Samsung F8000 -- 2013 Flagship Models - Page 31 - AVS Forum
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post #901 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

$5199

Yea that is there price online and on Amazon. Buy Squad has it for $4,385 but not sure how reputable they are...

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post #902 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 11:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Cmay, I know the Elite has less blooming than the 950, but what other differences have you seen? The Elite's off-axis viewing is nothing to rave about and I assume the Sony is not too much different. I had a 920 that I traded for the Elite and my biggest issue (I think it was my sample) was poor uniformity. My buddy got the same set and his uniformity was far better.

Ken, the one thing that stood out to me when I was looking at the 70 Elite was how good the uniformity was for such a large panel. Aside for the green blob issue on the Nov 12 builds, I always was impressed. I also felt the 70 elite had significantly less noticeable banding than any large LED panel that I have seen in person. The only drawback (other than price) was that since the Elite had not been updated in 2012, it'd 3D capabilities did not keep up with the other manufacturers. It's a sad day that both the Elite and HX950 are technically discontinued models as they were perhaps the two best full array local dimming sets ever produced.
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post #903 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 11:11 AM
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Originally Posted by nu02wrx View Post

Haha going to work later ill take pics. Have some proof before you call bs. And no I don't work at westbury, I work farther east. And a quick check by one of the workers at bby in our inventory system would have shown one on shelf display in my store. No need to lie about it, trying to be helpful.

Apologies are in order nu02wrx. Apparently the BB salesguy at Westbury did not see that the Setauket location does indeed have one on display.
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post #904 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 11:13 AM
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eagle_2 stated they changed the policy because of the number of television sets returned last year, especially the Samsungs.

In a different thread, someone there said that the policy was changed due to the online price matching policy to prevent people from buying today from Best Buy, then ordering online after they decide they like it, and then returning the product to Best Buy to recoup the sales tax. Of course that can still occur within 15 days, but it makes it more challenging.

In reality, it is probably a combination of all of them. Usually when corporations make a policy change, they like to back it up with 3 or more bullet points of positive effects from making the change.

I did not intend anybody to think that I was stating that as fact. My apologies if that's how it was taken. I was simply commenting on the fact that it seems obvious to me that if they are changing the policy on returns, it is because they feel they are getting too many returns and they're trying to stop the bleeding. Not just on tvs, but I'm sure the large amount of tv returns they get must take a toll. It seems every time I walk into a Best Buy there's a tv at the front returns counter that just got returned.
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post #905 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 11:15 AM
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I just called Samsung hoping to get any info on if they're planning on including the standard remote this year. After two different departments, they said they had no information available yet as the sets aren't hitting stores for another few weeks. They said to call back in a few weeks and they should have that information.
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post #906 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 11:15 AM
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Originally Posted by cmay91472 View Post

Ken, the one thing that stood out to me when I was looking at the 70 Elite was how good the uniformity was for such a large panel. Aside for the green blob issue on the Nov 12 builds, I always was impressed. I also felt the 70 elite had significantly less noticeable banding than any large LED panel that I have seen in person. The only drawback (other than price) was that since the Elite had not been updated in 2012, it'd 3D capabilities did not keep up with the other manufacturers. It's a sad day that both the Elite and HX950 are technically discontinued models as they were perhaps the two best full array local dimming sets ever produced.

Cmay, do you see noticeable banding or uniformity issues on the 65" 950? I can't say I saw it on the store sample at Sony, but I'm not sure how revealing the material that was playing was to see it.
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post #907 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 11:18 AM
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Originally Posted by gweempose View Post

These days, everybody has a camera built into their phone. If someone claims that they saw a new TV but doesn't provide any pics, I'm always skeptical.

I may be the only person left that can say this, but I don't own a fancy phone with a camera in it. Just a basic tracfone. It's all I need. I'm not glued to my phone when I'm out. I do have a small tablet but the built-in camera is so bad I can't even call it a camera.
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post #908 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 12:02 PM
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just got to my store, Westbury had one in stock not on display LOL. All stores have one in stock, we are the only ones who have it on display. Have pics on my phone, trying to get them on here.
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post #909 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 12:12 PM
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new remote, seeing if this works





have more pics but I'm working, will try more later. Accepting apologies starting ........ now.
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post #910 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 12:19 PM
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So how's the picture quality on this new flagship from Sammy?
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post #911 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 12:20 PM
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Hi nu02wrx,
is this 55" (F8000) on these photos?


