"Lowest" end sony with IPS panel, if any? or LG, Panasonic, & Vizio only? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 30 Old 02-08-2011, 01:55 AM - Thread Starter
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Just curious which if any currently available Sony models would be certain to have an IPS panel. I found their panel code reference here that listed IPS, but could not identify any models with the IPS code designation.

I've just noticed with my mom & dad's sony, she has chairs waay out to the side, & the pic looks just as rich from any angle (though i have not confirmed that it is actually an IPS in there). Also, I am clinging to my old thinkpad w/an IPS panel for as long as possible for the same reason vs. any other notebook I've used. So between those observations & reading reviews about having to sit perpendicular to so many panels to preserve colors etc. I'd like an IPS, & prefer to stick with sony.

LG would have to be from a B&M store because I don't want to play the buy & return lottery for a "W" serial number, & the Panasonic lCD reviews don't seem quite as favorable, but at least you know you're getting an IPS when their website tells you that's what's in there. MIght take some convincing/educating to go with Vizio.

Not going to be too picky about type "alpha", & want to leave price & size out of the equation for the moment just to see what my options are. Flexible in that regard.

Prefer ccfl over led backlighting, but that's low priority as that's the direction they're headed now & want to keep options open. Same with 60/120/240Hz etc.


Any input/advice appreciated.
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post #2 of 30 Old 02-08-2011, 04:32 AM
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I don't think Sony is using any IPS screens, but I believe Sanyo does if you want to add another option to your list.
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post #3 of 30 Old 02-08-2011, 08:35 AM
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interesting question. i always wondered if led/ccfl lcd tv were ips or tn display. no one seems to mention/clear care about it. not even professional tv reviewer do, yet they always criticizes lcd for their poor viewing angles compared to plasma. i would assume the critique would want to tell us what kind of lcd panel it is for thoroughness sake. either that or lcd tv doesn't use either ips or tn display but some other variant. can someone elaborate? thanks
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post #4 of 30 Old 02-08-2011, 09:49 AM
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Very few TVs are TN panels most are IPS (in some form) or VA. TN is pretty much reserved for PC monitors since you're generally staring at them straight on.

This is kinda sad as Samsung makes some pretty bitchin' PC monitors including their 24" FX monitor which has a tuner built into it and costs as much as some 22 - 26" TVs packs a lowly TN panel. Sure made me feel better when I saw that about spending the extra $25 to get the 26".

Must..find...technogoodies!!!!
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post #5 of 30 Old 06-12-2011, 11:52 PM
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only LG is using the IPS panel in there 3D TV( which can b used as a monitor also), sony is using VA panel.....
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post #6 of 30 Old 06-13-2011, 02:38 AM
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post #7 of 30 Old 06-13-2011, 09:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by verma_anirudh View Post

only LG is using the IPS panel in there 3D TV( which can b used as a monitor also), sony is using VA panel.....

The LG 42LK450 (LCD) uses the S-IPS panel. The fourth letter of the product code is a "Y" (as opposed to last year's S-IPS designation which used a "W"). The panel type has been confirmed by the loupe test (magnifying glass).
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post #8 of 30 Old 07-14-2011, 09:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Otto Pylot View Post

The LG 42LK450 (LCD) uses the S-IPS panel. The fourth letter of the product code is a "Y" (as opposed to last year's S-IPS designation which used a "W"). The panel type has been confirmed by the loupe test (magnifying glass).

Hello Otto, my "pilot" friend: Just found your post on this site. I trust you're well, and that life on the Peninsula is good.

As you will recall, I ordered the LG-37LE3500 but it came without the IPS & I declined the delivery. Instead I went for the Panasonic TC -L37E3 which does have the IPS panel; but it turned out to be a bomb with rather obvious screen uniformity and sharpness/focus issues, as well as problems in getting decent color/brightness combinations. I need to return it too. Do you know if anything changed at LG re. the IPS panel issues? And finally, what about the 37" size for the 450k of which you wrote. Does that also have the IPS panel? Maybe that's what I should buy. And if you don't know how could one find out? As before, I am not interested bells and whilstles, a dependably excellent picture from a non-reflective screen is all I really need. Thomas.
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post #9 of 30 Old 07-14-2011, 10:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tomstan View Post

Hello Otto, my "pilot" friend: Just found your post on this site. I trust you're well, and that life on the Peninsula is good.

