Official Samsung LNxxA650 Owner's Thread - Page 700 - AVS Forum
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post #20971 of 23507 Old 02-08-2009, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Desisuperman View Post

I just bought this tv and i'm loving it... except for ONE thing!

I was watching the movie 'The Strangers' Last night in a completely dark room. the movie itself is a very dark movie so i couldnt help to notice a clouding issue that was persistent throughout the movie (majority of the movie is shot in a dark scenery)

i get cloduing in the top left & top right hand corners and in the lower-middle part of the screen both on the left and right side.

Im running the lastest firmware and i mentioned before I just picked this tv up a week ago or so. Is this panel defected and should I call samsung?

Is this Normal?

How do I correct this ?

I'm sure others have experienced this as well so your sharing your experience will be greatly helpful

thanks

Is it "normal" well its normal for some who post in here about it. Since most people who use owner forums are here to discuss "problems" you will see a much higher percentage of posts about "problems" - (birds of a feather etc) than you will positive comments. Just remember in forums such as these you are not posting to "tech support", but to a bunch of novices interlaced with a handful of people who actually know what they are talking about, all offering advice or opinion.

This begs the question, are the "problems" being posted here TV related or source related (ie set top box, cabling, HDTV setup, poor service provider, cabling) etc? Or for that matter user related. Yes many of the audio and PQ issues posted in here by people blaming their TV are in fact source related or user related and not the TV. You also have in these forums people who are so anal that what starts out as a negligible issue that the average viewer would never notice, soon becomes fixated on and blown totally out of reality.

The number of people in here that continually return or exchange TV's only to find fault in their replacement is astounding. That speaks volumes about those people and not the product. That trend populates not just this owners' thread, but owner threads covering everything from soup to nuts. It is simply the nature of the beast.

Having said all that yes clouding and flashlighting is an issue on some LCD's. It is not unique to Samsung or to any particular brand or manufacturer. I have never had it on my set, nor have many other owners. I suggest you take the time to search this forum on the flashlight subject keeping in mind what I said with regards to some posting in here. You will find opinion and suggestion which may help.
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post #20972 of 23507 Old 02-08-2009, 11:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Desisuperman View Post

I just bought this tv and i'm loving it... except for ONE thing!

I was watching the movie 'The Strangers' Last night in a completely dark room. the movie itself is a very dark movie so i couldnt help to notice a clouding issue that was persistent throughout the movie (majority of the movie is shot in a dark scenery)

i get cloduing in the top left & top right hand corners and in the lower-middle part of the screen both on the left and right side.

Im running the lastest firmware and i mentioned before I just picked this tv up a week ago or so. Is this panel defected and should I call samsung?

Is this Normal?

How do I correct this ?

I'm sure others have experienced this as well so your sharing your experience will be greatly helpful

thanks

It sounds like this is a common LCD issue. I just bought a Vizio LCD and it has noticable clouding as well on ALL sources (games, cable, BR, DVD). I might try doing a swap to see if I can get a better set.

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post #20973 of 23507 Old 02-08-2009, 12:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mtnmike View Post

Is it "normal" well its normal for some who post in here about it. Since most people who use owner forums are here to discuss "problems" you will see a much higher percentage of posts about "problems" - (birds of a feather etc) than you will positive comments. Just remember in forums such as these you are not posting to "tech support", but to a bunch of novices interlaced with a handful of people who actually know what they are talking about, all offering advice or opinion.

This begs the question, are the "problems" being posted here TV related or source related (ie set top box, cabling, HDTV setup, poor service provider, cabling) etc? Or for that matter user related. Yes many of the audio and PQ issues posted in here by people blaiming their TV are in fact source related or user related and not the TV. You also have in these forums people who are so anal that what starts out as a negligible issue that the average viewer would never notice, soon becomes fixated on and blown totally out of reality.

The number of people in here that continually return or exchange TV's only to find fault in their replacement is astounding. That speaks volumes about those people and not the product. That trend populates not just this owners' thread, but owner threads covering everything from soup to nuts. It is simply the nature of the beast.

