Official Samsung UNxxES8000 Owner's Thread - Page 211 - AVS Forum
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post #6301 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 07:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Stefanhvt View Post

Nice info. I totally agree, standard is the lesser of two evils. Although I have to say that on my ES8000 ce dimming is disabled or almost unnoticeable without any tweaks at all.

Yeah after the last couple weeks, I believe CE is less jarring on the 8000 than on the 7500, probably because it too is being activated by Micro Dimming's zones. I think what I'm seeing now may be about what you already see.


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post #6302 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 07:40 AM
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Originally Posted by mx6bfast View Post

On the flashing color bars of the AVS disk, red, blue, green, should all 3 of them stop blinking at value 237. Is it better to have a higher gain or offset? I haven't recalibrated my tv since the most recent update and plan on doing it next week as my wife will be out of town. I recall last time I did it red wasn't even blinking at all on that pattern.

In case this helps.....

From the AVS Manual...

A4 Color Clipping
This clipping pattern is similar to White Clipping, but it splits the vertical bars into red, green, and blue. The pattern allows you to observe how white-level may affect colors on digital displays. Flashing gray is included behind the lettering that labels the digital values. The bars for 235 have been labeled as red, green, and blue to remind the user that 235-251 are allowed to blend together or clip. You can use this pattern to ensure that red, green, and blue are not blending together for 219-233. If the range from 219-233 does not flash, you may need to lower white-level so the entire range of colors will display. Using this pattern you may find that red, green, and blue do not necessarily clip at exactly the same levels, but you simply want to make sure levels lower than 235 flash. Nearby levels can be difficult to tell apart, so if the display never shows flashing for 235 or higher it may be difficult to spot flashing at 233.


A few weeks ago we were talking about colors in general, especially reds in Standard being too vivid. Some people may like that, which is fine, but I seem to prefer a more "natural" look - closer to what the directors and editors intended so I had lowered my overall Color to 45. I wound up bumping it back to 48 because I realized I perhaps liked a little extra vividness. While it's true that Contrast seems to need to be lower in Standard mode, on my panel it doesn't need to be that much lower based on the WOW BD and AVS files. Using the Color Clipping file as well as those others, it confirmed for me a Contrast of 98 in Standard, but it also confirmed my Color should be 45. So I lowered it back to 45 again. If for viewing pleasure I want it to be a little more vivid, I may bump it up later, but for now I'll leave it at there being all colors flash up to 233.


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post #6303 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 09:57 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Garnoch View Post

In case this helps.....
From the AVS Manual...
A4 Color Clipping
This clipping pattern is similar to White Clipping, but it splits the vertical bars into red, green, and blue. The pattern allows you to observe how white-level may affect colors on digital displays. Flashing gray is included behind the lettering that labels the digital values. The bars for 235 have been labeled as red, green, and blue to remind the user that 235-251 are allowed to blend together or clip. You can use this pattern to ensure that red, green, and blue are not blending together for 219-233. If the range from 219-233 does not flash, you may need to lower white-level so the entire range of colors will display. Using this pattern you may find that red, green, and blue do not necessarily clip at exactly the same levels, but you simply want to make sure levels lower than 235 flash. Nearby levels can be difficult to tell apart, so if the display never shows flashing for 235 or higher it may be difficult to spot flashing at 233.

A few weeks ago we were talking about colors in general, especially reds in Standard being too vivid. Some people may like that, which is fine, but I seem to prefer a more "natural" look - closer to what the directors and editors intended so I had lowered my overall Color to 45. I wound up bumping it back to 48 because I realized I perhaps liked a little extra vividness. While it's true that Contrast seems to need to be lower in Standard mode, on my panel it doesn't need to be that much lower based on the WOW BD and AVS files. Using the Color Clipping file as well as those others, it confirmed for me a Contrast of 98 in Standard, but it also confirmed my Color should be 45. So I lowered it back to 45 again. If for viewing pleasure I want it to be a little more vivid, I may bump it up later, but for now I'll leave it at there being all colors flash up to 233.

