LG LH85 w/ Wireless Media Box Thread - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 24 Old 09-08-2009, 06:08 PM - Thread Starter
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I got my brand new 55 inch LG LH85 LCD with the Wireless Media Box a few days ago and put it up over my fireplace almost immediately. My first impression, was pure elation. The picture is fantastic. Its very bright, clear, and the darks are nice as well. The 60GHz wireless feature, and the fast approaching football season is what lured me into buying this without any worthwhile reviews (if you take a look at my pictures you'll understand my excitement about the wireless feature). Since the first look, my opinion has gone down. So for the rest of you thinking about getting one, here's my review. I'll continue to update it as I explore some of the settings to fix the one issue with the TV.

At this early stage, I'm disappointed in the wireless feature. The picture is crystal clear, however there is significant "judder" even in regular, non-fast-paced sports. I have a wide open room with the media box set about 12-13 feet away from the TV. I get 3 out of 5 bars of signal strength. If I can get my wife off of the TV, I'll have a chance to get into the settings and hopefully tune the bad judder out.

I'd also like to try a direct connection to the TV to make sure it isn't the TV itself.

So if any of you are ready to click the purchase button tonight, I'd recommend waiting a bit longer for more reviews. Like I said, I'll keep folks updated as I get a chance to modify the settings.

If anybody has recommendations, I'd love to hear them. I'm far from an expert on LCD's as this is my first big screen flat panel TV, but I am an engineer so I love tinkering if you have ideas.
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post #2 of 24 Old 09-08-2009, 08:57 PM - Thread Starter
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It appears that the judder issue is mostly present in slow motion scenes and scenes where a camera is panning the view. I just watched a replay of last year's Super Bowl and I hardly noticed any judder. However, several movies on TV were almost impossible to watch because the judder was so bad.

Here are a few pics:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/4231991...647481/detail/
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post #3 of 24 Old 09-09-2009, 07:08 AM
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Judder is normally caused by the use of 3:2 pulldown to display 24fps film based content since each frame is not displayed the same number of times. Unless your TV is a 120Hz capable of 5:5 pullown there is no way to eliminate Judder.
Last years super bowl was "fillmed" and broadcast with a 720p(1280x720@60) camera so there would be no judder.
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post #4 of 24 Old 09-09-2009, 07:56 AM
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Was the judder detected during there is any blocking the media box and TV or it just show up in the normal case?

I just want to know it is the wireless part to cause the issue or the display processing part to cause this.

Thanks.
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post #5 of 24 Old 09-09-2009, 10:48 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walford View Post

Judder is normally caused by the use of 3:2 pulldown to display 24fps film based content since each frame is not displayed the same number of times. Unless your TV is a 120Hz capable of 5:5 pullown there is no way to eliminate Judder.
Last years super bowl was "fillmed" and broadcast with a 720p(1280x720@60) camera so there would be no judder.

The TV is 120Hz with 24fps. I notice it quite a bit on SD programming.


Quote:
Originally Posted by tklous View Post

Was the judder detected during there is any blocking the media box and TV or it just show up in the normal case?

I just want to know it is the wireless part to cause the issue or the display processing part to cause this.

Thanks.

The media box and tv have a clear line of site of each other. I think I'll try to plug directly into the TV tonight, rather than use the wireless to see if the issue goes away. I have so far just assumed that the problems were wireless related, because no other products on the market have successfully done it. This was the feature I was most skeptical of when buying the TV, so maybe its clouded my troubleshooting methods so far. Also of note, is that walking in front of or blocking the media box for several seconds doesn't effect the picture at all. So at least LG's claims of being able to allmost immediately redirect and bounce the signal around obstacles seems to be true.
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post #6 of 24 Old 09-09-2009, 10:54 AM
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Can you turn the 120hz feature on and off? Any other picture improvement features that you can turn on and off?

I know the 240hz made the picture on the LH90 pretty bad, but when turned off the picture was stellar.

I would mess around with all those settings besides testing if it is due to the wireless box
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post #7 of 24 Old 09-09-2009, 11:03 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mhdiab View Post

Can you turn the 120hz feature on and off? Any other picture improvement features that you can turn on and off?

