Official Sharp Elite PRO-70X5 and 60X5 Owners Thread - Page 16 - AVS Forum
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post #451 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 04:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Please don't interpret my switch to feeling any differently about the 929 than what I've posted since I owned it. It is still a fabulous set with an incredible image. I was really feeling I wanted the extra size and I also wanted to see if the DSE could be minimized with the Elite. As I posted in the Sony thread, DSE was my biggest issue with the display.

But in no way would I hesitate recommending the 929 to a friend.

Now, is the Elite worth 2X the price of a 929? I think if you shop around you'll find the differential is not quite that bad. As to whether it's worth it to you, that depends on how much you'd appreciate the extra size with the extra edge in PQ in certain areas. As I said in my mini-review, nobody can say if the value is there other than the prospective purchaser. For some the answer will be an unequivocal 'no' and for others a resounding 'yes'.

Either way there really is no mistake in choosing either.

I'm going to hold onto the 929 for awhile and see how the prices shake out on the Elite sets. Glad you have a set you really like. Luckily DSE is very light on my 929 or I'd be in your boat. DSE is why my 111FD went back.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonyboy View Post

Uh oh! Looks like someone's getting the upgrade itch again.

The price on the Elite even after some shopping is holding me back. If that 60" gets to $4k or less I'm in.

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post #452 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 04:48 PM
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Originally Posted by 141park View Post

Hi Airgas1998- What problems are you having? I just want to make sure I don't have those on my 70 inch. It would be great if you can share your EXACT issues so I can be on the look out for those on mine.

Thank you.

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post #453 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 04:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzook View Post

so now your bashing Robert at VE who has been a significant and long term contributor on numerous sites. You sir have officially lost your compass readings. STOP with the BS will you. You cant afford the Elite and your pissed about it and making up CRAP. Plain and simple.

And last time I checked, the shootout is determine on a great number of factors and NOT to the conclusion of the owner you speak about.

but what do I know compared to your vast knowledge. PLEASE crawl back to the BB you work at.

I don't think he is bashing Robert. It's just Robert talks up whatever hot new TV he has. It's his job after all since he sells TVs. I always caution my enthusiasm when I see his remarks.

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post #454 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 05:18 PM
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As a happy Elite 151 owner for the past 3 1/2 yrs, its gratifying to see the improvements LCDs are making in the bigger sizes so that when its time to replace my 151 I won't be giving up anything. By then the prices will have come down and another version no doubt will be available.

Nice to see the Elites live on!
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post #455 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 05:46 PM
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As a fellow 151 owner I'm
waiting to see how these tvs fair in people's homes after some time. Before I bought my 151 I too was lured by the lcds at the store as the added brightness was hard to dismiss. But once you get a tv home you start to appreciate the little things that don't count in store and I ended up selling both lcds I had because I just couldn't enjoy them. I know my 151 isn't perfect but it's flaw don't annoy me to the point I can't enjoy the tv. It's not even so much black levels but things like processing, fit and finish, and even sound. I've yet to see any tv match my 151 in the sound department which since I have a dedicated home theater in the basement and don't want to get a surround system for my flat panel matters to me. I'm hoping this elite set is superior to my 151 as I would always like to go bigger but until people let the new wear off and evaluate it's livability I can't justify that kind of money.

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post #456 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 05:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bpmurr View Post


I'm going to hold onto the 929 for awhile and see how the prices shake out on the Elite sets. Glad you have a set you really like. Luckily DSE is very light on my 929 or I'd be in your boat. DSE is why my 111FD went back.

The price on the Elite even after some shopping is holding me back. If that 60" gets to $4k or less I'm in.

I positive it will be even cheaper then that come march. But supply will be limited!
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post #457 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 05:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chronoptimist View Post

I think his point is that they won't be watching them on flat panels.

