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post #121 of 270 Old 02-17-2012, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by anthonymoody View Post

Right. And per your prior speculation I agree that if it happens it'll be a 4K set, which in its own wy makes it more likely to happen. A statement as much as a product to sell.



As I said - outperform in *some* areas. How about correcting cyan out of the box, or the pulsing in non-THX modes?

I thought the Cyan issue was already corrected via firmware? and new sets were shipping ok? To me that's not really a hardware performance issue...I'd expect both sets with proper firmware to perform the same. The panels and processing will be the same from what I've read? Are you reading some upgrades are possible for the 945?
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post #122 of 270 Old 02-17-2012, 11:55 AM
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Originally Posted by 6SpeedTA95 View Post

I thought the Cyan issue was already corrected via firmware? and new sets were shipping ok? To me that's not really a hardware performance issue...I'd expect both sets with proper firmware to perform the same. The panels and processing will be the same from what I've read? Are you reading some upgrades are possible for the 945?

No cyan fix has been issued afaik, and new sets still have it, also afaik. I agree that it's software which is why I think the 945's won't have it (they'll have figured it out by the time the 945 ships).

So with the panels and processing the same (as you wrote) the 945 should equal or better the Elite in most if not all areas of performance. Keep in mind that i find it equally easy to speculate that the eventual 2012 Elites will outperform the 945...

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post #123 of 270 Old 02-17-2012, 11:55 AM
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The cyan fix is not out yet, no.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working.
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post #124 of 270 Old 02-17-2012, 12:07 PM
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YEP

Some japanese Sharp folks visited Robert Zohn at Value Electronics and While having a cup of coffee they discussed Elite Pro's problems. THATs ALL THUSSFAR!! WE'LL KEEP YOU INFORMED!!
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post #125 of 270 Old 02-17-2012, 12:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rogo View Post

The cyan fix is not out yet, no.

truthfully probably never will be, along w/ the pulsing issue. if they can correct this in the 945 line, and implement ld well i think this will be the set to watch very closely. it at least as the making (genetic wise) to be a great set. if this unit turns out to be 90% of what the elite is/was with the current price structure there wouldn't be a big enough jump pq wise to justify the additional dollars the elite demands.

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post #126 of 270 Old 02-17-2012, 01:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anthonymoody View Post

No cyan fix has been issued afaik, and new sets still have it, also afaik. I agree that it's software which is why I think the 945's won't have it (they'll have figured it out by the time the 945 ships).

So with the panels and processing the same (as you wrote) the 945 should equal or better the Elite in most if not all areas of performance. Keep in mind that i find it equally easy to speculate that the eventual 2012 Elites will outperform the 945...

I wasn't aware the CYAN issue was still alive.
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post #127 of 270 Old 02-17-2012, 04:11 PM
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This wait for the 945 is annoying me as much as some of you are annoyed waiting for the Elite fixes. This is neither here nor there, I'm just venting on a Friday.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working.
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post #128 of 270 Old 02-18-2012, 08:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rogo View Post

This wait for the 945 is annoying me as much as some of you are annoyed waiting for the Elite fixes. This is neither here nor there, I'm just venting on a Friday.

What's presumed street timing here...April?

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post #129 of 270 Old 02-18-2012, 09:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anthonymoody View Post

What's presumed street timing here...April?

I hope so. Although May/June may be more realistic???

Sooner the better, I'd like to have a new set by football season. With an MSRP of 3500 to 4k for the 60 incher (speculation on my part) it'll be 8 or 10 weeks before we see respectable street pricing.
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post #130 of 270 Old 02-18-2012, 01:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anthonymoody View Post

What's presumed street timing here...April?

Cnet says June.

http://reviews.cnet.com/flat-panel-t...-35118011.html
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post #131 of 270 Old 02-18-2012, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by myoda View Post

Sharp Reveals TV Pricing

http://www.twice.com/article/480374-...TV_Pricing.php

see post 96
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post #132 of 270 Old 02-18-2012, 04:06 PM
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I am more inclined to believe June for the 945s than anything more optimistic.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working.
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post #133 of 270 Old 02-18-2012, 05:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rogo View Post

This wait for the 945 is annoying me as much as some of you are annoyed waiting for the Elite fixes. This is neither here nor there, I'm just venting on a Friday.

In the event that the 945 does not turn out to be up to expectations, do you have another option/plan-B?
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post #134 of 270 Old 02-18-2012, 06:40 PM
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Originally Posted by mike50 View Post

In the event that the 945 does not turn out to be up to expectations, do you have another option/plan-B?

wait for the bugs to work themselves out of the elite.

