Input lag wars!, post your input lag results of your LCD display here for reference - Page 14 - AVS Forum
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post #391 of 4228 Old 03-05-2010, 08:25 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AABBCCAA View Post

Controller lag is not the same as processing lag, even a good PC will need at least 2 frames to react to user input and change the stuff on screen accordingly (unless the game is rather simple). Add 1 frame to that if the picture is refreshing 60 times per second, double that if the game is running at 30fps. The good news is that developers can, contrary to input lag from flatscreens and input devices, account for this type of lag and design their games around it.

But its not like our brains are lag free...




Take a look at the first post in this thread.

yeah i've seen that before and know about human RT but once again just like everything else having a laggy display just adds a constant delay to everything you do

one thing in particular that i've found to be impossible to adapt to when using a laggy display is leading moving targets in a game

I still love to play Battlefield 1942 and fly the old school airplanes in that game, to be a good pilot you need to be able to lead a target in front of you so that your stream of bullets hits his engine and he goes down.

playing this game on my Sony 32XBR6 with 2-3 frames of input lag it was impossible to do this and i could only shoot down another plane if it was in front of me and never turned, rarely happens

on my PC monitor and my Panny 37S1 both having 1 frame of lag at most, its no problem i shoot em down like i was on a CRT playing the game

If you're a gamer or interested in using an LCD TV as a primary monitor take a look at my thread on Input Lag
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post #392 of 4228 Old 03-05-2010, 09:15 AM
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I'm not trying to say that the human brain is to slow to notice display related input lag, I had my fair share of sh!tty HDTVs and i know that it can basically ruin the experience.

The Panasonic S1 LCD seems to be the perfect TV for PC gaming, but the lack of picture controls make it less than great for console gaming. I owned a Panasonic 42C10 Plasma for about 2 Weeks and could never get the picture right, it was either to dark or washed out.
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post #393 of 4228 Old 03-05-2010, 09:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frito View Post

from best to worst
Lag figures are normal then game mode results
Sharp 46 LE700 80 ms 5 ms
Panasonic TX-P46G10 5 ms 5 ms (plasma)
Panasonic TX-L32V10E 5 ms 5 ms (32/37 S1/G1 equivalent)
LG 47SL8000 30 ms 10 ms
Sharp LC46D65E 10 ms 10 ms
Samsung LE52A558P3 40 ms 10 ms (A550??)
Samsung PS50B850 80 ms 10 ms (plasma)
Samsung LE40A856 40 ms 20 ms (A850??)
Samsung PS63B680 90 ms 20 ms (plasma)
Panasonic TX-42V10E 20 ms 20 ms (plasma)
Sharp LC 42DH77E 40 ms 20 ms
Sharp 46 LE600 20 ms 20 ms
Sharp 40 LE600 20 ms 20 ms
Sharp 40 LE700 20 ms 20 ms
Toshiba 40LV685 50 ms 20 ms
Toshiba 37RV635DR 30 ms 20 ms


Dang, from your post above, it seems that I should have gotten the Sharp 46 LE700, but I Just put in an order for a Sony Aquos LC46E77U yesterday!

How does that model compare to that list?

Buyer's remorse...
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post #394 of 4228 Old 03-05-2010, 10:17 AM - Thread Starter
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Those are european models and I think the DH77E on that list is the euro eqiv. but i'm not sure

edit: corrected model name i put E77U at first

If you're a gamer or interested in using an LCD TV as a primary monitor take a look at my thread on Input Lag
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post #395 of 4228 Old 03-05-2010, 01:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frito View Post

I highly recommend Panasonic 32/37" 1080p LCD's

I currently use a 37" S1 as a monitor for my PC, others on here are using 32S1's

Looking for a 42-47''. have had a Westy VK42F240S for 1.5 years- still going strong but a few dead pixels (mostly noticeable on white). boring screen compared to my friends a750 (but he mostly watches tv).Will keep an eye on this thread for more 2010 models. Maybe upgrade this holiday season.
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post #396 of 4228 Old 03-05-2010, 02:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frito View Post

