Official Sony XBR HX909 owners' thread (52HX909, 46HX909, HX9, HX900) - Page 93 - AVS Forum
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post #2761 of 2895 Old 09-23-2011, 09:08 AM
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Well, it appears Sony has admitted that there is a problem with the 46HX909 and Netlfix, as they are swapping this unit out for the 929 without hesitation.

So, the 929 is a beauty which lost close to 30lbs in weight, added wi-fi, and is slimer.

Finally, a company making the customer whole...
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post #2762 of 2895 Old 09-23-2011, 09:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PCTools View Post

Well, it appears Sony has admitted that there is a problem with the 46HX909 and Netlfix, as they are swapping this unit out for the 929 without hesitation.

So, the 929 is a beauty which lost close to 30lbs in weight, added wi-fi, and is slimer.

Finally, a company making the customer whole...

What?!?! Link or more info please! I'm happy with my 909 but if I can get a brand spankin new 929 I'm all over it!
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post #2763 of 2895 Old 09-23-2011, 11:18 AM
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Originally Posted by supersoldier11 View Post

What?!?! Link or more info please! I'm happy with my 909 but if I can get a brand spankin new 929 I'm all over it!

Agreed!!! x2
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post #2764 of 2895 Old 09-23-2011, 01:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chronoptimist View Post

The local dimming is visible as soon as you go off-axis, this is normal. You do not have to be at very wide angles for it to happen.

Make sure that you do not have the black corrector or adv. contrast enhancer options enabled, and you have brightness set correctly, as those can exacerbate the problem. (turning areas that shouldn't be completely black off)

If the visibility of the zones off-axis viewing is too distracting (in some ways, I would say that it's more distracting than regular LCD off-axis viewing, even though the image is higher contrast) I would suggest turning down LED dynamic control to low, running in game mode, or disabling it entirely.

Make sure that the contrast setting is at least 80, and that you have the backlight set correctly. You should be able to look at a full white screen comfortably with the auto light limiter turned off. What often works well is to turn the backlight completely down, watch maybe half an hour of content with this dim picture, and turn it up notch-by-notch until a full white screen starts looking white again rather than a dull grey. Most people find this is at least a couple of notches lower than their previous setting.

In most content, the local dimming is not visible when watching a film on-axis with the exception of things like end credits.

It's true, the reds are somewhat shifted towards yellow, but not enough to turn them orange. Most uncalibrated LCDs, especially those with wider gamut capabilities tend to shift
reds towards crimson rather than where they should be, so the reds on the 909 would look more orange in comparison.

If you have a HTPC capable of running madVR with 3D LUTs enabled, I can help you get more accurate colour in general though. (including reds)
There is no CMS option with this display, so your only control is hue. This primarily affects the secondary colours and is best left alone in most cases.

Thank you so much for the info. I'm afraid I don't know what a HTPC capable of running madVR with 3D LUTs enabled is, so I guess I'm out of luck. Is this something a professional calibration person has? Also, I'm not sure what a CMS option is. As for hue, I've had to turn mine to -6 just to add some pigment to skin tones - otherwise everyone looks kind of pasty and greenish. So far, I haven't found anyone else who's had to adjust hue, so that has me a bit worried. Also, you recommended setting the contrast to 80, but where is that setting? I see backlight and brightness, and, in advanced settings I see enhanced contrast, but nowhere that I can adjust actual contrast. can you point me in the right direction?

The question that looms large in my head is this: do the panels vary to such a degree from unit to unit that I could have one with exceptionally bad blooming issues? I looked at two 929s - one at Fry's and one at a local Sony store and the blooming was not bad at all in comparison to my 909. I realize that Sony has addressed this issue to some degree with the new model but it makes me think that perhaps I have an exceptionally bad panel. Is this possible??