Cheers.
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post #912 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by nu02wrx View Post

new remote, seeing if this works





have more pics but I'm working, will try more later. Accepting apologies starting ........ now.

Thanks a lot for the pics, but tell us later whith details , please, about the precision black and how it really works to get rid of clouding ( you can also turn it on in the standard mode or only in cinema ? ). I want you to correct me if i'm wrong by telling me that there isn't a new crystal black panel as Samsung claims in its Korean site . See U .
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post #913 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 12:42 PM
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nu02wrx thanks for the pics and your "first impressions" how looks the tv compare to an ES8000 and a HX850? In reviews page like whathifi they say that this tv has a more sony-look like
Thanks and this is a 55" version?
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post #914 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 01:17 PM
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Oh look, it fits on that stand just fine...tongue.gif

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post #915 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 01:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Cmay, do you see noticeable banding or uniformity issues on the 65" 950? I can't say I saw it on the store sample at Sony, but I'm not sure how revealing the material that was playing was to see it.

Ken, apart from hockey (I'm starting to wonder if any 65 inch LED can do hockey without any issues whether banding or DSE), the only time I notice vertical banding is on the occasional panning sequence. It is extremely faint single vertical band about 2 inches wide located in the center above the Sony logo and can not be seen on solid color backgrounds except grey (damn that no input home screen on the HX950! It just had to be grey eek.gif ) for instance, at the beginning of wreck it Ralph at the bad guy support group, I noticed it when the did the 360 pan around the room. But compared to the 65ES8000 it is a non issue. On the Samsung, it was not only noticeable on panning, it was noticeable on full color backgrounds like the PS3 menu screens, and noticeable during movies on just about any sky, water, fog, desert, etc scene panning or no panning.

As for other uniformity, my unit does not display any uneven color, hot spots, flashlighting or DSE (I think a lot of people confuse banding for DSE). I lucked out with the first try after several exchanges trying to get an ES8000 with no MAJOR defects. Out of seven, 4 dead pixels, 3 with atrocious vertical banding. On top of that 2 had faulty 3D. Obviously, I exchanged that many times because if you got a defect free ES8000, it really is a good set. Ultimately, QC issues did me in and I opted for the Sony. If I wasn't the only one who had to exchange numerous es8000s, then I probably would not harp on the QC so much, but once I started posting in the es8000 forum, I quickly learned I was actually the norm, not the exception at least when it came to the 65 model. Even scarier was hearing how it was just as bad with the D8000s from other forum members.

Are you going to check out the F8000 in person today? Please post what your opinion is when you have a chance. I really do hope they correct QC as I am interested in this set, but just very skeptical in regards to the QC aspect.
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post #916 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by DustinLH00 View Post

Oh look, it fits on that stand just fine...tongue.gif

65 will overlap on that, 60 may extend all the way to edge maybe overlap a tad. No one was concerned with the size of the 46 or 55 stand on a regular AV unit like that.
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post #917 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by cmay91472 View Post

I lucked out with the first try after several exchanges trying to get an ES8000 with no MAJOR defects. Out of seven, 4 dead pixels, 3 with atrocious vertical banding. On top of that 2 had faulty 3D.

What retailer were you going through and did they give you grief with 7 returns? Just curious.

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post #918 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 01:33 PM
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What retailer were you going through and did they give you grief with 7 returns? Just curious.

