The Official Sony EX720 Owner's Thread - Page 8 - AVS Forum
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post #211 of 2054 Old 06-16-2011, 11:25 AM
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Question: How many of you has 1.4 compliant HDMI cables when viewing 3D content? I have a 1.3 cable from Monoprice, got it a few years ago. Ordered some 1.4 just to make sure. Will it eliminate some of the crosstalk issues maybe?
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post #212 of 2054 Old 06-16-2011, 12:39 PM
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All I have is 1.4 cables... I even took the cable from the Alice 3d kit and hooked it directly from my ps3 to my TV. I even tried 2 different hdmi ports on the TV thinking it was possible that 1 was bad.
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post #213 of 2054 Old 06-16-2011, 12:59 PM
 
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I have a 1.4 cable for my xbox and a 1.3 for my FIOS box. It doesn't make any difference regarding the crosstalk. I see the same effect on my games as on my FIOS 3D- "double vision" on the borders, especially the top.
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post #214 of 2054 Old 06-16-2011, 01:29 PM
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Why am I the only one on here that has actually complained to Sony about the 3D problem. I really can't believe all of you just accept it.
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post #215 of 2054 Old 06-16-2011, 01:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nikonosis View Post
Why am I the only one on here that has actually complained to Sony about the 3D problem. I really can't believe all of you just accept it.
It's in my opinion that 3D is just as terrible in the theatre. What I enjoy most is high def 2D performance and this tv delivers on that. I am glad I won't be wasting 70 dollars on a single pair of glasses.

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post #216 of 2054 Old 06-16-2011, 01:45 PM
 
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Niko, I did and it seems the only hope is that it may be fixed by a software update. Like the squatch, I love the 2d performance. I also got the TV for $150 as a replacement for an SXRD so I feel I already got a great deal. While I agree with you that the 3D needs work, it is not a huge problem for me. Basically I wasted 80 bucks on glasses but I could just sell them to someone for $40 or so down the line. I'd rather wait and see. I wish I had a PS3 to further test the issue, and the frame packing vs side by side performance, but I have a feeling the limitations of the TV processor or software is the real issue. Let me know if your replacement is any better and I may follow suit.

The 3D issue is really not too bad with some things which is why i think it is a translation issue. I'm having fun playing thru COD Black Ops again in 3D depsite the problem, which is not too noticeable in that game. Also, Crysis 2 actually lets you control the 3D Depth so if you turn it down, the doubling decreases. This is what leads me to believe the TV is not defective. Do you have Crysis 2? You can actually see the images coming together onscreen as you turn down the depth setting.
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post #217 of 2054 Old 06-16-2011, 01:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Sasquatch321 View Post
It's in my opinion that 3D is just as terrible in the theatre. What I enjoy most is high def 2D performance and this tv delivers on that. I am glad I won't be wasting 70 dollars on a single pair of glasses.
Ive watched a lot of 3D in stores when looking at TV's and nothing is even close to as bad as this TV. There is always some crosstalk but not on 50%+ of the screen... Its so bad on this TV that nothing seems to actually come off the screen...
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post #218 of 2054 Old 06-16-2011, 01:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bitterkevin View Post
Niko, I did and it seems the only hope is that it may be fixed by a software update. Like the squatch, I love the 2d performance. I also got the TV for $150 as a replacement for an SXRD so I feel I already got a great deal. While I agree with you that the 3D needs work, it is not a huge problem for me. Basically I wasted 80 bucks on glasses but I could just sell them to someone for $40 or so down the line. I'd rather wait and see. I wish I had a PS3 to further test the issue, and the frame packing vs side by side performance, but I have a feeling the limitations of the TV processor or software is the real issue. Let me know if your replacement is any better and I may follow suit.

The 3D issue is really not too bad with some things which is why i think it is a translation issue. I'm having fun playing thru COD Black Ops again in 3D depsite the problem, which is not too noticeable in that game. Also, Crysis 2 actually lets you control the 3D Depth so if you turn it down, the doubling decreases. This is what leads me to believe the TV is not defective. Do you have Crysis 2? You can actually see the images coming together onscreen as you turn down the depth setting.
If that's truly the case with the software or processor, doesn't Sony have any sort of quality control? Why would they even advertise this TV as 3D? I mean its literally that bad... I just can't believe the 3D image I am seeing is what Sony intended us to see.
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post #219 of 2054 Old 06-16-2011, 02:46 PM
 
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I really hope you are right, Niko... cuz I am afraid that you aren't. But like I said, let me know how the replacement turns out, because if I know mine is defective, I will go thru the hassle of having a tech out.
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post #220 of 2054 Old 06-16-2011, 03:06 PM
 
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Yeesh... google "ex720 crosstalk" and it seems we are not the only ones... this is why i think it is more technological limitations than a defect.
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post #221 of 2054 Old 06-16-2011, 03:19 PM
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If thats true then I am going to complain, complain, complain, and complain some more till either the issue is fixed or they give me a TV that displays 3D correctly.
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post #222 of 2054 Old 06-16-2011, 03:21 PM
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Quote from Flatpanelshd

Quote:
3D picture quality has been improved compared to the 2010 models, which is nice. We have not tested most 2011 LCD/LED models at this point but at the moment EX720 has one of the lowest levels of crosstalk amongst LCD/LED models.