Anyone out there have any advice on what to adjust if say Red is clipping ealier than Blue and Green?? Is this parttern JUST for the adjustment of Color and Contrast? Or is this where some custom color mapping or 10p White Balance can allow for finer adjustment?
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post #6304 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 10:33 AM
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ok I've encounterd a issue I have been noticing a blue line flickering, while watching tv, (all hdmi cables) what cuases this? not in the same area.
anyone?
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post #6305 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 10:39 AM
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Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

I took delivery of a 65" 8000 on Thurs. Though this Chief mount that extends 34" posed a challenge the Geek installation went pretty well.
tv 002.jpg 1979k .jpg file (I'm awaiting a new black HT cabinet for under TV)
The display didn't show any outstanding defects right out of the box but with my room being fairly bright on sunny mornings, and especially with this TV's reflective glass, I had to wait for nightfall to really see if this unit's boogeyman might only come out at night.
Having read most of this thread, I used Nitro's settings in Std Mode. I then ran the DVE test patterns and it performed pretty well.
I then put it through its paces on a variety of material. First impression: Wow! This is one big, beautiful TV. smile.gif Films are SO much more immersive, detailed and downright enjoyable compared to the old 40" Sammy.
IMG_0094.jpg 1631k .jpg file (I apologize as my cell phone pics can't do it justice, and I later realized that some settings were off for that pic)
Banding: present at times- when an even sky fills the top of the screen such as in 1 or 2 scenes in" Troy", similar to this scene below from "The Two Towers".
IMG_0083.jpg 1820k .jpg file
Clouding: I've not seen irregular splotchiness so I guess this set passes that test.
Light leakage/ flashlighting: I see some leakage all around the edges, with more in the corners, but the visibility of this problem is varies depending on content. It is more noticeable in a dark room but is only apparent during certain very dark scenes, as previously described in this thread. All edges appear equally affected but assymetrical content on the screen often produces an uneven effect. Brightness=45 seems the best setting to tame it. I'm pretty sure that because I'm not a videophile, if I hadn't read this thread I really wouldn't have paid much attention to it. It's hard for me to capture it with the cellphone camera-it's a bit more obvious than this shows:
IMG_0086.jpg 1765k .jpg file
IMG_0091.jpg 1913k .jpg file
Last night we watched some 3D (Transformers , Thor) and everyone really liked it. It really enhanced immersion and the fun of movie night. The novelty may wear off, but I'm buying Avatar3D!biggrin.gif
We then watched football (MI lost frown.gif) and baseball (Tigers lost again!mad.gif) and everyone loved the PQ- no disturbing motion artifacts at all. AutoMotion Plus was on Std.. And like with films, the added detail apparent with the larger screen really enhanced the experience.
All in all. this TV is a huge, huge upgrade for my HT. My limited understanding is that some amount of leakage is common and expected with current edge-lit LED technology. And that the leakage I'm seeing may even lessen over the next 2 weeks. This set seems well worth the $3K and I'm not going to pay thousands more for the new Sony XBR65. Plasma is not an option because of daytime light levels in my room. The unanimous vote here in the SoundofMind HT is that "Wow, this TV's a keeper!"
I'm interested in your feedback.

As long as you're happy with it that is what counts! Seems that some suggest that LCDs do need to settle a bit after delivery and installation, so keep an eye on the good and the bad over the next few weeks. We particularly loved - LOVED - the PQ last night during the WS, but that's perhaps because we were rooting for SF biggrin.gif
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post #6306 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 11:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Catt99 View Post

As long as you're happy with it that is what counts! Seems that some suggest that LCDs do need to settle a bit after delivery and installation, so keep an eye on the good and the bad over the next few weeks. We particularly loved - LOVED - the PQ last night during the WS, but that's perhaps because we were rooting for SF biggrin.gif

HA! So that made it look better? smile.gif

I didn't even see SoundOf Mind's post - odd. I'll give it a read and just update this post if I can add to it.