Dustin, went through BB with the Sammy's. No hassles, extremely easy. As mentioned before, I did ultimately receive the 90 day exchange ban. That is why I knew about the 15 day reduction and why it was being changed since I had called corporate to complain and they told me about the policy change that was coming up when I asked how the ban would affect future returns for me once it was up.
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post #919 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 01:42 PM
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Originally Posted by cmay91472 View Post

Dustin, went through BB with the Sammy's. No hassles, extremely easy. As mentioned before, I did ultimately receive the 90 day exchange ban. That is why I knew about the 15 day reduction and why it was being changed since I had called corporate to complain and they told me about the policy change that was coming up when I asked how the ban would affect future returns for me once it was up.

So the biggest hassle was probably re-packaging the television and driving back and forth?

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post #920 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 01:55 PM
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Originally Posted by DustinLH00 View Post

So the biggest hassle was probably re-packaging the television and driving back and forth?

The biggest hassle with the 65ES8000s was actually having to wait the three days between when I called to exchange and the day they came to pick up the old set and deliver the new one. Once I dropped down to the 60ES8000 to get away from the banding, after the 4th set (1st 60) was delivered with dead pixels again, I just packed it up and exchanged in store for returns number 5, 6 and 7.. Since the 60 is so light it was no problem at all repacking, carrying, and lifting with just one person -- assuming one has enough cargo space.
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post #921 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 02:09 PM
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Originally Posted by DustinLH00 View Post

Oh look, it fits on that stand just fine...tongue.gif

It's still obvious by the photo that the stand is the entire length of the panel. You will need a table at least as long or longer than the panel is no matter what, when normally that shouldn't be the case.
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post #922 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 02:11 PM
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Geez...nobody can take a joke.

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post #923 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 02:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmay91472 View Post

Ken, apart from hockey (I'm starting to wonder if any 65 inch LED can do hockey without any issues whether banding or DSE), the only time I notice vertical banding is on the occasional panning sequence. It is extremely faint single vertical band about 2 inches wide located in the center above the Sony logo and can not be seen on solid color backgrounds except grey (damn that no input home screen on the HX950! It just had to be grey eek.gif ) for instance, at the beginning of wreck it Ralph at the bad guy support group, I noticed it when the did the 360 pan around the room. But compared to the 65ES8000 it is a non issue. On the Samsung, it was not only noticeable on panning, it was noticeable on full color backgrounds like the PS3 menu screens, and noticeable during movies on just about any sky, water, fog, desert, etc scene panning or no panning.

Actually I'll go so far as to say I wonder if any flat panel, plasma or LED, can do hockey without DSE. I've had Fujitsu & Pioneer Kuro plasmas, Sony & Sharp LEDs and all of them showed DSE to one degree or another on hockey. It seems to be inescapable. frown.gif
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Originally Posted by cmay91472 View Post

Are you going to check out the F8000 in person today? Please post what your opinion is when you have a chance. I really do hope they correct QC as I am interested in this set, but just very skeptical in regards to the QC aspect.

Yup, I did and I'm back. I met nu02wrx (he may prefer the anonymity, so no names) and he's really a hell of a nice guy. Again my apologies to him for doubting the floor model's existence.

I have to say my initial impression was one of disappointment. He had it looking better than he said it did yesterday, but you could clearly see evidence of the edge lighting and its unevenness. There was also a black level fluctuation that appeared at times in some dark scenes with brighter objects. On the left hand side of the screen, you could pretty clearly make out one of the zones. In all fairness, we're not at all sure all of the adjustments are where they should be. It's very hard (especially for someone that's never had a Sammy before) to figure out the interaction of the myriad of controls for LED lighting, black levels etc. It's really bewildering and I'm pretty good with this stuff. The Samsung seems to have more picture parameter adjustments than most displays I've seen. The Sony has quite a few too, but having had Sonys, it's not as daunting to me.

I can tell you that after having seen the Sony XBR950 earlier, the Sony displayed a picture with greater depth without the anomalies I saw on the Samsung, but with its local dimming and heftier price tag, that's probably expected. We both felt the Sony had the superior picture.

I'll hold off coming to any conclusion until I see one that's been ISF'd by someone that really understands the interaction of the adjustments.
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post #924 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 02:14 PM
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So it's starting to look like they really might not be including the standard remote? Nu02wrx didn't include any pictures of the standard remote, so I'm guessing it didn't come in the box?