My Panny 37S1 has motion focus

it does work to reduce motion blur but not by a whole lot. its pretty easy to tell on moving tickers on news channels if you switch it on and off

the only drawback to it is visible flickering at 60hz with bright or white images and at night its more noticeable, it does not impact input lag in any way and may actually improve the readings on input lag tests slightly

I leave it on all the time on my Cable box input but it stays off on my PC input for obvious reasons, no thanks to CRT flicker on my PC hehe

Curious, why did you opt to go for the S1 model vs the G1 with Motion Picture Pro 3? Was it the $150 difference in price or did you think the MPP 3 didn't offer a better enough picture to bother with?

Can you tell me how much worse fast motion scenes/sports look without Motion Focus on? I'm thinking on a 32" it shouldn't be as noticeable, but I'd like to know how noticeable you think it is on your 37".
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post #397 of 4228 Old 03-05-2010, 03:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hi Def Fan View Post

Curious, why did you opt to go for the S1 model vs the G1 with Motion Picture Pro 3? Was it the $150 difference in price or did you think the MPP 3 didn't offer a better enough picture to bother with?

Can you tell me how much worse fast motion scenes/sports look without Motion Focus on? I'm thinking on a 32" it shouldn't be as noticeable, but I'd like to know how noticeable you think it is on your 37".

I did not get a G1 for a few reasons, no store locally carried it, i heard mixed reviews on how well MPP 3 worked and there was a chance that it being 120hz may have damaged its low input lag and i'm not willing to buy a TV online and have to go through the hassle of shipping it back if i did not like it, the 37S1 was a safe bet because it had been tested for low lag, i've seen it in sears locally and could buy it in sears locally for a very cheap price new and thats what i did (paid 625 out the door with tax!)

Motion focus does make small improvement in motion resolution but its still and LCD and motion is not as good as say a plasma or a CRT TV.

that being said there is no noticeable severe blurring or smearing on these TV's like some LCD TV's can have and overall it performs as good as any 60hz LCD i've seen or owned and i got no complaints even though i do prefer watching things on a plasma now that i own one mainly due to the motion

If you're a gamer or interested in using an LCD TV as a primary monitor take a look at my thread on Input Lag
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post #398 of 4228 Old 03-05-2010, 04:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frito View Post

I did not get a G1 for a few reasons...

OK, thanks frito, I saw a L37G1 at a local store and I was impressed with MPP3. I'm pretty sure you can turn it off though so I don't see why it would cause any more input lag for gaming with it off. I only want the motion processing for movies, sports, etc.

I'm considering the possibility of a 37". The info I've read says a 6' viewing distance is doable. That's about the farthest I can sit for gaming with my current setup of desk at one end of my living room with the display on a 30" or so stand behind the desk. Of course for movies & TV I'd just roll my chair back.

Can you tell me what your eye to screen distance is with your 37" whilst gaming? I can get the L37G1 right now for $720 with free shipping. My neighbor uses a 32" TV for gaming from about 10' across his living room and it looks too far for me on that size. I was trying to estimate based on his set and it looks like I'd be more comfortable at about 5' for gaming, so I think 6' for a 37" is not unreasonable.
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post #399 of 4228 Old 03-05-2010, 05:24 PM - Thread Starter
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there is a possibility that having 120hz on the TV alone may increase input lag even when MPP 3 is turned off, it really depends on how Panasonic implemented the feature so IMO its a gamble, if your buying locally and you know you can return it no questions asked in case it is laggy even with MMP 3 off then go for it by all means i'd love to get some lag test results on a 120hz panny so we have an idea of if the new '10 models with MPP 4 are likely to add lag or not

as for gaming on my 37" as i use it as my PC monitor all my gaming is done on the PC and i'm about 2-3 feet away from the screen

