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post #181 of 4891 Old 05-02-2013, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by jenoa17 View Post

Supposedly only 7 ms of input lag. Even with that number probably being inaccurate, this should be a good pick for gaming.

Review: http://www.trustedreviews.com/sony-bravia-kdl-55w905_TV_review

Looks like I've just found my next professional gaming tv!

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post #182 of 4891 Old 05-02-2013, 11:49 AM
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Wow, thats a pretty stellar review from www.trustedreviews.com
Is that a decent site? I'm really tempted to pre order now...
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post #183 of 4891 Old 05-02-2013, 11:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sasquatch321 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by jenoa17 View Post

Supposedly only 7 ms of input lag. Even with that number probably being inaccurate, this should be a good pick for gaming.

Review: http://www.trustedreviews.com/sony-bravia-kdl-55w905_TV_review

Looks like I've just found my next professional gaming tv!

Cool........I believe it, but I'm not 100% sure I believe it. That's less than 1/120th of a second. A 240Hz monitor takes 4.16 ms between frames, and if everything is turned off (and it's truly able to munch on only one frame at a time and keep up with that rate) then it's possible, but yikes.

Note, the Leo Bodnar clocked some TV's in error at 0 ms, as reported by the site creator of displaylag.com. Dunno why, mostly because I haven't seen his schematic/design.

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post #184 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 07:54 AM
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20-25% viewing angle !!!
What has happened with TV tech??
My 6 year old XBR4 has 180 degrees viewing angle. Does Sony expect the whole family to be sitting bang in front of TV? What a piece of junk.
And plasma does not work for me. I have my TV in a family room and not in a dungeon.
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post #185 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 08:31 AM
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Originally Posted by malcolmp6 View Post

20-25% viewing angle !!!
What has happened with TV tech??
My 6 year old XBR4 has 180 degrees viewing angle. Does Sony expect the whole family to be sitting bang in front of TV? What a piece of junk.
And plasma does not work for me. I have my TV in a family room and not in a dungeon.

According to Sony web site specs, this was claimed to have a 178 degree viewing angle. What happens when you exceed the 25% you state, and is this something you read somewhere or your own experience? This would be a real game-changer for me as I consider the non Q-Display LCD as single user due to viewing angle deficiency.
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post #186 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 08:37 AM
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post #187 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 08:52 AM
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Thanks. Read it. Back to waiting for something decent to come along...
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post #188 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 10:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malcolmp6 View Post

20-25% viewing angle !!!
What has happened with TV tech??
My 6 year old XBR4 has 180 degrees viewing angle. Does Sony expect the wholeo family to be sitting bang in front of TV? What a piece of junk.
And plasma does not work for me. I have my TV in a family room and not in a dungeon.

I have a 46 inch xbr5 which is the same as your xbr4 and it seems like the viewing angles on LED backlit sets are worse than the "old school" CCFL backlights that our xbrs use.

I'm still going to follow this set because I have the upgrade itch and Sony is one of the few manufacturers that care about audio, both with the speakers and by providing a headphone jack on their higher end sets.

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post #189 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 11:47 AM
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So, does anyone think the viewing angle on this set is going to be worse or comparable to the HX950? I had the 950 briefly and was shocked at how bad the picture degraded when just moving a few couch cushions to the left/right of center.
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post #190 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 11:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malcolmp6 View Post

20-25% viewing angle !!!

To be clear, that's not what the review said.

He said 20° to 25° off-axis. This equates to a 40-50° viewing angle.

Still terrible, but don't make it worse than it is. smile.gif

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post #191 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 03:24 PM
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I was going to invest in a Samsung F8000 but wasn't happy with the judder and lag I saw on it. So I purchased my first Plasma a Panasonic VT60.

I've been receiving some humming and buzzing from the tv and I'm not sure if that's normal or not. Best Buy is going to come out Monday and let me know. If it's normal I may turn the tv in and look to get an LED.

The Samsung's have seemed to have quality issues. I know the Sony W800 (something like that) was LED tv of the year last year. Would this be considered their best set this year without getting into a 4K?

Where do you guys think this set will stand in regards to judder/lag for sports and PS3 gaming. Those are my biggest concerns with LED. But IR, buzzing and humming may to much for me to overcome to stick with the Plasma.

