Official 70"+ LCD thread - Page 19 - AVS Forum
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post #541 of 1421 Old 04-25-2011, 03:23 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by specuvestor View Post

Constraints changed:
-More Energy saving, >50% less power vs 5 years ago, LCD or plasma. IIRC California Energy bill also do not apply to >50" TVs
-No more LED shortage set prerequisite for larger LCDs.
-though not mass market but pricing is attractive vs competitors. This is the main reason why I'm in this thread to witness the dawn.

Talking about future constraints they may become much more severe. One reason is that it is impossible the next few billions of consumers which will be coming on the market in places like Asia can own big flat panels even if they are energy-efficient. Both energy and environment conservation will play big role. Gas-guzzling cars are good example.

There are also likely behavioral changes so somebody owning big displays, houses, cars will be seen as a jerk.

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Originally Posted by specuvestor View Post

Constraints still:
-supply (also mean less cost down on mother glass as Asahi or Corning only makes 10G motherglass for Sharp)
-perception psychology (42" owners likely to upgrade to around 50-55" rather than 70", this been discussed previously on the mean size) WAF is major issue.
-Financial, $3000 not considered cheap as it represents a month's income for many.
-Physical like Transportation and wall area.

I can see big displays but not in the LCD context but other tech like OLED wallpaper. This could also double as heating.
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post #542 of 1421 Old 04-25-2011, 09:16 AM
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55" will be if not is already the new 42". Meaning avg. Size so anyone looking for above Avg. Size will go 60, 65, 70 and higher once its readily available and for a good price.

Yiu can get the sharp 70" 732 for $2600's which is same price or less then some 55 inchers like samsung 55D8000 so i wouldnt call the sharp 732 the ferarri of tv's, more like the toyota/honda.

Ppl dont have a chance to ignore it because its not in most stores so most ppl dont even know about it. If they do it seeit they will assume its 5-6k or more like samsung 65".
So its important for stores to post the price on it.

As long as the picture quality is as goood, many might see it and the price in store abd wantto go for the sharp 70" 732 over the 55-60" they originally came to the store for.

If you can fit 55-60, most ppl have room for the 70. Make it a thin bezel like samsung D8000 series and the 70 will fit places otherwise regelated to a 55-60"
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post #543 of 1421 Old 04-25-2011, 12:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Quatre View Post
55" will be if not is already the new 42". Meaning avg. Size so anyone looking for above Avg. Size will go 60, 65, 70 and higher once its readily available and for a good price.

Yiu can get the sharp 70" 732 for $2600's which is same price or less then some 55 inchers like samsung 55D8000 so i wouldnt call the sharp 732 the ferarri of tv's, more like the toyota/honda.

Ppl dont have a chance to ignore it because its not in most stores so most ppl dont even know about it. If they do it seeit they will assume its 5-6k or more like samsung 65".
So its important for stores to post the price on it.

As long as the picture quality is as goood, many might see it and the price in store abd wantto go for the sharp 70" 732 over the 55-60" they originally came to the store for.

If you can fit 55-60, most ppl have room for the 70. Make it a thin bezel like samsung D8000 series and the 70 will fit places otherwise regelated to a 55-60"
I agree Quatre. Others have mentioned that some people just don't want bigger TV's and that the forum members here are a very small niche group, unrepresentative of the market as a whole. While there is truth to that claim, I also think that if someone has a given budget for a TV, they will generally buy the largest screen they can afford, all else being equal. The option may be spending less for a smaller screen of similar quality, but then again it comes down to cost, assuming space is not a factor.

The same argument can be made for the size of computer monitors. Not so long ago, 20" monitors were considered large and anything larger was hard to find and extremely expensive. However, now you can buy a 28" screen for less than $300. Why would anyone be interested in a 20" today for the same price?!? Maybe only a very small percentage of the population that have a limited amount of space on their desk, but my point is that people will generally buy the largest size they can easily afford.

With TV's, the sweet spot in price / size is probably around 46" today and is gradually increasing. Knowing that technology will make TV's more affordable in the future, 60" and 70" TV's will eventually become mainstream.
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post #544 of 1421 Old 04-25-2011, 12:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Quatre
55" will be if not is already the new 42". Meaning avg. Size so anyone looking for above Avg. Size will go 60, 65, 70 and higher once its readily available and for a good price.