Having said all that yes clouding and flashlighting is an issue on some LCD's. It is not unique to Samsung or to any particular brand or manufacturer. I have never had it on my set, nor have many other owners. I suggest you take the time to search this forum on the flashlight subject keeping in mind what I said with regards to some posting in here. You will find opinion and suggestion which may help.

While I would agree with what you are saying for the most part, I think this clouding issue is a common thing with LCD's and I would guess a lot more people have this than we see reported. I would bet that a lot of the people who have the clouding simply dont notice it as it seems very obvious to me that dif people are more sensitive to this LCD artifact as compared to others. Example......I noticed the clouding right away when we got our new set a few weeks ago, but when bringing it up to my GF she had not noticed it at all and even after pointing it out to here she still does not see it when simply watching the set while at the same time it catches my eye. My whole point is that I bet a lot of people who claim to have no clouding might actualy have it, but are simply not sensitive to it and dont see it. It is very similar to how a lot of people are sensitve to rainbows, vertical banding, etc....while others are not and dont see it even though commonly it is there.

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post #20974 of 23507 Old 02-08-2009, 12:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Toe View Post

While I would agree with what you are saying for the most part, I think this clouding issue is a common thing with LCD's and I would guess a lot more people have this than we see reported. I would bet that a lot of the people who have the clouding simply dont notice it as it seems very obvious to me that dif people are more sensitive to this LCD artifact as compared to others. Example......I noticed the clouding right away when we got our new set a few weeks ago, but when bringing it up to my GF she had not noticed it at all and even after pointing it out to here she still does not see it when simply watching the set while at the same time it catches my eye. My whole point is that I bet a lot of people who claim to have no clouding might actualy have it, but are simply not sensitive to it and dont see it. It is very similar to how a lot of people are sensitve to rainbows, vertical banding, etc....while others are not and dont see it even though commonly it is there.

You may be right, but I am not one of those. I am well aware of what clouding/flashlighting look like, and that is not an issue on my set. However, it is present on my 22" LCD computer monitor. The only other Samsung 600 series I have had time to deal with is my son's which also does not have it. Anyway it is an issue with LCD's and has been for years. Some have it. Some don't. Some have it to a lesser degree than others. Many never notice it and many who do don't care. So in essence there really is no way of knowing what percentage of LCD's sold have this issue. A few unfortunates that have never heard of this or know what it is, come in here to see about tweaking, calibrating, or just out of curiousity. Then after reading about it and finding it on their LCD they are never happy again. Kind of funny because had they never heard of it til then, and began focusing on it, so their experience with the set which would have been great turns into something just the opposite. Quality LCD manufacturers strive to minimize or eliminate the problem, but one has yet to be produced where out of 100% of the sets manufactured a percentage won't have it to some degree. Just a consumer roll of the dice.

You bring up a good point that many consumers are totally satisified with being able to watch a great HDTV picture. And they make up the vast majority of Samsung 600 series owners. In here you have many of the others who frett and completely lose their enjoyment over issues many others never see or care about. But for them that will be true (for the most part) with any expensive product they buy. Perfection expected when there is no perfect HDTV regardless of price. Some have levels of expectations set unrealistically high, and as a result end up being very disappointed time and again. Somewhere somehow you can always find something to frett about that could be better. It just is what it is.
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post #20975 of 23507 Old 02-08-2009, 12:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mtnmike View Post

You may be right, but I am not one of those. I am well aware of what clouding/flashlighting look like, and that is not an issue on my set. However, it is present on my 22" LCD computer monitor. The only other Samsung 600 series I have had time to deal with is my son's which also does not have it. Anyway it is an issue with LCD's and has been for years. Some have it. Some don't. Some have it to a lesser degree than others. Many never notice it and many who do don't care. So in essence there really is no way of knowing what percentage of LCD's sold have this issue. A few unfortunates that have never heard of this or know what it is, come in here to see about tweaking, calibrating, or just out of curiousity. Then after reading about it and finding it on their LCD they are never happy again. Kind of funny because had they never heard of it til then, and began focusing on it, so their experience with the set which would have been great turns into something just the opposite.