Any help/suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
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post #192 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 03:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Tarheel1400 View Post

I was going to invest in a Samsung F8000 but wasn't happy with the judder and lag I saw on it. So I purchased my first Plasma a Panasonic VT60.

I've been receiving some humming and buzzing from the tv and I'm not sure if that's normal or not. Best Buy is going to come out Monday and let me know. If it's normal I may turn the tv in and look to get an LED.

The Samsung's have seemed to have quality issues. I know the Sony W800 (something like that) was LED tv of the year last year. Would this be considered their best set this year without getting into a 4K?

Where do you guys think this set will stand in regards to judder/lag for sports and PS3 gaming. Those are my biggest concerns with LED. But IR, buzzing and humming may to much for me to overcome to stick with the Plasma.

Any help/suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Plasmas, even Panasonics, are often known to exhibit some buzzing....I think mostly on white or otherwise bright scenes. It's often imperceptible for normal viewing, but known to sometimes on unlucky sets or bad models be pretty bad.

As far as judder goes: do you mean judder or motion blur? Judder is observable with slow pans and is related to pull-down effects. Motion blur is related to fast moving objects.

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post #193 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

Plasmas, even Panasonics, are often known to exhibit some buzzing....I think mostly on white or otherwise bright scenes. It's often imperceptible for normal viewing, but known to sometimes on unlucky sets or bad models be pretty bad.

As far as judder goes: do you mean judder or motion blur? Judder is observable with slow pans and is related to pull-down effects. Motion blur is related to fast moving objects.

Tgm,

I know when they were demoing the F8000 for me (supposedly the best LED on market right now) during certain scenes of the Dark Knight Rises Blu Ray that weren't even fast moving it would seem to lag or the motion would all of a sudden move funny then go back to what looks like normal tv watching. I don't know if that's called judder or soap opera effect etc. All I know was it was goofy and a concern.

I went in with the intention of buying a high end LED and EVERY BB sales person talked me into a Plasma. My concerns with Plasma were buzzing, humming and IR. They told me that wasn't an issue on the high end Panasonics so I invested in the VT60. Sure enough I've had the tv for 30 hours and I'm experiencing all 3. I'm thinking that's a deal breaker for me.

With LED's I know you don't get the noise and have to worry about IR (burn it can still occur I understand) but there is refresh rates and motion issues that have to be addressed. I understand the Sony LED last year was awesome and an award winner. Reading the reviews for this set (since I can't afford a 4k) they seem to address motion rates and make it seem like its not as much of an issue for things like sports and PS3 gaming. I'm just hoping some of you guys can give me more of the facts and what can be expected from this new Sony set.
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post #194 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 04:04 PM
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Viewing angle won't be an issue for me because I'm sitting 6.5 feet away (I want a 55inch set) and my room doesn't have the area for entertaining so at most it would just be my gf and I watching the tv from center.
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post #195 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 04:08 PM
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You also sometimes hear such terrible reviews from gamers on LED sets. I love my PS3 and would be bummed if It couldn't handle Madden or MW3. The Samsung F8000 has gotten terrible reviews from gamers. This was another reason all the sales people were pushing me towards the Plasma.
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post #196 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 04:33 PM
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Ok. So I just got off the phone with Sony store and he told me they have some 55inch XBR-950. Would that be a better bet than waiting for this set? It sounds like the 900 may not be as good as the 950.
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post #197 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 04:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tarheel1400 View Post

You also sometimes hear such terrible reviews from gamers on LED sets. I love my PS3 and would be bummed if It couldn't handle Madden or MW3. The Samsung F8000 has gotten terrible reviews from gamers. This was another reason all the sales people were pushing me towards the Plasma.


I'm really surprised though that you had such trouble with the plasma. The VT60 is truly supposed to be a tower of achievement.

You didn't leave much time for conditioning it though (30 hours is all you've had it). What does the user manual suggest? I'm heard people insist on things like 200 hours or more for such things using a specialized video (color slides?) on repeat.

Plasmas are supposed to be very susceptible to IR/BI *until* they are broken in that way. Perhaps the IR you noticed in the first 30 hours just might be because of exceedingly new plasma cells(?) I wonder if that goes for the buzzing as well. I hope an experienced plasma owner chimes in.

