Official Sharp Elite PRO-70X5 and 60X5 Owners Thread - Page 255 - AVS Forum
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post #7621 of 14585 Old 03-20-2012, 07:36 PM
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Originally Posted by airgas1998 View Post


come on Ken, you have to be a little skeptical at this point don't you?

Being skeptical is one thing, flat out saying a fix isn't coming is another, and completely baseless.
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post #7622 of 14585 Old 03-21-2012, 02:04 AM
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Originally Posted by genewildershair View Post

being skeptical is one thing, flat out saying a fix isn't coming is another, and completely baseless.

+1
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post #7623 of 14585 Old 03-21-2012, 03:47 AM
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Originally Posted by airgas1998 View Post


come on Ken, you have to be a little skeptical at this point don't you?

Well skepticism is fair, but that's different than an official sounding "there will be no fix". The latter sounds like the poster has some inside track.
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post #7624 of 14585 Old 03-21-2012, 08:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

The only problem with the theory that all sets have the pulsing in all modes is the fact that there are people like me who see pulsing clearly in one mode, but not in others. I have it in non-THX movie mode but not in THX or ISF modes. So it's clearly not a question of not recognizing the pulsing, we see it in one mode and not the other.

Ken, I don't think it has anything to do with the mode. I think the reason why it goes away for you when you change to anything except movie is that the picture gets brighter. If I up'd the brightness the flickering went down on my set. Much like raising the ambient light of the room reduced the problem. Of course it is just a theory, but we do have a lot of confirmed sets with the problem in THX mode, so I really don't think this is limited to a movie mode-only problem. It very well may be source material based too... I'd be curious to see if you have the problem with Darker Than Black in THX mode with no ambient light.

AnotherDude, there may be slight differences in the TVs that are causing the problem. As for settings, I know Ken and I were using the same settings for a while (CNET). I tried all of the recommended settings given in this forum but the flickering remained (to different magnitudes) in each one.
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post #7625 of 14585 Old 03-21-2012, 10:16 AM
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Originally Posted by jeffs2 View Post

Ken, I don't think it has anything to do with the mode. I think the reason why it goes away for you when you change to anything except movie is that the picture gets brighter. If I up'd the brightness the flickering went down on my set. Much like raising the ambient light of the room reduced the problem. Of course it is just a theory, but we do have a lot of confirmed sets with the problem in THX mode, so I really don't think this is limited to a movie mode-only problem. It very well may be source material based too... I'd be curious to see if you have the problem with Darker Than Black in THX mode with no ambient light.

AnotherDude, there may be slight differences in the TVs that are causing the problem. As for settings, I know Ken and I were using the same settings for a while (CNET). I tried all of the recommended settings given in this forum but the flickering remained (to different magnitudes) in each one.

I think we're both saying the same thing - the mode changes how the set responds to variations in brightness. And as I like really deep blacks and dark shadows, I'm kind of glad I don't get the flashing / pulsing more than I actually do - I calibrate with the backlight at 25 ISF (0-100 range, 50 default), which I think works out to something like -15 in THX (-30 to +30 IIRC).

I often use the CNet THX settings for comparison to my calibration. When you say Darker Than Black is that a movie or reference to the brightness? I set mine so that the 2% level is just visible and darker than black looks like black.


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post #7626 of 14585 Old 03-21-2012, 12:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffs2 View Post

Ken, I don't think it has anything to do with the mode. I think the reason why it goes away for you when you change to anything except movie is that the picture gets brighter. If I up'd the brightness the flickering went down on my set. Much like raising the ambient light of the room reduced the problem. Of course it is just a theory, but we do have a lot of confirmed sets with the problem in THX mode, so I really don't think this is limited to a movie mode-only problem. It very well may be source material based too... I'd be curious to see if you have the problem with Darker Than Black in THX mode with no ambient light.

Actually for my current settings Jeff, the picture doesn't get any brighter in ISF Night mode, yet the flickering is gone.
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post #7627 of 14585 Old 03-21-2012, 01:15 PM
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Even with flaws...I just watched frozen planet...amazing pq
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post #7628 of 14585 Old 03-21-2012, 01:58 PM
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Picking up my 60" Elite on Friday and would like to contribute my perception of the issues with my set. Is there a way I can replicate settings and source material to say yes or no on the pulsing?
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post #7629 of 14585 Old 03-21-2012, 02:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Well skepticism is fair, but that's different than an official sounding "there will be no fix". The latter sounds like the poster has some inside track.

my inside sources tell me no cyan fix...better?
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post #7630 of 14585 Old 03-21-2012, 02:10 PM
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Originally Posted by TitusTroy View Post

my inside sources tell me no cyan fix...better?

and your inside sources on the ld flaw?

