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pharmdogg's Avatar pharmdogg
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Personally,the THX Android app got me close enough and I was happy with it. I did have my brightness pretty high so I was getting some washed out blacks but to my untrained eye it looked fine. Post calibration the picture is not quite as retina searing as before. I'll leave it the way it is since it is more pleasing to my eyes now. The auto backlight works pretty well too if you set it on "high".
dpiantino's Avatar dpiantino
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Update: I thought there was a bug in the calibration software, but there isn't. The calibration settings are set so that the general settings do not interact with the professional settings. i.e. You can't mess up your professional calibration by adjusting the general brightness, contrast, color and tint. As soon as you enter the professional settings, the professional settings take over.

What brought this about was when I was looking at my gamma values in the professional setting. I was seeing a 1.9 in the prof settings, and when I switched to the general settings it jumped to 2.2 if I moved the brightness, contrast, tint, or color. If I went back to the professional settings, it went to 1.9.

This is a disappointment because it really doesn't allow you to do a poor mans calibration. i.e. use the general brightness and contrast, but set the colors independently in the professional settings. Unless it retains the color settings, but you have to ensure that you go back into the general settings and make a small adjustment see it uses the general settings brightness and contrast values. If the latter is the case then to me this is in fact a bug. If this doesn't make sense, then play with it, you will see what I'm referencing.

Just be aware that if you are going back and forth between professional and general settings your brightness and contrast will change. It looks like the professional settings clip the whites and blacks, but it may be that they did a good job with the "0" settings on the tv. I set mine to show more white detail if available.

FYI: This screen is not completely uniform as far as color. I have a red push at the left and right sides.
Bill Ball's Avatar Bill Ball
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dpiantino:

What material are you using to help you assess gamma, color uniformity?
dpiantino's Avatar dpiantino
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One of the sections of the Disney WOW disk has a gamma gray value scale. The bar that blends into the background is supposed to represent the gamma value that you have achieved. Each bar is labeled with a gamma value.

Simple brightness, contrast, color, and hue is either with the blue filter and Disney WOW, I actually use the Disney blue filter with the HD709 disk

Professional mode has R,G,B filters. The filters can be used individually, or in combinations of two. The full color adjustment required dialing in the colors with a single filter applied, and then both filters applied against the color bar screen. With the filters applied you can see that the goal is to get each pair of bars to match, or make the black bars appear black. It's hard ot describe, but made sense while doing it.

Example. I believe green and cyan are next to one another. With one of the filters applied they both look green, so the goal is to adjust hue, brightness, and saturation until they match. Then apply the red filter and the green should now look black. BUT its a compromise. Getting them where they matched perfectly with the eye on the first filter meant I couldn't have them completely black with the second filter added.

Here is what I ended up with using the built in TV color bar, results differed slightly when using the HD709 color bar with the PS3. (This is probably the downfall of using built in filters. It's not really calibrating each source)

R G B C M Y
Hue -17 -7 29 5 12 18
Satur 19 -14 6 16 25 1
Bright -5 -2 -21 -17 -8 11
offset 0 0 0 0 0 0
gain 0 0 0 0 0 0


I assume this will all change once the 11pt white value was calibrated correctly to dial in gamma???? But I have no way of doing this. So I left the colors the way they are above. And adjusted backlight, brightness, contrast, color, and tint in the general settings. I'll probably get the thing calibrated at some point. I'd just like to see what someone is able to do with a calibration meter and the built in tuning software.
dpiantino's Avatar dpiantino
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Another thing I forgot to mention about this set. Unfortunately it did pop out at me until my other tv was gone. When mounting the tv I noticed that the semi matte coating on the screen looks different. Could be nothing, but I noticed it before I new that any changes had been made to this set under the hood. I was expecting the same old E701.

