Official Sony KDL-55W900A Owners Thread - Page 82 - AVS Forum
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post #2431 of 4963 Old 12-23-2013, 08:20 PM
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Oh, and to further beat this dead horse, check out the amazon reviews. The w900a does not have a single review under 4 stars. In fact, it has only six 4-star reviews with the rest being 5-star. The F8000 however has thirteen 1-star reviews, four 2-star reviews, and eight 3-star reviews.
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post #2432 of 4963 Old 12-23-2013, 08:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRN94 View Post

Televisions reviewed is a sham. They can't calibrate the TV's to save their lives. The F8000 is CONFIRMED by CNET to peak at a brightness of 127 foot lamberts or 435 nits or 435 cd/m2. CNET also confirms that it is brighter than the Sony. Also, the calibrated black level of the F8000 is 0.05 cd/m2 confirmed by multiple reviewers.

CNET in the F8000 review: "In its Dynamic picture mode the F8000 produces a searing 127 fL, the best of the 2013 models in my lineup -- the WT60 got to 123 and the Sony (W900A) to 107 -- and much brighter than even the F8500 plasma at 83 fL."

I trust Flat Panels HD's readings of contrast ratio. Televisions reviewed is not trust worthy at all considering how wrong their peak brightness is off by. And they for sure took the calibrated black level of the W900A while they took the out of the box black level of the F8000 at a higher light output and probably no local dimming enabled COULD explain how off their readings are by.

FlatPanelHD's F8000 review: http://www.flatpanelshd.com/review.php?subaction=showfull&id=1371125593

Black level 0.10 cd/m2
Brightness 293 cd/m2
Contrast ratio 2930:1

FlatPanelHD's W900A review: http://www.flatpanelshd.com/review.php?subaction=showfull&id=1373877495

Black level 0.08 cd/m2
Brightness 239 cd/m2
Contrast ratio 2988:1

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1463286/official-samsung-unxxf8000-owners-thread/120

Post 147. Buzzard767 did his own contrast ratio test, both dynamic and ANSI. He found the ANSI contrast ratio of the F8000 to be 3465:1 and the dynamic contrast ratio to be 4514:1.

Considering how different the contrast numbers each reviewer and equipment appear to get, you COULD claim the W900A has a superior contrast ratio but they are practically the same and the difference is imperceptible. And if you cared about contrast ratio so much by a small difference, you'd get a plasma with a contrast ratio that is over 5 to 10 fold higher. CNET also gave the F8000 identical picture quality score as the W900A due to taking into account both strength and weaknesses of both.

CNET said "As usual the best plasmas still have it beat, but the only other 2013 LED we've placed in its (the F8000's) picture quality league so far is the Sony KDL-55W900A. It's available only in one 55-inch size, however, and it can't compete with the Samsung's design, features, or sheer wow factor. If you're in the high-end TV market and don't want a plasma, the Samsung UNF8000 should be among the first on your list."

CNET also said "For plasma-phobic videophiles who want a TV in a size other than 55 inches, the Samsung F8000 remains our top pick. It's close enough to the Sony that both earned identical picture quality scores, and both sets' local-dimming schemes do a great job of pushing edge-lit LED as high up this list as it can go. Video processing and 3D actually surpass the Sony, but in other areas F8000 is a tiny step behind. No matter -- if you "settle" for this amazing TV you can console yourself with the best design and features on the market."

CNET on F8000's audio vs the W900A's audio performance: "Aside from the VT60, the F8000 was the best-sounding TV in my lineup. The F8000 delivered more impact and visceral feel than the chronically thin-sounding W900A."

Source: http://reviews.cnet.com/holiday-gift-guide/tv/best-tv-picture-quality/2300-35250_7-10018630-6.html http://reviews.cnet.com/flat-panel-tvs/samsung-un55f8000/4505-6482_7-35576107.html

Stop putting words like "flawless" and "perfect" into my mouth and stop putting words into CNET's mouth claiming they said "unrivaled" when clearly they did not on EVERY account when discussing the two TV's.

CNET is fair to conclude both TV's are close enough to not declare any winner since both have pros and cons to their picture performance and overall user experience.