Even if that is his point, it's wrong. They don't all go into darkened home theaters just to watch something, either. I'm not saying they never do, but they don't always.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working. (Oh, and plasma didn't die because of logistics problems, nor does OLED ship in big boxes because it comes from Korea.)
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post #458 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 06:00 PM
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Unfortunately they were playing the animated movie Rio. As we all know animation looks good on almost any set. The black bars at top and bottom looked very black indeed..but the showroom there is not even close to as dark as my living room is at night with most or all lights off. The screen was somewhat reflective, but I'd say not much more so than my 6020 Kuro...it was far from being a mirror. From what I could see the set looked quite impressive..I am looking forward to pro reviews done under better conditions. Oh..and that price has to come down..no matter how good it looks I'm not paying that much today for what is pretty certainly at best only a slightly better product than say a Panny V-30. Glad to know that progress is being made though..this could quite likely be the new PQ king.
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post #459 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 06:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JukeBox360 View Post

Purely explains why you've been ranting that this set is the same as a 735. As I said before. No, it isn't. Not even close. You really seem like someone who's trying to justify your purchase. Which isn't going to happen in this thread. 735 is a very large crappy set. Congrats

Quote:
Originally Posted by mankite View Post

As a fellow 151 owner I'm
waiting to see how these tvs fair in people's homes after some time. Before I bought my 151 I too was lured by the lcds at the store as the added brightness was hard to dismiss. But once you get a tv home you start to appreciate the little things that don't count in store and I ended up selling both lcds I had because I just couldn't enjoy them. I know my 151 isn't perfect but it's flaw don't annoy me to the point I can't enjoy the tv. It's not even so much black levels but things like processing, fit and finish, and even sound. I've yet to see any tv match my 151 in the sound department which since I have a dedicated home theater in the basement and don't want to get a surround system for my flat panel matters to me. I'm hoping this elite set is superior to my 151 as I would always like to go bigger but until people let the new wear off and evaluate it's livability I can't justify that kind of money.

I had a 151, it is a phenominal set even by today's standards. The new 70" Elite is definitely superior from what I've seen. Any larger high quality display (eg larger than 65") is going to be expensive because it costs a lot more to manufacture with local fine dimming etc than the smaller panels - the higher prices will not change until the process is less costly. Upcoming Samsung 75" = $12k or so, upcoming LG 72" = $10k. Elite 70" is priced right.

Don't get confused with the regular Sharp 735 being less $, like I said, *high quality* large panels are still expensive to make. Low quality ones are not.


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post #460 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 06:26 PM
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Originally Posted by HiFiFun View Post

So we are finally be a bit objective..

I've always been objective. Of course to some, objectivity only comes when you agree with them.
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post #461 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 06:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Sonyboy View Post

Ken

Great review! Very informative. I will eventually replace my 500m with one of these sets. I can get the sony for a great price now, but I'm not sure if going up just five inches is enough. So if I go 60 inch elite I will have to save some pennies until early next year and hopefully get a price drop. Just out of curiosity did you sell your 929 or return it? Thanks again for the excellent feedback between these two beauties.

Thanks Sonyboy. I exchanged my 929.
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post #462 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 06:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzook View Post

so now your bashing Robert at VE who has been a significant and long term contributor on numerous sites. You sir have officially lost your compass readings. STOP with the BS will you. You cant afford the Elite and your pissed about it and making up CRAP. Plain and simple.

And last time I checked, the shootout is determine on a great number of factors and NOT to the conclusion of the owner you speak about.

but what do I know compared to your vast knowledge. PLEASE crawl back to the BB you work at.

I think it's wise to simply stop responding to his nonsense. Dumping on Robert is totally uncalled for and his comments are simply untrue. Robert gives his honest opinion and you have a choice to agree or disagree. But in the years I've known him I've never known him to mislead people. He has a passion for this stuff just as we do and when he sees something that really stands out, he gets excited. I can well understand that.
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post #463 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 06:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Dawgneck View Post

Thanks for your reply Ken.

