Just hook up 2 wires from the CAT5 to the garage door opener just like the 2 wires are hooked that run to the toggle switch. Connect those same 2 wires to the Control4 Relay Output. To determine open/close status reliably, you really need a open/close sensor (magnetic sensor) that will also need to be run to the HTC/MC and hooked to a Contact Input.


after that it is creative programming.


hope this helps.
 
#15 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by captaincondor /forum/post/0


Jkv hit the nail on the head. Have a magnet on the door end so that it knows if its open or closed, then add the connection from the motor to the relay in your distribution panel. Do the programming to boot. jkv said he does his to the switch i believe but both do the same it all depends where your installer did his prewire to.

correct..it doesn't matter. I prewired to the button/switch but it could have also been done at the motor...same result.

Quote:
Just be careful with some systems (HAI) if a certain zone isn't secure then it will still arm the system (auto bypass) and when that door becomes closed it then arms into the system. I don't know how c4 works in that sense.

Good luck

true (and I do have a HAI system)...but (1) I don't use the auto-bypass feature (it is turned off) and (2) the garage door is configured as an auxillary zone so it doesn't have to be closed ("ready") to arm the system.
 
#16 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by LVS /forum/post/0


dhendriksen,


You already have control4? I am assuming either an HTC or Media Controller correct? From the sounds of it you already have CAT5 running to the garage door opener, correct?


Now, if your CAT5 runs from garage door opener to the HTC/MC and if you have an available relay on either the HTC/MC you can control your garage door very easily. Just hook up 2 wires from the CAT5 to the garage door opener just like the 2 wires are hooked that run to the toggle switch. Connect those same 2 wires to the Control4 Relay Output. To determine open/close status reliably, you really need a open/close sensor (magnetic sensor) that will also need to be run to the HTC/MC and hooked to a Contact Input.


after that it is creative programming.


hope this helps.

I do already have Control 4, I am hooking this up to a media controller. What pre-wiring is done sounds like it will be perfect. I have one CAT5 dropping out of the ceiling above each of the garage door openers, and I have one CAT5 coming out of the wall near the floor next to each of the garage doors. I should be able to do those two for the sensors, and the other two for the motors. The other end of all those wires comes to my A/V room, and I do have available relays on my Media Controller.


I am trying to become more proficient at this, and trying to involve my friend less. All the help you guys have provided has been great, I should be able to make the physical connections now. I just need to know which contacts to connect to on the Control 4. Will it be NO, or NC for the sensors? Also, which connections do I make on my media controller for the wires running to the motor? Can anyone explain to me what programming is involved?



Again, all your help is greatly appreciated.
 
#17 ·
For the Magnetic Sensors for determining open/close, there are 3 potential connections 12V, SIG, GND: These don't require power, so just hook 1 wire From CAT5 that is hooked to Magnetic sensor to the Input "SIG", and the other wire should be connected to GND.


For the relay that goes to Garage Opener, there are 3 potential connections COM, NC, NO: Just attach one wire to the COM (common) terminal the the other to the Normally Open (NO) terminal. The relay switch will close when the relay is activated.


As far as programming, it all depends on what you are trying to accomlish.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dhendriksen /forum/post/0


I do already have Control 4, I am hooking this up to a media controller. What pre-wiring is done sounds like it will be perfect. I have one CAT5 dropping out of the ceiling above each of the garage door openers, and I have one CAT5 coming out of the wall near the floor next to each of the garage doors. I should be able to do those two for the sensors, and the other two for the motors. The other end of all those wires comes to my A/V room, and I do have available relays on my Media Controller.


I am trying to become more proficient at this, and trying to involve my friend less. All the help you guys have provided has been great, I should be able to make the physical connections now. I just need to know which contacts to connect to on the Control 4. Will it be NO, or NC for the sensors? Also, which connections do I make on my media controller for the wires running to the motor? Can anyone explain to me what programming is involved? I do have the software (Composer version 1.3.2.), and I can make that available to anyone who wants it as well, I understand it is hard to get.


Again, all your help is greatly appreciated.
 