And all this criticism and defensiveness is hilarious. All I was saying was "Hey, IF you are bothered by the uniformity issues of the W900A, the F8000 is close enough to provide an equally satisfying visual experience with a very homogenous uniformity across the panel in both brightness and color." And all I get is a bunch of confirmation bias and bogus statistics about BOTH TV's performance specs. If you all are that content in your choice of the W900A, then ignore my good intentioned post.

Also, I can find way more pictures of W900A's having problems then I can find F8000's having problems. Case in point, ON THIS EXACT THREAD you guys completely ignore. As a reminder, let me post my UN55F8000's panel uniformity again as proof my experience is superior to what the W900A offers even at it's quality controlled best (if you happen to get a W900A panel that doesn't have dead pixels, vertical banding, bright/dim white spots, color reproduction inconsistencies, backlight bleed, etc. the list goes on). Someone, please post a picture of their W900A that is as uniform as my F8000. Seriously. Until then I'm not buying anyone's blind delusion claiming the W900A provides a more uniform panel than the F8000.















Please, someone show me pictures of their W900A with superior uniformity to mine. Pictures of mine are shown above. I'm not taking this Sony propaganda lightly. Show me EVIDENCE that your W900A is superior to my F8000. So far all I've gotten is a bunch of non-argument dodging responses with no evidence or cited/trustworthy specs.

After this post you call us defensive? As already stated the W900A has superior picture quality. Get. Over. It.
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post #2433 of 4963 Old 12-23-2013, 09:09 PM
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This is using input from a DVD or BD Player? Check the output settings of the player and the input settings of the TV. It pretty much sounds like the player is delivering full-RGB [0-255], but the TV is expecting limited-RGB [16-235]. Unless you have a faulty set, the W905 is not clipping any blacks or whites.

Thanks for your response.

 

I am using a PS3 as my Bluray player which is connected to the TV with an HDMI cable.  I have not altered the default output settings of the PS3 for Bluray playback.

 

From your response I assume that I want to output full RGB from my PS3?  For the w900a to display all the shades of black/white it sounds like I need both my PS3 set to output full RGB and the TV set to display full RGB as well.  Correct?  Does that mean there is a setting on the TV that can be toggled between full and limited RGB?  If so can someone tell me in what menu that setting can be found on the w900a?  I would guess it's one of the options in the Pro Picture Setup menu... but am not sure.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.

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post #2434 of 4963 Old 12-23-2013, 09:48 PM
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Hey guys, I've been reading this thread for months now and recently bought the W900A. I have tried a few of the settings found on this thread (thank you guys for providing those). I have watched a few movies on it, (Avengers, Gangster Squad) they looked amazing. I still have to try to see how it does with some video games. I have noticed some issues with the screen; some blotches on the white screen and maybe a little clouding on the hdmi screen. You might be able to notice even when the pictures below were taken on my nexus phone. I really want to know if this is a panel I should return or not. I am new to really inspecting television screens and I am worried that I will notice something wrong with the screen after the return period ends. If you would like to see more pictures let me know. Thank you.




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post #2435 of 4963 Old 12-23-2013, 09:50 PM
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It would be nice to get back to the regularly scheduled program now. This bickering is not becoming.
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post #2436 of 4963 Old 12-24-2013, 12:37 AM
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Originally Posted by rub5670 View Post

Hey guys, I've been reading this thread for months now and recently bought the W900A. I have tried a few of the settings found on this thread (thank you guys for providing those). I have watched a few movies on it, (Avengers, Gangster Squad) they looked amazing. I still have to try to see how it does with some video games. I have noticed some issues with the screen; some blotches on the white screen and maybe a little clouding on the hdmi screen. You might be able to notice even when the pictures below were taken on my nexus phone. I really want to know if this is a panel I should return or not. I am new to really inspecting television screens and I am worried that I will notice something wrong with the screen after the return period ends. If you would like to see more pictures let me know. Thank you.





My panel shows no light leaking into the screen. Was your tv delivered in the mail? I was lucky enough to score a panel with absolutely no problems directly from Best Buy.