I currently have a FHD1, a 150HD and a 151HD in my house. I'm contemplating the new 70" Elite, but I'm worried LCD screens still have issues I'll spot and will irk me.

Have you come across anything negative that irks you, compared to your plasma?

No PQ issues compared to plasma now that blacks are as good as they are Dawgneck. However I am having an issue that is virtually identical to the one reported by Codeman. When in non-THX movie mode, the picture will occasionally dim very very significantly as it did about an hour ago while my wife and I were watching a movie. I can sometimes induce this issue by simply switching picture modes.

The only mode that seems to be immune to this issue is THX mode. I'm not sure if this is something that's just occurring to 60" Elites, but I haven't seen anyone with a 70" reporting this. It's a very significant issue that needs addressing.
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post #464 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 07:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

No PQ issues compared to plasma now that blacks are as good as they are Dawgneck. However I am having an issue that is virtually identical to the one reported by Codeman. When in non-THX movie mode, the picture will occasionally dim very very significantly as it did about an hour ago while my wife and I were watching a movie. I can sometimes induce this issue by simply switching picture modes.

The only mode that seems to be immune to this issue is THX mode. I'm not sure if this is something that's just occurring to 60" Elites, but I haven't seen anyone with a 70" reporting this. It's a very significant issue that needs addressing.

Maybe Sharp Elite should make it up to us early adopters by switching them out free of charge for brand new 70" units unaffected by this issue.

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post #465 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 07:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

No PQ issues compared to plasma now that blacks are as good as they are Dawgneck. However I am having an issue that is virtually identical to the one reported by Codeman. When in non-THX movie mode, the picture will occasionally dim very very significantly as it did about an hour ago while my wife and I were watching a movie. I can sometimes induce this issue by simply switching picture modes.

The only mode that seems to be immune to this issue is THX mode. I'm not sure if this is something that's just occurring to 60" Elites, but I haven't seen anyone with a 70" reporting this. It's a very significant issue that needs addressing.

that is strange indeed, as i don't have this issue with my 60",but rather a weird annoyance with background fluctuations/flickering. i have noticed that when i disable ld it goes away.

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post #466 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 07:46 PM
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Can somebody verify that in a blacked out room if you turn, to say, an hdmi input that has no signal, that the screen is absolutely black. Or if there is some MLL. Thanks


Scott J.

Edit; Of course with local dimming on.
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post #467 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 07:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by codeman896 View Post

Maybe Sharp Elite should make it up to us early adopters by switching them out free of charge for brand new 70" units unaffected by this issue.

A man can dream...

-Craig

do me a favor and test this theory. keep ld off and then cycle through your picture modes. is there any dimming going on then?

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post #468 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 07:49 PM
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Originally Posted by airgas1998 View Post

that is strange indeed, as i don't have this issue with my 60",but rather a weird annoyance with background fluctuations/flickering. i have noticed that when i disable ld it goes away.

airgas, if you are watching your 60" and go into the menu --> picture options --> IVC and just scroll up and down between High, Mid, and Low (without going onto LD or Off) it consistently dims and brightens the set correctly without any incidents of dramatic dimming?

Just curious because this is how I figured out that all inputs on my TV are affected and not just the Xbox or a specific HDMI input, but I can get this glitch to happen with any device any input. It wouldn't be much of a problem if it only dimmed dramatically when switching these settings, but as Ken and I have both observed it dimed/brightened usually after come from a "black out" scene transition.

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post #469 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 07:57 PM
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Originally Posted by codeman896 View Post

airgas, if you are watching your 60" and go into the menu --> picture options --> IVC and just scroll up and down between High, Mid, and Low (without going onto LD or Off) it consistently dims and brightens the set correctly without any incidents of dramatic dimming?

Just curious because this is how I figured out that all inputs on my TV are affected and not just the Xbox or a specific HDMI input, but I can get this glitch to happen with any device any input. It wouldn't be much of a problem if it only dimmed dramatically when switching these settings, but as Ken and I have both observed it dimed/brightened usually after come from a "black out" scene transition.

