Official Samsung UNxxF8000 Owners Thread - Page 7 - AVS Forum
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post #181 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 03:32 PM
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Hello Buzz,

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post #182 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 04:21 PM
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Hello Buzz,

Thanks for posting your calibration numbers. Just a couple of questions, are these numbers best for viewing cable / dish or blu-ray sources? Also what is the differance between Film Mode 1 and 2? Please send me the mini tutorial about Cal-Day and Cal-Night. When this is enabled, will a setting be displayed in the Menu to turn from day and night or maybe off / on?

Thanks!
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post #183 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 04:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pickstv View Post

Hello Buzz,

Thanks for posting your calibration numbers. Just a couple of questions, are these numbers best for viewing cable / dish or blu-ray sources? Also what is the differance between Film Mode 1 and 2? Please send me the mini tutorial about Cal-Day and Cal-Night. When this is enabled, will a setting be displayed in the Menu to turn from day and night or maybe off / on?

Thanks!

In post 180 I said "The F8000 cross posts the CMS and the 10p White Balance so only the 2 point White Balance is new for the meter required settings" and I have received some questions as I didn't explain it.

When Cal Day & NIght are enabled (yes, they appear in the menu along with Movie, Normal, etc), Movie, Cal Day, and Cal Night do not have separate memories for the 10 point White Balance and the Custom Color Space menus. In each of these, any change in one of them is automatically copied to the other two picture modes. That is why only my 2 point White Balance numbers changed from Night (Movie) to Day (Cal-Day) modes. The only way to get around this is to use separate HDMI inputs.

Film 1 & 2 come into play when 480i/1080i DVD movies are inputted 3:2 pull down takes place. I always have used Film 2 and honestly don't notice the difference anyway as I'm very insensitive to SOE. Edit: I've seen sources that also say Film1 and also Off so I guess you'll have to experiment.

Next post I'll put up a tutorial for the Service Menu Day/Night enabling.
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post #184 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 05:05 PM
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Service Menu

Please don't touch anything in the SM other than what I post below. You can brick your TV.

You need the old style remote. I haven't figured out the code in the new one.

1. Turn the TV Off.
2. With the remote control press Mute, 1, 8, 2, Power. It takes a few seconds and then the SM will appear
3. Arrow down to SVC and press the Enter button in the center of the arrows
4. Arrow down to Expert and press Enter
5 .Right click on N/D ADJ to ON --- NOT FIX
6. Press Enter
7. Press Power
8. Wait a few seconds
9. Press Power
10. The Picture Mode will start in Dynamic
11. Change Picture Mode
12. Done
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post #185 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 05:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post

Service Menu

Please don't touch anything in the SM other than what I post below. You can brick your TV.

You need the old style remote. I haven't figured out the code in the new one.

1. Turn the TV Off.
2. With the remote control press Mute, 1, 8, 2, Power. It takes a few seconds and then the SM will appear
3. Arrow down to SVC and press the Enter button in the center of the arrows
4. Arrow down to Expert and press Enter
5 .Right click on N/D ADJ to ON --- NOT FIX
6. Press Enter
7. Press Power
8. Wait a few seconds
9. Press Power
10. The Picture Mode will start in Dynamic
11. Change Picture Mode
12. Done

So, this will give you separate settings for day and night, both in movie mode?

Thanks...

______________________

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post #186 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 05:25 PM
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Originally Posted by moonhawk View Post

So, this will give you separate settings for day and night, both in movie mode?

Thanks...

No. It adds Cal-Day and Cal- Night

Dynamic
Standard
Natural
Movie
CAL-NIGHT
CAL-DAY

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post #187 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 06:00 PM
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BUZZ,
Just out of curosity does this apply to the ES8000 series also ?

Nothing's Perfect So Stop Expecting It ! Glenee

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post #188 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 06:21 PM
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Buzz,

You've done a great job in posting your calibration numbers. I still like to know, what input source would these settings be best suited for...over the air, cable/dish or blu-ray movies.

Thanks
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post #189 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 06:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenee View Post

BUZZ,
Just out of curosity does this apply to the ES8000 series also ?

Yes, although the menu might look slightly different. It changes a bit every year. Just don't press enter, right, or left click on anything you don't totally understand. Unlike the User menu, this one can get you in trouble in a hurry.

