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post #31 of 1817 Old 01-05-2011, 09:57 PM
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If I was a design engineer, and whom who had knowledge of LCD's... i would have mounted the LEDs left and right vs top and bottom in the first place. You know, just saying...
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post #32 of 1817 Old 01-05-2011, 10:02 PM
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Aside from them really grabbing your attention (they look fantastic) but I have to wonder, will the PQ be any good in that small of a form factor?

One other thing, have they greatly reduced input lag for gaming on their LCDs this year? This is my biggest gripe with their entire 2010 LCD line, the lag was just too much.

I also want to see their CCFL models as well, since they usually have better overall performance. (especially with uniformity and off angle viewing)

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post #33 of 1817 Old 01-05-2011, 10:05 PM
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the new thin bezel designs are nice and I love the picture quality of Samsungs for HD/blurays but I can't and won't get a Samsung if the gaming lag/response time is still horrible as in the past..
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post #34 of 1817 Old 01-05-2011, 10:20 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gagit811 View Post

the c8000 has what they call precision dimming, its edge lit but with dimming. The leds are on the top bottom of the screen. This new micro dimming is more of the same but with the leds mounted on the sides, this should improve on the c8000 dimming as for letter box movies you wont get flash-lighting in theory. I can see how this should improve on the dimming as I own a c8000. For the record my c8000 doesn't have flash-lighting so I guess things can only get better for d8000.

Thanks. I've owned two C8000 LED's now. The first had a slight bit of flashlighting in one of the bottom corners, but the second was better and did not really have any issue with flashlighting if I kept my backlight comfortably below 10 in a dark room.

I could care less about supposed improvements in flashlighting, since it is possible to get no flashlighting from a cheap CCFL!

The waterfall effect is a bit annoying on the C8000, even though overall I thought the picture quality was very nice. The native contrast of the panel was very good. The only major drawback was the horrible viewing angles. I know Samsung has done absolutely zero on that front. So, all I want these arseholes to do is add some local-dimming so I don't have to see light spillage across half the screen everytime there is a dark background with some white near the center of the screen.

Switching the lights from the top and bottom to the sides? Whoopty fluffing doo! Why don't these jerks put lights all around the frame, top/bottom/sides? Wouldn't that allow for even BETTER control of dimming? Maybe they will finally add LED's all around the whole frame for 2012.

When there is white text centered in the middle of a black screen, I am still going to see a wide swath of light spillage all the way from the side to the center where the text is, am I not?

Sounds like a bunch of bullcrap to me. Time to switch to Sony, and dump Samsung, now that Sony has nice glossy screens, and a 55 and 65 inch full-array locally-dimmed on tap. Perhaps LG can offer a decent screen filter for a change this year, and I can jump ship to their local-dimmer, with wider viewing angles.

Point is, Samsung can keep their edge-lit CRAP.

I can see how nice the C8000 would have been if it had some genuine local-dimming. Opportunity wasted by those chumps.
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post #35 of 1817 Old 01-05-2011, 10:38 PM
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When will D9000 available and the sizes? I'd love to put that on the living room Thought I guess it can't be swivel--stuck?
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post #36 of 1817 Old 01-05-2011, 10:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keyser View Post

Can someone please calculate for me how wide a 60- and 65-inch would be with the 0.2" bezel??

Here is a table of the width and height in 16:9 ratio for a given diagonal size. You can add whatever width that you need to figure out the actual TV dimension. The 40D6400 is looking good for me to fit in a 36" wide cabinet. So far only a 37" would fit.

Width Height
40 34.86 19.61
46 40.09 22.55
55 47.94 26.96
60 52.29 29.42
65 56.65 31.87
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post #37 of 1817 Old 01-05-2011, 10:52 PM
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great design, but not nearly as compelling as LG's or even Sony's new offering with the micro dimming plus crap.

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post #38 of 1817 Old 01-05-2011, 11:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimjianlin View Post

Here is a table of the width and height in 16:9 ratio for a given diagonal size. You can add whatever width that you need to figure out the actual TV dimension. The 40D6400 is looking good for me to fit in a 36" wide cabinet. So far only a 37" would fit.