As you will recall, I ordered the LG-37LE3500 but it came without the IPS & I declined the delivery. Instead I went for the Panasonic TC -L37E3 which does have the IPS panel; but it turned out to be a bomb with rather obvious screen uniformity and sharpness/focus issues, as well as problems in getting decent color/brightness combinations. I need to return it too. Do you know if anything changed at LG re. the IPS panel issues? And finally, what about the 37" size for the 450k of which you wrote. Does that also have the IPS panel? Maybe that's what I should buy. And if you don't know how could one find out? As before, I am not interested bells and whilstles, a dependably excellent picture from a non-reflective screen is all I really need. Thomas.


Howdy Tomstan. Life is good (that is not a plug for LG ) I have heard that the 37LK450 does indeed have the S-IPS panel ( "Y" in the fourth position of the product code), but as always, I'd use the loupe test on a floor model if you can and confirm. As far as any IPS issues, I don't think LG has changed their "policy" on being quiet as to what kind of IPS panels they put in their various models. You should be able to find a floor model at BB or Fry's.
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post #10 of 30 Old 07-14-2011, 08:13 PM
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I guess we've been out of touch for too long. I thought I had mentioned last month that BB doesn't have the 37LV3500s, not in their B&M's nor on their web site; and we don't have a Fry's in my New Mexico burg. That's why I was forced to buy from the web via Vann's and it didn't work. I do believe that our local BB actually does have the LK450, I should check into it. But do all LK450's have the IPS panel or could the one you heard zbout have merely been one-off? I have now talked to my daughter in your bailiewick to check out the LV3500 at Fry's to see if they actually have any with the IPS panels and, if yes, can they ship it to me here as an internet order. We'll see. And just to confirm, you do think that the 3500 has the matte screen? Thomas
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post #11 of 30 Old 07-14-2011, 08:32 PM
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LCD/LED with some variant of IPS i know of = Panasonic, Vizio, LG, Philips

Pros of IPS - good viewing angles, little to no ghosting in dark scenes

Cons of IPS - black levels are awful which equals poor contrast ratio

The 100,000:1 dynamic contrast ratio are marketing gimmicks, you'd have to use the dynamic contrast setting at high to get those results and the picture becomes so washed out at HIGH its unwatchable
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post #12 of 30 Old 07-14-2011, 08:36 PM
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Otto: FYI - Just checked the 37LK450 listing on Amazon - there were reports that they lost the IPS panel lottery. Evidently, the IPS panel is not the standard for this unit. Caveat Emptor. SO, buy it locally, if at all, and look for the great "Y". Thomas
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post #13 of 30 Old 07-14-2011, 08:40 PM
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Jangaboo: FYI, I actually bought the Panasonic TC-L37E3 and it was a bomb. See my e-mail yesterday, above. Cannot recommend this to anyone with a critical eye. But it does have a pretty design and a good remote. Thomas
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post #14 of 30 Old 07-14-2011, 08:41 PM
 
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You should add Sharp to your list...

ASV(which is their own design) has always had a consistently wider angle of view than everybody else.

By the way...Sony typically uses IPS on their lower end TV, ASV in their top TV's.
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post #15 of 30 Old 07-14-2011, 09:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schan1269 View Post

You should add Sharp to your list...

ASV(which is their own design) has always had a consistently wider angle of view than everybody else.

By the way...Sony typically uses IPS on their lower end TV, ASV in their top TV's.

pretty sure thats incorrect about Sony using IPS even in lower end sets, pretty sure Sony is all VA panels - i own a 40ex401 and its a Samsung VA panel

A good test for IPS is touching the screen, TN panels would also respond the same way as IPS



i was a supporter of IPS before but I prefer VA technology now for far better black levels and I haven't noticed any ghosting in dark scenes at least with this Samsung Va panel

the 32lv2500 from LG rated below is probably an AUO VA Panel, it was said to have great black levels but poor viewing angles which are characteristics of VA




http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TFT_LCD
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post #16 of 30 Old 07-14-2011, 09:24 PM
 
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Sony's high end LCD use Sharp's ASV panel. I don't follow LCD though.