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post #7631 of 14585 Old 03-21-2012, 02:40 PM
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Fix or No Fix. My inside sources tell me I'm Keeping Mine.

Nothing's Perfect So Stop Expecting It ! Glenee

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post #7632 of 14585 Old 03-21-2012, 02:47 PM
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fix or no fix. My inside sources tell me i'm keeping mine.

+1

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post #7633 of 14585 Old 03-21-2012, 04:02 PM
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so Kevin Miller just posted a response over at HDJ...hopefully Kevin can answer my question here at AVS or someone will re-post my question to him over there

Kevin:

can you talk about the overall 'eyeball test' versus the accuracy of the colors itself on the Elite...seems like the Elite owners and advocates continually go on about how the Elite 'looks' great to them regardless of any measurement errors and how that is far more important then data points...I remember 2 years back at the Shootout you guys tested the LG LX9500 and the measurements looked spot on but it failed the eyeball test...so the Elite does the opposite and am wondering how much weight you place on this
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post #7634 of 14585 Old 03-21-2012, 04:17 PM
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Ken, the 151 is for sale!!!!!!! you must be in for the long haul
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post #7635 of 14585 Old 03-21-2012, 05:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

The only problem with the theory that all sets have the pulsing in all modes is the fact that there are people like me who see pulsing clearly in one mode, but not in others. I have it in non-THX movie mode but not in THX or ISF modes. So it's clearly not a question of not recognizing the pulsing, we see it in one mode and not the other.

It's not that simple because the pulsing is material dependent. Whatever material you're using to look for pulsing probably just doesn't show it in THX or ISF modes. Before I returned the TV, I saw plenty of scenes that had severe pulsing in 'Elite Pure' but none in THX. Eventually I found a good test scene which showed the problem in all modes.

I can re-upload the test files again if people really want them. But if you're happy with the set, I suggest just leaving it alone - it's one of those issues that you can't unsee and it may ruin your enjoyment of the TV.
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post #7636 of 14585 Old 03-21-2012, 07:01 PM
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Hi everyone, I have been following this thread for awhile and am continuing to sit on the fence with this display. My question would be to the owners mainly the 60 inch owners( that's what I'm looking at) knowing what you know now about the Elite would you still purchase it? I'm looking to upgrade my pdp5010 and want something a little larger any insight would be appreciated thank you.
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post #7637 of 14585 Old 03-22-2012, 03:16 AM
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Originally Posted by TeflonDon66 View Post

Hi everyone, I have been following this thread for awhile and am continuing to sit on the fence with this display. My question would be to the owners mainly the 60 inch owners( that's what I'm looking at) knowing what you know now about the Elite would you still purchase it? I'm looking to upgrade my pdp5010 and want something a little larger any insight would be appreciated thank you.

I've got the 60 and yes, I would without question do it again in a second. There isn't a display out there with a better picture IMO.
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post #7638 of 14585 Old 03-22-2012, 03:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wizziwig View Post


It's not that simple because the pulsing is material dependent. Whatever material you're using to look for pulsing probably just doesn't show it in THX or ISF modes. Before I returned the TV, I saw plenty of scenes that had severe pulsing in 'Elite Pure' but none in THX. Eventually I found a good test scene which showed the problem in all modes.

I can re-upload the test files again if people really want them. But if you're happy with the set, I suggest just leaving it alone - it's one of those issues that you can't unsee and it may ruin your enjoyment of the TV.

It's very material dependent, no doubt about it. But It's not just my test material that doesn't show the pulsing in THX or ISF modes, it's any material from any source. In those modes I have not seen one instance of what I see in non-THX mode. I certainly know what it looks like, I'm sensitive to it (my wife isn't), but it's just not there in the modes I mentioned for any material, from any source.

If for some reason the test material you had showed it on my display, I certainly wouldn't worry about it in my setup since the material I watch has never shown it.
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post #7639 of 14585 Old 03-22-2012, 08:36 AM
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Originally Posted by AnotherDude View Post

I often use the CNet THX settings for comparison to my calibration. When you say Darker Than Black is that a movie or reference to the brightness? I set mine so that the 2% level is just visible and darker than black looks like black.

Yes, we are saying the same thing.