EDIT:

SoundOfMind, thanks for sharing. Man, for a 65" you seem to have gotten lucky! Looks great! The banding doesn't surprise me for the 65" but it seems minimal compared to any others we've seen here especially since it didn't bother you during sports. love your setup too. Looks great and will look even better after you get your cabinet. I bet those speakers sound nice. smile.gif Good luck!


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post #6307 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 11:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Garnoch View Post

In case this helps.....
From the AVS Manual...
A4 Color Clipping
This clipping pattern is similar to White Clipping, but it splits the vertical bars into red, green, and blue. The pattern allows you to observe how white-level may affect colors on digital displays. Flashing gray is included behind the lettering that labels the digital values. The bars for 235 have been labeled as red, green, and blue to remind the user that 235-251 are allowed to blend together or clip. You can use this pattern to ensure that red, green, and blue are not blending together for 219-233. If the range from 219-233 does not flash, you may need to lower white-level so the entire range of colors will display. Using this pattern you may find that red, green, and blue do not necessarily clip at exactly the same levels, but you simply want to make sure levels lower than 235 flash. Nearby levels can be difficult to tell apart, so if the display never shows flashing for 235 or higher it may be difficult to spot flashing at 233.

A few weeks ago we were talking about colors in general, especially reds in Standard being too vivid. Some people may like that, which is fine, but I seem to prefer a more "natural" look - closer to what the directors and editors intended so I had lowered my overall Color to 45. I wound up bumping it back to 48 because I realized I perhaps liked a little extra vividness. While it's true that Contrast seems to need to be lower in Standard mode, on my panel it doesn't need to be that much lower based on the WOW BD and AVS files. Using the Color Clipping file as well as those others, it confirmed for me a Contrast of 98 in Standard, but it also confirmed my Color should be 45. So I lowered it back to 45 again. If for viewing pleasure I want it to be a little more vivid, I may bump it up later, but for now I'll leave it at there being all colors flash up to 233.


With so many people finding near 100 contrast to be correct, I'm guessing there is something quite different with my panel. I have a little bit of vertical banding, but not near what other people have stated, so maybe this panel is quite different. Anyway, I'm currently using the AVS patterns to dial in my picture and I have to drop contrast to 72 to get the correct color clipping to show. I had to go back and adjust the brightness to get that back in place, but not a big adjustment was needed. The picture looks great now and was much improved.

What are you all using to set the white balance? Or even the 10p settings. I've used the AVS stuff for brightness, backlight and contrast, but don't have a clue what to use to set those color specific items (currently using someone's settings they posted for those). My WoW disks are getting here today, but I'm not sure if that's what I'll use for those things or not. Are you all using some hardware to get those settings, or is this WoW disk going to have something that will allow me to do it?


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post #6308 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 11:02 AM
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Originally Posted by slopokeR View Post

ok I've encounterd a issue I have been noticing a blue line flickering, while watching tv, (all hdmi cables) what cuases this? not in the same area.
anyone?

That doesn't sound good and sound like a defect. Hard to tell right now. Does it happen only on one input?


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post #6309 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 11:06 AM
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Originally Posted by gtm73 View Post

Anyone out there have any advice on what to adjust if say Red is clipping ealier than Blue and Green?? Is this parttern JUST for the adjustment of Color and Contrast? Or is this where some custom color mapping or 10p White Balance can allow for finer adjustment?

I'm sure 10p helps that because I don't have this issue with Movie mode but do with Standard. The strong red push for a lot of people in Standard is why my White Balance Red Gain is down to 5.


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post #6310 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 11:09 AM
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Originally Posted by slopokeR View Post

ok I've encounterd a issue I have been noticing a blue line flickering, while watching tv, (all hdmi cables) what cuases this? not in the same area.
anyone?