Dark Knight looked pretty darn spectacular last night on the set. I hadn't watched it on the other set so I can't tell if there is a real difference. I will say that the colors on this set pop more than the older set. It was the first time since owning this model that there was a seem where I felt like I could put my hand into the screen a touch the water. I had only experienced this with plasma in the past. Again, it was dark knight, and wish I could reference the other set. May just be the "New" placebo effect. Usually this set requires a break in period. The color non uniformity doesn't seem to impac viewing, but I haven't watched the olympics or ice hockey. Usually this is where any white nonuniformity drives me mad.
Bill Ball's Avatar Bill Ball
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dpiantino View Post


Here is what I ended up with using the built in TV color bar, results differed slightly when using the HD709 color bar with the PS3. (This is probably the downfall of using built in filters. It's not really calibrating each source)

R G B C M Y
Hue -17 -7 29 5 12 18
Satur 19 -14 6 16 25 1
Bright -5 -2 -21 -17 -8 11
offset 0 0 0 0 0 0
gain 0 0 0 0 0 0


I assume this will all change once the 11pt white value was calibrated correctly to dial in gamma???? But I have no way of doing this. So I left the colors the way they are above. And adjusted backlight, brightness, contrast, color, and tint in the general settings. I'll probably get the thing calibrated at some point. I'd just like to see what someone is able to do with a calibration meter and the built in tuning software.
The CMS adjustments you made don't affect grayscale or gamma, but the offset and gain do. Although you need a meter to do the grayscale, it would be worth just eyeballing a 10% grayscale ramp pattern looking for obvious bias away from neutral gray in any of the segments. Note than having contrast high can introduce grayscale anomalies, so you may drop that first if you see pink or blue tint to see if that alleviates the anomaly. They may have tuned the grayscale better with the "Pro" or "Calibrated" options. All the picture and color temp modes in the earlier firmware are biased either red or blue. With my meter and the HD709 I got grayscale, color temp and gamma very close, but there were color errors that measured as significantly off (especially red) that I could not address well without the CMS you now have. The picture still looks stunning to me with good material. I don't see uniformity issues other than very mild clouding on dark test screens and very minor flashlighting, all not apparent otherwise, excepting a few of the dreaded "white spots" that can be seen only on things like hockey ice, still minor but growing. The latter will cause me to exchange the set soon. If it weren't for those white spots I would keep the set.
dpiantino's Avatar dpiantino
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I'll try playing with the offset and gain to tweak gamma. That is how I did it with the last set. I was able to get gamma at 2.1ish based on the WOW disk. I know enough to be dangerous and like to fiddle smile.gif My wife hates when I get a new tv.
seneschal's Avatar seneschal
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dpiantino View Post

Sorry, I received the Q serial today that replaced another tv with the white spots. This tv has no white spots. This is my second replacement tv related to the "white spot" problem. My 4th or 5th overall. First couple were due to uniformity/flashlighting issues.

That's good, you scared me on that!
So far my Q set is working fine too, no bright spots after two weeks.
DekPM19's Avatar DekPM19
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On Visio website they have a 70" model # E701i-A3 but the specs are n/a for 3d, so is this the new model with back lighting in stead of edge lit?

Tech Specs
Video
Screen Size: 70” Class
Diagonal Viewable: 69.51”
Backlight Type: Razor LED™
3D: N/A
Resolution: 1920 x 1080 (1080p)
Colors: 1.07 Billion (10-bits)
Dynamic Contrast Ratio: 1,000,000:1
Refresh Rate: 120Hz
Response Time: 6ms
Viewable Angle (H/V): 176˙/176˙
OSD Language: English, Spanish, French

http://store.vizio.com/led-lcd-hdtvs/e701ia3.html

Allen
Bill Ball's Avatar Bill Ball
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The A3 is the 2013 model. The 2014 model, not yet out in 70", ends with B#. Neither the 2013 or 2014 E-series 70" has 3D. 3D was only in the M-series for 2013 and some 42, 50 and 55" E's. None of the Vizio models in any series will have 3D in 2014. Yes, the E701i-A3 was edge lit. All 2014 models will be back lit.
DekPM19's Avatar DekPM19
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That's right I forgot that.
Allen
pharmdogg's Avatar pharmdogg
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Seems like the 3D gimmick has come and gone. No one really watches in 3D do they? Its kinda fun at first but once you get over the aura of have a 3D TV, I've rarely re-watched any of my 3D movies. Nice to see them focus on backlit vs. 3D. Money better spent IMO.