Yiu can get the sharp 70" 732 for $2600's which is same price or less then some 55 inchers like samsung 55D8000 so i wouldnt call the sharp 732 the ferarri of tv's, more like the toyota/honda.

Ppl dont have a chance to ignore it because its not in most stores so most ppl dont even know about it. If they do it seeit they will assume its 5-6k or more like samsung 65".
So its important for stores to post the price on it.

As long as the picture quality is as goood, many might see it and the price in store abd wantto go for the sharp 70" 732 over the 55-60" they originally came to the store for.

If you can fit 55-60, most ppl have room for the 70. Make it a thin bezel like samsung D8000 series and the 70 will fit places otherwise regelated to a 55-60"
$2600 for this tv? Um from where?
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post #545 of 1421 Old 04-25-2011, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Suzook View Post
$2600 for this tv? Um from where?
Yeah, I would like to know as well. $2969 is the local Best Buy and Sears price and I don't see it online for anything significantly different. I would love to see it at $2600 somewhere..
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post #546 of 1421 Old 04-25-2011, 04:01 PM
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Yeah, I would like to know as well. $2969 is the local Best Buy and Sears price and I don't see it online for anything significantly different. I would love to see it at $2600 somewhere..

Same here, any hesitation I have about the set would be gone if I could get it for that price. If only Amazon would get it in stock... (first party, not third party)

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post #547 of 1421 Old 04-25-2011, 04:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Quatre View Post

Led lcd is energy saving.

Also, I dont think msny ppl know about the one 70" availabe. And if they do they assume its expensive and that its "too big". As soon as they see the price, noone woukd say its too big.

Ppl used to fit monster rp crt's in small spaces with close seating. Also its the psychology that 70" is the biggest flat screen in most stores. As soon as there is 72, 75, 85 whatever. Then everyone would get the 70". Some ppl just want second to biggest or middle of the road even if they can fit and afford the 70.

Slim bezel like samsung d series will also make it look smaller causing many more to buy 70" or larger.

By your logic, people should all be buying 60" sets right now. The problem with your entirely thesis is your insistence on the use of "everyone". Everyone does not want a giant TV. Everyone will not take the biggest energy hog out there.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working. (Oh, and plasma didn't die because of logistics problems, nor does OLED ship in big boxes because it comes from Korea.)
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post #548 of 1421 Old 04-25-2011, 05:04 PM
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@bigtelevision, "I also think that if someone has a given budget for a TV, they will generally buy the largest screen they can afford, all else being equal. " This is not true. You >think> it's true, but it's not true. Go talk to sales reps and ask them if they ever sell the upscale smaller models. They will say yes. Those should sell zero units if your presumption was correct. And please don't fall back on "all else being equal". It's never equal. Some people will pay for picture quality they can't even see, features they'll never use, etc. Some people will want the TV to fit somewhere specific (99% of people?!?). Some people will simply agree to buy smaller to keep their wives happy.

@Spec, energy is still a constraint. More so in the future. Americans will have to become 20-40% more energy efficient on average just for openers. This is very doable (see California, rolling blackouts, 2000) but it means that today's 300 watts is less acceptable than 1995s 500 watts. And as irkuck says, China and India make this imperative that much stronger. It's almost like the developed world needs to help lead the developing world into lower-powered electronics, before it's too late.

The other constraints you list are real and many have a certain permanence.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working. (Oh, and plasma didn't die because of logistics problems, nor does OLED ship in big boxes because it comes from Korea.)
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post #549 of 1421 Old 04-26-2011, 08:19 AM
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Originally Posted by rogo View Post

@bigtelevision, "I also think that if someone has a given budget for a TV, they will generally buy the largest screen they can afford, all else being equal. " This is not true. You >think> it's true, but it's not true. Go talk to sales reps and ask them if they ever sell the upscale smaller models. They will say yes. Those should sell zero units if your presumption was correct. And please don't fall back on "all else being equal". It's never equal. Some people will pay for picture quality they can't even see, features they'll never use, etc. Some people will want the TV to fit somewhere specific (99% of people?!?). Some people will simply agree to buy smaller to keep their wives happy.