Quality LCD manufacturers strive to minimize or eliminate the problem. You bring up a good point that many consumers are totally satisified with being able to watch a great HDTV picture. And they make up the vast majority of Samsung 600 series owners. In here you have many of the others who frett and completely lose their enjoyment over issues many others never see or care about. But for them that will be true (for the most part) with any expensive product they buy. Perfection expected when there is no perfect HDTV regardless of price. Some have levels of expectations set unrealistically high, and as a result end up being very disappointed time and again. Somewhere somehow you can always find something to frett about that could be better. It just is what it is.

Agreed and well said. I will say that on the set I have here which is actualy my GF's set, this issue does bother me enough that I would take it back, but it is not my set and since she is not bothered by it, it will probably stay. I am one picky SOB though! A big part of it for me is I dont have any big (big IMO) issue with my personal display which is an RS1 projector, so these things stick out for me unfortunately.

By the way, I live in Denver

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post #20976 of 23507 Old 02-08-2009, 12:46 PM
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Agreed and well said. I will say that on the set I have here which is actualy my GF's set, this issue does bother me enough that I would take it back, but it is not my set and since she is not bothered by it, it will probably stay. I am one picky SOB though! A big part of it for me is I dont have any big (big IMO) issue with my personal display which is an RS1 projector, so these things stick out for me unfortunately.

By the way, I live in Denver

Longmont here and my 55" Sony GWIV LCD (going on 5 years) is still a great set. I haven't had the "blue blob" issue on that one yet LOL. But I definetly love this Samsung. It is the epitome of improvements and quality for your money compared to the sets of just a few years ago.
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post #20977 of 23507 Old 02-08-2009, 02:13 PM
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If anyone didn't realize though is that when using dynamic contrast and/or black adjust or use dynamic mode with DNIe turned on the blacks get crushed. This hides away any flashlight or clouding the tv has even when the backlight is set very high.

Since I believe many love the wow factor of those features it could make sense why one would never notice.

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post #20978 of 23507 Old 02-08-2009, 03:14 PM
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i totally agree with you & understand where your coming from

I am going to try running my smasung bdp-2550 directly to the tv rather then having it run through my receiver and see if that's where the issue lies but i'm not counting on it.

I live in a dark bsmt with very little lighting so to me it's very noticable.

I'm just wondering if there's somebody here who had the a a similiar issue and was successful at resolving the issue. It could be an issue with the calibration/settings, a defect in the panel or perhaps a problem with the source. Was anybody successful speaking or dealing directly with samsung in order to get this issue resolved.

Here's something interesting that i found on cnet

http://forums.cnet.com/5208-13973_10...sageID=2951556

The clouding is almost identical to the one show in the picture posted on cnet

http://img61.imageshack.us/img61/7641/0000629gp1.jpg


Quote:
Originally Posted by Mtnmike View Post

You may be right, but I am not one of those. I am well aware of what clouding/flashlighting look like, and that is not an issue on my set. However, it is present on my 22" LCD computer monitor. The only other Samsung 600 series I have had time to deal with is my son's which also does not have it. Anyway it is an issue with LCD's and has been for years. Some have it. Some don't. Some have it to a lesser degree than others. Many never notice it and many who do don't care. So in essence there really is no way of knowing what percentage of LCD's sold have this issue. A few unfortunates that have never heard of this or know what it is, come in here to see about tweaking, calibrating, or just out of curiousity. Then after reading about it and finding it on their LCD they are never happy again. Kind of funny because had they never heard of it til then, and began focusing on it, so their experience with the set which would have been great turns into something just the opposite. Quality LCD manufacturers strive to minimize or eliminate the problem, but one has yet to be produced where out of 100% of the sets manufactured a percentage won't have it to some degree. Just a consumer roll of the dice.

You bring up a good point that many consumers are totally satisified with being able to watch a great HDTV picture. And they make up the vast majority of Samsung 600 series owners. In here you have many of the others who frett and completely lose their enjoyment over issues many others never see or care about. But for them that will be true (for the most part) with any expensive product they buy. Perfection expected when there is no perfect HDTV regardless of price. Some have levels of expectations set unrealistically high, and as a result end up being very disappointed time and again. Somewhere somehow you can always find something to frett about that could be better. It just is what it is.

