Why no local dimming full LED's from Samsung this year? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 26 Old 06-16-2010, 11:25 PM - Thread Starter
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I passed on last years 8500 series and now I'm regretting it. I've been looking hard at the 65C8000 but I want a full LED.

Edge lit bleeding drives me crazy.

Any chance we see a full LED from Sammy this year?

This superior tech has been in Samsungs since 07 and the 81 Series.

Why this shift?

Is it price issue?

Or some issue with LED local dimming technology itself?
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post #2 of 26 Old 06-17-2010, 09:44 AM
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I too am looking for an A950 successor. I owned one in the US, now in the UK and only see Edge lit from Samsung. I have not been following news for over a year now.

What other models are LED Back/Smartlit?

Sony have the HX Series this year, no 3D though.

Sharp appear to have Quaddron and no smart backlight...

What are the options?
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post #3 of 26 Old 06-17-2010, 09:49 AM
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Edge-lit is ultra-slim,ultra-slim is 'hot'($$$$$).


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post #4 of 26 Old 06-17-2010, 10:00 AM
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i heard it was because a lawsuit between Sharp v Samsung copying Sharps full LED backlight technology so Sammy went to the new style edge lit, thats just a rumor mind you...

in cyberspace next 2 canada
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post #5 of 26 Old 06-17-2010, 10:06 AM
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Sharp sued Samsung & won so they cannot make Local Dimming Sets anymore/or for now. They have choose to create their own tech called "Precision Dimming"

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/sha...nts-2009-11-10
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post #6 of 26 Old 06-17-2010, 10:34 AM
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What I don't understand is if samsung stole this tech from sharp. Why doesn't sharps sets look even half as good as the sammys? Is there even a local dimming set out with sharp?
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post #7 of 26 Old 06-17-2010, 10:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BFJ 96 View Post

Sharp sued Samsung & won so they cannot make Local Dimming Sets anymore/or for now. They have choose to create their own tech called "Precision Dimming"

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/sha...nts-2009-11-10

Pando post; "

The lawsuit wasn't related to local dimming".
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post #8 of 26 Old 06-17-2010, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 8mile13 View Post

Pando post; "

The lawsuit wasn't related to local dimming".

That's how I remembered it since the edge-lit 8000 was also affected.
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post #9 of 26 Old 06-17-2010, 12:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JukeBox360 View Post

What I don't understand is if samsung stole this tech from sharp. Why doesn't sharps sets look even half as good as the sammys? Is there even a local dimming set out with sharp?

sharp history & facts Make products that others want to imitate
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post #10 of 26 Old 06-17-2010, 12:33 PM
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None of the links state what the content of the patent(s) that Samsung infringed on were. It is believed that one of them was related to full LED local diming. And just because the infringed on a patent for one desing dtail does not mean that all of Sharps designed sets should be better then Samsung's.
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post #11 of 26 Old 06-17-2010, 01:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walford View Post

None of the links state what the content of the patent(s) that Samsung infringed on were. It is believed that one of them was related to full LED local diming. And just because the infringed on a patent for one desing dtail does not mean that all of Sharps designed sets should be better then Samsung's.

Sharp has alleged that Samsung infringes LCD-related patents for the following products:

Liquid cristal display (LCD) modules manufactured by Samsung and sold in the US by Samsung.
LCD TVs and LCD monitors which incorporate the LCD modules manufactured by Samsung and sold in the US by SCE.
Mobile phones which incorporate the LCD modules manufactured by Samsung and sold in the US.


The five patents involved with the lawsuit are US patent Numbers 4,649,383 - 5,760,855 - 6,052,162 - 7,027,024 and 7,057,689 all of which relate to LCD modules.
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post #12 of 26 Old 06-17-2010, 02:56 PM
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I can only speculate, but shortages in the LED supply chain (due to sharply increased demand) may have affected their decision not to include LD sets this year. The risk of supply shortages affecting their production (or profits)may have been too great.
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post #13 of 26 Old 06-17-2010, 03:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 8mile13 View Post

Sharp has alleged that Samsung infringes LCD-related patents for the following products:

Liquid cristal display (LCD) modules manufactured by Samsung and sold in the US by Samsung.
LCD TVs and LCD monitors which incorporate the LCD modules manufactured by Samsung and sold in the US by SCE.
Mobile phones which incorporate the LCD modules manufactured by Samsung and sold in the US.