Lastly, I mentioned a while back that a few days after I got my TV, I turned it on, it turned itself off, and then back on again. I read that Sony addressed this with a firmware update, so I allowed the TV to auto update the firmware and hadn't had that issue again until a couple of days ago, when I was setting the input labels, etc., I pushed the blue "home" button and the TV did not respond. I pushed it several times more and got no response. The TV then shut itself off, then back on again. I tried pushing the blue button again, with no luck. The TV again turned itself off and back on. Then, when I tried to access any of the menus, I got a message that said something like "starting up - please wait..." After about 10-15 seconds I was able to access the menus and everything seems fine. I had a Sony-authorized repair person take a look at it after it happened the first time and since we couldn't reproduce it, he had no idea why it would happen or how to address the issue. What do you think is going on?
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post #2765 of 2895 Old 09-23-2011, 02:47 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PCTools View Post

Well, it appears Sony has admitted that there is a problem with the 46HX909 and Netlfix, as they are swapping this unit out for the 929 without hesitation.

So, the 929 is a beauty which lost close to 30lbs in weight, added wi-fi, and is slimer.

Finally, a company making the customer whole...

Seriously? Ill gladly take a second 929 to replace my 909!

What do we have to do for this?
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post #2766 of 2895 Old 09-23-2011, 03:24 PM
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Ya i'd also like to know how. Im happy with my 909 but if i can get a 929 im all over it
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post #2767 of 2895 Old 09-23-2011, 09:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jsulmeyer View Post

Thank you so much for the info. I'm afraid I don't know what a HTPC capable of running madVR with 3D LUTs enabled is, so I guess I'm out of luck. Is this something a professional calibration person has?

Sorry. A HTPC (Home Theatre PC) is basically just any computer hooked up to a TV for video playback. I use a PC for all my DVD/Blu-Ray playback using madVR for the best image quality. The 3D LUT option inside madVR is a color management system (CMS) which gets color as accurate as it can be on this screen. It requires a reasonably powerful CPU & graphics card for smooth playback though. (and you either need to rip the discs or run something like AnyDVD HD for Blu-ray playback)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jsulmeyer View Post

Also, I'm not sure what a CMS option is. As for hue, I've had to turn mine to -6 just to add some pigment to skin tones - otherwise everyone looks kind of pasty and greenish.

What is your source and display settings? Are you used to looking at a properly calibrated display?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jsulmeyer View Post

Also, you recommended setting the contrast to 80, but where is that setting?

It might be labelled "picture" in USA.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jsulmeyer View Post

The question that looms large in my head is this: do the panels vary to such a degree from unit to unit that I could have one with exceptionally bad blooming issues?

I very much doubt it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jsulmeyer View Post

I looked at two 929s - one at Fry's and one at a local Sony store and the blooming was not bad at all in comparison to my 909.

Not the same display, and blooming will be far less noticeable in a bright shop environment.

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Originally Posted by jsulmeyer View Post

I pushed the blue "home" button and the TV did not respond. I pushed it several times more and got no response. The TV then shut itself off, then back on again. I tried pushing the blue button again, with no luck. The TV again turned itself off and back on.

My TV has done this once before too, never since.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jsulmeyer View Post

Then, when I tried to access any of the menus, I got a message that said something like "starting up - please wait..." After about 10-15 seconds I was able to access the menus and everything seems fine.

That's completely normal. Because LEDs can turn on instantly, the HX900 actually starts displaying an image before the rest of the TV software has finished loading.

There is a "quick start" option in the menus that stops this from happening, at the expense of drawing more power in standby. As your TV had effectively "crashed" (an inevitability now that we have all this internet connectivity) it would have been doing a cold restart which is why you will have finally noticed the TV doing this. I disabled the quick start feature on my TV (I'd rather save the power, and I usually turn it off at the wall anyway) and this happens every time I turn it on.

Now that I think about it, never letting the display fully turn off might be why it crashed in the first place.
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post #2768 of 2895 Old 09-23-2011, 10:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chronoptimist View Post

What is your source and display settings? Are you used to looking at a properly calibrated display?