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post #135 of 270 Old 02-18-2012, 08:55 PM
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I see that Samsung announced a 8000 75 incher at $7300 --edge lit

Yep, hopefully its actually a production model this year too
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post #136 of 270 Old 02-24-2012, 05:53 AM
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Just pre-ordered a LC-70LE745U, is there a huge difference between it being a 120 panel and the 847U being a 240hz?
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post #137 of 270 Old 02-24-2012, 12:00 PM
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Originally Posted by mikecoscia View Post

Just pre-ordered a LC-70LE745U, is there a huge difference between it being a 120 panel and the 847U being a 240hz?

Almost certainly not. For some people, the premium will be worth it. For many, they'd have a tough time noticing even side by side. In your home, so long as you like it, who cares what else is out there?

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working.
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post #138 of 270 Old 02-25-2012, 11:59 AM
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Originally Posted by rogo View Post

Almost certainly not. For some people, the premium will be worth it. For many, they'd have a tough time noticing even side by side. In your home, so long as you like it, who cares what else is out there?

Thanks, just want to make sure I am not going to notice any lag or blur while gaming or watching any fast action on TV. Wasn't sure if it was worth waiting any paying for the 847U.
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post #139 of 270 Old 02-25-2012, 12:20 PM
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Originally Posted by mikecoscia View Post

Thanks, just want to make sure I am not going to notice any lag or blur while gaming or watching any fast action on TV. Wasn't sure if it was worth waiting any paying for the 847U.

So I don't really want to open this can of worms, but the differences between 120 and 240Hz really don't have anything to do with blur, even though intuitively they would.

Lag is almost entirely separate from screen refresh rate, but actually is sometimes worse on the higher refresh screens since they need to generate more interpolated frames.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working.
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post #140 of 270 Old 02-25-2012, 01:35 PM
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Was at the local COSTCO in Northern VA today, they just got in 2012 Sharps for 70 and 60 inch of the 640U model. The Number at COSTCO is LC-60C6400U and LC-70C6400U. Obviously, the numbering system looks specific to COSTCO as latest Sharp release, uses LC-60LE640U. Anyway, these TVs have a Matte Screen, the base does not swival, they have 240 motion and Smart Central, etc.
The only thing I could not confirm is if these models can surf the net. Anyway, FYI.

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post #141 of 270 Old 02-25-2012, 06:53 PM
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Originally Posted by dearsmiths View Post

Was at the local COSTCO in Northern VA today, they just got in 2012 Sharps for 70 and 60 inch of the 640U model. The Number at COSTCO is LC-60C6400U and LC-70C6400U. Obviously, the numbering system looks specific to COSTCO as latest Sharp release, uses LC-60LE640U. Anyway, these TVs have a Matte Screen, the base does not swival, they have 240 motion and Smart Central, etc.
The only thing I could not confirm is if these models can surf the net. Anyway, FYI.

dearsmiths

Awesome to see it has arrived. I respect the general restrictions on price talk on these forums, however I don't see this model listed yet on the Costco web site or in my local store. How much was the 70 at your store?
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post #142 of 270 Old 02-25-2012, 08:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dearsmiths View Post

Was at the local COSTCO in Northern VA today, they just got in 2012 Sharps for 70 and 60 inch of the 640U model. The Number at COSTCO is LC-60C6400U and LC-70C6400U. Obviously, the numbering system looks specific to COSTCO as latest Sharp release, uses LC-60LE640U. Anyway, these TVs have a Matte Screen, the base does not swival, they have 240 motion and Smart Central, etc.
The only thing I could not confirm is if these models can surf the net. Anyway, FYI.

dearsmiths

Yep, the LC-60LE640 and LC-70LE740 have been released
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post #143 of 270 Old 02-26-2012, 07:47 AM
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Originally Posted by rogo View Post

So I don't really want to open this can of worms, but the differences between 120 and 240Hz really don't have anything to do with blur, even though intuitively they would.

Lag is almost entirely separate from screen refresh rate, but actually is sometimes worse on the higher refresh screens since they need to generate more interpolated frames.

Interesting, so what is the real benefit of 240hz or is all just a marketing gimmick? I know most blu-rays are 24fps and work well with 120hz because of 3:2 pull down. Gaming also because most are 30-60fps. Although if I am understanding you correctly in order to get up to 240hz, alot of interpolation is going on and gives rise to the soap opera effect. Correct? If that is the case then its all about putting a bigger number on the box so they can charge you a premium price?
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post #144 of 270 Old 02-26-2012, 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by mikecoscia View Post

Interesting, so what is the real benefit of 240hz or is all just a marketing gimmick?

Most of the "benefit" of 240Hz is marketing.
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I know most blu-rays are 24fps and work well with 120hz because of 3:2 pull down. Gaming also because most are 30-60fps. Although if I am understanding you correctly in order to get up to 240hz, alot of interpolation is going on and gives rise to the soap opera effect. Correct? If that is the case then its all about putting a bigger number on the box so they can charge you a premium price?