Width Height
40 34.86 19.61
46 40.09 22.55
55 47.94 26.96
60 52.29 29.42
65 56.65 31.87

Thank you

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post #39 of 1817 Old 01-06-2011, 12:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by koffas View Post


Samsung just announced they've quadrupled their investment in OLED tech (on par with LCD). No doubt will see increasingly larger OLED TVs on the market within the next couple years.

http://www.koreaherald.com/national/...20110105000858

Awesome, looking forward to it.
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post #40 of 1817 Old 01-06-2011, 12:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimjianlin View Post

Here is a table of the width and height in 16:9 ratio for a given diagonal size. You can add whatever width that you need to figure out the actual TV dimension. The 40D6400 is looking good for me to fit in a 36" wide cabinet. So far only a 37" would fit.

Width Height
40 34.86 19.61
46 40.09 22.55
55 47.94 26.96
60 52.29 29.42
65 56.65 31.87

I would imagine the height measurement doesn't include being on a stand. Just a thought for those with cabinet enclosures.
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post #41 of 1817 Old 01-06-2011, 06:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Do-It-Yourself View Post

If I was a design engineer, and whom who had knowledge of LCD's... i would have mounted the LEDs left and right vs top and bottom in the first place. You know, just saying...

Yeah. There is small problem though: getting backlight uniformity over larger distance is more complicated. They had to learn top-bottom first before going to the left-right.
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post #42 of 1817 Old 01-06-2011, 06:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by koffas View Post

Samsung just announced they've quadrupled their investment in OLED tech (on par with LCD). No doubt will see increasingly larger OLED TVs on the market within the next couple years.
http://www.koreaherald.com/national/...20110105000858

That explains why they stopped innovating LCD, only just small & cosmetic changes. It is hard to believe they will have OLEDs
with significant sizes competing with supercheap LCDs in a few years. But things are developing at such crazy pace this may come.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DocuMaker View Post

Point is, Samsung can keep their edge-lit CRAP.I can see how nice the C8000 would have been if it had some genuine local-dimming. Opportunity wasted by those chumps.

As you can see, their likely game is jump over the messy LCDs and go to the OLED. Surely there won't be locally dimmed Samsung LCD anymore, there will be fully dimmed OLEDs at some point.
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post #43 of 1817 Old 01-06-2011, 06:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keyser View Post

Can someone please calculate for me how wide a 60- and 65-inch would be with the 0.2" bezel??

There is no 65-inch, only 55 and 60.

This begs a question: Have they given up on 65 inchers?
Or supersized sets will come later this year?
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post #44 of 1817 Old 01-06-2011, 07:06 AM
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So no full LED backlit TV's from Samsung other than the top of the line model?

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post #45 of 1817 Old 01-06-2011, 07:20 AM
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Originally Posted by sirbrillo View Post

So no full LED backlit TV's from Samsung other than the top of the line model?

Yes it looks like it. I am pretty disappointed, looks like LG will take my money this year.

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post #46 of 1817 Old 01-06-2011, 08:32 AM
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lol, looks like Samsung decided smaller bezels were what people really wanted, not better picture quality, oh no, picture quality must be perfect in their opinion, why fix that when they could just make the bezel smaller and add a few more useless gimmicks to their TVs. I miss the days when TV makers competed on picture quality and not gimmicks like apps, IPTV, 3D, bezel thickness, touchscreen remotes, etc. I have a feeling the manufacturers have decided to completely stop research on current technology and instead focus on OLED, unfortunately that means the Pioneer Kuros still won't be bested for at least another 5 years.
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post #47 of 1817 Old 01-06-2011, 09:17 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LikeEmThik View Post

lol, looks like Samsung decided smaller bezels were what people really wanted, not better picture quality, oh no, picture quality must be perfect in their opinion, why fix that when they could just make the bezel smaller and add a few more useless gimmicks to their TVs. I miss the days when TV makers competed on picture quality and not gimmicks like apps, IPTV, 3D, bezel thickness, touchscreen remotes, etc. I have a feeling the manufacturers have decided to completely stop research on current technology and instead focus on OLED, unfortunately that means the Pioneer Kuros still won't be bested for at least another 5 years.