My TV has done this once before too, never since... Now that I think about it, never letting the display fully turn off might be why it crashed in the first place.

Thank you so much for all the excellent information. I feel better knowing that my unit likely isn't significantly different than other's 909's, so at least I can find some comfort in the fact that I probably don't have a defective one. Same goes for the "rebooting", as you accurately called it. Again, glad to know I'm not the only one...

As for my source and display settings: I'm away from home for a few days, so I'll have to get back to you on the settings. And no, I'm not used to looking at a properly calibrated display (BTW, my 909 hasn't been calibrated). In fact, what I'm used to is a 40-inch, edge-lit Samsung with very saturated colors and lots of "pop" but also horrible backlight bleeding and a non-uniform panel) As for the sources I'm using, I'm watching broadcast TV through a Motorola cable box/DVR, complements of Time Warner Cable, and connected to the TV via both HDMI (I believe it's high speed) and component cables (I was trying to decide with one looks better - any thoughts on this?). I'm also watching Blu-ray and standard DVDs via a Yamaha BD-2900 (originally a fortune when it came out, I got a mint display unit at BB Magnolia for $49). It's a first gen Blu-ray player so it loads REALLY slowly and lacks BD live features, but HD content looks pretty good; up-conversion also looks pretty good, although I read some reviews that felt it cold be better) This is also attached to the Sony via HDMI. Lastly, I have Apple TV via HDMI and a Wii, attached via composite cables.

I have no home theater audio setup - gonna have to save up after spending everything I had on the TV. Luckily, I got my 46HX909 for $949 new, in the box from Fry's, so at least I got a sweet deal and explains why I kept it, despite the negative issues I'm trying to resolve.

Other than the blooming and off-angle issues, the things that continue to bug me are skin tone lacking sharp detail and pigment (most people have a flat, pasty look, which is why I've adjusted hue to -6 to compensate), reds tend to be mustardy/orange rather than crimson (no fix or work-around so far), and SD or 720i content looking really bad. Of course, on the upside, blacks look great, no issues with motion when viewing decent content, and the style of the TV (no cheap, shiny, black plastic bezel) is the best I've ever seen.

I'll post my picture settings in a couple of days when I get home.

Thanks again :-)
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post #2769 of 2895 Old 09-26-2011, 09:09 AM
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Does anyone want or need an extra/replacement stand for a 46HX909? I have an entire extra set, including base, neck, neck cover, etc. If so, feel free to send me a private message.
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post #2770 of 2895 Old 09-26-2011, 04:33 PM
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Just when I decided to keep my 46HX909, the issue of sudden reboots and on-screen menu lagging has re-emerged. Specifically, when I try to access and navigate the on-screen menus, they take forever to respond, then nothing happens, even though I'm pushing the arrow buttons and the green light on the TV is blinking. Then, without warning, even after I've stopped pushing the buttons on the remote, the menus zip across the screen.

This behavior, like the sudden reboots, occurred when I first got the TV a couple of months ago, and then stopped happening. I figured a firmware update fixed the issue. Still, to be safe, I had an authorized Sony technician take a look at the TV. They, in turn, contacted Sony, who recommended replacing the main board and the remote receiver board. Since the problem had subsided, I elected, at that time, to hold off on the repairs.

For the last month or so the issues did not happen. I'm not sure if this is related or not, but during this time, my TV wasn't hooked up to my network (I returned the both the over-priced Sony USB dongle and moved my Apple AirPort express, which provides access to the wireless network via an ethernet cable from the express to the TV, to my office.). A few days ago I re-connected the TV to the network via the AirPort express, reconnected the co-ax cable to the back of the TV (even though I guess it's not necessary), and it seemed everything was okay at first. Overnight the TV did a firmware update from 105 to 107. I refreshed my web content and then, while customizing my input labels, I lost the use of the home button and then the TV rebooted itself. It did this twice.