BTW, how can one tell if a TV/panel is backlit vs. edge lit? Are there tell tale signs? The biggest difference between my original vs. replacement set was there was no flashlighting in the corners anymore even when I had the backlight set at 100%. I think that impressed me the most (other than it could sear my eyes).
Bill Ball's Avatar Bill Ball
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Generally edge lit sets are very thin, but that's about it as to external signs. However, if you look at the 2013 60" edge lit at 1.94" (other makes are as little as 1" thick) and the 2014 60" backlit at 2.54", the difference is not that great in this case. Most backlit displays over the last few years were not full-array (they had fewer LEDs spaced further from the screen) and were thicker. You got an A3 so you know it's edge lit.

As to flashlighting, it seems to essentially be a manufacturing issue, perhaps affected by handling/shipping stress. Some sets within the same model have none while other light up in the corners and some parts of side edges. I have negligible flashlighting in one corner. I lucked out in that regard and now you have too.
Tugotti's Avatar Tugotti
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Hi Guys,

 

New to the message board, just recently bought a Vizio E701i- A3 open box at best buy.  I was wondering do ya'll have any pictures of the white spots that ya'll are talking about?  I would want to get it replace if its happening to mine. thanks in advance


dpiantino's Avatar dpiantino
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I gave up on the professional mode. Mine looks really good with just the general settings calibrated with the HD709 disk. It is very close to the "calibrated" setting. Maybe CNET will eventually do a calibration review. I know it wasn't considered the greatest calibration review, but a lot of people seemed to like their settings. I just want to know from a professional's point of view if the new menu allows a significant improvement in calibration end result vs the old menu.

I still think the colors pop more on this set. Not sure if the backlighting changed. I can see minor flashlighting with the brightness turned up. I just assumed this meant it was edge lit. The back of the tv struck me as being different when I was hooking up my cables, but I couldn't put my finger on why.

Im tired of swapping my TVs, but Vizio's customer service has been top notch. Give them proof of a problem and they make it right.
seneschal's Avatar seneschal
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tugotti View Post

Hi Guys,

New to the message board, just recently bought a Vizio E701i- A3 open box at best buy.  I was wondering do ya'll have any pictures of the white spots that ya'll are talking about?  I would want to get it replace if its happening to mine. thanks in advance

Scroll up for my picture
There were lots of other pictures on this thread of the white/bright spots too.
indept's Avatar indept
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pharmdogg View Post

Seems like the 3D gimmick has come and gone. No one really watches in 3D do they? Its kinda fun at first but once you get over the aura of have a 3D TV, I've rarely re-watched any of my 3D movies. Nice to see them focus on backlit vs. 3D. Money better spent IMO.

BTW, how can one tell if a TV/panel is backlit vs. edge lit? Are there tell tale signs? The biggest difference between my original vs. replacement set was there was no flashlighting in the corners anymore even when I had the backlight set at 100%. I think that impressed me the most (other than it could sear my eyes).

That may be your opinion but according to what I read there is effort to bring about glasses free 3D. I have a 2013 M551D and enjoy the 3D effect. My only complaint is the scarce availability of 3D movies. There are a few available on comcast but none that are easily gotten through rental. I don't care to buy every 3D movie I watch. I saw something about Netflix rentng them but havn't seen any on their site. I did buy the newest Star Trek 3D but would like to see more rentals.
pharmdogg's Avatar pharmdogg
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indept View Post

That may be your opinion but according to what I read there is effort to bring about glasses free 3D. I have a 2013 M551D and enjoy the 3D effect. My only complaint is the scarce availability of 3D movies. There are a few available on comcast but none that are easily gotten through rental. I don't care to buy every 3D movie I watch. I saw something about Netflix rentng them but havn't seen any on their site. I did buy the newest Star Trek 3D but would like to see more rentals.

Well, I was talking about active and passive 3D since there is no glasses free 3D on the market. I've heard about it and if it does come to market at a reasonable price point, it could be the future of all TV. But current 3D tech was and is a fad. Content is scarce like you said and most ppl don't care to buy a movie just for the 3D. I know I don't hahah. You know its dead if content providers aren't really pushing it. It was an effort for TV manufactures to sell more flat panel TVs after they had maxed out the technology. This is just my observation.
seneschal's Avatar seneschal
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pharmdogg View Post

Well, I was talking about active and passive 3D since there is no glasses free 3D on the market. I've heard about it and if it does come to market at a reasonable price point, it could be the future of all TV. But current 3D tech was and is a fad. Content is scarce like you said and most ppl don't care to buy a movie just for the 3D. I know I don't hahah. You know its dead if content providers aren't really pushing it. It was an effort for TV manufactures to sell more flat panel TVs after they had maxed out the technology. This is just my observation.

