2012 Panasonic TC-LxxWT50 IPS LED Anticipation Thread - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 63 Old 02-02-2012, 12:52 AM - Thread Starter
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HD guru giving these soon-to-be-released Panasonic 2012 IPS panels serious props!

http://hdguru.com/ces-2012-post-show...243/#more-7243

http://hdguru.com/wp-content/uploads...nic_table.html
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post #2 of 63 Old 02-02-2012, 01:04 AM - Thread Starter
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Official Panny features & spex links:

http://panasonic.net/avc/viera/us201...ct/wt_lcd.html

http://panasonic.net/avc/viera/us201..._lcd_spec.html
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post #3 of 63 Old 02-02-2012, 01:15 AM - Thread Starter
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some pix:









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post #4 of 63 Old 02-02-2012, 07:53 AM
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post #5 of 63 Old 02-02-2012, 02:26 PM
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I have three Panasonic LCD's, (2) 32" and (1) 37". I've been waiting for something
larger from Panny and got excited about the WT50 UNTIL I read:

1920 scanning backlight (240 Hz refresh x 8 scanning segments= 1920)

I expected a full, LED backlight with a zillion segments. I read that it was edge-lit
but could not verify.

Major disappointment.

Absolutely zero problems with all three EXCEPT for the newer 32" (model
number escapes me) - when left off for more than a day or two, you have to
hold down the power button for 10-20 seconds to get it to power on; otherwise,
the relay clicks, you think it's powering up, and then it powers down.

I might have to "hard reset" (holding power button down) more than once
to get it to power up, but once powered, it works great.

I was so hoping for a full LED backlight. This is a game changer.

Don't care it's super thin - rather have a structure that can withstand its
own weight. Judging from the other "thin" units I've seen, they barely
add any stiffness to the frame.

lon
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post #6 of 63 Old 02-02-2012, 03:36 PM
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WT series is suppose to support YUV (Y'CrCb) 4:4:4. Nice. No more blurry texts.
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post #7 of 63 Old 02-02-2012, 07:58 PM
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55inch IPS screens! Too bad it took so long for them to come out, a year ago and I would have been all over one of these.

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post #8 of 63 Old 02-02-2012, 08:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

55inch IPS screens! Too bad it took so long for them to come out, a year ago and I would have been all over one of these.

FWIW, the Sony KDL55BX520 is a 55" IPS screen. Not LED (Edge or Local dimming, though... only CCFL...)

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...0#post21585160

Also supports 4:4:4 in Game or Graphics Scene modes.

But yeah, I kind of want one of these new Panasonics too. Would be interested looking at a 55" Local Dimmed IPS Alpha screen, especially with such a nice design.

Current HT setup:

Samsung UN65F6300 65" LCD HDTV, Polk CS20 Center, 2x Polk Monitor 75T Fronts, 2x Polk TSI300 Backs, Polk PSW110 Subwoofer.

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post #9 of 63 Old 02-03-2012, 04:58 AM
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Maybe Panny is giving up on their Plasmas with the famous floating blacks problem?
I'm surprised they are marketing larger LCD panels. I thought they drew the line around 32 or 37".

The sets look like the ones LG are planning to introduce. Chrome domes. I thought everyone learned their lesson with those awful 'chinsey silver' frames that distracted from the image Sony introduced 5-7 years ago.

Abundant OTA television is what makes this country different from all others. Lets keep it this way.
The Internet is no place for streaming video.
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post #10 of 63 Old 02-03-2012, 05:05 AM
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Quote:


FWIW, the Sony KDL55BX520 is a 55" IPS screen. Not LED (Edge or Local dimming, though... only CCFL...)

The type of panel should have no relationship on the type of backlight used.

Abundant OTA television is what makes this country different from all others. Lets keep it this way.
The Internet is no place for streaming video.
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post #11 of 63 Old 02-03-2012, 06:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by videobruce View Post

The type of panel should have no relationship on the type of backlight used.

I know THAT. I'm just saying, it's just an old technology, nothing advanced in that particular TV.