One thing I failed to mention earlier is that when you're in a sub menu such as SVC, you can back out by pressing the menu button. This is NOT required in my directions above.

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post #190 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 06:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pickstv View Post

Buzz,

You've done a great job in posting your calibration numbers. I still like to know, what input source would these settings be best suitted for...over the air, cable/dish or blu-ray movies.

Thanks

The settings are for Rec.709 calibration, the standard by which both Blu-Ray discs and broadcast TV are "supposed" to adhere. Blu-Rays are 95+% compliant but TV is all over the map. Every network, every program, every camera - different. Judge your display with a Blu-Ray you know and look for memory colors like flesh tones and grass. If flesh is a little pink/red, turn the Color control down a few clicks. Too pale, the other way.

Don't try to adjust for broadcast TV or you'll become frustrated. Case in point, Fox News in Studio programs use four cameras two of which are quite good and the other two positively stink. Discovery, History, Speed, NBC Sports, Golf, and a few other networks are usually quite good but not always.

Final note on Blu-Ray movies - many modern movies are heavily stylized with Cyan background themes or similar which can taint memory colors throughout the movie. Many of the darker action and sci fi flicks are like this. Casino Royale is a good BD to use for reference and forum member Jeff Meier (umr) was nice enough to put the following information together. I use it for demo and if you have the movie you should use it to verify your "calibrated" picture. http://homecinemaguru.com/?p=1120

Bonus Edit: I'm watching the Sweet 16 on TBSHD with my very accurate 3D LUT calibrated F8000. Skin tones are awesome. If you get a chance, use this channel for the duration of the tournament and enjoy their excellent calibrated cameras and transmission. - ComCast Cable in my case.
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post #191 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 07:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post

The settings are for Rec.709 calibration, the standard by which both Blu-Ray discs and broadcast TV are "supposed" to adhere. Blu-Rays are 95+% compliant but TV is all over the map. Every network, every program, every camera - different. Judge your display with a Blu-Ray you know and look for memory colors like flesh tones and grass. If flesh is a little pink/red, turn the Color control down a few clicks. Too pale, the other way.

Don't try to adjust for broadcast TV or you'll become frustrated. Case in point, Fox News in Studio programs use four cameras two of which are quite good and the other two positively stink. Discovery, History, Speed, NBC Sports, Golf, and a few other networks are usually quite good but not always.

Final note on Blu-Ray movies - many modern movies are heavily stylized with Cyan background themes or similar which can taint memory colors throughout the movie. Many of the darker action and sci fi flicks are like this. Casino Royale is a good BD to use for reference and forum member Jeff Meier (umr) was nice enough to put the following information together. I use it for demo and if you have the movie you should use it to verify your "calibrated" picture. http://homecinemaguru.com/?p=1120

Bonus Edit: I'm watching the Sweet 16 on TBSHD with my very accurate 3D LUT calibrated F8000. Skin tones are awesome. If you get a chance, use this channel for the duration of the tournament and enjoy their excellent calibrated cameras and transmission. - ComCast Cable in my case.

+1, Awesome info. the F8000 looks like the best HDTV in "the sea" of sets on Best Buy's wall.
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post #192 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 07:15 PM
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hey doesn't anyone know when the 60in f8000 is going come out ? also can someone who has this tv tell me if led motion plus is available on this tv i think they renamed it to led motion clear, does that have to be enable to get the so called 1200 hz ? another thing i was wondering what the default setting for standard were
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post #193 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 07:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post

The settings are for Rec.709 calibration, the standard by which both Blu-Ray discs and broadcast TV are "supposed" to adhere. Blu-Rays are 95+% compliant but TV is all over the map. Every network, every program, every camera - different. Judge your display with a Blu-Ray you know and look for memory colors like flesh tones and grass. If flesh is a little pink/red, turn the Color control down a few clicks. Too pale, the other way.

Don't try to adjust for broadcast TV or you'll become frustrated. Case in point, Fox News in Studio programs use four cameras two of which are quite good and the other two positively stink. Discovery, History, Speed, NBC Sports, Golf, and a few other networks are usually quite good but not always.