Pretty sure pharmdogg is right, the 3D was just a fad.
pharmdogg's Avatar pharmdogg
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tugotti View Post

Hi Guys,

New to the message board, just recently bought a Vizio E701i- A3 open box at best buy.  I was wondering do ya'll have any pictures of the white spots that ya'll are talking about?  I would want to get it replace if its happening to mine. thanks in advance

Don't worry, it will be pretty obvious when you get them. You'll do a double take and think someone was scratching your screen from the inside.
DekPM19's Avatar DekPM19
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If you didn't buy this tv what would you have bought. I have been looking at this tv and the Sony w859a big price jump for 5" less. I am looking for something bigger than my 50" kuro to tie me over until next best thing is here and doesn't cost a small fortune.
Allen
primetimeguy's Avatar primetimeguy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DekPM19 View Post

If you didn't buy this tv what would you have bought. I have been looking at this tv and the Sony w859a big price jump for 5" less. I am looking for something bigger than my 50" kuro to tie me over until next best thing is here and doesn't cost a small fortune.
Allen

That pretty much sums it up for me, anything else I looked at cost more for less screen size. Bang for buck it is a good deal.
DekPM19's Avatar DekPM19
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I have the Super Bowl and the national championship game recorded so when I do buy I can check out how good the tv is with football. I am kinda waiting on the 2014 models to come out.
Allen
indept's Avatar indept
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seneschal View Post

Pretty sure pharmdogg is right, the 3D was just a fad.

Well if it's a fad it's because the industry insisted on making it that way. You would think with all the different brands of 3D tv's that have sold over the years some company, like Netflix, would try renting 3D movies and see how it goes. When you get a good 3D movie it's fun to watch it. You & pharmdogg may not be big on it but I've enjoyed a few good 3D movies on comcast HBO & Starz when they make them available, problem is that there have only been a few I'm interested in, Men in black 3, John Carter, spiderman (the newest one) to name a few.
dpiantino's Avatar dpiantino
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I'm in the "3D is a fad" camp. Until they do it without the use of glasses it won't take off. I hate 3D in the theater. Glasses degrade the color too much. My 2cents
Tugotti's Avatar Tugotti
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any body have the screw spec for the 4 screws that screws into the back of the TV?


indept's Avatar indept
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tugotti View Post

any body have the screw spec for the 4 screws that screws into the back of the TV?

As per the factory manual:
Screw Size: M6
Hole Pattern: 400mm (V) x 400mm (H)
indept's Avatar indept
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dpiantino View Post

I'm in the "3D is a fad" camp. Until they do it without the use of glasses it won't take off. I hate 3D in the theater. Glasses degrade the color too much. My 2cents

Just curious, do you have a 3D TV. I have the M551D & I find that the brightness & color are great in 3D. I don't mind the glasses, they are light enough to wear comfortably.
dpiantino's Avatar dpiantino
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indept View Post

Just curious, do you have a 3D TV. I have the M551D & I find that the brightness & color are great in 3D. I don't mind the glasses, they are light enough to wear comfortably.

I do not have a 3D tv, I was referring to the color degradation at the movie theater. I don't like wearing the glasses. I've alos noticed that a lot of movies made for 3D have scenes in them that you can tell were meant to amplify the 3D experience.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying the technology is bad. I've scene some pretty neat 3D stuff. I think it is a young technology in the consumer market. Advances will come quickly if it sticks around, and todays 3D will be old news very fast. I wouldn't pay more for a 3D set, but if it came with it, then bonus smile.gif
AuraXR's Avatar AuraXR
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I have been reading this thread and thought that my picture was pretty good until the Olympics started. When a large white background is displayed, I can see several large circular areas in the middle of the screen that are a few shades different. I only notice this on large, white backgrounds. What do you guys think? Is it a bad enough problem for me to call Vizio or should I not worry too much about it?
Tags: Vizio , Lcd Hdtv , Vizio E550va 55 Inch Lcd Hdtv , Vizio E701i A3 Led Hdtv

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