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post #198 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 05:01 PM
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It seems like this TV and the Samsung F8000 are the best LEDs this year (non UHD). It would be nice to see both TVs side by side, playing the same content, in a dark room.
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post #199 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 05:02 PM
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Tgm,

That's what everyone has said and they also told me buzzing and humming was a thing of the past. The buzzing/humming (two separate noises) are driving me mad though. I can't get much feedback from the VT60 forum guys on the noise but they have been great with everything else. I know Panasonic and Plasma advocates say the altitude issues aren't an issue anymore but I'm at 5800 feet (CO) I wonder if that's why no one else seems to understand in the forums why I'm having this issue.

It will be interesting to see what the Best Buy tech has to say about it Monday.

My local Sony store has 2 XBR950's in stock but boy are they EXPENSIVE. Would easily be another 900 bucks out of my pocket to get one. That seems like too much. He told me the w900 will be pretty similar to the new 4K sets minus the resolution obviously.

I'd be nuts to pull the trigger on the XBR right? They seem way too expensive for the LED market.
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post #200 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 05:04 PM
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Originally Posted by eclipsegt View Post

It seems like this TV and the Samsung F8000 are the best LEDs this year (non UHD). It would be nice to see both TVs side by side, playing the same content, in a dark room.

Eclipse,

I can tell you the F8000 had a good amount of motion issues when I looked at it. That's why I got my Plasma but I'm not sure that was the right call either. I may be waiting on this new Sony and returning my Plasma next week.

I'm going to give it the weekend to stop buzzing but if it doesn't then its outta here.
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post #201 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 05:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tarheel1400 View Post

Tgm,

That's what everyone has said and they also told me buzzing and humming was a thing of the past. The buzzing/humming (two separate noises) are driving me mad though. I can't get much feedback from the VT60 forum guys on the noise but they have been great with everything else. I know Panasonic and Plasma advocates say the altitude issues aren't an issue anymore but I'm at 5800 feet (CO) I wonder if that's why no one else seems to understand in the forums why I'm having this issue.

It will be interesting to see what the Best Buy tech has to say about it Monday.

My local Sony store has 2 XBR950's in stock but boy are they EXPENSIVE. Would easily be another 900 bucks out of my pocket to get one. That seems like too much. He told me the w900 will be pretty similar to the new 4K sets minus the resolution obviously.

I'd be nuts to pull the trigger on the XBR right? They seem way too expensive for the LED market.

I wouldn't buy it, I have other projects for that level of casheesh, but I have to tell you it's damn impressive if what you want is something to keep for a long time and not care about 4K, possibly ever.

$2940 for a 2012 xbr-55hx950,
http://www.amazon.com/Sony-XBR55HX950-55-inch-Internet-Full-Array/dp/B008XG1MHS/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1367627729&sr=8-1&keywords=xbr+950
which is cheaper than the 2013 900 "first run" price. And I've only seen the 65" in person, and MAN does the 2012 XBR 950 know how to handle motion. Or so it seemed to me and I'm sensitive to it.

Did you run any break-in images on the VT60, and for how long?

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post #202 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 05:48 PM
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Tgm,

I'm up to about 40 hours of break in colored slides downloaded from the VT60 forum.

The buzzing hasn't changed a bit. I'm assuming the slides and break in period is more for PQ and aging the gases than actually addressing the buzzing and humming. I could be wrong but no one has told me different.

With repetitive calls to Best Buy everyone has told me 2 things are possible.

1. It's a bad set.

2. The noise is amplified by my small room.

Sony may match that price. Still seems really high for a set that's 12 months or older. I may be able to get them down some more but who knows.

I have seen some people say the banding on the set is bad. Have you heard/experienced this? Do you like the XBR950? What's your feeling on it versus the w900?
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post #203 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 05:58 PM
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Double post...sorry.
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post #204 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 06:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tarheel1400 View Post

Tgm,

I'm up to about 40 hours of break in colored slides downloaded from the VT60 forum.

The buzzing hasn't changed a bit. I'm assuming the slides and break in period is more for PQ and aging the gases than actually addressing the buzzing and humming. I could be wrong but no one has told me different.

With repetitive calls to Best Buy everyone has told me 2 things are possible.

1. It's a bad set.

2. The noise is amplified by my small room.

Sony may match that price. Still seems really high for a set that's 12 months or older. I may be able to get them down some more but who knows.