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post #20979 of 23507 Old 02-08-2009, 04:03 PM
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Just got myLN40A650 from Amazon today. The carrier's (CEVA)warehouse was 15 miles away and I picked it up. It was shipped on Friday and arrived today. Everything was perfect. Plays great. I have to make adjustments to minimize the soap-opera effect (I'm sure due to the AMP).
No damage whatsover. Plays great. Would like to find some good calibration levels.
Updated the firmware to the latest 2007x. Crazy that 2007 is the latest firmware after a 2008xx.
Is there anyway to shut off the tune when you turn the set on/off.
And does this red light always stay on when the set is off?

I have not read the book yet, but I will tomorrow.

Thanks for your help.
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post #20980 of 23507 Old 02-08-2009, 04:23 PM
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I beleive you can remove the red light, and lowering AMP will remove that "Saop-opera" effect. as for the Tune yes in the menu you can remove it.
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post #20981 of 23507 Old 02-08-2009, 04:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dudley07726 View Post

Just got myLN40A650 from Amazon today. The carrier's (CEVA)warehouse was 15 miles away and I picked it up. It was shipped on Friday and arrived today. Everything was perfect. Plays great. I have to make adjustments to minimize the soap-opera effect (I'm sure due to the AMP).
No damage whatsover. Plays great. Would like to find some good calibration levels.
Updated the firmware to the latest 2007x. Crazy that 2007 is the latest firmware after a 2008xx.
Is there anyway to shut off the tune when you turn the set on/off.
And does this red light always stay on when the set is off?

I have not read the book yet, but I will tomorrow.

Thanks for your help.

er, 2008 is newer than 2007. for the tune, go into set up and external (or is it audio and then external) and turn it off. the red light does stay.
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post #20982 of 23507 Old 02-08-2009, 05:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Leetthal View Post

I beleive you can remove the red light, and lowering AMP will remove that "Saop-opera" effect. as for the Tune yes in the menu you can remove it.

Really? Can you tell us how then, other than unplugging?
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post #20983 of 23507 Old 02-08-2009, 07:33 PM
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Really? Can you tell us how then, other than unplugging?


Cover it with black tape?
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exactly
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post #20985 of 23507 Old 02-08-2009, 11:43 PM
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Originally Posted by HD_Hobbit View Post

Been enjoying my 46A650 for about a month now. Have a serious question about the sets capability to do a 5:5 pulldown of 24p material.

From all that I read the 120hz panel refresh will indeed make a smooth cinema-like viewing on 24p HD material if amp is turned off.

Most blu rays are 23.976 as are most MKV 1080p or 720p video files.

Does any one here have a Network Media Tanks like the Popcorn hour or Istar or IO box whatever connected by HDMI cable to a A650?

Have you played any 23.976 MKV files on it? Are they smooth on the A650?
Sets like the PCH have a 23.976 output setting - so is that the setting you use to insure smoothness?

Looking for ways to eliminate the customary 3:2 pulldown judder that happens when 24 converts to 60.

TIA

Wait, 24fps footage playsback jaggy on this set? Because I was going to buy the 32A650 specifically for connecting my computer to it and watching 23.98 fps .mkv files
and the 32" version only does 60fps, so I couldn't get the 120 :S

edit//

Also I keep hearing about an 'AMP' problem, what's that? The AMP for audio inside the set?
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post #20986 of 23507 Old 02-09-2009, 05:19 AM
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[quote=Test123455;15772085]er, 2008 is newer than 2007. for the tune, go into set up and external (or is it audio and then external) and turn it off. the red light does stay.[/QUOTe

Do you have a link for a 2008 firmware update?

I have not seen that anywhere.

thanks
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post #20987 of 23507 Old 02-09-2009, 06:00 AM
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er, 2008 is newer than 2007. for the tune, go into set up and external (or is it audio and then external) and turn it off. the red light does stay.

2008-10-20 IS THE CREATION DATE OF NEW FIRMWARE 2007
AS STATED ON sAMSUNG SITE
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post #20988 of 23507 Old 02-09-2009, 06:20 AM
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Hi,

New owner of a LN52A650. I'm using the TV turner for watching DTV and I was wondering. How come I can't use the "Just Scan" picture size when the DTV channel is 720p? It only give me that option when the channel is broadcasting in 1080i.

