At >69", when will there be options other than Sharp? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 31 Old 02-12-2012, 11:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Later this year (probably around October) we will be buying a new LCD TV in 70-80" range. I'd like high in the range, while my wife says 70" is plenty big. I think I could get her to go as high as maybe 72" if it were available.

Everytime I see the Sharp 70" (or 60" or 80") in the stores, I am disappointed in the lack of details in the faces compared to most of the other sets I see. Maybe it is just that most Sharps in the stores need adjustment to look better or maybe it is just that aren't as good. I do not know.

What I do know is that above 65", Sharp is only game in town, unless you want to pay over $10,000 for one of the specialty TVs, like B&O.

Does any know if this will change this year?
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post #2 of 31 Old 02-12-2012, 12:06 PM
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I thought the other tv manufactures kind of ceded the 70 and up to Sharp. If you want anything bigger that isn't sharp I think Panasonic may be entering that area

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post #3 of 31 Old 02-12-2012, 12:23 PM
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From viewing 60, 70 and 80 inch displays, I find that bigger is usually not better. There is a gradual degradation of picture quality as the display gets larger. Personally, I've decided not to find the largest display possible, but a large display that will still look great, most likely a 60" to 65".
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post #4 of 31 Old 02-12-2012, 12:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StockInv View Post

From viewing 60, 70 and 80 inch displays, I find that bigger is usually not better. There is a gradual degradation of picture quality as the display gets larger. Personally, I've decided not to find the largest display possible, but a large display that will still look great, most likely a 60" to 65".

My feeling exactly. There simply aren't enough data points in the signal, nor pixels in the screen, to warrent too wide a viewing field. That's at my viewing distance, which is unlikely to exceed 11 feet no matter how I might organize things in the future.


Of course, other people's tastes and viewing distance may differ.
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post #5 of 31 Old 02-12-2012, 02:11 PM
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Couldn't disagree with you guys more. The only thing more stunning than the 70" Elite picture is the overwhelmingness of the 80" Sharp 632 picture. Completely slaughters the viewing experience of any small 55-60" set, and at any (reasonable) viewing distance IMO.

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post #6 of 31 Old 02-12-2012, 02:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davegow View Post

My feeling exactly. There simply aren't enough data points in the signal, nor pixels in the screen, to warrent too wide a viewing field. That's at my viewing distance, which is unlikely to exceed 11 feet no matter how I might organize things in the future.


Of course, other people's tastes and viewing distance may differ.

Which might be resolved (no pun intended) by the 4K Panels?

So far 60 Inch is as big as I have, Sharp Panel. Not sure if I see the need to go larger yet.
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post #7 of 31 Old 02-12-2012, 02:56 PM
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I can't believe you guys
Don't blame the screen size blame the source
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post #8 of 31 Old 02-12-2012, 03:20 PM
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Yeah I disagree. 1080p looks great at 70 inches and just as good at 80. 4k at this point In my opinion is almost unnecessary.

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post #9 of 31 Old 02-12-2012, 05:21 PM
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Yeah, I'm not going to bother disputing the patently absurd notions that screen size should max out below 70"... As to the core question, it's Sharp and Sharp right now.

Samsung is promising -- for the second year in a row -- a 75" model. If they deliver it, the price will be high and the performance most likely won't. Figure $8000 MSRP +/-.

Panasonic may deliver a larger TV later this year. Emphasis on "may".

Otherwise, it's Sharp and Sharp.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working.
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post #10 of 31 Old 02-12-2012, 06:19 PM
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Panasonic is supposed to release a 70VT50 in the summer. I don't think they will this year but I'm sure it's a definite for 2013.

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post #11 of 31 Old 02-12-2012, 08:47 PM
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I keep reading people asking the same question on here regarding what other manufacturers will get in this game. I guess i don't understand why anyone needs a brand other than Sharp. Usually if there is only one company the theory is by having others enter, prices will drop and quality will go up. However, Sharp is already doing that all themselves.

They have put out the Elite and now a lower priced local dim set. Question to the OP - have you seen a properly calibrated Elite? You'll be hard pressed to find a better picture and I'm sure the new 945 series will get pretty close to Elite quality with the 70" probably selling in the low $3k range by late summer.