I know the 240hz made the picture on the LH90 pretty bad, but when turned off the picture was stellar.

I would mess around with all those settings besides testing if it is due to the wireless box

Unfortunately I don't think there is a way to turn the 120Hz off. I haven't read anything about it and I can't find it in any of the menus.
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post #8 of 24 Old 09-09-2009, 02:34 PM
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GT1135,
The TV does not change its refresh rate based on the input. It appears that your TV is a standard 60HZ TV and you are seing Judder when the 24fps content you are sending it is converted to 60fps using 3:2 pulldown. If your TV was in fact a 120Hz model you would not see Judder when sending it 24fps if it used 5:5 pulldown when sensing 24fps icoming content.
The fact that you can nothing in your documentation to say that your TV is a 120Hz model and that you have the ability to disable the motion flow features of 120 Hz and have it jiust display all 60 fps content twice makes me even more sure that you have a 60Hz TV.
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post #9 of 24 Old 09-09-2009, 02:55 PM
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I notice from the following announcement the new Wirless LG 55-inch 55LHX is a 240Hz model. The same announcement states that the LH85 has "24p Real Cinema technology" which often means 3:2 pulldown for 24fps filme based content. Maybe your user manual desscribes if this is what it means

http://www.twice.com/article/339824-...D_TV_Lines.php
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post #10 of 24 Old 09-09-2009, 03:22 PM
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This is a 120hz tv as the OP stated

http://www.lge.com/us/tv-audio-video...-tv-55LH85.jsp

Can the truemotion not be set to low / off? That is a bit surprising to me since the LH90 has so many options
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post #11 of 24 Old 09-10-2009, 06:41 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walford View Post

GT1135,
The TV does not change its refresh rate based on the input. It appears that your TV is a standard 60HZ TV and you are seing Judder when the 24fps content you are sending it is converted to 60fps using 3:2 pulldown. If your TV was in fact a 120Hz model you would not see Judder when sending it 24fps if it used 5:5 pulldown when sensing 24fps icoming content.
The fact that you can nothing in your documentation to say that your TV is a 120Hz model and that you have the ability to disable the motion flow features of 120 Hz and have it jiust display all 60 fps content twice makes me even more sure that you have a 60Hz TV.

The documentation clearly states that it is 120Hz:
http://www.lge.com/us/tv-audio-video...-tv-55LH85.jsp

Unfortunately the documentation/manual that came with this TV is very, very brief and doesn't really go into any of the menus. I'm quite disappointed in that. I can't find any way to turn off Motionflow, and the menus themselves are quite limited in options.
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post #12 of 24 Old 09-10-2009, 06:55 AM - Thread Starter
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So I found a product spec PDF on the LG page.
For the video specs it shows this(this was my understanding of what I was purchasing):
- HDMI 1080p/1080i/720p
- TruMotion 120Hz
- 24p Real Cinema (5:5)

Then buried down at the bottom it shows this for the "wireless features":
- Video Resolution 1080p/60f

So I guess that means that wirelessly I can only get 60Hz. Is that correct?
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post #13 of 24 Old 09-10-2009, 07:52 AM
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You send it 60fps via wireless and it converts that to 120fps by either
Showing each frame twice.
or interpolating between each pair of 60fps input to create 120fps
or using 5:5 pulldown to create 120fps from 24fps input.
This is exactly the same way a wired 120Hz display works when receiving wired 60fps or 24fps content.
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post #14 of 24 Old 09-10-2009, 08:38 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walford View Post

You send it 60fps via wireless and it converts that to 120fps by either
Showing each frame twice.
or interpolating between each pair of 60fps input to create 120fps
or using 5:5 pulldown to create 120fps from 24fps input.
This is exactly the same way a wired 120Hz display works when receiving wired 60fps or 24fps content.

Ok, so based on that spec "theoretically" the video quality should be the same via the wireless connection as it is wired, right?

However, could this be a signal issue on the wireless side. Maybe other wireless devices are creating "noise" affecting the wireless signal. I'm equating this to something like signal attentuation if I was watching 1080p over a 75ft HDMI cable.