Is it a solid line? If so, it sounds like your blue LEDs in that row are coming on for some reason. What do you mean by "not in the same area"? If there's a solid line of LEDs that are getting stuck on, they won't move around. I guess It's possible you have more than one row of LEDs that are having the same issue. Either way, as Garnoch said, it doesn't sound good and will likely require a replacement inverter, cable and/or panel.


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post #6311 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 11:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Jestered View Post

With so many people finding near 100 contrast to be correct, I'm guessing there is something quite different with my panel. I have a little bit of vertical banding, but not near what other people have stated, so maybe this panel is quite different. Anyway, I'm currently using the AVS patterns to dial in my picture and I have to drop contrast to 72 to get the correct color clipping to show. I had to go back and adjust the brightness to get that back in place, but not a big adjustment was needed. The picture looks great now and was much improved.
What are you all using to set the white balance? Or even the 10p settings. I've used the AVS stuff for brightness, backlight and contrast, but don't have a clue what to use to set those color specific items (currently using someone's settings they posted for those). My WoW disks are getting here today, but I'm not sure if that's what I'll use for those things or not. Are you all using some hardware to get those settings, or is this WoW disk going to have something that will allow me to do it?

Without equipment, you basically have to do it by eye or by trying people's settings that used equipment. I tried many before settling on CNET's color and white balance settings for their Movie mode. I've tried some since too. Adjustments were made from there but I've never changed the basic color settings or 10p settings since settling on theirs - except for tests. Plus they used 100 Contrast too, and so all said, my panels seems close to that one. In Standard, I didn't have 10p options and the red push was stronger so I made adjustments to match Movie as closely as I could. My settings are available via a link after you click on my name to the left - or just go to page 117. If you're finding you need your contrast lower though, Nitra's settings may work better for you. It doesn't hurt to try things out though. Good luck!


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post #6312 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 11:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Garnoch View Post

Without equipment, you basically have to do it by eye or by trying people's settings that used equipment. I tried many before settling on CNET's color and white balance settings for their Movie mode. I've tried some since too. Adjustments were made from there but I've never changed the basic color settings or 10p settings since settling on theirs - except for tests. Plus they used 100 Contrast too, and so all said, my panels seems close to that one. In Standard, I didn't have 10p options and the red push was stronger so I made adjustments to match Movie as closely as I could. My settings are available via a link after you click on my name to the left - or just go to page 117. If you're finding you need your contrast lower though, Nitra's settings may work better for you. It doesn't hurt to try things out though. Good luck!

Thanks! I think I'm already using your settings for those things. I too was seeing too much red push and dropped those things like you mentioned in your settings. It worked well and the red is perfect for my eyes now. Oh and I'm also using the brightness trick to try to tame the dimming problem and it seems to have worked for me like others have already stated. I don't think I'll be going back to Movie mode now.


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post #6313 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Garnoch View Post

That doesn't sound good and sound like a defect. Hard to tell right now. Does it happen only on one input?
its on hdmi 1 for cable box, I switched it to #2, same thing but I ran my blu ray player it doesn't do it. I played it for 5min. I just purchased the monoprice redmere cables also.
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post #6314 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 11:26 AM
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You're welcome. Same here - I may not go back. I thought I was happy before except missing Micro Dimming, but now I'm thrilled. I'll update as some time goes by.


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post #6315 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 11:29 AM
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I ve also been on support with them cuase you can't piggy back 3 cables, from box to wall plate, to 2nd plate, then to tv
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post #6316 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 11:35 AM
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Well the good news is that sounds like an issue with the cable box, not the TV. I use monoprice cable too and have never had issues.


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post #6317 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 11:40 AM
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Originally Posted by slopokeR View Post

its on hdmi 1 for cable box, I switched it to #2, same thing but I ran my blu ray player it doesn't do it. I played it for 5min. I just purchased the monoprice redmere cables also.