Sharp is updating and improving rapidly while aggressively pushing down prices. By late summer their entire line-up will all be 3D (even the cheap sub $2k 70" 640 model). The 80" is already available below $4k and by fall the newer 3D 240hz 80" will probably be close to $4k.

They've recently started discussing 4k image and I would bet they will be the first to implement it at a reasonable price.
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post #12 of 31 Old 02-13-2012, 11:31 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caneaddict View Post

I keep reading people asking the same question on here regarding what other manufacturers will get in this game. I guess i don't understand why anyone needs a brand other than Sharp. Usually if there is only one company the theory is by having others enter, prices will drop and quality will go up. However, Sharp is already doing that all themselves.

They have put out the Elite and now a lower priced local dim set. Question to the OP - have you seen a properly calibrated Elite? You'll be hard pressed to find a better picture and I'm sure the new 945 series will get pretty close to Elite quality with the 70" probably selling in the low $3k range by late summer.

Sharp is updating and improving rapidly while aggressively pushing down prices. By late summer their entire line-up will all be 3D (even the cheap sub $2k 70" 640 model). The 80" is already available below $4k and by fall the newer 3D 240hz 80" will probably be close to $4k.

They've recently started discussing 4k image and I would bet they will be the first to implement it at a reasonable price.

I have seen the Elite 60 and 70 and the Sharp 60, 70 and 80. I have seen exactly one of these 5 (an Elite, 70 but maybe a 60, that was showing a Blu-ray that had faces that were sharp) that was acceptable. But I will not be going with any TV with a glossy screen like the Elites. I hate having to make sure that every light is off and every curtain closed to watch it. Sharp, Sony and others make realitvely glare-free screens.

What I don't understand is that when I go to places like Best Buy and Fry's and look at a range of TV sets of the same size, the Sharp 60 (and 70 and 80) is not nearly as sharp in the faces, which is what we care about most, than the other sets. Maybe without proper calibration Sharp can't do what the others can without any special calibration or maybe Sharp is just the least sharp screen. I don't understand it.

Does anyone else?
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post #13 of 31 Old 02-13-2012, 12:26 PM
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I agree with you. The Panasonic plasma GT and VT series look the most realistic, but feature for feature and size for size are relatively expensive. They only go up to 65" and from what I've read they won't be releasing anything bigger in 2012. They also require active 3D glasses (so does Sharp). I think passive is the future and wish Sharp an others would adopt it.

I'm looking at getting a TV around September and will probably get an LG LED since they throw in 4 pairs of passive glasses.
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post #14 of 31 Old 02-14-2012, 10:24 AM
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I spent a lot of time at CES looking at TVs, and up until last week was an owner of a Sharp Elite 70". I see exactly what you are saying; the Sharp Elite to me didn't see as sharp as say the new Samsung 75ES8000.

At the show it was difficult to really do a good comparison. The TVs were separated by a good distance and they were showing vastly different content. I wonder if it has something to do with the pixel structure of the TVs. With the Elite I can see the sub-pixel structure when I get close...the Samsung has a more "monitor-like" structure, and at no point did I feel I was too close to watch. I really look forward to getting some time to play with an ES8000. Making sure it wasn't just a cream-of-the-crop panel, seeing what the black level looks like, etc. I have to say though, with the bright content they were showing, it was the best picture I've ever seen on a TV.

If the detail resolution of the Sharp sets have you worried, keep an eye out for their 4k sets at the end of the year. There is a very good chance the tech will make it to market late this year and it looks very promising. Their demos were more geared to showing the benefits of the 4k resolution (which was very apparent) and less about 'wow look at what a great picture'.

I'm sure I will get one of these two this year. My head is telling me that I'd be an idiot for buying anything except that Sharp 4k set. My heart along with my impatient nature will be pushing for the 75ES8000.
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post #15 of 31 Old 02-14-2012, 02:47 PM
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I can't compare the Sharp to many others in an "in-home" environment but I can say that the Sharp LC-70LE632U that I have looks amazing with HD from Directv and really outstanding with blu-ray. The Avatar blu-ray is stunning. I have not noticed any lack of details in faces. Mine has only been calibrated with the Disney WOW disc. On that they have a face used to help get your settings right and the detail was fantastic. I think Sharp is doing good things and I hope it continues. Going from a 47 inch Toshiba to this 70 inch Sharp was pretty profound.
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post #16 of 31 Old 02-14-2012, 03:12 PM
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I own the 70" Sharp 735U (came from a 61" Samsung DLP) and I can tell you that a 3D Blu-Ray or other 1080p content looks amazing. As said earler, blame the source, not the size of the panel.
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post #17 of 31 Old 02-14-2012, 06:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JB426 View Post