Yes. A "true 240Hz" panel has to interpolate a minimum of 3 frames for every one frame of source. ("Pseudo 240" is another thing entirely, which uses backlight strobing and is how things like "720 and 960 Hz" are sold, that's a different topic.) In theory, you could interpolate those three frames fantastically well and do amazing things with them. In reality, it doesn't tend to work out that way. It's also rare for any panel to have a true 4ms grey-to-grey repsonse time which you'd need to even make the 240 distinct frames....

It's mostly marketing.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working.
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post #145 of 270 Old 02-26-2012, 01:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rogo View Post

Most of the "benefit" of 240Hz is marketing.


Yes. A "true 240Hz" panel has to interpolate a minimum of 3 frames for every one frame of source. ("Pseudo 240" is another thing entirely, which uses backlight strobing and is how things like "720 and 960 Hz" are sold, that's a different topic.) In theory, you could interpolate those three frames fantastically well and do amazing things with them. In reality, it doesn't tend to work out that way. It's also rare for any panel to have a true 4ms grey-to-grey repsonse time which you'd need to even make the 240 distinct frames....

It's mostly marketing.

which is why the 80" 120Hz Sharp is a bargain if 3D is not an issue , seems to pull off great blacks & minimal clouding( I couldn't see any on the sets I've seen ) will report back when mine gets here next week

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post #146 of 270 Old 02-26-2012, 05:03 PM
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which is why the 80" 120Hz Sharp is a bargain if 3D is not an issue , seems to pull off great blacks & minimal clouding( I couldn't see any on the sets I've seen ) will report back when mine gets here next week

I have a 52 inch 830U with terrible clouding. Sharp has agreed to replace my 830u with their 2012 LC-52U640U. The main differences I have noticed is the 640U is not Quadtron, doesn't have the yellow color, its 4M to 1, the 830U is 6M to one, and the 830U swivels whereaas the 640U doesn't. And, the 640U can surf the net and has better internet apps. Price wise, they appear to be about the same. Anyway, does this sound like a good deal, or should I get my money back, and go elsewhere? I need a tv with a Matte screen, so my other choices are LG5700 at Costco, the newer Sharps at Costco, and Vizio. They all have the Matte screens.

Thanks, dearsmiths
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post #147 of 270 Old 02-26-2012, 06:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dearsmiths View Post

I have a 52 inch 830U with terrible clouding. Sharp has agreed to replace my 830u with their 2012 LC-52U640U. The main differences I have noticed is the 640U is not Quadtron, doesn't have the yellow color, its 4M to 1, the 830U is 6M to one, and the 830U swivels whereaas the 640U doesn't. And, the 640U can surf the net and has better internet apps. Price wise, they appear to be about the same. Anyway, does this sound like a good deal, or should I get my money back, and go elsewhere? I need a tv with a Matte screen, so my other choices are LG5700 at Costco, the newer Sharps at Costco, and Vizio. They all have the Matte screens.

Thanks, dearsmiths

that's so new it's not listed yet
Do you know if it's a full array or a edge lighted model?
that would be the question
the edge lighted ones suck I M H O

I like the fact that some of the Sharps don;t have the yellow 4th pixel myself.
I would want to find out more about the display to make a decision like that .

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post #148 of 270 Old 02-27-2012, 06:24 AM
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I am in the same boat, I currently have the 70LE632U, Sharp has also agreed to swap this panel out. My concern is that the place I bought it(Sears), doesn't have any more. So, Sharp offered to swap it with the 2012 LC-70LE640U panel. The only thing I know about this one, it that's it edge-lit, compared the 632U full array. No reviews on the new one, so not to sure what to do?

Could the 2012 be worse then the 2011 model?
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post #149 of 270 Old 02-27-2012, 08:56 AM
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Originally Posted by gtbdevs View Post

I am in the same boat, I currently have the 70LE632U, Sharp has also agreed to swap this panel out. My concern is that the place I bought it(Sears), doesn't have any more. So, Sharp offered to swap it with the 2012 LC-70LE640U panel. The only thing I know about this one, it that’s it edge-lit, compared the 632U full array. No reviews on the new one, so not to sure what to do?

Could the 2012 be worse then the 2011 model?

I myself would hold out for a full back array if not get a refund & buy the 80" 632 it's a whole different display than the 70"
I'd explain that you bought a full back lighted array & you want the same level of features , edge lighted is not a better feature at all.

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post #150 of 270 Old 02-27-2012, 10:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Fastslappy View Post

I myself would hold out for a full back array if not get a refund & buy the 80" 632 it's a whole different display than the 70"
I'd explain that you bought a full back lighted array & you want the same level of features , edge lighted is not a better feature at all.

Thanks, I will definitely give that a shot..
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