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post #223 of 2054 Old 06-16-2011, 03:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bitterkevin View Post

Yeesh... google "ex720 crosstalk" and it seems we are not the only ones... this is why i think it is more technological limitations than a defect.

I did a search on google for that and 95% of the crosstalk discussions I see on this TV are from this thread...
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post #224 of 2054 Old 06-16-2011, 04:35 PM
 
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There's a lot more than just us talking about it... including several threads that mention that FlatPanelHD site review saying the crosstalk is reduced (note: not GONE) yet they still see crosstalk. I watched a thing on youtube about how refresh rate can be a cause... maybe cuz our TV is 120hz with fake software 240hz (that is disabled in 3d mode hmmm) is why we get the crosstalk?

I admire your crusade but I just dont have time to call sony every day. If you want me to help you make a stink on forums, just link me. I agree with you completely but I always thought 3D was a gimmick anyway so I am not so enraged.
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post #225 of 2054 Old 06-16-2011, 04:41 PM
 
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post #226 of 2054 Old 06-16-2011, 05:20 PM
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I don't call them but I do complain on the I have a defective Sony TV facebook page
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post #227 of 2054 Old 06-16-2011, 05:30 PM
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When the panel displays a new frame, it scans from the bottom up to the top, and it takes an average of 7 ms to draw the whole frame.

To reduce the amount of crosstalk, Sony blacks out both eyes for 3 ms, which should give the screen the time to get rid of one frame and redraw the next one. But as we saw, it only has time to get rid of the bottom half of the preceding frame. When one of the lenses becomes transparent again, the top half of the preceding frame is still visible, which is why crosstalk is much more visible at the top than at the bottom.
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post #228 of 2054 Old 06-16-2011, 08:22 PM
 
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Yeah that review is pretty damning. That's exactly what you see too, right? Sucks.
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post #229 of 2054 Old 06-17-2011, 12:09 AM
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I don't expect too much for the ex720 series, its really an entry to 3d. 2d wise it is awesome.

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post #230 of 2054 Old 06-17-2011, 12:42 AM - Thread Starter
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Bitter,

Please do try 3D using a PS3. I'm having no problems as I output everything from the PS3... movies, games. I even watched Legend of the Guardians and it is breath taking in 3D. (Especially the scene where the owlets are training amidst the heavy rain and thunder storms) Really worth the price.

While I agree that this is an entry level 3D (and also wholeheartedly agree that it is a damn awesome 2D TV), I'm quite satisfied with the 3D program.

Texted our local Sony representative and she gave me the number of Sony Philippines. They will schedule a visit to look at my TV but a replacement is very possible since the TV is just a month old.

I will also consider the HDMI cable, but I won't get my hopes up. Watched two SD DVDs using my Samsung HTIB and it displayed some lines, although not as evident. Maybe a 1.4 HDMI cable will make a difference? I don't know but can't wait to get home and try.
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post #231 of 2054 Old 06-17-2011, 09:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Injected Sin View Post
I don't expect too much for the ex720 series, its really an entry to 3d. 2d wise it is awesome.
That is a bullcrap excuse, if the TV says it does 3D, it should do 3D. Not half 3D. There is no where on the box where it says it only does the bottom half the screen in 3D.
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post #232 of 2054 Old 06-17-2011, 09:21 AM
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Originally Posted by bitterkevin View Post
Yeah that review is pretty damning. That's exactly what you see too, right? Sucks.
Ive also seen a lot of other reviews where they don't list that as a problem. Thats a big reason that I feel there is defective TV out there. I was flat out told by a Sony Authorized repair tech that there is a known issue with the 3D.
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post #233 of 2054 Old 06-17-2011, 09:23 AM
 
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http://www.digitalversus.com/sony-br..._10659_16.html

Check this review out, it is pretty damning. This is exactly the problem I see with side by side sources. Sony sources such as Qriocity look much better tho, because it is Frame Packing 3D, the "official" Sony 3D. I don't like how they are forcing us to use a Sony PS3 or Blu Ray for decent 3D. I also did not expect much from this 3D since it is their cheapest model, but Niko is right, the quality is inexcusably bad.