I can't compare the Sharp to many others in an "in-home" environment but I can say that the Sharp LC-70LE632U that I have looks amazing with HD from Directv and really outstanding with blu-ray. The Avatar blu-ray is stunning. I have not noticed any lack of details in faces. Mine has only been calibrated with the Disney WOW disc. On that they have a face used to help get your settings right and the detail was fantastic. I think Sharp is doing good things and I hope it continues. Going from a 47 inch Toshiba to this 70 inch Sharp was pretty profound.

How do Directv network TV shows look as far as sharpness in the face?
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post #18 of 31 Old 02-14-2012, 06:13 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jeffs2 View Post

I spent a lot of time at CES looking at TVs, and up until last week was an owner of a Sharp Elite 70". I see exactly what you are saying; the Sharp Elite to me didn't see as sharp as say the new Samsung 75ES8000.

At the show it was difficult to really do a good comparison. The TVs were separated by a good distance and they were showing vastly different content. I wonder if it has something to do with the pixel structure of the TVs. With the Elite I can see the sub-pixel structure when I get close...the Samsung has a more "monitor-like" structure, and at no point did I feel I was too close to watch. I really look forward to getting some time to play with an ES8000. Making sure it wasn't just a cream-of-the-crop panel, seeing what the black level looks like, etc. I have to say though, with the bright content they were showing, it was the best picture I've ever seen on a TV.

If the detail resolution of the Sharp sets have you worried, keep an eye out for their 4k sets at the end of the year. There is a very good chance the tech will make it to market late this year and it looks very promising. Their demos were more geared to showing the benefits of the 4k resolution (which was very apparent) and less about 'wow look at what a great picture'.

I'm sure I will get one of these two this year. My head is telling me that I'd be an idiot for buying anything except that Sharp 4k set. My heart along with my impatient nature will be pushing for the 75ES8000.

Is the Samsung 75ES8000 the usual glossy, highly reflective screens that Samsung normal uses?
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post #19 of 31 Old 02-14-2012, 07:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevenpaulrhodes View Post

How do Directv network TV shows look as far as sharpness in the face?

If you're talking about HD broadcasts then they look really good, at least to me. I haven't really tried to focus on that but if I notice anything I'll post back. I'm normally viewing from about 14 feet away.
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post #20 of 31 Old 02-14-2012, 08:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevenpaulrhodes View Post

Is the Samsung 75ES8000 the usual glossy, highly reflective screens that Samsung normal uses?

Yes, that's pretty much all they use. You can do your hair while watching TV.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working.
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post #21 of 31 Old 02-16-2012, 08:40 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by JB426 View Post

If you're talking about HD broadcasts then they look really good, at least to me. I haven't really tried to focus on that but if I notice anything I'll post back. I'm normally viewing from about 14 feet away.

Yes, my wife and I watch watch mainly network dramas, all in HD, and what is most important to us is the detail in the faces. When looking at Best Buy comparing the Sharp 60 to other 60s, the details were not there in the Sharp but were in most of the others. Instead of details, the Sharp's had blown out, spotchy colors.
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post #22 of 31 Old 02-16-2012, 08:59 AM
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I would never judge the quality of a display at Best Buy. I don't think they spend too much time properly calibrating them. It's not that I don't trust my eyes, I don't trust BB to display TV's in the best manner, especially with variables such as lighting, other nearby displays, and reflections. Instead, I would rely on this forum and other comments from owners readily found on other internet sites.
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post #23 of 31 Old 02-16-2012, 09:24 AM
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Originally Posted by StockInv View Post

I would never judge the quality of a display at Best Buy. I don't think they spend too much time properly calibrating them. It's not that I don't trust my eyes, I don't trust BB to display TV's in the best manner, especially with variables such as lighting, other nearby displays, and reflections. Instead, I would rely on this forum and other comments from owners readily found on other internet sites.