I use and love those cables.
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post #6318 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 11:42 AM
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Well the good news is that sounds like an issue with the cable box, not the TV. I use monoprice cable too and have never had issues.
I was thinking the samething I was going to go swap out the box, it seems more video signal, thanks for the help. I would hate to have to return a week old tv. eek.gif
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post #6319 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 11:45 AM
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the cables are very nice!! but that sad thing we tried to setup with wall plates and they wouldnt work,( unless when I switch out the box it does) it would only work with redmere cables going in to plate #1 then I had to use a different hdmi( the thick black ones) to plate #2 then redemers to the tv, frown.gif
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post #6320 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 11:58 AM
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I was thinking the samething I was going to go swap out the box, it seems more video signal, thanks for the help. I would hate to have to return a week old tv. eek.gif

Ha, yes. BUT, make sure you swap it out and know for sure before your return window closes. smile.gif


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post #6321 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 12:56 PM
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Well the good news is that sounds like an issue with the cable box, not the TV. I use monoprice cable too and have never had issues.

Careful now - you don't want to get any warnings for plugging products. wink.gif

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post #6322 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 01:03 PM
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Good catch, that actually made me laugh.


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post #6323 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Garnoch View Post

Thanks, Stefan. Putting all this stuff together helps paint the picture of what's going on. And Catt's link had info I had never seen before. I can only assume that website somehow got Samsung to go into detail as to what was going on. Some people probably don't click links, so I'll paste the pertinent info here....
Micro Dimming, according to Samsung, is software using exceptionally fast processors that can instantaneously run algorithms on the information coming from your antennae, cable box, or dish and decide on whether or not to tweak the lights and darks of the picture by adjusting the cells in the liquid crystal display (LCD) itself instead of the actual LEDS. WHEW! That was a mouthful!
It does this by dividing the LCD screen into zones. The Micro Dimming Ultimate divides the screen into app. 600 zones. You may be thinking, that’s a lot of zones, but why should I pay more for micro dimming when local dimming is less expensive and does the same thing? The answer is, they have the same goal, but one should be exceptionally better at the job.
Instead of adjusting the brightness of the LEDS they devised a system that would work at the liquid crystal level. And if they could adjust / tweak with perfection the actual liquid crystal cells on the display it would effectively give you the ultimate picture. You see all light has to go through the liquid crystal cells in a LCD screen. Each liquid crystal cell already does a little twisting and turning to allow on a certain amount of light through in Local Dimming, but with Micro Dimming the software will go deeper into each pixel and adjust each pixel in a zone giving you a staggering better contrast of lights and darks. That’s the theory.
So what is Micro Dimming Ultimate?
The system software will divide the screen up into app. 600 zones and each zone will give each pixel in that zone the attention it deserves faster than you can see. Adjusting on three levels for contrast, sharpness, and overall image color.
So what is Micro Dimming Pro?
The Pro version has app. 300 zones which makes it not as attentive to detail as the 600 zone Ultimate, but also works on three levels. Contrast Enhancements, Color Enhancements and Sharpness
So what is Micro Dimming Standard?
This also has app. 300 zones, except it only deals with contrast enhancements (darks and lights) and does not have the color and sharpness enhancement features of pro and ultimate.
Is Micro Dimming worth the money over Local Dimming?
Most experts would say not yet. There’s still much more that could be done to improve the technology. As some Plasma and other less expensive Local Dimming LCD LED TVs still give off a better picture. Me personally, I couldn’t tell the difference between Ultimate and Pro, but could definitely see a difference on the standard.
That being said I would never buy a TV with Standard Micro Dimming as it’s not as effective as Local Dimming and doesn’t really give that great of contrast, in my opinion. So either go Pro, Ultimate or Local Dimming. At least for now as all three will give you approximately the same picture.