Final note on Blu-Ray movies - many modern movies are heavily stylized with Cyan background themes or similar which can taint memory colors throughout the movie. Many of the darker action and sci fi flicks are like this. Casino Royale is a good BD to use for reference and forum member Jeff Meier (umr) was nice enough to put the following information together. I use it for demo and if you have the movie you should use it to verify your "calibrated" picture. http://homecinemaguru.com/?p=1120

Bonus Edit: I'm watching the Sweet 16 on TBSHD with my very accurate 3D LUT calibrated F8000. Skin tones are awesome. If you get a chance, use this channel for the duration of the tournament and enjoy their excellent calibrated cameras and transmission. - ComCast Cable in my case.

Thanks Buzz....
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post #194 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 07:46 PM
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Buzz - thank you very much for sharing your knowledge and settings. It's greatly appreciated!

~Bill
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post #195 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 07:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seansingh7326 View Post

hey doesn't anyone know when the 60in f8000 is going come out ? also can someone who has this tv tell me if led motion plus is available on this tv i think they renamed it to led motion clear, does that have to be enable to get the so called 1200 hz ? another thing i was wondering what the default setting for standard were

According to a trusted Samsung reseller, the 60" F8000 is shipping the week of 4/8/13:

http://un65f8000.com/

The 65" and 75" will follow (hopefully soon) after that.
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post #196 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 07:52 PM
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F8000 owners only:

1) Any vertical banding to speak of on your 55" sets?

2) Just to refresh my memory, did we ever hear of any significant banding on any 55" Samsung set from previous model families including the ES8000?

Asking because if the answers to the above questions are NO and NO, then the answer really doesn't point to any improvement in the F8000 on the 55" set.

Thanks!
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post #197 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 07:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post

Quite frankly I have found no difference visually or measurably. I've looked at sidebars, measured them, tried to see if that very small amount of glow on the inside of the bars from the edge lighting LEDs gets dimmer or brighter, etc. and I've come up empty handed. If you have a specific setup you'd like me to try I'll be happy to do it.

This makes me wonder if there's any benefit to the F8000 over the F7500, other than voice and motion. I thought Cinema Black was only on the 8000, but everything I've heard so far about it is it's basically useless. Another "feature" we're paying extra for that everybody just leaves off?
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post #198 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 07:57 PM
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Does anyone know if the optical out of this TV passes 5.1 or does it mix down to 2 channel ? The reason I ask is that I am running a quality 2 channel system now and do like the sound. I want to take the optical out and run it into a DAC, then to my amp. Do you think there would be lip sync issues doing it this way? I have an older Sammy 5271 from 6 years ago and do not have any lip sync issues now, but that older TV may not have as much processing as the new F8000.

Thanks !!
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post #199 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 07:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post

Everything seems on the up and up in the Movie Mode.

Service Menu enabled Cal-Day and Cal-Night modes have one problem so far that I have found. Calibration requires either full screen "field" patterns or plasma type APL window patterns. Do not use standard window patterns on black backgrounds as the results will be very inaccurate.

Have we been able to figure out yet definitively if micro-dimming is on or off this year in movie mode, or can it be turned on or off? Is that what Smart LED is? Still confused. Remember, last year micro-dimming was unavailable in movie mode.
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post #200 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 08:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post

Service Menu

Please don't touch anything in the SM other than what I post below. You can brick your TV.

You need the old style remote. I haven't figured out the code in the new one.

1. Turn the TV Off.
2. With the remote control press Mute, 1, 8, 2, Power. It takes a few seconds and then the SM will appear
3. Arrow down to SVC and press the Enter button in the center of the arrows
4. Arrow down to Expert and press Enter
5 .Right click on N/D ADJ to ON --- NOT FIX
6. Press Enter
7. Press Power
8. Wait a few seconds
9. Press Power
10. The Picture Mode will start in Dynamic
11. Change Picture Mode
12. Done

For reference - two questions. One, did you notice any setting while you were in the service menu for CE-Dimming? In older models it was an option that could be disabled in the service menu, but last year, they greyed it out so it couldn't be turned off.

Also - does going into the service menu still void the Samsung warranty? There was a big article on that last year or maybe the year before - alerting everyone that simpy going into the service menu for any reason is enough for Samsung to invalidate the warranty, as they can check to see if you've ever entered it. People should be aware of this before going into their service menu.