I have a 60" Sharp, the LE632. The Picture is fantastic after some calibration. I also own 2 Sony's, which out of the box, has really good pictures. I think the Sharp just needs more fiddling with the settings. In terms of having a "sharp" picture, the Sharp is better than my 2 CCFL Sony's. I agree that "at the store", the Sharp in torch mode does not look as good as some others, I always ask for a remote to play with the settings. Never judge a tv at the store's settings. I would of liked the 70" but wife is against the idea. "Happy wife, happy life."
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post #24 of 31 Old 02-26-2012, 06:13 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StockInv View Post

I would never judge the quality of a display at Best Buy. I don't think they spend too much time properly calibrating them. It's not that I don't trust my eyes, I don't trust BB to display TV's in the best manner, especially with variables such as lighting, other nearby displays, and reflections. Instead, I would rely on this forum and other comments from owners readily found on other internet sites.

Today I finally saw a large Sharp at some place other than Frys or Best Buy. A local media store, Starlight, had an 80" Sharp on display with a DirecTv feed.

I was very pleasantly surprised since it looked excellent. And, as a bonus, my wife finally started to agree with me that, since we will be watching it from 13-17' back in our new family room, the 80" might actually be the right size after all. (she originally thought 70 was too big but she was willing to go that big if I insisted but no bigger)
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post #25 of 31 Old 02-27-2012, 01:28 PM
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FWIW I replaced my Samsung UN55B8000 (2009) with a Sharp 70le735u, same place, same mount, same couch, same distance (about 9.5 feet) and it isn't too big and the image quality is excellent once you spend some time dialing it in or paying for a calibration. (I rolled my own from settings on this forum) I'm thrilled to have a matte screen back and as a gamer the panel and signal processing abilities of the unit feels very fast.

I've been a Samsung fan for a long time and went with the Sammy even though it had a glossy screen which is something I've always hated, still I haven't looked back since getting the Sharp.

I have very minor clouding but it's not as noticeable as it was on the Samsung. Difference between edge lit and backlit I'm guessing. Only real complaint I have is during dark scenes (after a fade out and right before credits start for example) the backlight sometimes can't seem to make up it's mind to be on or off and it will occasionally flash --, I call it sheet lightning. I watch movies with the lights down low -- casual watching I don't notice it at all.

at 13+ feet I think you'll want that 80" display.
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post #26 of 31 Old 02-27-2012, 04:48 PM
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The Samsung is still the flashlight edge lit correct? I love my 55D7000 for the style, look, etc. But seeing an Elite simply calibrated in Magnolia (and hooking up my laptop to see a few games etc), is simply stunning.

Makes my other 73" Mits 2008 DLP look like doo doo.
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post #27 of 31 Old 02-27-2012, 05:20 PM
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The Samsung is still the flashlight edge lit correct? .

Every Samsung is edge lit except for some new, very cheap model that appear to use "direct LED" which is technically a full array tech, but not a very good one.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working.
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post #28 of 31 Old 02-27-2012, 10:54 PM
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Originally Posted by rogo View Post

Every Samsung is edge lit except for some new, very cheap model that appear to use "direct LED" which is technically a full array tech, but not a very good one.

To blow some optimism, perhaps Samsung E-series edge lits will not have previous edge-lit problems?

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post #29 of 31 Old 02-27-2012, 11:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anthonymoody View Post

Couldn't disagree with you guys more. The only thing more stunning than the 70" Elite picture is the overwhelmingness of the 80" Sharp 632 picture. Completely slaughters the viewing experience of any small 55-60" set, and at any (reasonable) viewing distance IMO.

Yeah I agree with you 100%
when you view one of these , the Elite 70" & the Sharp 832 80" , that's been set-up correctly they are stunning.
the detail is amazing for panels of that size . Most B&M's that I been to all have them way outta whack,
Sharp is selling a boat load of them as well ....
In the case of the 80" I feel the big box stores don't really want to show it's best side as it's selling so well that it hurts sales of the other brands , it's best for them to have a 80" that looks not quite as good as the displays that are not selling well .

Mike

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post #30 of 31 Old 02-28-2012, 01:13 AM
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Originally Posted by irkuck View Post

To blow some optimism, perhaps Samsung E-series edge lits will not have previous edge-lit problems?

I certainly hope so. The price on the ES is so astronomical, though, I've crossed it off my list.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working.
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