Darker Than Black (vol 2) is a show reference, and the material that I used to illustrate the problem to the Sharp Engineering that came to my house. It was far and away the worst flickering material I've seen. If you are looking for the problem that would be my recommendation for source material (though I admittedly did not try Wizziwig's).

I concur with Wizziwig you probably don't want to look for this problem. I'm sure for the first week I saw the flickering and just assumed it was part of the source material. After watching a couple of scenes with prolonged periods of flicker it bothered me enough to look into it. Once that switch flips from assuming its the source to realizing its the TV you see the problem more and more. Even worse, you start noticing flickering is source material that you never saw before (Robot Chicken is an example).

While you are probably best off following Wizziwig's advice, there is a part of me that selfishly would like more people gathering data on this in hopes of helping Sharp isolate and fix the issue.
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post #7640 of 14585 Old 03-22-2012, 09:40 AM
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I just got a popup notification for firmware update 1.7. Installing now. Wish me luck.

Any idea what this update is for?
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post #7641 of 14585 Old 03-22-2012, 09:43 AM
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I just got a popup notification for firmware update 1.7. Installing now. Wish me luck.

Any idea what this update is for?

Hmmmm. Well as much as I wish its for what we all hope I doubt its anything other than some minor bug fixes
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post #7642 of 14585 Old 03-22-2012, 09:53 AM
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Ok......I dont know if this is a placebo or I want to pretend its not there but I just did the update. Was previously watching something that I could clearly see pulsing and now.....I havent seen it yet..... Someone please try and confirm. I am probably wrong but.....
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post #7643 of 14585 Old 03-22-2012, 09:59 AM
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Ok......I dont know if this is a placebo or I want to pretend its not there but I just did the update. Was previously watching something that I could clearly see pulsing and now.....I havent seen it yet..... Someone please try and confirm. I am probably wrong but.....

Maybe the new firmware disables LD
That would be good news if that is the case. I won't be able to confirm anything until later this evening, but even then, I usually watch in thx mode and don't notice any pulsing/flickering. I do have the soap opera and movie clips that show the pulsing in other modes, so I will try to test with those later (time and wife permitting).

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post #7644 of 14585 Old 03-22-2012, 10:05 AM
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Maybe the new firmware disables LD
That would be good news if that is the case. I won't be able to confirm anything until later this evening, but even then, I usually watch in thx mode and don't notice any pulsing/flickering. I do have the soap opera and movie clips that show the pulsing in other modes, so I will try to test with those later (time and wife permitting).

LD is not off....so far I havent seen it in the one source I was watching before but I cant tell if my eyes are playing tricks on me. One thing I noticed is a slight more grain in the pq....hope someone else can confirm or deny with other material
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post #7645 of 14585 Old 03-22-2012, 10:12 AM
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Oh No! I'm at work!!! I'll be leaving soon on an emergency call ...


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post #7646 of 14585 Old 03-22-2012, 10:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Suzook View Post

Ken, the 151 is for sale!!!!!!! you must be in for the long haul

Yup. I haven't used the Pro 151 since I got the Elite. The 151 still has a great picture, but in my house it's redundant.

We may be moving, and at that point I'd probably get the 70" Elite.
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post #7647 of 14585 Old 03-22-2012, 10:24 AM
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LD is not off....so far I havent seen it in the one source I was watching before but I cant tell if my eyes are playing tricks on me. One thing I noticed is a slight more grain in the pq....hope someone else can confirm or deny with other material

I never noticed the pulsing before, so can't comment, but I don't see any more grain with 1.7. Using movie THX.
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post #7648 of 14585 Old 03-22-2012, 10:25 AM
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Update.....several different material....so.far I cant discern pulsing.....could they have really done it...
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post #7649 of 14585 Old 03-22-2012, 10:27 AM
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Firmware update today for the flickering issue... I got off the phone with Will from Sharp... He said it greatly improves it, but they will have a follow up update to enhance it even more...

Living Room: Elite Pro 70X5FD, Oppo BDP-93 Blu ray Player, and Yamaha Aventage RA-3000 A/V Receiver, Panamax M5300-PM, PS3 (60GB Fatty), XBOX 360 Elite 250GB, Nintendo Wii, XBOX HD DVD player, Logitech Harmony 1100 Remote

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post #7650 of 14585 Old 03-22-2012, 10:30 AM
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Firmware update today for the flickering issue... I got off the phone with Will from Sharp... He said it greatly improves it, but they will have a follow up update to enhance it even more...

Thanks for the info.

Sure would be nice if they posted up release notes for these updates.
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