Of course this is why the brighter areas of Standard mode are brighter than Movie mode, requiring their backlights to be set differently for a similar light output. This technology is also making the blacks in Standard (and other modes) appear darker than Movie. Combine that with CE Dimming which is dimming the whole panel during dark scenes and you can see what the outcome will be. The problem for some of us is that CE Dimming is intrusive, which is what I'm liking about this new trick. Is this trick introducing some unwanted effects to a calibration? Quite possible. Is MD and CE introducing unwanted effects to a calibration too? Probably, which is probably why Samsung didn't put this stuff in Movie mode. For the first time though, I'm feeling the lesser of two evils is Standard with these tweaks. Man, has my picture looked sick the last two days. All it will take though is me finding one place where it really messes up my picture for me to go back to Movie mode though - which I was loving.
By the way, other than the discs, two of the main scenes I used for realizing I was losing too much detail and that this trick needed tweaking on my panel, was the following....
UP
The scene where you first meet Muntz, standing in the shadows of the cave. (the cutaway shots of the house with colored balloons is a great scene to compare colors, shadows and detail between Standard and Movie too)
The Empire Strikes Back
The scene where you first see the Emperor in person walking off the shuttle craft. He's dressed all in black and his face in the shadows of his cloak and from the craft. This is intercut with shots of Vader, who is of course also dressed in black with nice folds in his costume against a brighter floor and back ground.

Very good post and thanks for sharing that information here. That goes a lot more into detail than anything else I've read on the subject. Now I actually understand what micro-dimming is trying to accomplish and how it does it. Why couldn't Samsung have that exact explanation in their manuals? Then again, look at their firmware notes...

I went through and tweaked standard mode today with the AVS disc, using the new CE-Dimming workaround of course. I also tweaked movie mode a bit more also. Both seem fine according to the AVS disc - black clipping, APL clipping, white clipping, color clipping, color steps, grayscale steps - they all seem fine with both standard and movie - with just some slight variances with the bars between the two picture modes. Yet there is most certainly a difference between the 2 modes, even though in both cases the bars are correct. The whites in standard are much brighter and whiter - making the whites in movie mode look rather dull - even though contrast is set at 94 for movie and 84 for standard. Based on what you posted above, I'm now certain that this is due to the micro-dimming which is active in standard. As far as detail in dark areas, I believe they are very very close - perhaps movie reveals a tiny bit more detail in the blacks but its extremely close - and I do have gamma on +1 in movie mode so that may be the reason right there.

Other things I've noticed since the workaround and additional tweaks:

- Many seem to be okay with contrast close to 100 even in standard. Using the AVS disc, that's just a bit too high for me - there's just a tiny bit of white clipping when close to 100 - not bad, just a tiny bit. It seems around 84 I can see all the bars without having to stare for minutes - perhaps a bit higher would work as well - I landed on 84 and kept it there.

- Dynamic contrast seems rather safe to use on low only; with the AVS tests, low does not alter the patterns enough to even need to make any changes whatsoever. Medium has a more drastic effect and does affect the bars - and high is out of the question - it just wrecks havoc with the blacks and whites. For me I think dynamic contrast is not necessary for standard but it may prove useful at times. In movie mode it seems to almost be required just to make up for the lack of micro-dimming.

- Standard can appear slightly harsh at times when things are very brightly lit - like many shows these days with floodlights just poured over peoples faces during reality shows, talk shows, etc. - in these cases movie seems to dial it back and keep things from looking flooded. In standard, faces can sometimes look just a bit brighter than I would like, even though everything else is fine. I believe that's due to the micro-dimming, which is enhancing the lighter areas.

- It's obvious how bad natural mode is when viewing AVS test patterns. The color is dreadful - color bars look almost pastel. And color clipping, black clipping and white clipping are all in full force. Ditto for Dynamic mode.

Overall I think with the new CE-Dimming workaround, I will be spending most of my time in standard mode. Movie mode just looks a bit too dull and lifeless to me in general, when comparing to movie. As far as color, I think I'm pretty happy at this point with the color in both modes. This set has a real issue with reds - the color clipping patterns just barely misses clipping the red, and that's with R-Gain down to 10 and R-Offset down to 3! But with the reds dialed back, the color actually looks quite good - with color tone set to standard. The warm 1 and warm2 modes both lean too much towards yellow for my tastes.