From an older service manual: "Samsung reserves the right to void any warranty claims if you or any unauthorized person modifies settings within the service menu."
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post #201 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 08:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post



Don't try to adjust for broadcast TV or you'll become frustrated. Case in point, Fox News in Studio programs use four cameras two of which are quite good and the other two positively stink. Discovery, History, Speed, NBC Sports, Golf, and a few other networks are usually quite good but not always.

Final note on Blu-Ray movies - many modern movies are heavily stylized with Cyan background themes or similar which can taint memory colors throughout the movie. Many of the darker action and sci fi flicks are like this. Casino Royale is a good BD to use for reference and forum member Jeff Meier (umr) was nice enough to put the following information together. I use it for demo and if you have the movie you should use it to verify your "calibrated" picture. http://homecinemaguru.com/?p=1120

All so very true. I discovered how futile it was to try and get cable channels to look right last year. Every channel, every show, as you said, sometimes even different cameras, look different. Different black levels, different colors, it's all over the place.

Also regarding the stylized color palettes movies use these days - they often use either cyan or orange far too heavily nowadays in setting "moods". So many films on blu-ray have had their color timing altered drastically, usually for the worse: Aliens, The Exorcist, The Matrix, Night of the Living Dead (re-make), the upcoming Lifeforce (already said to have color timing alterations), Lord of the Rings. It's a sick obsession these days for directors to meddle with the color timing before releasing it on blu-ray. All too often the term "blu-ray" is taken literally, as cyan seems to be the color of choice for Hollywood lately.
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post #202 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 08:25 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seansingh7326 View Post

hey doesn't anyone know when the 60in f8000 is going come out ? also can someone who has this tv tell me if led motion plus is available on this tv i think they renamed it to led motion clear, does that have to be enable to get the so called 1200 hz ? another thing i was wondering what the default setting for standard were

It's still called "clear motion rate"
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post #203 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 08:25 PM
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Originally Posted by 1080D View Post

Does anyone know if the optical out of this TV passes 5.1 or does it mix down to 2 channel ? The reason I ask is that I am running a quality 2 channel system now and do like the sound. I want to take the optical out and run it into a DAC, then to my amp. Do you think there would be lip sync issues doing it this way? I have an older Sammy 5271 from 6 years ago and do not have any lip sync issues now, but that older TV may not have as much processing as the new F8000.

Thanks !!

For legal reasons, if it's like past sets, it can only pass 5.1 from internal playback from apps or from USB media playback. They aren't allowed to pass 5.1 from HDMI sources - they must be down-mixed to stereo. Stupid, I know, but that's how it is. I can't imagine it being any different this year, but if it is I'd love to know. Last year you could pass DTS or Dolby Digital surround over optical as long as the input source wasn't HDMI.
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post #204 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 08:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1080D View Post

Does anyone know if the optical out of this TV passes 5.1 or does it mix down to 2 channel ? The reason I ask is that I am running a quality 2 channel system now and do like the sound. I want to take the optical out and run it into a DAC, then to my amp. Do you think there would be lip sync issues doing it this way? I have an older Sammy 5271 from 6 years ago and do not have any lip sync issues now, but that older TV may not have as much processing as the new F8000.

Thanks !!


If it is like the ES8000, which I imagine it is, then:

If you are watching a source native to the Samsung (like content from SmartHub) that has 5.1 sound it will pass 5.1 sound out through the digital audio optical out.

If you are watching a source that is passed to the Samsung via HDMI it will only output 2.0 (PCM) sound. Thus things like a cable box, TiVo, AppleTV passed through HDMI to the Samsung in 5.1 then out the optical out comes out as 2.0 (PCM).
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post #205 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 08:32 PM
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I had terrible flashlighting and clouding on my es8000, along with flickering which i couldn't stand. Now that i got my refund from samsung i was thinking about getting the xbr950, but is it better than the f8000? how those it compare to other leds? also is it better than the 8500?
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post #206 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 08:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eagle_2 View Post

For reference - two questions. One, did you notice any setting while you were in the service menu for CE-Dimming? In older models it was an option that could be disabled in the service menu, but last year, they greyed it out so it couldn't be turned off.

Also - does going into the service menu still void the Samsung warranty? There was a big article on that last year or maybe the year before - alerting everyone that simpy going into the service menu for any reason is enough for Samsung to invalidate the warranty, as they can check to see if you've ever entered it. People should be aware of this before going into their service menu.