6 feet is about the distance i view it from when on/in bed and its about normal sized at 6 feet, i dont think you'll have any problems and it will be much better than playing games on a 32" from 10 feet away

we have a 50" plasma in the living room and we play xb360 and wii games on it from 10 feet away and its good size for that distance, at 6 feet away from a 37-40" is pretty close to the same visual size as 10 feet away from a 50"

If you're a gamer or interested in using an LCD TV as a primary monitor take a look at my thread on Input Lag
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post #400 of 4228 Old 03-05-2010, 06:52 PM
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I have just been reading about how developers are adding motion blur to hide the limitations of game engines. They reduce texture size and add motion blur while turning in a game. This keeps frame rate up, at the added cost of having everything appear blurred while turning in a game.

I did a little more research on the games I play, and it appears Fable 2, Uncharted 1&2, and some others have this artificial motion blur. This is what I am seeing on my Toshiba 52XV645U. So I think the pixel response is not the problem with this TV. It's the darn games with added motion blur. On larger TV's like 52"+, this type of motion blur becomes more apparent.
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post #401 of 4228 Old 03-05-2010, 07:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Yeah that has been a growing trend in FPS games, what sucks is unlike PC games that have that you cannot shut it off in the console games

yet another reason why PC FPS games are superior IMO

If you're a gamer or interested in using an LCD TV as a primary monitor take a look at my thread on Input Lag
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post #402 of 4228 Old 03-05-2010, 10:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sharky974 View Post

Interesting article on game input lag, along with some figures for some games

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/di...article?page=1

BioShock 2 Frame-rate Locked 133-150ms
BioShock 2 Frame-rate Unlocked 100-150ms
Call of Duty: World at War 66ms-100ms
Dante's Inferno 100ms
Killzone 2 150-183ms
LittleBigPlanet 100ms
Mirror's Edge 133ms
MotorStorm: Pacific Rift 116ms-133ms
Resident Evil 5 100-150ms
Ridge Racer 7 66ms
Street Fighter IV 66ms
Unreal Tournament III 100-133ms
WipEout HD 84ms

That's not counting display lag, I'm pretty sure, although the article does not greatly assure me they pegged their display lag out in the first place.

Seems the difference from one game to the next can be greater than from one Tv to the next.

ok read the article all the way through, all they seem to prove is that a properly made game will respond quickly and the response time is directly linked to frame rate, that would explain why older simpler PC games like Quake 1,2,3,4 Half-life, CS, source engine based games like CSS HL2 TF2 and L4D1,2 on PC's have less of a problem with this because the PC they run on are much more powerful and without even using SLI you can achieve frame rates much higher than 60fps therefore lowering a games built in input lag.

this also explains why guys like me who play PC FPS games never play with V-sync on because it does hurt game play to have it on, we want to see frame rates well over 100 or we're not happy

Lag is nothing new though with any FPS game and there are acceptable limits, internet lag in very old simple games like Quake and Q3 directly impact your performance and the lower your internet lag is the better of a player your able to be, if you got a 100 ping and the guy your fighting has a 40 ping, your are an extreme disadvantage, at least on the console games i suppose the game lag is locked for all players equally for the most part so its irrelevant as long as its within acceptable ranges of under 100ms preferably around 60ms. in my 14 years of experience playing PC FPS games i've come to notice a few things

a ping 60 or below is hard to notice while playing the game online, 60-100 is noticeable but adaptable with some time about 5-10 minutes of playing your brain can adjust to the delay. 100-140 it becomes unplayable and anything beyond that is unplayable pretty much online.

lag figures that high of course are non existent these days, even playing on servers overseas only results in a ping in the low 100's and playing on any domestic server will get you anywhere from 20ms for a pretty local server to 60-80ms for one on the other side of the USA. only in the day's of dial up did you have pings in the 200+ area and ISDN lines improved the ping to about 100-180ms range and yes i used to have an ISDN line back in the day!

there is another thing though that i've noticed, games based on John Carmack's coded engines are always ultra responsive, Source engine is also ultra responsive and has been built off of his quake engine.

any other FPS game that has came out based on entirely different engines never perform the same and always take time to adapt to how they "feel" when your used to playing quake etc.