Then, yesterday, I discovered that there was a HUGE lag in the on-screen menus. I tried unplugging the TV. I tried disconnecting the network cable. I tried disconnecting the co-ax cable. I unplugged everything accept the HDMI cable from the cable box to the TV. Still, the menus lagged like crazy.

I contacted Fry's, and they allowed me to return and re-purchase the TV, giving me a new 30 day window to try to resolve the issue. HOWEVER, they warned me that if Sony attempts to repair the TV, THEY WILL NOT ALLOW ME TO RETURN IT - EVEN WITHIN THE 30 DAY PERIOD. I asked, out of curiosity, how they would know, and they said that their system would be updated to alert them to the unit having been serviced. This was the manager of the returns department, so perhaps it's true.

So here are my questions:

1. Could the firmware update or web content update be causing these issues? Like I said, the menu lag continued to occur even after disconnecting the TV from the network, but by then the firmware and content updates had already been loaded.

2. Could my Apple AirPort Extreme router be an issue?

3. I paid $949 for this TV, new. I HATE the idea of returning it. Is it worth keeping and having the repairs done, forfeiting the ability to get my money back, with no assurance that the problems will be resolved. Even the Sony repair guy said he had no idea if replacing those two boards would resolve the issues?

4. Can Fry's ACTUALLY tell if an item being returned had been repaired? Could they possibly have a link to Sony? Seems far-fetched, but the manager was pretty adamant about that point.

I'd GREATLY appreciate any and all advice!

Thank you.

UPDATE: Took the TV out of it's box and hooked it up again. Just power and HDMI to cable box. Still got severe menu lag. Then, accessed the "initial setup" and went through all the steps, skipping network setup. This seems to have cleared up the menu lag - at least for now. I then connected a new Sony Wireless USB dongle, set up the network, and re-downloaded web content. Still no menu lag. Again, I didn't do a factory reset - I just walked through the initial setup and that seems to have had a positive effect on the menu lag.

I contact Sony Tier 2 tech support and got the procedure for a factory reset, just in case (the initial setup did not clear any of my picture settings, input labels, network name and password, etc.). I will hold off on performing a factory reset until the lag or sudden reboots re-appear. The technician I spoke to said that sometimes, when a firmware update is done, files can remain in memory and that perhaps running through the setup flushed the memory? Does this make any sense? Has anyone else experienced this kind of memory "bottle-neck" affecting the on-screen menus or causing a brief reboot of the TV? Could I have a bad memory SIM? Is the memory stored on the main board or is it housed separately?

Again, many, many thanks.
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post #2771 of 2895 Old 09-27-2011, 08:59 AM
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My 909 at random sometimes gets the purple halo around the blacks when on the ps3 what can be the cause to this? its random and has happened only twice....help

thanks
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post #2772 of 2895 Old 09-27-2011, 08:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jsulmeyer View Post

Just when I decided to keep my 46HX909, the issue of sudden reboots and on-screen menu lagging has re-emerged. Specifically, when I try to access and navigate the on-screen menus, they take forever to respond, then nothing happens, even though I'm pushing the arrow buttons and the green light on the TV is blinking. Then, without warning, even after I've stopped pushing the buttons on the remote, the menus zip across the screen.

I think we can admit that this TV doesn't have the zippiest on-screen display. It sounds to me as though your TV gets very sluggish when it's accessing the Internet. I would suggest that you disable network connectivity and see if the sluggishness goes away.

In my opinion, you can get VASTLY better Internet content using a PS/3 or a $100 AppleTV. And if you use Netflix, you're nuts to use this TV's built-in Netflix app; it provides very poor quality compared to the quality you will see using an AppleTV or PS/3.