And, ASV has ALWAYS had a wider actual viewing angle than IPS.

The difference is...

ASV has a wider INITIAL angle of view(almost 60 degrees off axis). By the time you get to the extreme(closing in on 75 degrees) ASV finally trails off and IPS has a slight edge at the EXTREME edge of viewing angle.

But if you need a panel for the extreme viewing angle(greater than 70 degrees) you should be buying a plasma.
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post #17 of 30 Old 07-14-2011, 09:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jangaboo View Post

pretty sure thats incorrect about Sony using IPS even in lower end sets, pretty sure Sony is all VA panels - i own a 40ex401 and its a Samsung VA panel

Sony has a LCD fab JV with Samsung called SLCD which produces VA panels
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post #18 of 30 Old 07-14-2011, 09:56 PM
 
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So Sony uses VA, IPS and ASV...cool.

Anyway, ASV are the best for viewing angle.
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post #19 of 30 Old 07-15-2011, 04:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schan1269 View Post

Sony's high end LCD use Sharp's ASV panel. I don't follow LCD though.

And, ASV has ALWAYS had a wider actual viewing angle than IPS.

The difference is...

ASV has a wider INITIAL angle of view(almost 60 degrees off axis). By the time you get to the extreme(closing in on 75 degrees) ASV finally trails off and IPS has a slight edge at the EXTREME edge of viewing angle.

But if you need a panel for the extreme viewing angle(greater than 70 degrees) you should be buying a plasma.

This is contrary to all the reviews of Sharps that I've come across. ASV is almost always reported to have the worst viewing angle of the 3 technologies. Sharp's trump card is that they've always had the biggest panels, not their viewing angle.
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post #20 of 30 Old 07-15-2011, 04:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Frank Benign View Post

This is contrary to all the reviews of Sharps that I've come across. ASV is almost always reported to have the worst viewing angle of the 3 technologies. Sharp's trump card is that they've always had the biggest panels, not their viewing angle.

I agree. I've looked at a lot of tv's lately and always compare them from off axis viewing angles. Sharp seems to be about the worst which surprised me actually.
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post #21 of 30 Old 07-15-2011, 07:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jangaboo View Post

pretty sure thats incorrect about Sony using IPS even in lower end sets, pretty sure Sony is all VA panels - i own a 40ex401 and its a Samsung VA panel

A good test for IPS is touching the screen, TN panels would also respond the same way as IPS



i was a supporter of IPS before but I prefer VA technology now for far better black levels and I haven't noticed any ghosting in dark scenes at least with this Samsung Va panel

the 32lv2500 from LG rated below is probably an AUO VA Panel, it was said to have great black levels but poor viewing angles which are characteristics of VA




http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TFT_LCD

Jangaboo: Highly interesting input, thank you very much. It seems that LG's LK450 scores best in that department. I should re-evalue it relative to LG's 37LV3500. Do you know if your test was with an IPS panel? According to a couple of posts I've seen on the web the LK450's don't all come with the IPS. It seems LG also inserts these panels whenever they feel like it. Thomas
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post #22 of 30 Old 07-15-2011, 10:18 AM
 
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Notice I said INITIAL viewing angle...not EXTREME viewing angle.

ASV panels have the best INITIAL viewing angle at 45 degrees(as in how far from center you can get BEFORE there is ANY noticeable difference). At 60 degrees ASV starts to fall off enough that IPS starts matching it. Beyond 70 degrees IPS does finally have an advantage.

But, if you need greater than 60 degrees...buy a plasma.

So, which stat is more important? The people at 80 degrees able to see it? Or everybody within 45 degrees having the same picture as the person "dead center"?
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post #23 of 30 Old 07-15-2011, 01:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tomstan View Post

Jangaboo: Highly interesting input, thank you very much. It seems that LG's LK450 scores best in that department. I should re-evalue it relative to LG's 37LV3500. Do you know if your test was with an IPS panel? According to a couple of posts I've seen on the web the LK450's don't all come with the IPS. It seems LG also inserts these panels whenever they feel like it. Thomas

You are mistaken. The first graph shows the black level luminance.
In other words, the lower the better. Therefore, in terms of black levels, the LG LK450 DOES NOT score very well in the black department.