Battlefield series games that i love to play actually have some of the worst engines I've ever used but you can get used to its quirkiness as well given time and become a great player in those games.

what you cannot get used to however is shooting at moving targets that are not there because your display has 45+ ms input lag, objects and targets can move so fast in an FPS game that by the time that delayed frame reaches your eyes the person is literally gone and although you always have to lead moving targets in shooters it becomes increasingly more difficult to predict how much father to lead a moving target when your display is delaying the image on screen by more than 30ms

generally speaking having used a TV with my PC that had 45ms input lag (the sony) you can adapt to it and play games fine but your performance in the game goes up quite dramatically once your playing it on a display with less than 30ms input lag

anyways a bunch of rambling here on my part. hehe

oh and input lag results to be posted soon for our Panny 50X1 plasma.

its got a little bit over 30ms input lag at 1280 x 720, its 1368 x 768 native but unfortunately my CRT monitor did not want to play nice with that resolution so i will deduct 10ms for image scaling and call it 20ms input lag most likely and in line with what I've seen reported on other similar panny plasma's

If you're a gamer or interested in using an LCD TV as a primary monitor take a look at my thread on Input Lag
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post #403 of 4228 Old 03-06-2010, 01:16 AM - Thread Starter
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Panasonic 50X1 720p Plasma

1280 x 720 (TV is 1366 x 768 native, it will display this resolution over HDMI but unfortunately my CRT monitor would not display it so i had to use the lower resolution)

35ms input lag, actual input lag could be lower at the panel's native resolution but as most 720p video games will be outputting 1280 x 720 it does not really matter

as usual with Panasonic TV's they do not reduce lag in game mode, it is simply another picture mode on the TV


If you're a gamer or interested in using an LCD TV as a primary monitor take a look at my thread on Input Lag
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post #404 of 4228 Old 03-06-2010, 08:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frito View Post

35ms input lag, actual input lag could be lower at the panel's native resolution but as most 720p video games will be outputting 1280 x 720 it does not really matter

It looks lower than 35ms to me. The CRT is at about 00.514. I can see 00.486 on the bottom row of the X1, so your max input lag is 28ms. The X1 may be about to update the top number, so it's possibly lower.

I can also see that the faint numbers are all at nearly the same brightness, while on LCDs they tend to fade from fully on to fully off as you get to the highest value. I don't see how this can be accounted for by the faster pixel response time alone. Perhaps plasmas don't update top to bottom like LCDs?

SMTT is accurate enough that I'm starting to wonder if input lag and pixel lag need to be considered separately, totalling up to "display lag."

Anyway, it's nice to see that the X1 plasma falls into at least the "not bad" category.
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post #405 of 4228 Old 03-06-2010, 10:55 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by wondras View Post

It looks lower than 35ms to me. The CRT is at about 00.514. I can see 00.486 on the bottom row of the X1, so your max input lag is 28ms. The X1 may be about to update the top number, so it's possibly lower.

I can also see that the faint numbers are all at nearly the same brightness, while on LCDs they tend to fade from fully on to fully off as you get to the highest value. I don't see how this can be accounted for by the faster pixel response time alone. Perhaps plasmas don't update top to bottom like LCDs?

SMTT is accurate enough that I'm starting to wonder if input lag and pixel lag need to be considered separately, totalling up to "display lag."

Anyway, it's nice to see that the X1 plasma falls into at least the "not bad" category.