All true, but Samsung is laughing all the way to the bank.
Speaking of those gimmicks, here are screenshots of the 2011 UI and remote.

Whatever you migh say about PQ, the near bordeless design is a head-turner.




http://www.electronista.com/articles...a.thin.bezels/
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post #48 of 1817 Old 01-06-2011, 09:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LikeEmThik View Post

lol, looks like Samsung decided smaller bezels were what people really wanted, not better picture quality, oh no, picture quality must be perfect in their opinion, why fix that when they could just make the bezel smaller and add a few more useless gimmicks to their TVs. I miss the days when TV makers competed on picture quality and not gimmicks like apps, IPTV, 3D, bezel thickness, touchscreen remotes, etc. I have a feeling the manufacturers have decided to completely stop research on current technology and instead focus on OLED, unfortunately that means the Pioneer Kuros still won't be bested for at least another 5 years.

We are to the point to where PQ even on the lowend tvs looks great. The average person can't tell the difference form full led to edge led tvs. Samsung is going to where people can tell the difference design, They have to do something to attract new buyers and still make a profit. If they go full array led with true local dimming that would only drive up production cost. Samsung stays competitive by offering lower prices then the likes of Panasonic and LG. If they did go back to full led (I would like them to) they would have to do one of two things, price it in the 4k+ range or keep it under 4k and lose money on it.

There are the others that offer full led but it looks like Samsung is out of that game. Lcd tech really has hit a wall as to improvement PQ wise, so the next step for lcd is how much thiner you can get. I didn't expect them to go this rout with the borderless bezel, but I will admit I like it. I liked the look of LG lx9500 but the banding, bad 3d and high cost kept me from buying it. At least Samsung can give you a great looking tv at reasonable prices.
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post #49 of 1817 Old 01-06-2011, 12:47 PM
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They look good, as did last years. But I do think the thinner the bezel/frame, the more likelyhood there is of clouding and flashlighting, which has become more common as these TV's have gotten slimmer, IMO.
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post #50 of 1817 Old 01-06-2011, 01:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gagit811 View Post

We are to the point to where PQ even on the lowend tvs looks great. The average person can't tell the difference form full led to edge led tvs. Samsung is going to where people can tell the difference design, They have to do something to attract new buyers and still make a profit. If they go full array led with true local dimming that would only drive up production cost. Samsung stays competitive by offering lower prices then the likes of Panasonic and LG. If they did go back to full led (I would like them to) they would have to do one of two things, price it in the 4k+ range or keep it under 4k and lose money on it.

There are the others that offer full led but it looks like Samsung is out of that game. Lcd tech really has hit a wall as to improvement PQ wise, so the next step for lcd is how much thiner you can get. I didn't expect them to go this rout with the borderless bezel, but I will admit I like it. I liked the look of LG lx9500 but the banding, bad 3d and high cost kept me from buying it. At least Samsung can give you a great looking tv at reasonable prices.

I wouldn't say the 65" LCD/LED from last year (at $5999 retail) was particularly reasonable. I am surprised they came out with a larger plasma (64") but only went to 60" in their new LCD line. Does anyone know the weight or depth of the 2011 line? The bezel is tiny but I don't think they went slimmer (like LG) did on the actual cabinet depth...
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post #51 of 1817 Old 01-06-2011, 01:44 PM
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I'm in the market for a Samsung and wanted to buy one pretty soon.

Would it be a better idea to wait for these new ones to release (I have no idea when that is)? It would probably drop the price of older ones, or have a new one in my price range, right ($300-600)?
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post #52 of 1817 Old 01-06-2011, 01:57 PM
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Until they put an IPS panels in their TVs there is no chance of me buying one. I will not accept pathetic viewing angles.

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post #53 of 1817 Old 01-06-2011, 02:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rezlov View Post

I'm in the market for a Samsung and wanted to buy one pretty soon.

Would it be a better idea to wait for these new ones to release (I have no idea when that is)? It would probably drop the price of older ones, or have a new one in my price range, right ($300-600)?