From an older service manual: "Samsung reserves the right to void any warranty claims if you or any unauthorized person modifies settings within the service menu."

I did not notice anything pertaining to CE-Dimming nor did I look for it. I only use the SM to enable the Cal modes as all calibration controls are available in the user menus like any well designed displays in the last four years or so, Sharp Elite and Panasonic ccc enabled modes excepted but require specialized software like ControlCal or CalMAN DDC.

If SM entry validated a warranty it would be stated in the User Manual (I don't see it), and if they were concerned about it then SM access could be made only accessible with a tech Service Remote - it wouldn't be the first time. The very fact that Cal modes exist at all and may be enabled is proof enough that Samsung wants knowledgeable calibrators to have access.

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post #207 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 08:49 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seansingh7326 View Post

I had terrible flashlighting and clouding on my es8000, along with flickering which i couldn't stand. Now that i got my refund from samsung i was thinking about getting the xbr950, but is it better than the f8000? how those it compare to other leds? also is it better than the 8500?


Gorilla glass is a nice benefit on the xbr950, as far as content, and smart hub/streaming goes Samsung is definitely the winner. Picture quality on the sony is fantastic but the Samsung comes really close. The samsung F8500 on the other hand, is a great TV, terrific black levels, extremely sharp contrast, It's a big improvement over last year's E7000/E8000 plasma display panels. Depending on your room environment, go with either the F8000 or the F8500. If ambient light is not a problem, i'd go with the F8500.
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post #208 of 7481 Old 03-29-2013, 08:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seansingh7326 View Post

I had terrible flashlighting and clouding on my es8000, along with flickering which i couldn't stand. Now that i got my refund from samsung i was thinking about getting the xbr950, but is it better than the f8000? how those it compare to other leds? also is it better than the 8500?

I think the better way to look at it is.... will the F8000 be able to produce blacks and contrast as well as the HX950. Not if the HX950 is as good as the F8000 or F8500 as you worded it.

We already know the HX950 does this extremely well while also exhibiting essentially zero flashlighting or cloudiness when local dimming is engaged which is most of the time. It's up to the F8000 to prove that edge lit technogy can close the gap between full array local dimming. Will the larger 60 and 65 F8000s successfully keep blacks black without crushing them as well as not sacrificing contrast when dimming the top and bottom zones? Thats much more real estate for edge lit to cover than the smaller 46 and 55 models which is why they tend to show fewer anomalies than the larger sets. We won't know until they come out.

Considering there is quite a difference in cost, if the F8000 can come close to the HX950, that would be considered a moral victory for edge lit as the F8000s will cost substantially less especially the 65 inch model.

But I would be shocked if any edge lit will ever be able to equal full array w/local dimming like the HX950s and Sharp Elites.
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post #209 of 7481 Old 03-30-2013, 02:46 AM
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Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post

I did not notice anything pertaining to CE-Dimming nor did I look for it. I only use the SM to enable the Cal modes as all calibration controls are available in the user menus like any well designed displays in the last four years or so, Sharp Elite and Panasonic ccc enabled modes excepted but require specialized software like ControlCal or CalMAN DDC.

If SM entry validated a warranty it would be stated in the User Manual (I don't see it), and if they were concerned about it then SM access could be made only accessible with a tech Service Remote - it wouldn't be the first time. The very fact that Cal modes exist at all and may be enabled is proof enough that Samsung wants knowledgeable calibrators to have access.

All controls are available in the user menus except CE-dimming. That's the problem.

I believe it was Cnet unless I'm mistaken that posted an article a while back warning Samsung users that Samsung reserves the right to void any warranty if the service menu has been accessed. I think that's ridiculous, since how can they tell if it was accessed by a user or a calibrator? Still, Cnet was sufficiently concerned about it enough to post an article about it.
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post #210 of 7481 Old 03-30-2013, 06:38 AM
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Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post


Bonus Edit: I'm watching the Sweet 16 on TBSHD with my very accurate 3D LUT calibrated F8000. Skin tones are awesome. If you get a chance, use this channel for the duration of the tournament and enjoy their excellent calibrated cameras and transmission. - ComCast Cable in my case.

Danger, danger Will Robinson!!!! Is Buzz becoming an LED man? Nah, can't buy that. biggrin.gif
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