@Spec, energy is still a constraint. More so in the future. Americans will have to become 20-40% more energy efficient on average just for openers. This is very doable (see California, rolling blackouts, 2000) but it means that today's 300 watts is less acceptable than 1995s 500 watts. And as irkuck says, China and India make this imperative that much stronger. It's almost like the developed world needs to help lead the developing world into lower-powered electronics, before it's too late.

The other constraints you list are real and many have a certain permanence.

Rogo, I agree that upscale smaller units sell. I think you misunderstood my qualification of "all else being equal". Yes, some people have a space limitation and need the TV to fit in a certain location or cabinet. However, most, not all, will buy the largest TV that will fit in that location. If someone can only accommodate a 40" set, do you think they would opt for an upscale 32" set instead?? More than likely they will purchase a 40" set, upscale or not.

Some will also opt for a smaller upscale model because they want the features or due to PQ, etc, but for those consumers for which space is not a significant limitation, they will still purchase the largest TV with all the features they want for their given budget. If they had a larger budget, they would buy a larger upscale TV. As larger TV's become more affordable and available, the average TV size purchased will increase.

Yes, energy consumption is also consideration but TV's are also becoming more energy efficient. From the consumer side, unfortunately most, not all, consumers don't place energy consumption as the top consideration in their purchase, otherwise plasma TV's would not sell. There are also other more significant areas in the home where energy consumption could be reduced such as the AC unit or refrigerator.
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post #550 of 1421 Old 04-26-2011, 01:40 PM
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Originally Posted by rogo View Post

@bigtelevision, "I also think that if someone has a given budget for a TV, they will generally buy the largest screen they can afford, all else being equal. " This is not true. You >think> it's true, but it's not true. Go talk to sales reps and ask them if they ever sell the upscale smaller models. They will say yes. Those should sell zero units if your presumption was correct. And please don't fall back on "all else being equal". It's never equal. Some people will pay for picture quality they can't even see, features they'll never use, etc. Some people will want the TV to fit somewhere specific (99% of people?!?). Some people will simply agree to buy smaller to keep their wives happy.

@Spec, energy is still a constraint. More so in the future. Americans will have to become 20-40% more energy efficient on average just for openers. This is very doable (see California, rolling blackouts, 2000) but it means that today's 300 watts is less acceptable than 1995s 500 watts. And as irkuck says, China and India make this imperative that much stronger. It's almost like the developed world needs to help lead the developing world into lower-powered electronics, before it's too late.

The other constraints you list are real and many have a certain permanence.

Nothing you said negates the fact that the biggest regret people have is not buying the biggest panel they can afford and that fits their viewing room.
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post #551 of 1421 Old 04-26-2011, 03:16 PM
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Nothing you said negates the fact that the biggest regret people have is not buying the biggest panel they can afford and that fits their viewing room.

Biggest regret is usually one's 1st marriage. If not for that, most could easily afford a much bigger tv.
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post #552 of 1421 Old 04-26-2011, 09:16 PM
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@bigtv, "but for those consumers for which space is not a significant limitation, they will still purchase the largest TV with all the features they want for their given budget". I know you believe this to be true. I do not. I have seen countless people buy smaller TVs than their budget would allow or who have failed to make efforts to fill available space.

@spyboy, do you know that to be true? I don't hear that from people very often. I hear it at AVS very often. I think the mass market and AVS have very, very little in common.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working. (Oh, and plasma didn't die because of logistics problems, nor does OLED ship in big boxes because it comes from Korea.)
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post #553 of 1421 Old 04-27-2011, 04:16 AM
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A bit off topic but on my point why I think Sharp is selling the 70" at a operating loss @$3000 (likely EBITDA positive though) ASP per meter square for LG Display is $694 flat QoQ -17.2% YoY, and $708 for AUO -2.3% QoQ -15.8% YoY:

April 18 (Bloomberg) -- LG Display Co., the world’s second-largest maker of liquid-crystal displays, posted a loss that’s smaller than analysts estimated on demand for panels for smartphones and tablet computers.
The company had a net loss of 115.4 billion won ($106 million) in the three months ended in March, LG Display said in a statement today. That compared with an average estimate for a loss of 208.4 billion won in a Bloomberg survey of 12 analysts. Sales fell 8.7 percent to 5.37 trillion won.
LG may post a profit in the second quarter, helped by demand for displays in mobile devices and 3-D TVs, said the company, which makes screens for Apple Inc.’s iPad. Prices for displays used in tablet computers and laptops will likely maintain an “upward momentum,” Seoul-based LG said.