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post #2437 of 4963 Old 12-24-2013, 12:58 AM
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I got mine from Best Buy as well. I am thinking about trying my luck again and getting another W900A.
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post #2438 of 4963 Old 12-24-2013, 01:25 AM
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Originally Posted by rub5670 View Post

I got mine from Best Buy as well. I am thinking about trying my luck again and getting another W900A.

It very well could just be the effect of your camera as well. Try sitting face on to the tv from 7 feet back and if the entire screen is not black, return it.

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post #2439 of 4963 Old 12-24-2013, 01:27 AM
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Originally Posted by rub5670 View Post

Hey guys, I've been reading this thread for months now and recently bought the W900A. I have tried a few of the settings found on this thread (thank you guys for providing those). I have watched a few movies on it, (Avengers, Gangster Squad) they looked amazing. I still have to try to see how it does with some video games. I have noticed some issues with the screen; some blotches on the white screen and maybe a little clouding on the hdmi screen. You might be able to notice even when the pictures below were taken on my nexus phone. I really want to know if this is a panel I should return or not. I am new to really inspecting television screens and I am worried that I will notice something wrong with the screen after the return period ends. If you would like to see more pictures let me know. Thank you.





The hdmi screen "clouding" you see shouldn't pose any problems for normal tv viewing including dark scenes.
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post #2440 of 4963 Old 12-24-2013, 01:45 AM
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Just wanted to let you know, if you don't already, that you may have issues playing your Xbox 360 through the Xbox One HDMI In. I have read that it introduces significant input lag. If you notice any, you may need to look in to another solution.

Hmm damn is there such a thing as toslink switcher that decided Dolby digital? I hand one turtle beach headset I would like to use with both consoles
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post #2441 of 4963 Old 12-24-2013, 03:22 AM
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From your response I assume that I want to output full RGB from my PS3?
I'm not familiar with the PS3 (have a X-360) ... but, in principle and ideally, you want full-RGB output for video games, but standard YCbCr output for Blu-ray movies. (I don't know if that can be set independly on the PS3.)
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Does that mean there is a setting on the TV that can be toggled between full and limited RGB?  If so can someone tell me in what menu that setting can be found on the w900a?
Sure there is such a setting on the W9:

{Home} --> {Settings} --> {Display} --> {Video Input Settings} --> {Dynamic Range}

--> Choose the HDMI Port which the device is connected to, and switch it to "Full".


I'm a bit unsure now, because ... the standard setting for HDMI input is "Auto", which at times may cause problems because there is no standardized way to signal full-or-limited-RGB over HDMI. However, since you are using a PS3, one would assume that two Sony devices should know how to talk to each other ...

Anyway, try changing the HDMI Dynamic Range to Full, and see if it makes a difference.
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post #2442 of 4963 Old 12-24-2013, 03:50 AM
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Hi guys. I received my 55-W900A about two weeks ago. Everything seemed okay as far as I could tell. But then I noticed something odd near the top of the screen. It's a horizontal shading/line that goes across the screen just below the very top.

Is this horizontal banding?

I'm coming from a Sony Bravia kdl-46xbr2. So I know little about LED.

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post #2443 of 4963 Old 12-24-2013, 07:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Didee View Post

I'm not familiar with the PS3 (have a X-360) ... but, in principle and ideally, you want full-RGB output for video games, but standard YCbCr output for Blu-ray movies. (I don't know if that can be set independly on the PS3.)
Sure there is such a setting on the W9:

{Home} --> {Settings} --> {Display} --> {Video Input Settings} --> {Dynamic Range}

--> Choose the HDMI Port which the device is connected to, and switch it to "Full".


I'm a bit unsure now, because ... the standard setting for HDMI input is "Auto", which at times may cause problems because there is no standardized way to signal full-or-limited-RGB over HDMI. However, since you are using a PS3, one would assume that two Sony devices should know how to talk to each other ...

Anyway, try changing the HDMI Dynamic Range to Full, and see if it makes a difference.

I thought we were supposed to use HDMI Auto and then Limited RGB. Will my games look better on HDMI Full and Full RGB?
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post #2444 of 4963 Old 12-24-2013, 07:39 AM
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Originally Posted by DRN94 View Post

Stop putting words like "flawless" and "perfect" into my mouth and stop putting words into CNET's mouth claiming they said "unrivaled" when clearly they did not on EVERY account when discussing the two TV's.

