My Bravia screen is broken... and I can't get a straight answer as to why!!... HELP?!? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 7 Old 11-07-2012, 05:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi folks,

I pray you guys here at AVS can help me out, and are more intelligent than the idiot repairmen I've spent the last week talking to!!

So here's my issue in a nutshell (I'll try to be brief!):

I have a bad LCD panel. (so they say)

I own a Bravia 52". It's a KDL-52VL150. It has a dark image and ghosting (slow-motion) on the right side. After about 40 minutes of running, a power cycle will fix it. (E.G. it's warmed up)

I have done my due diligence and read the snot out of the problem online.

What I've done:

Eveything points to a TAB fault. Even youtube videos exist showing how to fix it.

I have done them. It does not fix it. All of my TABs seem to be perfectly fine and intact, and pressing them does nothing (I've pressed every one in every combination possible... including ALL at once).

So I thought T-CON. Well, every repairman said, "NOPE, it not the T-CON; that'll give you lines, not ghosting. It's the panel"
I've heard "It's the panel" so many times, I think I'm gonna go kick a neighbors cat.

Anyway. I've tried everything I could find to try, all with no luck. confused.gif


The question no one can answer...

SO, I noticed something as I was fiddling around with it, that got me thinking.... WTFetch?!
This is what it was:

When I first turn the TV on, the boot sequence looks FINE. What I mean by that, is that the Bravia logo displays FLAWLESSLY.
Normally when the TV is running, there is a HUGE dark haze right smack in the center of the TV; right where the Bravia logo was geographically located... but at start-up, that location, I.E the logo IS FINE!!! eek.gif

There is also a split second of "dead" color/background just after the Logo disappears and just before the screen goes to the live signal (video inputs, menu.. etcetera) that is also completely fine. It's not until the TV is done booting that the image problem creeps up.

After boot, the menu is affected by the darkening, every input is affected by darkening and slow-mo, it's all bad EXCEPT the logo and the split minute of dark-blue-almost-black blank space before the input/s comes live.

How is this possible? If the panel is bad.... then EVERYTHING displayed on it should also be bad... right????

How is the start-up sequence completely unaffected, but everything after that, all trippy?

The visual problems fit to a T, a bad panel. I just can't reckon in my mind how the panel can work for a brief moment (everytime) when it's turned on, but then be all bat-crap after.


PLEASE, please someone shed some light on this.

Is it my main-board? The inputs are affected equally.... but so is the menu. Is the 'menu' on the main-boards memory? Isn't the logo as well... even though it's unaffected??


If the panel is bad, so be it! But I REALLY wanna know how this is possible? And if it's also possible it's NOT actually a bad panel!?


Thanks SO much you guys! If you can't answer this... I'm gonna go nuts. biggrin.gif
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post #2 of 7 Old 11-13-2012, 03:20 PM - Thread Starter
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BUMP.

Can anybody help me out??? frown.gif
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post #3 of 7 Old 11-13-2012, 06:26 PM
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how many guys that make their living diagnosing and repairing tvs are you second guessing?

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post #4 of 7 Old 11-14-2012, 10:48 AM - Thread Starter
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I spoke with at least 10 different people.

You have to realize, the folks I spoke with buy parts and replace parts; not study how electronics work. I couldn't find a legit repairman.

I am not a genius and I only tinker passively, but I asked questions that I could answer with a higher probability of being right than they did. I used specific 'verbage' they didn't even recognize, and had to explain it 4 different ways. Eventually I ran out of patience trying to find someone who actually knew scopes and the machines used to fix the panels...or at the very least how they worked... my mother can buy a part and screw it in.

I asked the question I just mentioned above, to every single one, and they all said some version of "I don't know why, sorry guy" or , "well that's weird", or "hmm... that's strange" or "I don't know what you're talking about, but bring it in and I'll rape you and tell you that I don't know again".

Never got any sort of answer to my question. I want to make clear again, that if the panel is bad, so be it!