April 27 (Bloomberg) -- AU Optronics Corp., Taiwan’s second-largest maker of liquid-crystal displays, posted a quarterly loss that was double analysts’ estimate after prices of panels used in televisions fell to the lowest in two years.
First-quarter net loss was NT$13.9 billion ($482 million), compared with a profit of NT$7.3 billion a year earlier, the Hsinchu, Taiwan-based company said today. The average of 17 analysts’ estimates compiled by Bloomberg was for a loss of NT$6.8 billion.
AU Optronics, which supplies to Hewlett-Packard Co. and Sony Corp., posted revenue that missed analyst estimates because of lower-than-expected television panel prices and falling sales of smaller displays. Prices for TV panels are expected to “bottom out” in the current three months and remain “flat” from the first quarter, while those for computer displays may increase by a single-digit percentage, the company said.
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post #554 of 1421 Old 04-27-2011, 04:25 AM
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Originally Posted by rogo View Post

@bigtv, "but for those consumers for which space is not a significant limitation, they will still purchase the largest TV with all the features they want for their given budget". I know you believe this to be true. I do not. I have seen countless people buy smaller TVs than their budget would allow or who have failed to make efforts to fill available space.

@spyboy, do you know that to be true? I don't hear that from people very often. I hear it at AVS very often. I think the mass market and AVS have very, very little in common.

Don't you think that your theory will be disproved by Sharp ventures in multiple 70" panel lines? I say there's an entire huge segment of RPTV consumers that are and will continue to eye and purchase the Sharp Giant 70" units in multiple variations and Sharp will have multiple tiers to cover that segment.

We have more than a decade of RPTV owners from about a dozen manufacturers dwindled down to one with Mitsubishi. These folks along with consumers craving larger flat panels and without FP room astetics that will be filling this segment that Sharp has now created for 2011. How can anyone deny this massive RPTV segment that has dwindled close to extinction but comprise about 20 years+ evolution but will always crave the larger size they've grown accustomed to with RPTV and for many the Sharp will cost less than their original RPTV.

Are you actually telling us you've never bought a TV and not craved a larger more immersive experience? Come on - I would bet it's happened to us all.

What you "SEE" versus actually global consumer base are very diverse as to make such a comparison meaningless - your personal observations cannot be applied to a global market when flat panels are selling at the rate of over 130 million and growing - that size creates segments and tiers to be filled that you cannot comprehend individually. Sharp knows they have a RPTV segment that is massive in N. America and they have the economics in it's glass production at Sakai and retrofitted K1/K2 to fill that void that others may lack.

Price is no longer a barrier at least with Sharp since in the original large screen units that were over $10K. If there wasn't this market why would Panasonic build multiple variations of their 65" or build even larger for high end customers. The market is there and the pricing is now becoming consumer friendly and that can only be disproven if Sharp and others fail in that segment and so far I don't see it happening with Sharp or Panasonic or Samsung/Sony 65" panels.

Samsung 65F8000, 60D8000, 40HU6350, Panasonic 50E60 LCD's
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post #555 of 1421 Old 04-27-2011, 05:08 AM - Thread Starter
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I say there's an entire huge segment of RPTV consumers that are and will continue to eye and purchase the Sharp Giant 70" units in multiple variations and Sharp will have multiple tiers to cover that segment.
..... If there wasn't this market why would Panasonic build multiple variations of their 65" or build even larger for high end customers. The market is there and the pricing is now becoming consumer friendly and that can only be disproven if Sharp and others fail in that segment and so far I don't see it happening with Sharp or Panasonic or Samsung/Sony 65" panels.