Let me know what you think. Your input so far has already helped me understand the issue a bit better.
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post #15 of 24 Old 12-25-2009, 10:39 PM
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The "judder" you see is due to the 120Hz feature of the TV. As others have stated if you turn it off it will be fine. It pops up only slow moving shots, like the shots Matrix.

I have the 55LH85 for about two weeks now. The wireless used to be about 10 feet away from the TV strait across. It was perfect.

I moved the wireless box under the TV and i sometimes now get voice sync issues. It's a matter of placement issue i know it.

The TV it's self was... how do I put this... "eh" at first.
I've had time to play with the settings and get a chance to use the built it picture optimization wizard. It makes the TV shine. I watched District 9 today (again) and it was amazing. I was in the theater, without a doubt. Now for some 5.1 sound!

Note: The TV is not yet in Logitech's database. If you are planning to use a Harmony you'll have some trouble getting it perfect. I'm working on submitting my settings to the database.

My full review can be found here: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16889005090
12/10/2009 6:15:13 PM
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post #16 of 24 Old 12-26-2009, 12:42 PM
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Other factors aside I'm surprised we don't see more mention here of the Picture Wizard feature. It offers a good option for calibrating the tv for those unwilling to purchase a calibration disc like VE.

Steve S.
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post #17 of 24 Old 01-06-2010, 05:01 PM
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I wanted a bigger screen than 50”, (had a 25 yrs old 50" Sony projection, coffee table type) so after deciding on the brand, there were 3 LG’s I looked at, the LG 55LH40, LG 55LHX and LG 55LH85. The so-called LED TV’s, like the LHX, are only backlit LEDs, not true LED like OLED and even though not true LED, they are expensive. Sony sells a true OLED TV for $2500 for an 11” screen and they are sold out, but still out of my range. 120 Hz vs 240 Hz? The eye can’t tell that much difference for the price and LG 120 Hz has “True-Motion” to compensate for “judder”. The same goes for 720p vs. 1080p. The eye can’t tell much and I understand that HDTV transmissions are in 720p anyway, Blueray is in 1080p. What finally attracted me was the LG 85’s separate wireless media box with almost an infinite array of inputs and outputs, all transmitted wireless. If you have your sound system in one area and TV in another area, but in the same room, you’ve got it made with this system. Inside the packing box is the TV, media box, 2 power cords, owners manual, extensive manual on a CD, remote with batteries, microfiber cloth and protection cover to cover the hole used by the TV stand, if you want to hang it up on the wall. You have to purchase a separate HDMI cables and VGA cable if you want to hook it up to your computer.
I had my previous TV hooked up with cable converter box; Go-Video DVD-VCR recorder; Go-Video VCR to VCR recorder; Sony DVD player changer and Sylvania DVD recorder, that runs through a multiple switching box master control center and using the same with this TV, so I am probably getting some signal loss. I hooked up the TV cable into the LG media box. My cable company also supplies not only TV, but broadband and telephone, another possible signal loss. It takes a few seconds for the media box’s transmitter located in the front of the box to search for the receiver located under the LG logo on the TV. Reception is similar to the “bars” on your cell phone and I am receiving 5 bars. By the time I finished hooking it up, the Jay Leno show was on and I thought either my vision was impaired or something’s wrong with the TV, because Jay’s head/face was out of focus. Was I upset and almost blamed it on the TV until I switched to a pre-recorded DVR program and then played a DVD and also switched to HD programming. I had no focus problems. Then I remembered the bad hype that the Sony projection TVs got many years ago. The increased size accented the poor transmissions put out by the TV stations, not the fault of the TV. I have not used the HDMI hookup yet or surround-sound option. I have a separate surround-sound running out of my DVD-VCR recorder.
The LG media box has 3 HDMI connections in the back, 1 in the front and there is 1 on the TV for a total of 5 HDMI ports. There are also component, DVI and composite hookups as well as optical digital audio out.
The LG has HDTV; ISR; AV; Invisible Speakers: Trumotion: Smart Energy Savings+; Dolby; SRS; Clear Voice II: HDMI; Full HD 1080p; Wireless; Intelligent Sensor and DIVX.
An array of red leds on the bottom right indicates standby and when turned on, cycles like a Battlestar Galatica Cyclon and turns white. You have the option of turning this off. Controls on the TV are on the right side. The remote has a 5 sec. backlight to see in the dark. The front of the master box has USB and HDMI in, ports.