Niko, what did the tech say?
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post #234 of 2054 Old 06-17-2011, 11:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bitterkevin View Post
http://www.digitalversus.com/sony-br..._10659_16.html

Check this review out, it is pretty damning. This is exactly the problem I see with side by side sources. Sony sources such as Qriocity look much better tho, because it is Frame Packing 3D, the "official" Sony 3D. I don't like how they are forcing us to use a Sony PS3 or Blu Ray for decent 3D. I also did not expect much from this 3D since it is their cheapest model, but Niko is right, the quality is inexcusably bad.

Niko, what did the tech say?
The tech said its a known issue and wouldn't elaborate any further. Sony doesn't want everyone to know about the problem, if they did they would have to fix everyone's problem. But Sony is smart and knows there are people, like the ones on this board, that will just accept it how it is and never get the issue fixed.
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post #235 of 2054 Old 06-17-2011, 11:37 AM - Thread Starter
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My settings.

2D and 3D:

[Eco menu]
Light Sensor: ON

[Picture Adjustments menu]
Scene: Graphics
Backlight: 2
Picture: 95
Brightness: 54
Color: 53
Color Temperature: Warm 2
Sharpness: Min (50 - 3D)
Motionflow: Off
CineMotion: Off

[Advanced Settings menu]
Gamma: +1
Adv. Contrast Enhancer: High (3D ONLY)
Detail Enhancer: High (3D ONLY)
i/p Conversion: Speed

White Balance:
-2 ,0, 0, -2, -2, -2

[3D Settings]
Everything at Default
Glasses Brightness: AUTO (Most prefer HIGH though)

======================================

Basically same settings for everything HD. For SD, I make use of the Noise Reduction (set to Auto) and of course the Detail Enhancer.
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post #236 of 2054 Old 06-17-2011, 12:32 PM
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Got a question. Do I want "Display Area" in the screen setting menu to be at -1, Normal, or +1. I have it set on normal now and would it differ between sd and hd content at all?

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post #237 of 2054 Old 06-17-2011, 12:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CaliCool View Post

My settings.

2D and 3D:

[Eco menu]
Light Sensor: ON

[Picture Adjustments menu]
Scene: Graphics
Backlight: 2
Picture: 95
Brightness: 54
Color: 53
Color Temperature: Warm 2
Sharpness: Min (50 - 3D)
Motionflow: Off
CineMotion: Off

[Advanced Settings menu]
Gamma: +1
Adv. Contrast Enhancer: High (3D ONLY)
Detail Enhancer: High (3D ONLY)
i/p Conversion: Speed

White Balance:
-2 ,0, 0, -2, -2, -2

[3D Settings]
Everything at Default
Glasses Brightness: AUTO (Most prefer HIGH though)

======================================

Basically same settings for everything HD. For SD, I make use of the Noise Reduction (set to Auto) and of course the Detail Enhancer.

Nice, the noise reduction works great for sd cable. Totally agree with the rest of your settings as well, set it and forget it.

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post #238 of 2054 Old 06-17-2011, 01:16 PM
 
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Display Area: Full Pixel for Blu Ray, XboX, etc; Normal for TV. If you do full pixel for TV, you see a lot of overscan gibberish.
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post #239 of 2054 Old 06-17-2011, 01:17 PM - Thread Starter
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I just turned off Light Sensor. Will try and see if I'm happy after a week! (Black level versus an overall brighter image)

Also, switched to a high speed Sony 1.3 cable. I don't know how old my former cable was, but maybe it wasn't in the high speed category. Maybe it's the new high speed cable, maybe setting the IP conversion to Speed, or just maybe both. Jacked NBA 2K11 to my PS3 and it did improve the framerate of the 3D considerably. Before it was hellacious, but now it really is good.
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post #240 of 2054 Old 06-17-2011, 01:24 PM
 
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My settings.

[Eco menu]
All off, I hate auto adjust

[Picture Adjustments menu]
Scene: General/Custom, Game/Original, Graphics
Backlight: 5
Picture: Max
Brightness: 50
Color: 52
Color Temperature: Neutral
Sharpness: 50
All noise reduction off
Motionflow: Off
CineMotion: Off

[Advanced Settings menu]
All Off
Gamma: 0
i/p Conversion: Speed for Xbox, Quality for TV, only used for upconverting 1080i to 1080p really

White Balance:
default

[3D Settings]
Everything at Default
Glasses Brightness: High or Medium

I have fiddled with everything and nothing alters the 3D crosstalk. Interestingly, 3D mode locks your TV into MAX backlight and turns power saving off. Also, Motionflow is greyed out.

Default brightness is perfect for YCC709 and Full RGB, as you can "barely see" the thing in Xbox game test patterns you are supposed to barely see on default. I also used the nifty indie game app TV Calibration. That app also showed me Full Pixel is not on by default.
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