You seem to miss the point. Nobody is denying the market for huge sets, it is there and will be there. The point is how big is this in proportion to the market as a whole. Is this market growing (proportionally) , will it become mainstream? Average size of TV is increasing with time passing. Core question is: Will this continue or will taper off? Practically speaking: Will the likes Sharp 70" become main segment of TVs sold? Some people here claim this is only the issue of price, with price low everybody is rushing for 70 inchers and more. Others like myself think that mainstream consumers have a limit on size: the do not want their sets dominate their houses. This does not concern upper segments of consumers: videophiles, movie lovers, owners of dedicated home theaters, 'bigger is better' folks. They all welcome huge sets but this is margin of the overall market.
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post #556 of 1421 Old 04-27-2011, 08:50 AM
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You seem to miss the point. Nobody is denying the market for huge sets, it is there and will be there. The point is how big is this in proportion to the market as a whole. Is this market growing (proportionally) , will it become mainstream?

There are many people in this thread denying the market for huge sets, you could make the argument that it's the majority of the thread. Large displays will never be mainstream... the mainstream comparison only gets gets brought up when someone makes a persuasive argument that there is a viable market for large displays.
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post #557 of 1421 Old 04-27-2011, 09:32 AM
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You seem to miss the point. Nobody is denying the market for huge sets, it is there and will be there. The point is how big is this in proportion to the market as a whole. Is this market growing (proportionally) , will it become mainstream? Average size of TV is increasing with time passing. Core question is: Will this continue or will taper off? Practically speaking: Will the likes Sharp 70" become main segment of TVs sold? Some people here claim this is only the issue of price, with price low everybody is rushing for 70 inchers and more. Others like myself think that mainstream consumers have a limit on size: the do not want their sets dominate their houses. This does not concern upper segments of consumers: videophiles, movie lovers, owners of dedicated home theaters, 'bigger is better' folks. They all welcome huge sets but this is margin of the overall market.

My thought on this is that the increase in average TV size will taper off eventually but not until 70" or even larger sets become mainstream in 15-20 years. Beyond that, who knows what future technology will bring us.

Going back 20 years, a 35" CRT was considered extremely large and had a low WAF. Today, a 37" flat panel is considered small and has a much higher WAF because most every household today has a 37" set or LARGER. Sure it helps that flat panels take up less space than CRT's, but the perception of TV size is changing with time as larger TV's become more affordable and more commonplace and acceptable in homes. I also believe that as the functionality and integration of a TV expands to include wireless internet, on-demand movies, Skype, viewing photos, etc, its value as a home's centerpiece increases making larger sets still more desirable.

I think its important to view the future not from today's perspective but from what we expect our perspective will be in the future. This doesn't mean we can predict the future but advances in technology have continued to result in drastic changes to our culture and society. Just like 20 years ago no one would have imagined that hand held smart phones would be "free" or that a 35" TV would be considered small, no one today (or at least very few) would think that a 70" or larger set will be the norm.
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post #558 of 1421 Old 04-27-2011, 02:07 PM
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@Spec, is it possible that Sharp simply has a lower cost of making these panels than the other guys? I mean they use mostly in-house technology and have been doing this longer than anyone else. (Of course, you could be right they are taking a loss per sale, but that's very inconsistent with behavior in a market like this, which is why I'm skeptical they are. You raise good points, but I'm skeptical).

@Westa, after your personal invective against me last time, I'm loathe to respond at all. As noted below your post, you miss the point. And actually, my personal observations are very real. There was a saying I learned some time back "anecdote is the singular of data". I'll let you parse it for a while. I have encountered numerous people who don't buy the biggest thing available. Nothing in the market is going to change their behavior.

When you look at the market, you see "the kind of people who frequent AVS". Those people might have regrets about immersiveness. The Rogo family is currently in the market for a larger TV. We will, however, consider the way it looks in the room almost as much as we'll consider the way the picture itself looks. We will also factor in power consumption and features. Given that we'll likely keep the TV for 5+ years, I doubt a gap between $3000 and $5000 will really figure in much to what we end up.