#18 ·
For now I would just simply like to have some way of knowing my garage door is open, aside from physically lookind at the garage door :). I do not mind navigating through a menu in my control4, I can do that from bed. For now, I just want a way to be able to tell if my garage door is open or closed. Is that difficult? I am fairly new (brand new) to the programming side of this.
 
#19 ·
When you add the Garage to the project, you will add the Garage Door (relay used on MC) and you will add Garage Door Sensor(contact sensor used on MC) for the magnetic contacts. At this point you can determine the status of the Garage Door Sensor and the Garage Door for that matter from all the navigators, no programming really necessary outside of adding the devices to the project.
 
#20 ·
Cool...I will try that out tonight. Do you think a local lowes or home depot will have that sensor/switch that I need? If I do have to go out and find one online, do you have any suggestions?


Again, all your help is greatly appreciated!
 
#21 ·
Lowes and/or Home Depot should have these contact sensors. They make them for larger doors and then the smaller plastic like these at the attached link.

http://www.cardaccess-inc.com/inhome...es/index.php#3


Personally I would go with the bigger more industrial type but either will work.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dhendriksen /forum/post/0


Cool...I will try that out tonight. Do you think a local lowes or home depot will have that sensor/switch that I need? If I do have to go out and find one online, do you have any suggestions?


Again, all your help is greatly appreciated!
 
#22 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by dhendriksen /forum/post/0


For now I would just simply like to have some way of knowing my garage door is open, aside .

What type of security system do you have? That type of notification should be quite simple for any security panel if you hook sensors to the doors.
 
#23 ·
Wanted to add a few questions to this thread..

1. Does anyone make a 3 way magnetic switch? An attracted mode, no activity mode, and a repel/repulse mode. That way you could have magnets at open and closed status that do different things to a single sensor magnet...

Or just do two sensor magnets, one at open and one at closed, C4 reads which is which and knows status..?


2. Are there any garage door openers on the market that communicate? That via RS232 or Cat5/RJ45, etc you can send open/close and get status reports on the object in way sensors...


To OP, could always do a camera pointed at the front of garage to see if they are open. Keep a clicker by bedside...



Matt
 
#24 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by LVS /forum/post/0


Lowes and/or Home Depot should have these contact sensors. They make them for larger doors and then the smaller plastic like these at the attached link.

http://www.cardaccess-inc.com/inhome...es/index.php#3


Personally I would go with the bigger more industrial type but either will work.

I am going to buy my sensor switches today. What connections do I make to the sensor switch? Does it matter how the connections are made to the garage. I understand now how to connect them to control4, but not to the sensor or the garage. Could you please explain that for me? Sorry I am such a newb.
 
#25 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by dhendriksen /forum/post/0


I am going to buy my sensor switches today. What connections do I make to the sensor switch? Does it matter how the connections are made to the garage. I understand now how to connect them to control4, but not to the sensor or the garage. Could you please explain that for me? Sorry I am such a newb.

I am not sure exactly what connections you might be referring to. However, this is a cut & paste from an earlier post in this thread. This for the actual open/close sensor (magnetic).


"For the Magnetic Sensors for determining open/close, there are 3 potential connections 12V, SIG, GND: These don't require power, so just hook 1 wire From CAT5 that is hooked to Magnetic sensor to the Input "SIG", and the other wire should be connected to GND." Now connect the Cat5 that you connected to the Control4 to each wire on the magnetic sensor (should be 2 wires). You will mount 1 part of the sensor to the garage door itself and wired part will stay stationary. You mount these so that they can sense each other (determine whether contact is open or closed).


As far as the relay (controls actual opening/closing of the garage door) hook the wires as i have listed here.


"For the relay that goes to Garage Opener, there are 3 potential connections COM, NC, NO: Just attach one wire to the COM (common) terminal the the other to the Normally Open (NO) terminal. The relay switch will close when the relay is activated." I am not sure how you garage door(s) are labelled, but if you can figure out which wires the pushbutton go to (could be called "Com" & "Push Button), then just hook the COM that is connected to the C4 to the COM on the garage door and the "NO" on the C4 to the "Push Button".
 
#26 ·
That is what I needed. Thanks!
 
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