I'm looking forward to locally dimmed large IPS panels. The BX520 is only CCFL, so it's kinda "eh". Good uniformity on the screen, but you know... IPS black levels aren't as good as other panels... but I think local dimming will help out tremendously.

Current HT setup:

Samsung UN65F6300 65" LCD HDTV, Polk CS20 Center, 2x Polk Monitor 75T Fronts, 2x Polk TSI300 Backs, Polk PSW110 Subwoofer.

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post #12 of 63 Old 02-03-2012, 09:11 AM
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Quote:
IPS black levels aren't as good as other panels... but I think local dimming will help out tremendously.

Judging by what Panny wrote about the improved efficiency of these IPS panels along with what you just stated, I would be willing to bet black levels will be worse. More efficiency = higher output = more leakage.

Abundant OTA television is what makes this country different from all others. Lets keep it this way.
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post #13 of 63 Old 02-03-2012, 10:27 AM
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Possible release date, according to their official website:

TC-L55WT50: TBD UNTIL Apr / 3
TC-L47WT50: TBD UNTIL Mar / 6
TC-L55DT50: TBD UNTIL Feb / 28
TC-L47DT50: TBD UNTIL Jan / 31
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post #14 of 63 Old 02-03-2012, 12:19 PM
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So the new tech for the wide angle is just available in the WT version. Wonder how expensive it will go for.

Since I couldn't get stock for a sony Hx929, the DT and WT interest me. Panasonic had really low input lag on their plasma line so I'm wondering if they will be able to keep that in their LED lines.
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post #15 of 63 Old 02-03-2012, 12:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guibs View Post

So the new tech for the wide angle is just available in the WT version. Wonder how expensive it will go for.

Since I couldn't get stock for a sony Hx929, the DT and WT interest me. Panasonic had really low input lag on their plasma line so I'm wondering if they will be able to keep that in their LED lines.

All Panasonic LCD-LED TV will be equipped with IPS (Wide viewing angle).
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post #16 of 63 Old 02-03-2012, 07:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seanclayton View Post

All Panasonic LCD-LED TV will be equipped with IPS (Wide viewing angle).

from their website, the WT as a special panel that push this even beyong the IPs usual capability.
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post #17 of 63 Old 02-04-2012, 05:27 AM
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Looked great until finding out they are edge lit and not full array moving on.....
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post #18 of 63 Old 02-04-2012, 05:55 AM
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I believe the choice is to meet the new energy standards, something Plasmas will probably never meet. The 85 watts reported consumption is a far cry from even DLP RPTV's.

Abundant OTA television is what makes this country different from all others. Lets keep it this way.
The Internet is no place for streaming video.
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post #19 of 63 Old 02-04-2012, 03:43 PM
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From what I understand the WT panel will be full backlit with 16 zones of local dimming. This will make the problem of contrast on IPS panels a non issue. This information came from Value Electronics's Facebook page video interview with a Panasonic rep. If you wish to find the video interview, they talk briefly about it in part 2 of the interview around the 2:25 mark. I'm curious as to how this will stack up with the Sharp Elite's local dimming...

As a side note; HDGuru is saying that the WT has the best viewing angle of any LCD they have ever seen. I'm still more of a plasma guy, but it's nice to see Panasonic stepping up their game in the LCD market. Their new redesigned plasmas and WT series of LCD should really make potential buyers stand up an notice. http://hdguru.com/ces-2012-post-show...243/#more-7243
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post #20 of 63 Old 02-05-2012, 04:58 AM
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Quote:


full backlit with 16 zones of local dimming. This will make the problem of contrast on IPS panels a non issue.

But. it won't solve the problem with 'halos' caused by local dimming (edge lit or full).
Contrast or poor blacks? IPS panels have a issue with poorer blacks compared to VA/PVA panels, so local dimming is even more important.