Never used the words "flawless" or "perfect" in my post. You must be thinking of someone else.

As for the "unrivaled" part, CNET's exact words were "Among 2013 LED LCDs, and a list price of only $1,999, the Sony W900 has no picture quality equal we've reviewed so far. Its closest rival is the Samsung UNF8000, and while the two are very evenly matched, the Sony has a slightly better picture overall…".

CNET also went on to say "The Samsung F8000 is slightly worse in terms of black level and color…".
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post #2445 of 4963 Old 12-24-2013, 07:46 AM
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Originally Posted by billmcdougal View Post

I thought we were supposed to use HDMI Auto and then Limited RGB. Will my games look better on HDMI Full and Full RGB?

Game engines are internally working in full-RGB. If you force the output to limited-RGB, then the engine is first rendering 256 shades, then the output module is downconverting to 220 shades. So you have less information on the screen than the game engine did generate in first place.

Limited-RGB was invented for video output, to provide easier conversion of YCbCr / YUV video data, which is always 16-235. For native RGB content like console games, full-RGB is the better variant. Although the differences are pretty minor, most ppl won't see any difference either way.wink.gif
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post #2446 of 4963 Old 12-24-2013, 08:49 AM
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Originally Posted by turnbowm View Post

Never used the words "flawless" or "perfect" in my post. You must be thinking of someone else.

As for the "unrivaled" part, CNET's exact words were "Among 2013 LED LCDs, and a list price of only $1,999, the Sony W900 has no picture quality equal we've reviewed so far. Its closest rival is the Samsung UNF8000, and while the two are very evenly matched, the Sony has a slightly better picture overall…".

CNET also went on to say "The Samsung F8000 is slightly worse in terms of black level and color…".

How can you construe "slightly better" as "unrivaled"? Again, CNET still never used the word "unrivaled" and saying something's competition is "slightly worse in terms of black level and color" does not at all mean "unrivaled". The term unrivaled means having no competition or being incomparable. Being "slightly better" than the competition means you have a rival and that you are comparable. In other words, it's not "unrivaled".

I will repeat my CNET quotes including the links to the quotes as sources again since you appear to not have read them.

CNET said "As usual the best plasmas still have it beat, but the only other 2013 LED we've placed in its (the F8000's) picture quality league so far is the Sony KDL-55W900A. It's available only in one 55-inch size, however, and it can't compete with the Samsung's design, features, or sheer wow factor. If you're in the high-end TV market and don't want a plasma, the Samsung UNF8000 should be among the first on your list."

CNET also said "For plasma-phobic videophiles who want a TV in a size other than 55 inches, the Samsung F8000 remains our top pick. It's close enough to the Sony that both earned identical picture quality scores, and both sets' local-dimming schemes do a great job of pushing edge-lit LED as high up this list as it can go. Video processing and 3D actually surpass the Sony, but in other areas F8000 is a tiny step behind. No matter -- if you "settle" for this amazing TV you can console yourself with the best design and features on the market."

CNET on F8000's audio vs the W900A's audio performance: "Aside from the VT60, the F8000 was the best-sounding TV in my lineup. The F8000 delivered more impact and visceral feel than the chronically thin-sounding W900A."

Source: http://reviews.cnet.com/holiday-gift-guide/tv/best-tv-picture-quality/2300-35250_7-10018630-6.html http://reviews.cnet.com/flat-panel-tvs/samsung-un55f8000/4505-6482_7-35576107.html
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post #2447 of 4963 Old 12-24-2013, 09:14 AM
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For the love of all that is holy ... DRN, it's great that you love your TV, and wanted to post some pics. Please, everyone, let's stop the pissing match and CNET quote contest. This forum is invaluable for information and helpful hints, not bragging rights.
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post #2448 of 4963 Old 12-24-2013, 09:49 AM
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Originally Posted by DRN94 View Post

How can you construe "slightly better" as "unrivaled"? Again, CNET still never used the word "unrivaled" and saying something's competition is "slightly worse in terms of black level and color" does not at all mean "unrivaled". The term unrivaled means having no competition or being incomparable. Being "slightly better" than the competition means you have a rival and that you are comparable. In other words, it's not "unrivaled".