The five patents involved with the lawsuit are US patent Numbers 4,649,383 - 5,760,855 - 6,052,162 - 7,027,024 and 7,057,689 all of which relate to LCD modules.

Interesting since none of them relate to LED backlighting of the LCD panel.
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post #14 of 26 Old 06-17-2010, 03:46 PM
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So then no one knows why no local dimming?
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post #15 of 26 Old 06-17-2010, 09:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JukeBox360 View Post

So then no one knows why no local dimming?

I read a "rumor" in a UK forum ("AVForums") that Samsung is selling "enough" edge-lit models so that for Europe they didn't need any full-LED local dimming sets.
Don't if this is true but it could very well be and could be an answer to the question why the B8500 wasn't sold in Europe.

bye
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post #16 of 26 Old 06-17-2010, 09:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benny42 View Post


I read a "rumor" in a UK forum ("AVForums") that Samsung is selling "enough" edge-lit models so that for Europe they didn't need any full-LED local dimming sets.
Don't if this is true but it could very well be and could be an answer to the question why the B8500 wasn't sold in Europe.

Yeah. That could be why they were never sold there. But other reasons seem unlikly. Maybe they just want to have a very thin tv. I'm not sure. But I really wish someone knew the real reason. It's very interesting.
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post #17 of 26 Old 06-17-2010, 10:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LevityNYC View Post

Why no local dimming full LED's from Samsung this year?

Because they're stupid.

(Samsung that is, not local dimming LED sets)

One day at a time...
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post #18 of 26 Old 06-17-2010, 10:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FictitiousSamsungRepresentative View Post

Why should we sell local dimming models? They are expensive and complicated for us to manufacturer. The profit margins are low.

We would rather sell TVs that are cheaper and easier to manufacturer. With higher profit margins. We can make them super thin, give them a shiny bezel and fancy remote, and charge $7,000.

Consumers are sheep, and will buy whatever we tell them is cool. That's what we are counting on. Have you seen our new c9000?


One day at a time...
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post #19 of 26 Old 06-17-2010, 10:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Canonazo View Post

I can only speculate, but shortages in the LED supply chain (due to sharply increased demand) may have affected their decision not to include LD sets this year. The risk of supply shortages affecting their production (or profits)may have been too great.

That may have had something to do with it however i think it really just comes down to the higher mark ups and profit margins they are realizing with their edge lit sets. I think i read somewhere that samsung has partnered up with an led manufacturer to insure their supply of leds in the future.
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post #20 of 26 Old 06-18-2010, 09:10 AM
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How would there be a shortage of LEDs? Edge lit sets still sell like hot cakes
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post #21 of 26 Old 06-18-2010, 09:17 AM
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One thing is true:They are all in it for the money.
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post #22 of 26 Old 06-18-2010, 09:18 AM
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They should think about quality before they think about getting any money.
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post #23 of 26 Old 06-18-2010, 09:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by happy nightmares View Post

"Consumers are sheep, and will buy whatever we tell them is cool. That's what we are counting on. Have you seen our new c9000?"

Now that you mention it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2FX9rviEhw

Note how the "LED-sheep" are being "directed"!


bye
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post #24 of 26 Old 06-18-2010, 11:14 AM
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Originally Posted by JukeBox360 View Post

How would there be a shortage of LEDs? Edge lit sets still sell like hot cakes

Samsung is the largest TV manufacturer in the world. Supply shortages could have a much greater impact on their productivity if they need to shut down/reconfigure manufacturing and assembly lines than a smaller company.

If they can make 10 edge-lit units utilizing the same number LEDs as 1 LD unit it's much less risk to them and much more "guaranteed" revenue into their TV division.

I'd expect Samsung to offer LD sets again in 2011.

http://www.isuppli.com/Display-Mater...e-in-2010.aspx
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post #25 of 26 Old 06-18-2010, 11:39 AM
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Very nice articale. I sure would hope they'd go back to local dimming in 2011. I'm sure plenty of people would be excited about that. Do you think LD will ever be cheaper though? I don't just for the main fact that edge lit is always an option. So LD will always be considerd high cost/value.
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post #26 of 26 Old 06-18-2010, 11:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Canonazo View Post

If they can make 10 edge-lit units utilizing the same number LEDs as 1 LD unit it's much less risk to them and much more "guaranteed" revenue into their TV division.

Are you sure that the LEDs for edge-lighting are the same ones used in full-LED local dimming sets?

bye
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