Thanks
Craig

so the dimming occurs randomly out of the xbox as well? say like when watching a movie or a tv program it will all of a sudden dim? correct..

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post #470 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 08:00 PM
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Originally Posted by airgas1998 View Post


that is strange indeed, as i don't have this issue with my 60",but rather a weird annoyance with background fluctuations/flickering. i have noticed that when i disable ld it goes away.

Well you sure don't want to disable LD to deal with that.
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post #471 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 08:03 PM
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Originally Posted by airgas1998 View Post

so the dimming occurs randomly out of the xbox as well? say like when watching a movie or a tv program it will all of a sudden dim? correct..

Correct, I can replicate this issue on my HD-DVR, Bluray, Xbox - you name it. HDMI, component, they all suffer the same issue

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post #472 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 08:09 PM
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Originally Posted by airgas1998 View Post


so the dimming occurs randomly out of the xbox as well? say like when watching a movie or a tv program it will all of a sudden dim? correct..

It did with me tonight on two occasions without touching any controls. One was toward the end of a movie when coming out of a fade to black. As the fade to black ended and the picture returned, there was a brief flash and the picture returned at about 10-20% of what it should have been. I then had to go in to the menu, cycle through a few picture modes until the normal brightness returned, and then exit the menu. The same thing happened later while watching a news show. This is a pretty significant glitch.
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post #473 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 08:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

It did with me tonight on two occasions without touching any controls. One was toward the end of a movie when coming out of a fade to black. As the fade to black ended and the picture returned, there was a brief flash and the picture returned at about 10-20% of what it should have been. I then had to go in to the menu, cycle through a few picture modes until the normal brightness returned, and then exit the menu. The same thing happened later while watching a news show. This is a pretty significant glitch.

Yeah Ken that sounds exactly what I am describing. I only first noticed it on the Xbox 360 because it fades to black quiet often - between loading screens - when transitioning from the dashboard (OS) to the actual game, not to mention resolution switches when this happens also - I believe these factors exaggerated the issue and made it more noticeable. It wasn't until today that I noticed it actually happens while watching TV or movies also. Significant glitch indeed - I hope a resolution is in the immediate future.

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post #474 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 08:27 PM
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Originally Posted by codeman896 View Post


Yeah Ken that sounds exactly what I am describing. I only first noticed it on the Xbox 360 because it fades to black quiet often - between loading screens - when transitioning from the dashboard (OS) to the actual game, not to mention resolution switches when this happens also - I believe these factors exaggerated the issue and made it more noticeable. It wasn't until today that I noticed it actually happens while watching TV or movies also. Significant glitch indeed - I hope a resolution is in the immediate future.

Codeman, if you have the Blu Ray, DK, I'd be curious to see if you have the other glitch I've got (probably related and about 90% reproducible on mine). At the very beginning of the movie, when coming out of the animated dark swirly clouds, the picture brightens to the scene of the full screen fly by approach of the building with the glass being blown out. Just at the point it comes out of the dark clouds, I get from 1-3 rapid flashes to black and back to full brightness. It's almost as if you're turning a light switch on & off very rapidly. When the flashing is over, the picture returns to normal.

It's important to note this doesn't happen in THX mode, but does in non-THX movie mode. I haven't tried the other picture modes for this issue.
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post #475 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 08:31 PM
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Just spent some more time at Magnolia. They let me try quite a few of their discs on it. Transformers 2, Iron Man 2, Tron.
Thx mode is just superb. To me, it looks like a calibrated Pioneer Elite. Flesh Tones, colors. Just unreal for a non calibrated picture.
When the prices drop, this is my next panel. Period.
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post #476 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 08:37 PM
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Hmm. Hope these glitches are fixed soon. I finally got Current Wife's approval, and I went and looked at one at Best Buy tonight (FYI, they have a 70" at the BB in Atlantic Terminal in Bklyn for those in NYC). Looked great in the limited time I had with it. The only thing wrong with it was the amount of reflection coming off of all the other televisions. Had him take out the standard Pixar/animated movie and throw a regular movie in w/ the THX setting (Note: This television is good, but still doesn't make Superman Returns a decent movie).