@Irkuck, it's like reading something my brain was thinking.

@bigtv, a huge change in waf is that 37" TVs today are 3" thick and way like 35 lbs. The 35" CRT from then weighed 200 lbs and was 2 feet thick. It dominated a room the way a 50" would not today.

All that said, I don't think people really appreciate how negatively lots of people would react to a 6-foot-wide television being slapped on the wall or a credenza. I don't think people really appreciate how few homes in the U.S. could even possibly accommodate such a thing without altering furniture or walls -- and how few people would consider such an alteration.

While I admit I don't have any data, my guess is that among U.S. households (existing construction, all types of home) the addressable market for 70" TVs is currently 25% on the high side. Keep in mind, many Americans live in MDUs, small houses, open plan homes without giant swaths of wall, etc. I know some of you think "Everyone I know could fit a 70" TV in there house." But the issue is not of theoretical fit, it's of an actual, realistic space to place the TV that is consistent with where the TV currently is.

In Japan, the addressable market for 70" TVs is probably below 5% and Europe is similar.

Let's just pretend I am woefully wrong and that the addressable markets are 50% in the US (not a chance, but whatever), 20% in Europe and Japan. Let's also understand that in places like China and India the vast vast middle class will buy something inexpensive for generations. Already, we have ruled out the possibility of 70" TVs being "mainstream" by virtue of the fact that there isn't space for them.

I am pretty convinced that the maximum addressable market in the US is closer to the 25% number and that if you then segment inside that space the people with minimal TV watching, the people who would rather spend less, the people who would just flat out never consider a TV of 70 inches, you are looking at a cap in the US on the segment of 10% or so. And caps of 2-3% in Japan/Europe. And I am talking for a generation or two since housing stocks tend not to alter and geographic macro-trends will favor smaller homes as rising oceans make coastal lowlands increasingly difficult to inhabit toward the middle century (before we even bother debating global warming's cause, please understand I don't debate science and seas are rising; the only question on rising seas is whether or not we're headed for a tipping point where rises of many feet occur over a decade or two.)

The other macro trend that's important is the need to use less energy. And therefore, the mere presence of 70" TVs will be good news for the 60" TV, which will use less power -- all else being equal. Things that consume 1000 watts are already unpopular energy hogs; I doubt we will see the comeback of wasting energy when the cost of power will be headed up.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working. (Oh, and plasma didn't die because of logistics problems, nor does OLED ship in big boxes because it comes from Korea.)
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post #559 of 1421 Old 04-27-2011, 02:35 PM
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Well articulated but when push comes to shove it's still speculation and no more factual than the guy who says "everybody wants a big TV".

Would it be safe to say the potential market for a 70" would be all those who have, or are considering a 65", a large RPTV or a front projection unit but don't want the worry of day time wash out, power consumption, bulb replacement or difficulty with the installation...and "whatever that percentage is" would be the customer base for a 70" display. For arguments sake lets just go with that number and call it good.
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post #560 of 1421 Old 04-27-2011, 06:14 PM
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+1 as I posted previously if 70" sells 2m or 1% of total TV volume, then it would have matched or exceeded the sale of huge RPTV or home projector sales, and I would suggest there is a market for it and crossed a tipping point.

If it actually sells 20m or 10% of market I would think it is considered mainstream, not to mention 25%. I think iPhones are mainstream though only 1 in 10 uses it while windows phone is not. Plasma is mainstream for that matter as well. It may not be the largest market share but anyone coming out of a cave looking for a TV will likely know about it is considered mainstream IMHO.