Yeah it was difficult to test our X1 properly because its mounted on the wall above a fireplace, that CRT monitor was sitting on top of a floor standing loudspeaker just to get it close to the plasma's height

if i could have got the monitor closer to the TV i could have made the numbers smaller so we could have more results on each shot making it more consistent but unfortunately at the distance i had to take pictures from i had to make the numbers bigger so it would be more readable

also I don't really feel like dragging my 130lb computer back out into the living room again but i totally forgot that i should have used a black background with blue letters because of the phosphor decay rate on the blue phosphors being many times faster than red or green (i think thats right someone correct me if i'm wrong i'd have too look it up

oh yeah and plasma does not update pixels from top to bottom like LCD and CRT does

i used the frame timer program and you can see the difference

If you're a gamer or interested in using an LCD TV as a primary monitor take a look at my thread on Input Lag
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post #406 of 4228 Old 03-06-2010, 10:59 AM - Thread Starter
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heres my 37S1 vs CRT



heres the plasma vs the same CRT



as you can see plasma updates 1 sub field at a time (that's the yellow and then blue colors its either that or its a result of the blue phosphors being 1000x faster than the red and green ones that's actually probably more likely) and at least with a shutter speed of 1/60 the whole entire frame has already been displayed in that short time frame, on a CRT you can see the phosphor decay trail and on the LCD you can see the pixel rise and fall times both happening within 1 frame

If you're a gamer or interested in using an LCD TV as a primary monitor take a look at my thread on Input Lag
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post #407 of 4228 Old 03-06-2010, 11:45 AM
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I generally find it hard with the scrolling bar tests to figure out exactly what's going on. I think it's because at least one screen isn't vsynced, and/or there is a delay between the two video card outputs.

In your L37S1 pic, it looks like the S1 has just finished drawing the first bar. The CRT beam is at the top of the screen in the second position, but about a third of that bar has already been drawn below, because the bar position shifted mid-frame. Does it mean the S1 is about a third of a frame behind the CRT? That doesn't seem right, though it would be great if it is.

With SMTT, you can just look for the highest number on each screen. I've done some preliminary tests with it, and so far the results seem very consistent. I hope to have something definitive to share soon...
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post #408 of 4228 Old 03-06-2010, 12:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wondras View Post

I generally find it hard with the scrolling bar tests to figure out exactly what's going on. I think it's because at least one screen isn't vsynced, and/or there is a delay between the two video card outputs.

In your L37S1 pic, it looks like the S1 has just finished drawing the first bar. The CRT beam is at the top of the screen in the second position, but about a third of that bar has already been drawn below, because the bar position shifted mid-frame. Does it mean the S1 is about a third of a frame behind the CRT? That doesn't seem right, though it would be great if it is.

With SMTT, you can just look for the highest number on each screen. I've done some preliminary tests with it, and so far the results seem very consistent. I hope to have something definitive to share soon...

I agree completely SMTT is the most accurate program to use.

the timer bar is neat to use though but it only works if you can get a shutter speed of at least 1/60

both programs disable V-Sync, its much more noticeable to see this effect in the the scroller test on the CRT monitor because there is a horizontal tear that moves from top to bottom of the screen constantly

I think what makes SMTT more accurate is that it uses DirectX vs Java for the scroller test and i know at least that SMTT runs at super high framerates and according to the makers of the program its key that you get framerates over 1000 to get accurate numbers

If you're a gamer or interested in using an LCD TV as a primary monitor take a look at my thread on Input Lag
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post #409 of 4228 Old 03-06-2010, 03:56 PM
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So frito whats the input lag on your L37S1 I am curious because it would be similar if not the same as my L32S1 (which am very happy with)

Its great from Xbox 360 gaming. And I can tell I can feel a huge difference from an MVA Samsung 32.