Anyway, as soon as any potential holiday sales start up in the coming weeks I plan on picking up a 60". Only having one issue right now: We're renovating our apt. and putting in built-ins in a couple of weeks. Does anyone here know the amount of space between the bottom of the stand and the beginning of the screen? Trying to see if my center speaker will block any of the screen, or if I have to raise the television a bit (not mounting).

Also looking for some reactions on PS3 gaming with this television, since that and movies will be 99% of its use.
-anthony
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post #477 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 08:51 PM
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Ken I have actually watched that exact scene on the set twice but in THX mode both times. I will let you know my results when I test it tomorrow evening after work in other modes.

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post #478 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 10:23 PM
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Originally Posted by SCJohnson135i View Post

Can somebody verify that in a blacked out room if you turn, to say, an hdmi input that has no signal, that the screen is absolutely black. Or if there is some MLL. Thanks
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There's not going to be an MLL because it's an LCD. And it can adjust the brightness of the LED backlight. So when it's fed nothing, it's going to want to display nothing. And nothing has a brightness of basically zero. The LEDs will be essentially in off mode and the closed pixels will make the display appear absolutely black.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working. (Oh, and plasma didn't die because of logistics problems, nor does OLED ship in big boxes because it comes from Korea.)
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post #479 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 10:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

No PQ issues compared to plasma now that blacks are as good as they are Dawgneck. However I am having an issue that is virtually identical to the one reported by Codeman. When in non-THX movie mode, the picture will occasionally dim very very significantly as it did about an hour ago while my wife and I were watching a movie. I can sometimes induce this issue by simply switching picture modes.

The only mode that seems to be immune to this issue is THX mode. I'm not sure if this is something that's just occurring to 60" Elites, but I haven't seen anyone with a 70" reporting this. It's a very significant issue that needs addressing.

Thanks, Ken.

My guess is Sharp will correct this issue ASAP with a firmware update.

Outside of this issue, I'm happy to hear you like everything else about the set. I'm looking at the 70" and will possibly have it in the house by Christmas.

Thanks again.
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post #480 of 14595 Old 09-13-2011, 10:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Codeman, if you have the Blu Ray, DK, I'd be curious to see if you have the other glitch I've got (probably related and about 90% reproducible on mine). At the very beginning of the movie, when coming out of the animated dark swirly clouds, the picture brightens to the scene of the full screen fly by approach of the building with the glass being blown out. Just at the point it comes out of the dark clouds, I get from 1-3 rapid flashes to black and back to full brightness. It's almost as if you're turning a light switch on & off very rapidly. When the flashing is over, the picture returns to normal.

It's important to note this doesn't happen in THX mode, but does in non-THX movie mode. I haven't tried the other picture modes for this issue.

well ken and code this does not sound good, we can only hope that the engineers are aware of this and that fw2.13 covers this. as strange as my issue is i can not say that i have experienced the issue you guys have. however, this could be do to the fact that i do stay in the thx movie mode 90% of the time. when i'm watching from my dvr i will sometimes use elite pure mode. i did notice that the fw had a created date of 8/12 so it appears there has been some playtime. ken, since we bought from the same place i would think we got the same production runs. i can assure you out of the ten or so Robert got i was within that timeframe. i also think it is strange that no one on the 70" side is experiencing this, as although the obvious panel size difference internally we are using the same software,algorithms,etc. with my issue being able to completely cure it if you will by disableing ld tells me it's related to either the ld components(such as the diffusers) or the software part of that makeup. one thing is for certain us early adopters suffer with the bugs,hopefully raid will be able to kill them soon.

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