@rogo I think operating expense in Sharp Japan is unlikely to be cheaper than Korea or Taiwan. At 8G or 8.5G I think their cost will almost certainly not be cheaper. My guess is that their operating cost at 10G is unlikely to be much cheaper than $700 per meter square. For curiosity sake I probably will take a closer look at their end March numbers on an EBITDA basis to remove the underutilization penalty.
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post #561 of 1421 Old 04-28-2011, 06:27 AM
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"LCD segment 4Q FY3/11 sales were ¥244.5bn, operating profit ¥11.1bn and operating margin just under 5%. Almost all the operating profit came from smallmedium size LCDs. Its large LCD operations appear to be loss-making, and the margin on small-medium size LCDs is likely well above 5%. The conversion of the Kameyama No. 2 plant to small-size LCD production should further boost profitability. If Sharp could find some way to bring its large LCD business back to break even, we believe LCD segment operating profit of ¥50bn would be eminently achievable." -Merrill Lynch 27 Apr

"Opinion on results: As we highlighted in our Mar 1 note, large patent revenues helped turn the LCD business profitable in 4Q. Excluding these patent revenues, our models suggest LCD losses in excess of ¥20.0bn; in other words, it appears these patent revenues were large enough to offset.

Opinion on outlook: Panel start-ups at both Sakai and Kameyama were suspended on Apr 1, which we estimate are producing losses of approx. ¥20.0bn/month. Even if Sharp resumes operations incrementally from May, we would estimate 1Q losses of ¥35.0bn for LCDs and ¥25.5bn overall." -Morgan Stanley 28 Apr

You guys definitely getting a good deal on the 70" at $3000
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post #562 of 1421 Old 04-28-2011, 08:53 AM
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Another 70" High End on the way in late summer/fall.

Just announced this morning in Scandanavia at flatpanelsHD.

"Sharp has unveiled a LE830 range and the 70-inch LE73x range. According to our sources they also have the X5 flagship model prepared for August 2011 – before IFA 2011 in Berlin. We have no pictures of the TV at this point but our sources say that it’s going to be slim and “very elegant”."

"Sharp X5 will launch in 60 and 70 inches called LC-60X5 and LC-70X5. It’s the successor to the previous XS1 that was launched a few years ago.

Sharp X5 will feature backlit LED with local dimming, scanning backlights, 200/240 Hz, Quattron, and 3D. A range of multimedia functionality have also been incorporated such as the Aquos Net+ internet platform, Skype, DLNA, Wi-Fi and USB playback with DivX HD support.

We have also received information that X5 will include a built-in hard drive, dual tuners and iPhone/iPad remote controlling but we cannot confirm that information at this point. (These features are usually reserved for European models that never seem to make it to N. America)

Sharp X5 is scheduled for august 2011 release in 60 and 70 inches. The price is said to be much more “reasonable” than the previous XS1."

Samsung 65F8000, 60D8000, 40HU6350, Panasonic 50E60 LCD's
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post #563 of 1421 Old 05-01-2011, 12:35 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by westa6969 View Post
Another 70" High End on the way in late summer/fall.

Just announced this morning in Scandanavia at flatpanelsHD.

"Sharp has unveiled a LE830 range and the 70-inch LE73x range. According to our sources they also have the X5 flagship model prepared for August 2011 – before IFA 2011 in Berlin. We have no pictures of the TV at this point but our sources say that it’s going to be slim and “very elegant”."

"Sharp X5 will launch in 60 and 70 inches called LC-60X5 and LC-70X5. It’s the successor to the previous XS1 that was launched a few years ago.

Sharp X5 will feature backlit LED with local dimming, scanning backlights, 200/240 Hz, Quattron, and 3D. A range of multimedia functionality have also been incorporated such as the Aquos Net+ internet platform, Skype, DLNA, Wi-Fi and USB playback with DivX HD support.

We have also received information that X5 will include a built-in hard drive, dual tuners and iPhone/iPad remote controlling but we cannot confirm that information at this point. (These features are usually reserved for European models that never seem to make it to N. America)

Sharp X5 is scheduled for august 2011 release in 60 and 70 inches. The price is said to be much more “reasonable” than the previous XS1."

On first look these could be EU versions of sets already announced in the US. But the new X-names with apparent ultra-high-end branding suggest at least new sophisticated cosmetics.
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post #564 of 1421 Old 05-01-2011, 08:27 PM
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Originally Posted by irkuck View Post

Now it it interesting what will happen to Sharp. They fired 70 inchers as the last strategic asset but it may be not enough.