...BLA BLA BLA...

I've never heard of anyone more insecure about the TV they own. This is truly bizarre.
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post #2449 of 4963 Old 12-24-2013, 09:53 AM
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Originally Posted by hauz20 View Post

For the love of all that is holy ... DRN, it's great that you love your TV, and wanted to post some pics. Please, everyone, let's stop the pissing match and CNET quote contest. This forum is invaluable for information and helpful hints, not bragging rights.

Yes. Please, it's Christmas and we should be rejoicing not bickering. This forum is for the W900A and it would be nice to keep it on topic. If the Samsung/Sony debate must continue, it should go to IM. Merry Christmas all.
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post #2450 of 4963 Old 12-24-2013, 10:37 AM
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Originally Posted by hauz20 View Post

For the love of all that is holy ... DRN, it's great that you love your TV, and wanted to post some pics. Please, everyone, let's stop the pissing match and CNET quote contest. This forum is invaluable for information and helpful hints, not bragging rights.

My original post here was in good intention. But if someone presents me with an argument that is blatant fallacy or ad hominem (regardless of the topic) then I have no choice but to rebut it with evidence and explanation for the sake of truth and reason. So far, no one has been able to counter argue me so my original post still stands.

I will stop replying to the non-arguments and ad hominem considering no one read or addressed my original counter argument in the first place. I will leave you all with that but understand that if you resort to ad hominem in an argument, don't get upset when the person counter argues you with evidence. No one has any reason to give any respect for people who use ad hominem to argue.

I hope you all are enjoying your W900A, it's a brilliant TV no doubt. And for those who (a small minority) are frustrated if their W900A happens to have uniformity problems and replacements have not resolved it for you then please consider my original post.

Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays.
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post #2451 of 4963 Old 12-24-2013, 10:48 AM
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Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays.

Wishing you the same.
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post #2452 of 4963 Old 12-24-2013, 11:41 AM
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It very well could just be the effect of your camera as well. Try sitting face on to the tv from 7 feet back and if the entire screen is not black, return it.
Alright I'll give that a shot, thank you for the help.

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The hdmi screen "clouding" you see shouldn't pose any problems for normal tv viewing including dark scenes.

Yes, that should be true. I haven't noticed anything when watching television or movies.

I have another question for people that have the same kind of problem shown on the picture below. Would having a screen like the one below show any noticeable differences when playing video games? Would this be a deal breaker for you guys? I really appreciate your feedback. Thanks.
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post #2453 of 4963 Old 12-24-2013, 12:06 PM
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Originally Posted by DRN94 View Post

My original post here was in good intention. But if someone presents me with an argument that is blatant fallacy or ad hominem (regardless of the topic) then I have no choice but to rebut it with evidence and explanation for the sake of truth and reason. So far, no one has been able to counter argue me so my original post still stands.

I will stop replying to the non-arguments and ad hominem considering no one read or addressed my original counter argument in the first place. I will leave you all with that but understand that if you resort to ad hominem in an argument, don't get upset when the person counter argues you with evidence. No one has any reason to give any respect for people who use ad hominem to argue.

I hope you all are enjoying your W900A, it's a brilliant TV no doubt. And for those who (a small minority) are frustrated if their W900A happens to have uniformity problems and replacements have not resolved it for you then please consider my original post.

Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays.

Does this mean you're leaving?
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post #2454 of 4963 Old 12-24-2013, 11:10 PM
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Does this mean you're leaving?
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Originally Posted by *UFO* View Post

Ok figured it out. My panel number is: DQ3Y550LN0101.

I'll leave you with this forzanerazzurri and *UFO*:

55W900A
Panel: DQ3Y550LN0101 SLCD S-PVA (200Hz/240Hz) (Samsung Panel)

If you bought your W900A earlier this year, there's a very high chance that you're looking at a Samsung panel. In fact, *UFO* confirmed himself that he is celebrating his Samsung panel. Still think Samsung is rubbish?
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post #2455 of 4963 Old 12-25-2013, 12:03 AM
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To the guy that thinks that the samsung 8000 is better than the 900a you must be smoking some good stuff... I have read tons of reviews on the top 2013 led/lcd tv's and the 900a was on the top of the list 95% of the time... I am a big gamer and the 900a is unrivalled , the Samsung 8000 does have better features, sensors, motion detectors.... that is the only reason its bit more expensive... 