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post #6324 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 01:27 PM
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With so many people finding near 100 contrast to be correct, I'm guessing there is something quite different with my panel. I have a little bit of vertical banding, but not near what other people have stated, so maybe this panel is quite different. Anyway, I'm currently using the AVS patterns to dial in my picture and I have to drop contrast to 72 to get the correct color clipping to show. I had to go back and adjust the brightness to get that back in place, but not a big adjustment was needed. The picture looks great now and was much improved.
What are you all using to set the white balance? Or even the 10p settings. I've used the AVS stuff for brightness, backlight and contrast, but don't have a clue what to use to set those color specific items (currently using someone's settings they posted for those). My WoW disks are getting here today, but I'm not sure if that's what I'll use for those things or not. Are you all using some hardware to get those settings, or is this WoW disk going to have something that will allow me to do it?

I also find that I need my contrast a bit lower in standard mode. I can get close to 100 and it's not too bad but there is a bit f clipping - at 84 I can see all the bars and going lower doesn't seem to be necessary for me. In movie I can have the contrast higher and still see all the bars.

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post #6325 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 01:34 PM
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AVS reprimanding Ricoflashback for promoting something in a post is sorta like Osama Binladen reprimanding a dude for killing someone. Seriously, there are more ads on this site than anywhere. Pages take forever to load due to all the junk mail, it's like dialup. So these tweaks to the Standard Mode that Gornach is high on now, are those the ones that European person posted in a different forum, with the Brightness at 53? My other question is this: since many hate the Microdimming and Contrast Enhancement features in Standard Mode (that sold me on the set btw) thus going with Movie Mode, why now go back to Standard essentially shutting those features off? Why not just stick with Movie?

Samsung ES8000 65", Evo Kit installed, Yamaha AVR with Paradigm speakers, iMac, iPad, Apple TV and HTC One phone.
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post #6326 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 01:40 PM
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I forgot you weren't using the Warm modes any more.

It's hard enough getting different panels set up the same to begin with, but you can also factor in the fact that once you change one setting, it will throws the other out, then you compensate until it all appears correct. What I mean is that even if two panels were identical, you could have different settings on each that wind up looking about the same with the discs and files - and to the eye.

I never thought I'd be happy with Standard, but even now, watching my daughter watch Disney Channel from the kitchen, the set looks insanely good. Dare I say face melting, Eagle?

And I agree that if Samsung would just give us easy access to all this info, no one would really be complaining (about this stuff). Or the new trick we just learned.... Obviously when Samsung wrote the software, they knew that Brightness would control the screen turning off and the intensity of CE Dimming via thresholds. They could have simply documented all that for their customers.


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post #6327 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 01:45 PM
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Originally Posted by thebignewt View Post

AVS reprimanding Ricoflashback for promoting something in a post is sorta like Osama Binladen reprimanding a dude for killing someone. Seriously, there are more ads on this site than anywhere. Pages take forever to load due to all the junk mail, it's like dialup. So these tweaks to the Standard Mode that Gornach is high on now, are those the ones that European person posted in a different forum, with the Brightness at 53? My other question is this: since many hate the Microdimming and Contrast Enhancement features in Standard Mode (that sold me on the set btw) thus going with Movie Mode, why now go back to Standard essentially shutting those features off? Why not just stick with Movie?

It's JD that's I'm high on - the new trick is just adding to the euphoria haha.

Yes, the trick is from that other thread that some of us have posted in. We linked it here as well and even copied the info over here while giving PRSUT credit. I'm not sure how he found it though.

I don't think any of us hated Micro Dimming. In fact, it's the reason we want to use Standard. or put another way, we would like control to turn it on in Movie mode - without CE. The issue for some of us is that the dimming of the whole screen (CE), drives us nuts. This trick simply allows you to diminish the whole screen dimming via a Brightness threshold, while supposedly retaining Micro Dimming.