Are the Panasonic LCD's still good 1 frame or less lag?
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post #410 of 4228 Old 03-06-2010, 05:06 PM
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So do you need a camera with fast shutter speed to use SMTT or can you get fairly accurate measurements without one? When you said you can just look at the highest number I assume you mean no camera needed? I have a Dell P1230 CRT monitor to compare to so that's probably what I'll use.
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post #411 of 4228 Old 03-06-2010, 06:03 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hi Def Fan View Post

So do you need a camera with fast shutter speed to use SMTT or can you get fairly accurate measurements without one? When you said you can just look at the highest number I assume you mean no camera needed? I have a Dell P1230 CRT monitor to compare to so that's probably what I'll use.

you need a camera that will do 1/60 shutter speed, if your using a CRT as a control and your camera has automatic shutter speed just stick the CRT screen in the cameras full field of view and it will focus and adjust to 1/60 automatically and then move the camera while still half pressing the snap button so it hold the 1/60 setting and then take your photo when both screen edges are in view

If you're a gamer or interested in using an LCD TV as a primary monitor take a look at my thread on Input Lag
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post #412 of 4228 Old 03-06-2010, 06:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ice Cold View Post

So frito whats the input lag on your L37S1 I am curious because it would be similar if not the same as my L32S1 (which am very happy with)

Its great from Xbox 360 gaming. And I can tell I can feel a huge difference from an MVA Samsung 32.

Are the Panasonic LCD's still good 1 frame or less lag?

input lag is about 10ms if you adjust for pixel lag it ends up closer to 20ms

If you're a gamer or interested in using an LCD TV as a primary monitor take a look at my thread on Input Lag
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post #413 of 4228 Old 03-06-2010, 07:11 PM
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Originally Posted by frito View Post

both programs disable V-Sync, its much more noticeable to see this effect in the the scroller test on the CRT monitor because there is a horizontal tear that moves from top to bottom of the screen constantly

I think what makes SMTT more accurate is that it uses DirectX vs Java for the scroller test and i know at least that SMTT runs at super high framerates and according to the makers of the program its key that you get framerates over 1000 to get accurate numbers

My timer is V-Synced, and uses OpenGL. If both displays don't have exactly the same refresh rates, the video card has to choose a display to sync to. I take photos right when the tear is at the edge of the screen so it isn't noticeable. I'd like to see a combination of the two systems. (the timers in SMTT moving over a column every 16.7ms).

Interesting how the plasma doesn't scroll the image like CRT and LCD. Do you notice the Blue/yellow when watching video on your plasma? My grandmother has a ~5 year old 42" SD Panasonic Viera Plasma, and I notice the blue/yellow a lot as I move my eyes around. It also has a bit more flicker than an LCD. Is that what the 600hz thing is supposed to fix? It is usually run in 4:3 mode, and I don't notice any burn-in or IR when switching to 16:9.
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post #414 of 4228 Old 03-06-2010, 07:39 PM
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Thought I'd chime in with my own results. Monitor is a NEC MultiSync 3215 and it's being run at 1440 x 900 with a 50' VGA cable from a VGA splitter alongside my Samsung 942BW 19" computer monitor.

Sorry about the odd angles. They're placed perpendicular alongside each other and it's hard to get both in one shot.





Here's another interesting shot. The computer monitor on the left is being run through the NEC's VGA loop with a combined cable length of 100", while the monitor on the right is being run directly from the splitter via a 15" cable.

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post #415 of 4228 Old 03-06-2010, 07:59 PM - Thread Starter
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My timer is V-Synced, and uses OpenGL. If both displays don't have exactly the same refresh rates, the video card has to choose a display to sync to. I take photos right when the tear is at the edge of the screen so it isn't noticeable. I'd like to see a combination of the two systems. (the timers in SMTT moving over a column every 16.7ms).