Thanks.
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post #20989 of 23507 Old 02-09-2009, 06:42 AM
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Just wondered if any other info out there?
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post #20990 of 23507 Old 02-09-2009, 06:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sdswaney View Post

Hi
I've had my LN40A650 for about 7 months now (I love it). I was cleaning it yesterday and noticed that the red bezel was coming loose from the tv housing on both upper corners (actually the middle is fine but the corners look a little warped). I cleaned the tv maybe a month ago didn't notice any problem. The TV has not been moved or otherwise abused. I just wondered if anyone else has had this problem? And does anyone have any suggestions or comments?
Has anyone removed the bezel for any reason? How is it attached to the housing? etc. etc. Any suggestions?
Thanks

Sorry about the post above. I was just wondering if any other info about the "bezel coming loose" out there?
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post #20991 of 23507 Old 02-09-2009, 07:31 AM
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Hi folks. I'm returning a defective A630 and I'm pretty sure I'm going to go with the A650 as a replacement. There's a huge controversy among A630 owners (and perhaps other Samsung models) about different sets within that same model having LCD panels from different manufacturers, as indicated by a letter code on the back of the set. "S" panels are supposedly superior, coming directly from Samsung, while A and C panels are supposedly inferior, coming from other manufacturers.

Before buying a 52A650 from an online retailer that does not allow returns, I want to make sure that this issue does not affect the 650 model. From what I've read here, it appears that all A650s use S panels and I can't recall reading about folks reporting panels that differ significantly from the sets they saw in stores when it comes to off-angle viewing, color saturation, black levels, clouding, flashlighting, etc. Could anyone familiar with the outsourced panel issue please comment as to whether it affects the A650? Thanks.
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post #20992 of 23507 Old 02-09-2009, 07:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NashGuy View Post

Hi folks. I'm returning a defective A630 and I'm pretty sure I'm going to go with the A650 as a replacement. There's a huge controversy among A630 owners (and perhaps other Samsung models) about different sets within that same model having LCD panels from different manufacturers, as indicated by a letter code on the back of the set. "S" panels are supposedly superior, coming directly from Samsung, while A and C panels are supposedly inferior, coming from other manufacturers.

Before buying a 52A650 from an online retailer that does not allow returns, I want to make sure that this issue does not affect the 650 model. From what I've read here, it appears that all A650s use S panels and I can't recall reading about folks reporting panels that differ significantly from the sets they saw in stores when it comes to off-angle viewing, color saturation, black levels, clouding, flashlighting, etc. Could anyone familiar with the outsourced panel issue please comment as to whether it affects the A650? Thanks.

I think nearly all of recently purchased sets have been S panels?
I'm not sure I would purchase any LCD from an online vendor that does not accept returns. There are many sites that offer very competitive prices AND accept returns.
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post #20993 of 23507 Old 02-09-2009, 07:41 AM
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[quote=dudley07726;15775004]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Test123455 View Post

er, 2008 is newer than 2007. for the tune, go into set up and external (or is it audio and then external) and turn it off. the red light does stay.[/QUOTe

Do you have a link for a 2008 firmware update?

I have not seen that anywhere.

thanks

As discussed 3 times on that last 5 or so pages.

New TV's are shipping with 2008.9 FW but the latest made available by Samsung for download is 2007. Samsung support has mentioned that 2008.9 will likely be made available but has just not been posted yet. But that has been a couple months... so who knows...

Edit: BTW the 2008.9 and 2007.0 has nothing to do with the calendar date. It just happens that, after the numerous FW updates over the past year, they are in the same range as the calendar dates.
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post #20994 of 23507 Old 02-09-2009, 07:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by itachi183 View Post

Wait, 24fps footage playsback jaggy on this set? Because I was going to buy the 32A650 specifically for connecting my computer to it and watching 23.98 fps .mkv files
and the 32" version only does 60fps, so I couldn't get the 120 :S

edit//

Also I keep hearing about an 'AMP' problem, what's that? The AMP for audio inside the set?