I have seen some people say the banding on the set is bad. Have you heard/experienced this? Do you like the XBR850? What's your feeling on it versus the w900?


BTW, the 850 is a "KDL" not an XBR, {shrug}.

Hmmmmmm.....This is where 3rd-hand information would do you more harm than good, and you're at a particularly aggravating stage. Chatting with the crowd in those specific threads (XBR HX950, KDL HX850, and VT60) will help you the most. You've been in the VT60 thread.....what did they say?

Let me know what you decide. smile.gif

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post #205 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 06:11 PM
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I said 850 but meant 950.

Looks like I was incorrect the 950xbr is only about 6 months old. Pretty cool it has the Gorilla glass.

Shame Best Buy doesn't have it given I have a gift card with 350 dollars on it.

Not sure I can leave that on the table then go drop 3000 grand at a sony store, especially when they won't wiggle on the price any. There may be no point even going to look at the XBR950 if this is all the case. I would hate to like it than not afford it.

The W900 at least will probably be at Best Buy.

If the Plasma buzzing can't subside its going back. That is for sure.

The VT60 guys have not addressed my buzzing/humming concern at all. I've posted multiple times about it without anyone addressing it. I don't want to keep being repetitive so I'm kind of leaning on the peeps at Best Buy for the humming/buzzing information. They all seem to think its not normal.
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post #206 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 07:56 PM
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I walked in Best Buy on my way home from work. They don't have the W900a in their system so I thought that
was interesting. However PC Richards has it marked for May 28th at $2800. I really can't wait to see it-been wanting
to up grade for a few years now. Also take a look at the new STR DN-1040 AVR from Sony it looks great.
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post #207 of 4891 Old 05-03-2013, 11:50 PM
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Hey guys

For those buying this years model I thought you would like see this unboxing video of the w900a, which i came across in my travels on the net. I personally do not like the quartz design and the absence of the monolithic design, however for those using the stand, it seems easier to install than the previous models with a seemingly sturdier stand.

http://www.whathifi.com/video/sony-w9-series-tv-unboxing
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post #208 of 4891 Old 05-04-2013, 01:39 AM
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We may be in for a bit of a wait. I saw on 3 websites they are hearing June before these sets will be available. Who knows for sure though.
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post #209 of 4891 Old 05-04-2013, 01:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malcolmp6 View Post

20-25% viewing angle !!!
What has happened with TV tech??
My 6 year old XBR4 has 180 degrees viewing angle. Does Sony expect the whole family to be sitting bang in front of TV? What a piece of junk.
And plasma does not work for me. I have my TV in a family room and not in a dungeon.

I seriously doubt your XBR4 has a perfect 180 degree viewing angle with no drop off. Manufacturers always claim 180 degrees viewing angle, if you can still see the picture then it's technically viewable. Even if the contrast ratio drops to 2:1. That's how the viewing angle is measured.

I doubt this Sony is any worse than yours. It's still an lcd after all. Will be marginal.
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post #210 of 4891 Old 05-04-2013, 05:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HaRd2BeAr View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by malcolmp6 View Post

20-25% viewing angle !!!
What has happened with TV tech??
My 6 year old XBR4 has 180 degrees viewing angle. Does Sony expect the whole family to be sitting bang in front of TV? What a piece of junk.
And plasma does not work for me. I have my TV in a family room and not in a dungeon.

I seriously doubt your XBR4 has a perfect 180 degree viewing angle with no drop off. Manufacturers always claim 180 degrees viewing angle, if you can still see the picture then it's technically viewable. Even if the contrast ratio drops to 2:1. That's how the viewing angle is measured.

I doubt this Sony is any worse than yours. It's still an lcd after all. Will be marginal.


The XBR4 may or may not be better, but your over conclusion is incorrect. No. Simply put: LCDs are NOT all created equal.

My neighbors several year old LCD (Sony S-PVA panel I believe) looks fantastic(!!!!) at comparatively low grazing incidence. I was amazed when I became irritated at just how bad IPS seemed to be when it was supposed to be hands-down winner in that regard.

Besides, very few manufacturers claim a full 180° and only when they're emissive (OLED, Plasma). You'll see 176° and 178° more commonly. Should be listed as Crock° and BiggerCrock° respectively, but hardly ever will you see 180.

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