And well said about Ricoflashback, man!


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post #6328 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 01:50 PM
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Originally Posted by thebignewt View Post

AVS reprimanding Ricoflashback for promoting something in a post is sorta like Osama Binladen reprimanding a dude for killing someone. Seriously, there are more ads on this site than anywhere. Pages take forever to load due to all the junk mail, it's like dialup. So these tweaks to the Standard Mode that Gornach is high on now, are those the ones that European person posted in a different forum, with the Brightness at 53? My other question is this: since many hate the Microdimming and Contrast Enhancement features in Standard Mode (that sold me on the set btw) thus going with Movie Mode, why now go back to Standard essentially shutting those features off? Why not just stick with Movie?

Keep in mind that there are several different "enhancement" features in these sets, and not all of them are bad.

CE-Dimming

There are many people who are bothered by CE-Dimming, also referred to as auto-dimming.That kicks in when the screen is showing darker scenes, and dims the screen further, which many like myself find very unwelcome. Unfortunately that cannot be turned off since Samsung doesn't allow it, but fortunately, there is now a known workaround that seems to suppress that functionality. CE-Dimming is forced on in all modes except movie and CAL modes.

Micro-Dimming

Micro-dimming is very different from CE-Dimming, and garnoch posted a very good description just a few posts ago that describes exactly what it does and how. Micro-dimming is generally a good feature, and is forced on in all modes except movie and CAL modes. There really is no reason to want to disable micro-dimming in standard mode because if that's what you want you might as well just stick to movie since movie doesn't have it. If movie mode had micro-dimming I think we would all just be happy staying with movie mode.

Other enhancements like black tone and dynamic contrast are available in various modes, and are best used with discretion. Dynamic contrast tends to help add a bit more "pop" to the image, by increasing the contrast between whites and blacks, but don't set it higher than low unless you want clipping. Black tone deepens blacks but at the expense of clipping - even on low it clips, so my advice is leave it off for most viewing. Maybe for some animation, where there may be less or no detail in the blacks, it could come in handy to really add some depth to the black tones, but in general, it's not worth it to deepen the blacks but lose detail.

So basically you have CE-Dimming and Micro-dimming which can be easily confused. CE-Dimming is generally unwanted and the only way to avoid it is to either use movie or CAL modes, or use the new workaround in standard. Micro-dimming on the other hand is a good thing and that is why many of us want to stick with standard, since it is unavailable in movie and CAL modes. With the new workaround we get the benefit of the micro-dimming which movie doesn't have, while disabling the CE-Dimming which we don't want active.

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post #6329 of 16240 Old 10-29-2012, 01:52 PM
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I forgot you weren't using the Warm modes any more.
It's hard enough getting different panels set up the same to begin with, but you can also factor in the fact that once you change one setting, it will throws the other out, then you compensate until it all appears correct. What I mean is that even if two panels were identical, you could have different settings on each that wind up looking about the same with the discs and files - and to the eye.
I never thought I'd be happy with Standard, but even now, watching my daughter watch Disney Channel from the kitchen, the set looks insanely good. Dare I say face melting, Eagle?
And I agree that if Samsung would just give us easy access to all this info, no one would really be complaining (about this stuff). Or the new trick we just learned.... Obviously when Samsung wrote the software, they knew that Brightness would control the screen turning off and the intensity of CE Dimming via thresholds. They could have simply documented all that for their customers.

Thanks to the CE-Dimming workaround, I might dare say for the first time, yes, the image can look face melting! tongue.gif
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I'm thinking that due to the additional zones in the ES8000, compared to the 7500, that slightly-harsher look I mentioned above with faces especially when getting flooded with lights may not be so pronounced. The smaller amount of zones in the 7500 may result in faces getting brightened up more overall, since there aren't as many zones being considered. Just a thought.

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