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post #2456 of 4963 Old 12-25-2013, 12:49 AM
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The fact of the matter is there's not much between the samsung and the sony really is there? Let's be honest set up right they are probably on par. Design wise the sony would win for me and for others the Samsung is what they are after it comes down to choice and after that getting a good one and having the ability to get the best tune from the panel is the only other factor. As said in the above CNET review neither will be a high end plasma but as I'm learning slowly what you are used to doesn't mean you can't change flavour and enjoy the other benefits either technology has over the other. Quality control is the biggest problem I see in TV land but as my wife has said to me the last few days for minor things they can't have someone watch a TV for hours on end studying it like an exam paper ( which is what we do isn't it ha ). I'll always be in the plasma camp for it's superior PQ but pistol fights between these 2 high end LEDS come on fellas. Garnett215 my panel has similar weird lines to yours but on the sides pretty hard up to the frame edge
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post #2457 of 4963 Old 12-25-2013, 01:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRN94 View Post


I'll leave you with this forzanerazzurri and *UFO*:

55W900A
Panel: DQ3Y550LN0101 SLCD S-PVA (200Hz/240Hz) (Samsung Panel)

If you bought your W900A earlier this year, there's a very high chance that you're looking at a Samsung panel. In fact, *UFO* confirmed himself that he is celebrating his Samsung panel. Still think Samsung is rubbish?

Ugh...you know very little about TVs. I'm sure everyone is aware that Sony uses Samsung panels. What's your point? There are only so many panel manufacturers and thus based on your point, every tv should look exactly the same. But they dont. Do some homework abd figure out why. Furthermore, the most common TV faults and with Samsung in particular have nothing to do with the panel but rather the power supply and other related components. So many Samsung TVs don't last more than a couple years or have issues with turning off suddenly or restarting endlessly. They are one of the least realible of the major brands.
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post #2458 of 4963 Old 12-25-2013, 01:06 AM
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Why Sony don't make a larger panel of the W900 ?.........if they had a 65 inch i would buy one. Panasonic plasma a run my show....let me hear you all say best picture quality with me vt60..
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post #2459 of 4963 Old 12-25-2013, 08:02 AM
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the first picture has a light leak at the top of the white/screen and a large spot of light dead centre... he forgot to photoshop those out good job otherwise with your photoshop skills..... the samsung has terrible uniformity I brought back 3 sets, and a very good friend of mine went through 5, I do not believe that there is a good samsung 8000 screen out there.. your but hurt because your set is crap, so you come here and try to justify yourself, how about you google best led tv 2013 and see what comes up? where is the samsung in the pack? behind the 900a, why? because it is inferior....

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Originally Posted by DRN94 View Post

Hello, W900A owners.

I'm a Samsung UN55F8000 owner since this July. I've noticed some W900A owners have been having uniformity and off axis viewing issues. For those who feel the uniformity issues on the W900A are deal breakers for them, I would highly recommend switching over to the Samsung F8000. Firmware updates have reduced input lag to be negligible and uniformity on the F8000 is incredibly homogenous. Since the F8000 uses an SPVA panel, there is no pink color shift on whites. A slightly smaller color gamut is worth the price for uniform color reproduction across the panel in my opinion but it pains me to see some of you guys struggling with the frustration of panel uniformity.

Here are some pictures of my 55" F8000.









Off-Axis pictures. No pink or green/purple haloing. Just pure white.








If anyone has any questions about the F8000 or want me to take a picture of a certain condition/situation to compare then please tell me. Never settle with uniformity issues!
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post #2460 of 4963 Old 12-25-2013, 09:01 AM
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Why Sony don't make a larger panel of the W900 ?.........if they had a 65 inch i would buy one. Panasonic plasma a run my show....let me hear you all say best picture quality with me vt60..

They make an 850 that is 65 inches. Its nearly the same except I think the frequency is lower.
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