But I just wondered if somebody here, could tell me why the startup sequence is unaffected by the supposed LCD problem. I just want to understand how this is possible, and if it means that it may not be a panel issue, but another one.

I meant no disrespect. I assumed that someone who did it for a living would at least understand how the TV worked and could explain the process involved a little bit more explicitly! I quickly became tired of calling, and therefore came here.

I'm not second guessing anyone. I'm merely seek an understanding of this possibility. biggrin.gif Hopefully that makes more sense...
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post #5 of 7 Old 11-14-2012, 04:42 PM
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Gotcha!

having been a tech in the past (35 years at a Toyota dealership) I can tell you that techs are loathe to try to diagnose something over the phone--if they're right they lose money and if they're wrong they've alienated a potential customer. The most I'd do without seeing the car was make a couple of suggestions while stressing that without having any "hands-on" with it I was still basically making an educated guess.

As for being "parts replacers" there are good reasons for that--often it's cheaper to replace a part than to take it apart and repair it, usually more reliable too, and in this day and age of consumer protection laws it's often a matter of CYA. I still have a repair manual for a '69 Cadillac El Dorado, in which are detailed instructions on how to disassemble and overhaul a power antenna. At today's labor rates that procedure would cost hundreds more than simply installing a new one, not even taking into consideration that many assemblies these days just aren't designed to be taken apart.

There's some chance that the panel for your set comes pre-assembled with some other component like a circuit board or processor that is the actual culprit but is not available separately--this is for economy of production but negatively effects serviceability and economy of repair, I've seen this sort of thing in the automotive field (you can't get a single power seat motor from Toyota--have to but an entire seat frame) and know it also happens with electronics.

Also keep in mind the fact that in our throwaway culture fewer people are bothering to repair stuff so truly competent repair people are getting thin on the ground--you can't make a decent living at it.

I hope you find an answer to your problem--maybe find an internet forum populated by tv repair guys--I used to hang out in one 10 years ago but don't know if it still exists.

Best of luck!

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post #6 of 7 Old 11-15-2012, 12:55 AM
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Hello,

From what you are describing, it still seems like a TAB problem.
The TABS are a tricky thing, you can apply pressure at certain angles and it wouldn't do anything. Also, there are several TABS and one is enough to distort the whole panel entirely. There are some TABS that have a metal stub which is bonded on the panel and applying pressure on that exact point can fix it. Did you really try pressing on every possible edge on every possible TAB?


EDIT: right there
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post #7 of 7 Old 11-19-2012, 10:11 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks Steve. I do understand why most just replace parts, and I completely get the whole "not worth the hassle" part of fixing most things.

I guess I have a bit of OCD and need to know why the problem exists, and not just that there is one. And again, in this case, it appeared as if it was more than met the eye.
I just wanted to know the boot process and how logos are displayed, what part of the TV loads them, et cetera, so that I could figure out if somehow the startup sequence was bypassing the LCD problem.

Do-it-yourself, unfortunately, I have pressed every square millimeter of those darn little TABs. I even used my finger so that I could control the pressure, and to no avail. I was getting pretty mad actually, because everything pointed to that as the problem, and yet it wasn't altering the picture to push on them. I even had my wife lend both hands so we could push on all of them simultaneously and 'wiggle' a little bit to see if we could find a faulty joint.

I did notice something further however, that may put this to rest...

I hooked it up to my studio computer (figuring I could use it there at least, since my music programs are basically a static screen and wouldn't 'ghost' as bad as a moving picture), and noticed that when displaying dark colors, the problem would REALLY show up, but when I had a white-ish background, that darkening was substantially less. And not just because it was white. It seemed to be affected less.

So I'm thinking that it's possible that the BRAVIA logo only looks unaffected. Simply because it's white. When in fact, it is still being affected, but I can't tell.

I don't know if that made sense, but ultimately, my point is that my whole argument that the BRAVIA logo is unaffected, could be false.

However, if anyone can shed some light as to how the boot sequence works and where those images are stored, et cetera, I would LOVE the education.

Thanks guys! If you have any other ideas, I would love to try them!
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