If this problem remains after disconnecting the Internet feature, then it's something else... but I think it's Internet access.
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post #2773 of 2895 Old 09-27-2011, 09:02 PM
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I think we can admit that this TV doesn't have the zippiest on-screen display. It sounds to me as though your TV gets very sluggish when it's accessing the Internet. I would suggest that you disable network connectivity and see if the sluggishness goes away.

In my opinion, you can get VASTLY better Internet content using a PS/3 or a $100 AppleTV. And if you use Netflix, you're nuts to use this TV's built-in Netflix app; it provides very poor quality compared to the quality you will see using an AppleTV or PS/3.

If this problem remains after disconnecting the Internet feature, then it's something else... but I think it's Internet access.

Thanks for the input. The problem DOES remain after disconnecting from the internet, BUT it could be that whatever was downloaded is stuck in memory, thus causing the bottleneck even after the connection to the internet is removed. I'm not certain, but the lag seems to have re-emerged after either the most recent firmware update 4.107(?) and/or refreshing and loading internet content. Oddly, like I mentioned earlier, the way I fixed the problem - at least for now - was to run the initial setup (not the factory restore, which will be my next test if/when the problem comes back). Since the initial setup doesn't restore much of anything, I'm perplexed as to why this temporarily fixed the issues I was having. As the person at Sony said yesterday, the TV downloads files or "packets" and it's as if these downloads are getting stuck in memory, which is causing the bottleneck - much like when it takes forever for the browser to load on you PC and the scrolling is all messed up and you need to somehow flush the memory or reboot your computer to fix the problem. What I'm wondering now is a) have others experienced this behavior soon after a firmware update or a content refresh, and b) should I go through with Sony's recommended service, which is to have the main board replaced. Since they recommended that solution prior to my making the connection between the lag issue and the internet/firmware updates, I wonder if that would solve anything at all, and I hate the idea of having a brand new TV taken apart. If it's a "memory" issue or a "buffer" issue, is there a different repair that should be made? Any thoughts?

I would greatly appreciate feedback from anyone who has experienced these issues and if they've seen a connection between the menu lag and firmware update / web content update.
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post #2774 of 2895 Old 09-27-2011, 10:14 PM
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For what it's worth, I've been using the 52HX909's Netflix client 3+ hours a night for the last several months. I've never seen slowdowns due to streaming.

The only issues I've seen with remote responsiveness is immediately after powering on my TV, I normally have to wait 5-10 seconds before I can change the channel. I usually can't pull up Internet content on the TV for at least 20-30 seconds after the TV powers on. Nothing major.
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post #2775 of 2895 Old 09-28-2011, 09:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jsulmeyer View Post

P.S. - I heard once from a guy who seemed to know what he was talking about that Fry's get's sub-standard TVs from manufacturers, where grade "A" TV panels might go to Amazon or Best Buy and Fry's might get grade "B" or "C". Has anyone else heard this? Could this be the reason the blooming on my set (and the other ones I tried) is so bad?

Interesting that you mention this. A few years ago I bought a Sammy LCD from Circuit City (remember them?). About a week later, Fry's ran an ad for the same TV for $100 less than what I paid at CC.

I tried to get a price match at CC and the manager flat out refused because of the same reason you mention above. So I bought the one at Fry's and returned the original to CC. However, before I returned it, I compared the serial numbers (or part numbers) and everything matched up. So if it was of different stock I would have no way of knowing this.

I should also add that after about 3 years the Sammy did start having problems. It would take several attempts to get it to power on. But this was actually a well known issue and Samsung fixed it for free, even though the warranty had expired.

Also, this is my first post to this forum. I bought the 46" version of the 909 back in April. I will post a review soon.
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post #2776 of 2895 Old 09-28-2011, 10:15 AM
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Other than the blooming and off-angle issues, the things that continue to bug me are skin tone lacking sharp detail and pigment (most people have a flat, pasty look, which is why I've adjusted hue to -6 to compensate), reds tend to be mustardy/orange rather than crimson (no fix or work-around so far), and SD or 720i content looking really bad. Of course, on the upside, blacks look great, no issues with motion when viewing decent content, and the style of the TV (no cheap, shiny, black plastic bezel) is the best I've ever seen.