The TV also comes with automatic or manual time clock and sleep timer. Through the remote, you can access a simple manual and quick menu to make picture adjustments. Pressing the info on the remote will give you program info if broadcast by your cable/satellite company. It also has key lock; parental controls and channel locks.
You can view JPG files, play MP3 and movie files as well as Simplink equipped. There is a “Picture Wizard” where you can “tune” your TV to examples, as you desire and adjusts black level, white, color tint, horizontal and vertical sharpness and backlight. You also have manual, advanced and 2 expert settings that you can set according to what you are watching. The expert settings also go farther than my technical ability at this time and I haven’t messed with all the color adjustment in the expert setting. There are directions for optimal placement of the media box and I have mine just in front and under the right side of the TV. I found out after moving the box around that the front controls are “touch-sensitive” for all the ports on the box. I have not used the HDMI or blue-ray, but according to the other reviews, the picture is outstanding. That is probably the best way to appreciate the money you spent on this TV, since TV broadcasting is still not the best of worlds. (I have been getting “tileing” all year and have had the cable co. out numerous times and they are coming again Sunday to try to fix the tileing. I’m ready to go back to Dish or Direct TV.) I went and bought HDMI cable and hooked it up to the cable box output. A noticeable difference can be seen using coax HD from the box vs. HDMI from the box. If you are getting a poor pic, it’s probably you cable signal, not the TV.
The only Con I can find is that when you use the Intelligent Sensor with one light on in the room, the screen is too dim for my liking, but it saves 75% energy by dropping the brightness and backlight. When I turn the overhead light on, it adjusts accordingly and gets brighter. The other con is the email for registration is not what is printed on the card. “Secure” was left off the card or had been changed to a new email.
Contacting LG customer service by phone was answered quickly. I inquired why I am not receiving picture info. It seems it is the cable’s problem not the TV. I hooked another TV with picture info features up to cable and didn’t get any info either. At least I received immediate info from LG customer service, who also confirmed that my email registration had been confirmed.
This review above was posted since New Years, on numerous sites and the site I purchased it (Newegg screwed my full review up) since I could hardly find any detailed reviews. Since then, I purchased HDMI cables and hooked up the optical directly to a surround sound system. The difference between cable and HDMI hookup out of the cable box is very noticeable and brings the TV up to it's full potential (remember, broadcast is in 720p and the TV will tell you this when you press info). The only thing I haven't hooked up is Blue Ray, since I don't have it yet. Those that have, say it is astounding. Pay close attention to what I said about the reception. My cable is not the best and I occasionally have "tiling" and have called the company numerous times. The problems I have seen with voice sync and fuzzy pics is reception because when I play a DVR or DVD, there are no problems.
After looking at all the posts about 60hz 120hz etc. It is a 120hz TV. You also have 3 Truemotion 120hz modes, high, low and off. I am using low, with no judder. Someone is NOT reading the manual (the CD) that came with the TV. This TV is capable of producing outstanding pictures if it is calibrated properly and using the controls and info that came with it. Read the CD, play with the TV, then read the CD again and again. There is so much to calibrate with in this TV. I am still learning the potential of this TV. I have had no problems with poorly sounding speakers in the Clear Voice II mode. (As I mentioned, I have since gone directly to SRS Surround Sound.)
For those who have a transmit complaint, (the CD says) the media box has to be placed with 60 deg and range is 6.5 ft. Side to side is 5.5 ft. and full range (box FACING TV) 32.8 ft. I have moved the box and checked it all. I have mine under the TV and just in the front side and am getting 5 bars. The transmitter is in the front left side of the box and receiver under the TV LG logo.
I saw a 55 "Vizio at Walmart for $1350 and I don't think it will match this TV that is still selling for upwards of $2600. The old saying still stands, "You get what you pay for" and I am glad what I got.
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post #18 of 24 Old 01-20-2010, 10:44 PM
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I am seriously looking into buying this HDTV. In fact, it is the ONLY HDTV I am considering simply because it is the ONLY 55" LCD (non-LED) HDTV that has a separate connector/media box. It is ironic that the only spec I am interested in is the separate media box - quality, features, etc. are all secondary considerations.