Regarding the "AR filter", is this what you are referring to?;
http://www.astraproducts.com/info-ac...ve-filters.asp

Abundant OTA television is what makes this country different from all others. Lets keep it this way.
The Internet is no place for streaming video.
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post #21 of 63 Old 02-05-2012, 08:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by videobruce View Post

But. it won't solve the problem with 'halos' caused by local dimming (edge lit or full).
Contrast or poor blacks? IPS panels have a issue with poorer blacks compared to VA/PVA panels, so local dimming is even more important.

Regarding the "AR filter", is this what you are referring to?;
http://www.astraproducts.com/info-ac...ve-filters.asp


It most likely won't solve the issue with haloing. I am curious to find out how it will stack up with the LG Nano LCD and Sharp Elite. This is just my personal opinion, but I believe that manufactures should only use IPS panels if it has full local dimming. Black level performance is just terrible without it. I think Panasonic will make a big splash with their WT series. If the television is reasonably priced, (full local dimming, so most likely not) and has a low input lag, than I just might consider buying it.
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post #22 of 63 Old 02-05-2012, 11:25 AM
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Im not an expert, but em I right when I say, that IPS panel is a very fast panel and it could help finally solve the 24p motion blur problem? If you go through all high-end 2011 HDTV models, is there any model from the top line which offers 24p motion without absolutely any artefacts? I had EX500 from Sony with S-PVA panel before. PQ not very top, but motionwise no issues because of the fast S-PVA panel ( the trails were much easier for my eyes to tolerate ). Now I have VT30, which has 50Hz issue ( false contouring, posterization ), double images and noising. HX line from Sony is also not perfect.
Could a fast IPS panel return 24p motion clarity ( without any IFC! ) back to normal?
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post #23 of 63 Old 02-05-2012, 12:34 PM
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The panel doesn't affect 24p since it's low motion.

the issue lies with blacklight and how its strobbed, which means someone would have to test it and look out for mismatch.
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post #24 of 63 Old 02-05-2012, 01:48 PM
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Black level response should benefit from a new 8-phase backlight scanning system.
http://panasonic.net/avc/viera/us201...d.html#topic01
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post #25 of 63 Old 02-05-2012, 02:09 PM
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It's not something new and doesn't hold much weight tbh.

Let's say the Panasonic IPS system has sets of 8 LED bars behind the panel. In order for that to work correctly

1. The pixels must reach their target state before the backlight is cut-off
2. The backlight scan cycle must perfectly match the LCD scan cycle


I highly doubt Panasonic is willing to both spot on for every model they ship. I personally don't have any high hopes for Panasonic LCDs. They've always been significantly inferior to the Plasma line-up.
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post #26 of 63 Old 02-05-2012, 03:29 PM
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For anyone who is interested, Trusted reviews first look:
http://www.trustedreviews.com/panaso...ries_TV_review
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post #27 of 63 Old 02-05-2012, 06:03 PM
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Trusted reviews needs to provide factual data. Without the review is just an opinion. But they do provide factual data on other reviews (cameras)
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post #28 of 63 Old 02-05-2012, 08:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by videobruce View Post

But. it won't solve the problem with 'halos' caused by local dimming (edge lit or full).
Contrast or poor blacks? IPS panels have a issue with poorer blacks compared to VA/PVA panels, so local dimming is even more important.

Regarding the "AR filter", is this what you are referring to?;
http://www.astraproducts.com/info-ac...ve-filters.asp

IPS poor black level is not something that is as significant with backlit led since to acheive the best black, the Led are closed (shutdown) so no light at all acheiving infinite black.

With local dimming, the black will be black. There is indeed a concern with only 16 zones for the local dimming. Halo will be present unless the WT new tech to help with view angle diminish halos.
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post #29 of 63 Old 02-06-2012, 12:09 AM
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Your statement contradicts itself's.
You state' "is not something that is as significant", but then state; "There is indeed a concern with only 16 zones for the local dimming. Halo will be present ".
So it is indeed, "significant".

Abundant OTA television is what makes this country different from all others. Lets keep it this way.
The Internet is no place for streaming video.
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post #30 of 63 Old 03-10-2012, 09:58 AM
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I just noticed a preorder link for TC-L47DT50 on Panasonic's web site.
Anyone has info on the WT50 preorder or availability?
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