In rank in terms of contrast, the best is the Sony EX520, LGLV2500, LK450, and lastly, the Panasonic L42E30.
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post #24 of 30 Old 07-15-2011, 02:17 PM
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Thanks very much, Do-It-Yourself. Of course, you're right - I stand corrected.

Further in the matter of the LG IPS panel search, I went to my local BB to check out their 37LK450 which, in view of Otto's comment about it's IPS panel, I thought might subsitute for the 37LV3500 I've been searching for. Their demo LK450 was on the shelf and its box on the floor below. The model's label on the box had the dread "D" in the 4th. position. So it rather confirms what I saw on Amazon's site. It would seem that the IPS panel is not standard on this model. So again, Emptor Caveat.

The other thing to note about this unit is that, according to LG's website spec sheet, it's a power hog at 150 - 180 watts. No matter it's other virtues this is hard to justify for a fairly low end HDTV in this day and age. Thomas
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post #25 of 30 Old 07-15-2011, 05:05 PM
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AFAIK, all 47" panels are IPS.
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post #26 of 30 Old 07-15-2011, 06:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tomstan View Post

Jangaboo: Highly interesting input, thank you very much. It seems that LG's LK450 scores best in that department. I should re-evalue it relative to LG's 37LV3500. Do you know if your test was with an IPS panel? According to a couple of posts I've seen on the web the LK450's don't all come with the IPS. It seems LG also inserts these panels whenever they feel like it. Thomas

the black level and contrast ratio graphs are from http://www.televisioninfo.com - bunch of other TV brands reviewed there

and yep LG panel lottery is annoying but seems like all manufacturers do it especially for the lower end models
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post #27 of 30 Old 07-16-2011, 10:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jangaboo View Post

the black level and contrast ratio graphs are from http://www.televisioninfo.com - bunch of other TV brands reviewed there

and yep LG panel lottery is annoying but seems like all manufacturers do it especially for the lower end models

Thank you, once again, jangaboo - the televisioninfo site is a terrific recommendation. Wish I'd seen it earlier. I am now seriously considering returning the less than tolerably satisfying Panny TC-L37E3 and going for my 1st. choice: LG's-37LV3500 - even wihout the preferred IPS panel. Space consideration prevents me from 47" screens, as per Frank Benign's suggestion.
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post #28 of 30 Old 07-18-2011, 08:32 PM
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The drama quickens. My son-in-law in California, checking Fry's supplies of LG-37LV3500's, found a set with the magic "Y" in 4th. position and bought it for me. Eureka - They Exist! Now the 2nd. act begins. How to get it to New Mexico - specifically finding an outer box so it can get double boxed for UPS. It's really a problem, as I am beginning to find out. Buying from UPS costs a ridiculous sum and stores seem to either shred or flatten into piles for recycleing the moment boxes get unloaded and nobody seems to have any. Hrrrumph. Stay tuned. Thomas
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post #29 of 30 Old 07-29-2011, 08:06 AM
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Epilogue. The box for the LG-37LV3500 was found, the unit was shipped, it survived it's journey and, while somewhat cheaply built, the visuals are first rate. Highly recommended for anyone interested in a no-frills, ISP panel equipped, LED, 37" HDTV. End of story. T.
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post #30 of 30 Old 08-03-2011, 07:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jangaboo View Post

the black level and contrast ratio graphs are from http://www.televisioninfo.com - bunch of other TV brands reviewed there

and yep LG panel lottery is annoying but seems like all manufacturers do it especially for the lower end models

I don't understand why manufacturers consider small-screen sets their "lower end", and especially why they lump the 30-40 inch class in that category. These smaller sets are much more likely to be in the bedroom, where viewing position (and therefore viewing angles) are likely to be much more variable than a set in another room or in a home theater.

Why go cheap on us? There is a few pennies manufacturing cost difference between different size panels. It costs very, very little more to make a 47-inch panel than it costs to make a 32-inch panel of identical quality. That infinitissimally small cost difeerence is why LCD computer monitors jumped from 4:3 to wide format overnight: they weren't more expensive to build, but people would pay more. A lot more.

And I would pay a bit more for a HDTV that fit my circumstances. It's frustrating and aggravating when you go hunting for a smalleer screen for a specific purpose (not just to save a few bucks) and you can't find what you want or what you need.

It makes no sense.
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