AMP refers to Auto Motion Plus. If you need more info, grab your manual, read this thread, read any product literature on the 650, Google it or something...
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post #20995 of 23507 Old 02-09-2009, 08:07 AM
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Originally Posted by gmanvbva View Post

I think nearly all of recently purchased sets have been S panels?
I'm not sure I would purchase any LCD from an online vendor that does not accept returns. There are many sites that offer very competitive prices AND accept returns.

Good to hear, thanks. And as far as returns, very few sites will accept returns. (Amazon is one.) Most retailers you find listed on the major price comparison sites do not accept returns on large TVs; their return policies state that you must go to the manufacturer for service under the warranty.
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post #20996 of 23507 Old 02-09-2009, 10:17 AM
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Good to hear, thanks. And as far as returns, very few sites will accept returns. (Amazon is one.) Most retailers you find listed on the major price comparison sites do not accept returns on large TVs; their return policies state that you must go to the manufacturer for service under the warranty.

I believe both J&R and Fry's offer returns/exchanges on Large LCD's if the unit is defective.
I'm not sure if they will argue the semantics of "defective". I'm sure would both try to get you to place a service call (with Samsung) instead of returning it or exchanging it but their policy states they accept them.
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post #20997 of 23507 Old 02-09-2009, 10:20 AM
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Originally Posted by HD_Hobbit View Post

Been enjoying my 46A650 for about a month now. Have a serious question about the sets capability to do a 5:5 pulldown of 24p material.

...

Looking for ways to eliminate the customary 3:2 pulldown judder that happens when 24 converts to 60.

TIA

Wait, 24fps footage playsback jaggy on this set? Because I was going to buy the 32A650 specifically for connecting my computer to it and watching 23.98 fps .mkv files
and the 32" version only does 60fps, so I couldn't get the 120 :S

...

I'm not sure, but I think that HD_Hobbit was indicating that he was asking a serious, i.e., important, question, whether 24fps appeared different from 3:2 pulldown, not that he was seriously questioning, i.e., skeptical, whether 24fps worked. But I may be wrong.

In my viewing of blurays, 24fps appears noticeably smoother than the 3:2 pulldown we are used to seeing on regular DVD players. As well, 24fps of upscaled DVDs appears smoother, but with the Panasonic BD35, for standard DVDs you have to enable 24fps each time you start them, unlike blu-ray where it can be on all the time.
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post #20998 of 23507 Old 02-09-2009, 10:59 AM
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We are new 52" owners. We love it! My wife said she would get used to how big it is. She already has! It has a little clouding in a couple of corners, but we only notice it in dark room and scene conditions.
When I registered, Samsung said the manufacture date was 1/31/09, but... I brought it home before that on 1/28/09!
LOL

FW 2008.9
SQ02
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post #20999 of 23507 Old 02-09-2009, 11:13 AM
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does anyone have this tv with this panel ?
Is the 540 newer that the 550 or 650 ? A guy at stereo advantage told me the 630 is a newer tv than the 650, does anyone know if this is true ?
What is the story about being like winning the lottery if you get a SQ01 panel ?

I seen a LN52A640 tv today and it says on the side sticker SQ01 panel, is this panel that much better than any other s panel such as the SS04 ?

I would appreciate any info anyone can give me.
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post #21000 of 23507 Old 02-09-2009, 01:04 PM
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does anyone have this tv with this panel ?
Is the 540 newer that the 550 or 650 ? A guy at stereo advantage told me the 630 is a newer tv than the 650, does anyone know if this is true ?
What is the story about being like winning the lottery if you get a SQ01 panel ?

I seen a LN52A640 tv today and it says on the side sticker SQ01 panel, is this panel that much better than any other s panel suck the SS04 ?

I would appreciate any info anyone can give me.

I don't know anything about the 540 since I was never interested in the 5 series but, yes, the 630 is newer than the 650. While the 650 has a full gloss screen with 50,000:1 dynamic contrast, 4 HDMI inputs, and InfoLink, the 630 has a semi-gloss screen with 40,000:1 dynamic contrast, 3 HDMI inputs, and does not have InfoLink. The 630 is for people who want a less reflective screen; the trade-off is that colors aren't quite as rich, blacks aren't as deep, and contrast is a bit lower.
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