Anyway, I could care less about the wireless feature and I'm mostly interested in having a wired connection between the TV and the media box. The media box will be placed in a cabinet and there is a thick wall between the cabinet and the TV like this: TV||wall||{cabinet} (the TV is in one room while the cabinet is in the next room). The power cord and the wired HDMI cable will pass from the TV through a small hole in the wall to the other room where it will hook up to the media box in the cabinet. Therefore, there is no way for the TV OR the remote to see the media box. I will probably have at least 3-4 devices hooked up to the HDMI inputs on the media box, all located in the cabinet.

So the questions are as follows:

Is it possible to have a HDMI wired connection between the TV and the media box? Can the TV remote control all the inputs through that single HDMI input?

When I point the remote at the TV and press on the input button, will the input change on the media box? Will the TV be able to use the wired HDMI connection to the media box to change inputs on the media box itself? Without this functionality, I would have to go to the other room, open the cabinet, aim the remote at the media box, and press the input selection just to change the inputs.

I really hope this TV can do what I had described above. Any info would be appreciated.
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post #19 of 24 Old 03-10-2010, 02:42 PM
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I'm using the single non-wireless HDMI for my STB any chance you guys would know if its possible to have the TV turn on without the media box? I'm using a Logitech Harmony remote so i just need to submit the IR code to logitech. I have tested turning on the tv with the media box unpluged and eveything seems to work okay. Thank you.
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post #20 of 24 Old 05-13-2010, 06:36 AM
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I'm trying to also find a discreet code for the HDMI5 input, any one else looking/interested?

I would like to program it to my harmony remote. My ideal solution would be to only use the media box when necessary but unfortunately, according to LG, there is no way to power on to the media box without powering on the TV since they both use the same IR code.
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post #21 of 24 Old 10-22-2010, 12:27 PM
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My media center is across the room from the LG TV. Does anyone know if it is possible to connect a home theater system directly to the TV rather than routing wires across the room from the media center?

I haven't found a way but figured I'd ask...

Thanks
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post #22 of 24 Old 11-06-2010, 04:09 PM
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Did you ever establish if the wireless connection was contributing to your problems?
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post #23 of 24 Old 12-16-2010, 09:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gt1135 View Post

It appears that the judder issue is mostly present in slow motion scenes and scenes where a camera is panning the view. I just watched a replay of last year's Super Bowl and I hardly noticed any judder. However, several movies on TV were almost impossible to watch because the judder was so bad.

I got the 47 inch version of this TV last week, the 47LH85 , my first non-CRT TV, and I'm having the same issue. The picture is great, but motion can be very jerky and frustrating to watch on some shows and movies. Things look like they've been filmed on a camcorder, like the movie Blair Witch, or I would call it "hyper motion"... as you said, it makes some things almost impossible to watch, and it's so bad I feel like sending it back.

I am NOT using the wireless, I am plugging the media box directly into the TV with an HDMI cable. I have tried turning off "TrueMotion" and the option above it, "Real Cinema", but I don't really see much of a difference.

Does anyone own this TV and have any suggestions? A friend says, "That's just how LCD HDTV's are", but my computer's monitor (also S-IPS panel) has no problems at all with the same content.

Thanks!
Chuck
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post #24 of 24 Old 11-26-2013, 10:07 AM
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So I owned and loved this set for almost 4 years, but alas one of our little ones decided to end it's life. So I'm currently shopping for a new TV, but I was wondering if I can re-use the media box with any HDMI television. Has anyone tried connecting the media box to a different television. Was it compatible with an LG? Non LG?

I really like the media box and didn't realize how nice having 4 HDMI and 2 component Inputs was until shopping for a new set.
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