Interesting how the plasma doesn't scroll the image like CRT and LCD. Do you notice the Blue/yellow when watching video on your plasma? My grandmother has a ~5 year old 42" SD Panasonic Viera Plasma, and I notice the blue/yellow a lot as I move my eyes around. It also has a bit more flicker than an LCD. Is that what the 600hz thing is supposed to fix? It is usually run in 4:3 mode, and I don't notice any burn-in or IR when switching to 16:9.

right on, i assumed your program was java based because it does use java i had to install the run times to get it to work on my PC

as for the yellow/blue on the plasma, no not really if you turn you head when a white object is on screen you can see the yellow slightly in your peripheral vision but as for normal viewing never seen it, flicker is visible if you put up an all white screen however but that is normal for plasma and its no where near as bad as 60hz CRT flicker on the eyes

i still wonder though why i always get that horizontal tear on your program on both my CRT and my LCD monitor, every test i do is at 60hz on both displays, my LCD monitor shows that as well as my CRT monitor and i've switched outputs but it always happens

If you're a gamer or interested in using an LCD TV as a primary monitor take a look at my thread on Input Lag
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post #416 of 4228 Old 03-06-2010, 09:04 PM
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input lag is about 10ms if you adjust for pixel lag it ends up closer to 20ms

Thats still with in that 0-1 frame behind, I am still landing Street Fighter combos. that would not be possible if it was more than 1 frame behind so I am happy.


I have it set to Energy Saving mode because it makes the Blacks a little better.

And I even use Motion Flow during gaming I guess the scanning backlight can't hurt, I really don't notice and Pulsing. And I swear it helps.

Over all really happy, I even found the sweet spot that the IPS panel provide very wide but you have to be horizontally level no angle up or down.

Even the Black levels are, good once things get calibrated a bit.

But hey as long and its good for Gaming and can do 1920x1080 HDMI for PC thats plenty.

As far as x.v. Deep Color I really don't know how to properly set it. I just set it to AUTO and my 360 HDMI Color Space to Auto.
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post #417 of 4228 Old 03-06-2010, 09:09 PM - Thread Starter
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nothing out there today really uses x.v color yet

the motionfocus setting adds no input lag because its just a scanning backlight, it does nothing to the video signal and will help with reducing the sample and hold blur LCD's produce to the human eye so yeah go ahead and use it

If you're a gamer or interested in using an LCD TV as a primary monitor take a look at my thread on Input Lag
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nothing out there today really uses x.v color yet

the motionfocus setting adds no input lag because its just a scanning backlight, it does nothing to the video signal and will help with reducing the sample and hold blur LCD's produce to the human eye so yeah go ahead and use it


On a side note frito, I am glad to have scored the L32S1 for $389 from Amazon no tax free ship because, Its now $470 and $499 from some sellers, SEARS which I buy from and I am supporter of buying at SEARS poor guys are selling it for $599 and advertize it as having 120hz so does Panasonic but at least the Panasonic pdf clear the confusion up.

I would be pissed if I bought a L32S1 at SEARS for $599 thinking it had 120hz when it does not. Not sure why Panasonic has not corrected their website.
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post #419 of 4228 Old 03-06-2010, 09:46 PM - Thread Starter
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On a side note frito, I am glad to have scored the L32S1 for $389 from Amazon no tax free ship because, Its now $470 and $499 from some sellers, SEARS which I buy from and I am supporter of buying at SEARS poor guys are selling it for $599 and advertize it as having 120hz so does Panasonic but at least the Panasonic pdf clear the confusion up.

I would be pissed if I bought a L32S1 at SEARS for $599 thinking it had 120hz when it does not. Not sure why Panasonic has not corrected their website.

really, none of my local sears stores carry the 32S1, i bought my 37S1 at a local sears for 625 out the door via their website and picked it up locally, being that i'm in California a 26 dollar recycle fee should have been added to the bill but never was thanks to the sears websites error i guess

If you're a gamer or interested in using an LCD TV as a primary monitor take a look at my thread on Input Lag
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post #420 of 4228 Old 03-07-2010, 09:24 AM
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Are 1080p tv's more laggy then their 720p counterparts?
Example 32" lg-lh20 vs 32" lg-lh30. If your playing an xbox360 game thats 720p will there be more lag on the lh30 set due to upscaling.

I'll be purchasing a tv with the intention of playing xbox 360 on it and watching comcast hd sports stuff should i pay 80 to 100 dollars more for 1080p


(not buying a blueray player in the forseable future)
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