These are my experiences, and my set is fully calibrated. I have the 46", and I notice so do you....... there were forum rumours last year that in some territory areas the 46" sets had the normal Samsung panels while the 52" had the Sharp UV2A.

I am very unhappy with my set, but unless I can find a 52" I will never know what is the real case here.
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post #2777 of 2895 Old 09-28-2011, 10:35 AM
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post #2778 of 2895 Old 09-28-2011, 10:44 AM
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post #2779 of 2895 Old 09-28-2011, 10:45 AM
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post #2780 of 2895 Old 09-28-2011, 05:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Trepanator View Post

For what it's worth, I've been using the 52HX909's Netflix client 3+ hours a night for the last several months. .

You will see a very dramatic and noticeable improvement if you use a $99 AppleTV or a PS3 for Netflix. You're missing a lot of quality and ease of use.
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post #2781 of 2895 Old 09-28-2011, 11:19 PM
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post #2782 of 2895 Old 09-28-2011, 11:19 PM
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post #2783 of 2895 Old 09-29-2011, 10:13 AM
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Hi all -

Is there any difference, or are there any pros/cons, between having a wireless connection to the HX909 via the Sony USB device, as opposed to a "wired" connection via ethernet cable between the TV and an Apple AirPort Express, which, in itself, is receiving IT'S connection to my router wirelessly, since my router is in a different room? In this case, they are both "wireless" connections in terms of speed, but one is using the ethernet port and the TV sees it as a wired connection...

Many thanks
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post #2784 of 2895 Old 09-29-2011, 11:09 AM
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Originally Posted by alxrmero View Post

Attachment 223967

"Batman"

Your have crushing blacks. The blacks are preventing you from seeing important details. THis picture is a prime example. Nothing that can't be fixed with some settings but I'd personally spend some time to try to change some of them to get better results.
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post #2785 of 2895 Old 09-30-2011, 09:19 AM
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Correct me if I am wrong:

The 909 will display 780P with Netflix.
The 929 will display 1080 with Netflix.

If you get the Western Digital WD TV Live Plus 1080p HD Media Player, you will not ONLY get 1080P, but 5.1 Dobly Digital.


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You will see a very dramatic and noticeable improvement if you use a $99 AppleTV or a PS3 for Netflix. You're missing a lot of quality and ease of use.

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post #2786 of 2895 Old 10-01-2011, 07:14 PM
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Does anyone here have the Sony HTCT550W Soundbar connected to their HX909 via the WSCT550B46 speaker attachment bracket? I know Sony says it's only for the the 40/46" TVs but I thought I saw that someone hooked one of these soundbars to their 52"? Thx.
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post #2787 of 2895 Old 10-02-2011, 10:23 AM
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I've never owned a plasma TV and I'd love to hear, from the perspective of HX909 owners, the pros/cons of our set vs. a set like the Samsung D8000, which is so highly rated, has great viewing angles, inky-deep blacks, no blooming or backlight bleeding, etc. I have a chance to get a great deal on one, so I'd love some critical feedback. in addition to just positive feedback from D8000 owners.

Many thanks!
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post #2788 of 2895 Old 10-02-2011, 07:32 PM
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Took the advice of some of the members on this thread and decided to fix my picture settings. Hopefully this pic is alot better.

Attachment 224335
LL
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post #2789 of 2895 Old 10-02-2011, 07:44 PM
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post #2790 of 2895 Old 10-02-2011, 08:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alxrmero View Post

Took the advice of some of the members on this thread and decided to fix my picture settings. Hopefully this pic is alot better.

attachment.php?attachmentid=224335

That pic would look much better had the score stayed that way.
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