Nu02wrx, did the box include both remotes or only the touch remote pictured?

If I can't at least order the standard remote than I'm giving up on this set now. It's one thing to try to introduce us to the new touch features, but that shouldn't mean they force us to use it by not giving us the option of the standard remote.
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post #925 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 02:15 PM
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Nope, no standard remote Eagle. Just the touch remote. I saw it myself.

There's always a universal remote option for anyone bothered by it.
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post #926 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 02:18 PM
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Originally Posted by cmay91472 View Post

65 will overlap on that, 60 may extend all the way to edge maybe overlap a tad. No one was concerned with the size of the 46 or 55 stand on a regular AV unit like that.

Yeah, my AV rack is a bit shorter than some, so I'm a tad worried about the 46", but I think the 46" should fit. I doubt if the 55" would though. it would be way too close.
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Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Actually I'll go so far as to say I wonder if any flat panel, plasma or LED, can do hockey without DSE. I've had Fujitsu & Pioneer Kuro plasmas, Sony & Sharp LEDs and all of them showed DSE to one degree or another on hockey. It seems to be inescapable. frown.gif
Yup, I did and I'm back. I met nu02wrx (he may prefer the anonymity, so no names) and he's really a hell of a nice guy. Again my apologies to him for doubting the floor model's existence.

I have to say my initial impression was one of disappointment. He had it looking better than he said it did yesterday, but you could clearly see evidence of the edge lighting and its unevenness. There was also a black level fluctuation that appeared at times in some dark scenes with brighter objects. On the left hand side of the screen, you could pretty clearly make out one of the zones. In all fairness, we're not at all sure all of the adjustments are where they should be. It's very hard (especially for someone that's never had a Sammy before) to figure out the interaction of the myriad of controls for LED lighting, black levels etc. It's really bewildering and I'm pretty good with this stuff. The Samsung seems to have more picture parameter adjustments than most displays I've seen. The Sony has quite a few too, but having had Sonys, it's not as daunting to me.

I can tell you that after having seen the Sony XBR950 earlier, the Sony displayed a picture with greater depth without the anomalies I saw on the Samsung, but with its local dimming and heftier price tag, that's probably expected. We both felt the Sony had the superior picture.

I'll hold off coming to any conclusion until I see one that's been ISF'd by someone that really understands the interaction of the adjustments.

One thing I can say is that hockey looked far better on the ES7500 than it did on the 7000 plasma or the ST50. The plasma had issues with black flashes, probably the ABL or something reacting to the bright flood flashes above the stadiums. The LCD didn't have any issues with the flashes. Though banding is more obvious when the camera is constantly panning back and forth to follow the players.
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Ken Ross what size is the tv? And it's a shame that all the features of the F8000 doesn't solve the eventual problems that appeared on ES8000.
Greetings
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post #929 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 02:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Nope, no standard remote Eagle. Just the touch remote. I saw it myself.

There's always a universal remote option for anyone bothered by it.

Very sad news to hear. I really loved that remote. If I won't be able to purchase a standard remote then I'm out. An expensive universal remote is not an option for me, and I really did like the handling of the standard remote. They're going to piss off a lot of people this year when they learn they get 1 less remote than last year, and it's the wrong one. Samsung seems to excel at doing things like this. Stand that's too big for no reason. No standard remote. Same crappy 3D glasses that everyone hated last year. Ugh. I hate to dismiss the tv when I haven't even seen it but so far they're showing me they're the same old Samsung. They just don't seem to get, or care, what the customer wants. If they did any customer research on last years' sets they would realize people liked the standard remote, hated the touch remote, and hated the re-designed cheapo glasses. I'm not expecting any miracles with panel quality this year.

I wonder if the 2012 remote will work? At least for 95% of the functions? If so I wonder if we can still buy that replacement remote?
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post #930 of 3719 Old 03-07-2013, 02:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

There's always a universal remote option for anyone bothered by it.

Thanks for the confirmation on that. As far as controlling it with a universal remote, is there an IR receiver somewhere, or even better still, a direct IR port on the back?
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