I'm not sure if you know how realistic this statement may be. A forumer just said he bought the 70" at $2600+ while Sharp is clearing inventory and halting G10 production. I'm worried if this is preamble for something else, like pio when it launched 9G kuro
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post #565 of 1421 Old 05-01-2011, 08:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by westa6969 View Post

Another 70" High End on the way in late summer/fall.

Just announced this morning in Scandanavia at flatpanelsHD.

"Sharp has unveiled a LE830 range and the 70-inch LE73x range. According to our sources they also have the X5 flagship model prepared for August 2011 - before IFA 2011 in Berlin. We have no pictures of the TV at this point but our sources say that it's going to be slim and "very elegant"."

"Sharp X5 will launch in 60 and 70 inches called LC-60X5 and LC-70X5. It's the successor to the previous XS1 that was launched a few years ago.

Sharp X5 will feature backlit LED with local dimming, scanning backlights, 200/240 Hz, Quattron, and 3D. A range of multimedia functionality have also been incorporated such as the Aquos Net+ internet platform, Skype, DLNA, Wi-Fi and USB playback with DivX HD support.

We have also received information that X5 will include a built-in hard drive, dual tuners and iPhone/iPad remote controlling but we cannot confirm that information at this point. (These features are usually reserved for European models that never seem to make it to N. America)

Sharp X5 is scheduled for august 2011 release in 60 and 70 inches. The price is said to be much more "reasonable" than the previous XS1."

Thanks for this good news. I hope there is a thin 3d model to compete with the samsung 65C and D8000 aesthetically.
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post #566 of 1421 Old 05-02-2011, 01:53 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by specuvestor View Post

I'm not sure if you know how realistic this statement may be. A forumer just said he bought the 70" at $2600+ while Sharp is clearing inventory and halting G10 production. I'm worried if this is preamble for something else, like pio when it launched 9G kuro

I missed that Sharp is halting 10G production, where is the info coming from?
Maybe this is just shift to China as there were rumors Sharp intends to start 10G there?

In any case, things as they are LCD is not good business. Sony made losses through 7 ys until finally gave up. There will be only Sony branded TVs. Thus
no wonder Sharp may be moving same way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quatre View Post

Thanks for this good news. I hope there is a thin 3d model to compete with the samsung 65C and D8000 aesthetically.

Umm, but not at the cost of backlight uniformity
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post #567 of 1421 Old 05-02-2011, 05:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irkuck View Post

I missed that Sharp is halting 10G production, where is the info coming from?
Maybe this is just shift to China as there were rumors Sharp intends to start 10G there?

In any case, things as they are LCD is not good business. Sony made losses through 7 ys until finally gave up. There will be only Sony branded TVs. Thus
no wonder Sharp may be moving same way.



Umm, but not at the cost of backlight uniformity

Sharp announced on 4/8 (?) that they were stopping production of new panels until the end of the first week in May due to supply chain problems caused by the earthquake. However, they also said that they had enough completed panels in inventory to continue assembling TVs for 30 days. If true, TV shipments to retail should not be effected.

Regarding the X5, a reliable source says these will be available in late July. The source is getting an early unit in mid-late June to include in this years high end model "shootout". He is trying to get MSRP info and may have it this week.
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post #568 of 1421 Old 05-02-2011, 09:15 AM
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In terms of picture quality, would a new 70"+ LCD set be better or worse than getting a new optical block for my Sony SXRD 70" with the dreaded green blob or buying a new 70"DLP? Thinness of the set is not a concern for me and I'm not very interested in 3D.

Will all of the new Sharp models have the quattron yellow pixel that Widescreen Review recently panned?

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post #569 of 1421 Old 05-02-2011, 09:27 AM
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Major constraint is that there will be more constraints . Energy, environment and behavioral constraints are inevitable.



Yes, this is a constraint. On one hand display over 100" would be touching floor if put at eye level. On the other hand such big display probably would be more like cinema so could be hanged bit higher.

Less energy is used watching a movie at home on a large tv than driving to a movie theater.

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post #570 of 1421 Old 05-02-2011, 04:23 PM
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I'm interested in the 935 Sharp (whatever model # it ships under) a lot more than an X5.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working. (Oh, and plasma didn't die because of logistics problems, nor does OLED ship in big boxes because it comes from Korea.)
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