From what is seen now there are only cosmetic changes. If you are not attracted to the new make-up, it is not worth to wait.

From the plans of Samsung investment (above) it looks they have ace card in OLED and just continuing the game with LCD before the ace will show up on the walls. Most likely they perfected their Super AMOLED technology from mobiles so that it is ready for scaling up.
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post #54 of 1817 Old 01-06-2011, 02:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sitsat View Post

I wouldn't say the 65" LCD/LED from last year (at $5999 retail) was particularly reasonable. I am surprised they came out with a larger plasma (64") but only went to 60" in their new LCD line. Does anyone know the weight or depth of the 2011 line? The bezel is tiny but I don't think they went slimmer (like LG) did on the actual cabinet depth...

I would agree on their 65'', but other brands have 47''/55'' led tvs around that price point even the c9000. Samsung I believe offers more value per-dollar then some other manufacturers, just my opinion. From pictures it doesn't look the the tvs have gotten any thinner, I don't think they really needed to.

I feel like those of us that bought tvs in 2010 where just beta testing for this year. I was going to get a pn63c8000 but now I'm picking up a new D8000. These new sets use Bluetooth 3d glasses, no word on if my 3d glasses I have now are even compatible. I bet we'll have to buy an IR adapter for older 3d glasses.
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post #55 of 1817 Old 01-06-2011, 02:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irkuck View Post

From what is seen now there are only cosmetic changes. If you are not attracted to the new make-up, it is not worth to wait.

From the plans of Samsung investment (above) it looks they have ace card in OLED and just continuing the game with LCD before the ace will show up on the walls. Most likely they perfected their Super AMOLED technology from mobiles so that it is ready for scaling up.

I do like the looks, but not if they come with an extra price. Do you think the price on older models will drop when the new ones come out?

Also, has there been an announcement as to when they will be released?
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post #56 of 1817 Old 01-06-2011, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Rezlov View Post

I do like the looks, but not if they come with an extra price. Do you think the price on older models will drop when the new ones come out?

Also, has there been an announcement as to when they will be released?

prices may go down but not by much. When these new set drop they are going to be priced at a premium. So the old sets will look cheap by comparison. Samsung dose set their prices competitively so I would expect the same or not much more then last years prices. I picked up my un46c8000 last april and paid full retail, now you can get the tv almost 1k less. I would expect the same pricing cycle. Im geared up to buy a new tv right now, been saving all last year just for a bigger better tv, plus I got taxes coming up. The wife n I are getting ready to buy a new house and I want a theater room, So when these Tvs come in march I really wont care what the price is as long as I can have mine
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post #57 of 1817 Old 01-07-2011, 03:44 AM
 
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Quote:
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Until they put an IPS panels in their TVs there is no chance of me buying one. I will not accept pathetic viewing angles.

HD Guru Predictions for 2011:
http://hdguru.com/predictions-for-2011/3592/#more-3592

New LCD Panel Technology

7) DisplaySearch recently leaked information about a new type of LCD panel by Samsung, with a “new LCD cell structure called PLS, which combines the horizontal and vertical electric fields and has impressive off-axis image quality.” This may be the big surprise at the CES as Samsung remains quiet as to when its new LCD tech will debut.
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post #58 of 1817 Old 01-07-2011, 03:49 AM
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Originally Posted by DocuMaker View Post

HD Guru Predictions for 2011:
http://hdguru.com/predictions-for-2011/3592/#more-3592

New LCD Panel Technology

7) DisplaySearch recently leaked information about a new type of LCD panel by Samsung, with a new LCD cell structure called PLS, which combines the horizontal and vertical electric fields and has impressive off-axis image quality. This may be the big surprise at the CES as Samsung remains quiet as to when its new LCD tech will debut.

While I doubt that Samsung would be quiet about this kind of move, I would welcome it. Especially if it helps with their input lag troubles.

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post #59 of 1817 Old 01-07-2011, 08:24 AM
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When will the new sets be available to buy?
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post #60 of 1817 Old 01-07-2011, 08:33 AM
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When will the new sets be available to buy?

It says only "first half of 2011".
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