Official Sony [X9] XBR-55X900A / XBR-65X900A Owner's Thread - Page 307 - AVS Forum
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post #9181 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 10:52 AM
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The difference using Blu-ray is likely not noticeable.  Where you will see a different is with up-scaling 480p DVD.

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post #9182 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 10:52 AM
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Originally Posted by bruceames View Post

I'm using an Oppo 95 with ISO. Also tried with my secondary 93 ISO and no go.

The obvious workaround is to use the HDMI 2 out, which still works. You lose the superior DVD upscaling processing but since the TV upscales to 4k anyway, I don't think you'll notice the difference.

However if you insist on using HDMI 1, it will work if you boot up the player before you connect the HDMI jack to the TV. However for some reason 3D mode won't work unless you choose "force 3D" from the Oppo setup menu.

I'm still playing around with it, trying to see if the DVD look any worse from HDMI2 (I also have an external Darbee). To make it easier, I bought a 2 port HDMI switcher to go from HDMI 1 to HDMI 2 without the hassle of connecting and reconnecting HDMI cables. I'm hoping there's no real difference so I can just use HDMI 2 permanently for DVD and be done with it.

This is really bad

I heard this is a bug in the sony Software........Maybe Sony will fix it with the next Update.

I have only bluray isos. Over 200 movies.

Do you see a difference in quality when you have bluray between HDMI 1 and 2?
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post #9183 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 10:54 AM
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Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post

The difference using Blu-ray is likely not noticeable.  Where you will see a different is with up-scaling 480p DVD.

Ok. Only a little nightmare:mad:
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post #9184 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 10:58 AM
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A new problem which leaves me scratching my head.

 

For nearly a year now the Sony Tv has been streaming videos from my pc. These videos are in the windows media player.

Now whenever I add a video to the list (by dragging and dropping it into the win media player video list), the Sony tv says it cannot play this file.

On my Pc i can right click on any videos in WMP and play to Bravia, then the new video will be sent to the tv. This is the only way to play that newly added video. But if I try and play it from the TV videos directly, Tv refuses to play it.

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post #9185 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 11:16 AM
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This is trueeeeeee?



Sony has designed the BRAVIA® Televisions software update process to be customer friendly. This software update (version PKG4.411AAA) provides the following benefits:
Improvements over version PKG4.401AAA:

[*] Improves performance and stability of the Internet features

Benefits provided by previous updates and included in version PKG4.411AAA:

[*] Improves stability of the Screen Mirroring function
[*] Improves the login function for the Skype® online calling service
[*] Provides HDMI® 2.0 compatibility (Applies to 4K models only) 


Supports 4K 60p (3840X2160p (59.94/60Hz) YCbCr 4:2:0 8bit, 4096X2160p (59.94/60Hz) YCbCr 4:2:0 8bit)

[*] Improves stability of the sound output with a Blu-ray Disc™ player using an HDMI connection

Yes, HDMI 2.0 support has been there since December, I believe.

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post #9186 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 11:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Mrorange303 View Post

the samsung 4k curved tv has a flat looking picture your saying?
I saw the new samsung 65" curved 4k tv next to the 2013 65X900A, and to me, the curve, although impressive at first, did not do anything to improve picture quality. As a matter of fact, the upscaling of the X900A was still better than the new 2014 Samsung with the same 1080p source material and similar settings. I was stunned. The X900B is supposed to have a better upscaling effect, so that would mean the samsung cannot compete with the Sony lineup this year.
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post #9187 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 01:10 PM
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Originally Posted by RiED27880 View Post


I saw the new samsung 65" curved 4k tv next to the 2013 65X900A, and to me, the curve, although impressive at first, did not do anything to improve picture quality. As a matter of fact, the upscaling of the X900A was still better than the new 2014 Samsung with the same 1080p source material and similar settings. I was stunned. The X900B is supposed to have a better upscaling effect, so that would mean the samsung cannot compete with the Sony lineup this year.


Is it just me or is the whole concept of 'up-scaling' a bunch of BS.  You can't create the missing pixels.  Frankly, I'd prefer my X900A 4k set not do any upscaling and just show the proper 1080p footage as-is but in 2x2 blocks.  4k is a perfect square so 1080p with each pixel taking up a 2x2 area should look identical to a 1080p set.  It'll even have the same pixel density.  Trying to guess missing pixels would seem problematic to me.

 

I love my 65X900A set, but up-scaling has always been something that doesn't make sense to me.  One could argue if you had two differing shades of blues that you could interpolate the middle pixels for a smoother color... but on the flip side, if the true middle pixels were suppose to be a white pixel, you'd completely miss it.  So, why interpolate / upscale at all?  Am I missing something?  Seems like you'd want the true 1080p non-messed with and enjoy true 4k native.

 

Or is that what they're doing and when they say better upscaling, they just mean 'faster'?

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post #9188 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 01:47 PM
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Originally Posted by RiED27880 View Post

I saw the new samsung 65" curved 4k tv next to the 2013 65X900A, and to me, the curve, although impressive at first, did not do anything to improve picture quality. As a matter of fact, the upscaling of the X900A was still better than the new 2014 Samsung with the same 1080p source material and similar settings. I was stunned. The X900B is supposed to have a better upscaling effect, so that would mean the samsung cannot compete with the Sony lineup this year.
I spent 2 hours in bestbuy comparing the hu9000 and x900a side by side. There is a distinct advantage in upscaling on the hu9000. This is not a small or close competition. The hu9000 made.blurays look 4k. I cannot agree with. I simply cannot take that seriously. I love the x9 a. But the owners can can be delusional. Some are honest. But I will tell you right now, the people who say the x900a is brighter than the sammy. Or sharper looking. I know you have never seen the hu9000 in person. It's simple. The hu9000 uses a light technology comparable by the x900b. Not the x900a. I asked for an honest opinion. I'll take the ones who gave great answers. But for some.... no way you was able to review the hu9000 upscaling like you say. I spent literally 2 hours with both. Played avangers, dark knight, avatar and Pacific rim. Not once did the x900a do a better job. Not one single time. It never looked bad. It was never left in the dust. But the Sammy clearly is sharper and brighter with upscaling blurays. And yes it does matter. I have 500 plus blurays.
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post #9189 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 01:53 PM
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Samsungs TVs are definitely brighter than the 900A. The F8000 was positively eye-searing, for example.

Comparing sharpness on two uncalibrated TVs is folly, however. Calibrate the two TVs with test patterns and then compare them. Most people tend to prefer overly sharpened images with hard edges, but that doesn't mean that what you are seeing replicates the source.

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post #9190 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 01:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Shape View Post

Samsungs TVs are definitely brighter than the 900A. The F8000 was positively eye-searing, for example.

Comparing sharpness on two uncalibrated TVs is folly, however. Calibrate the two TVs with test patterns and then compare them. Most people tend to prefer overly sharpened images with hard edges, but that doesn't mean that what you are seeing replicates the source.
the x900b seems to be king. The hu9000 is a very close 2nd. But I like the soe. The people who says the sony wins is because it doesn't do the soe. But I think I'm going to get the x900b. Unless it stays 1k more.
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post #9191 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 02:16 PM
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Is it just me or is the whole concept of 'up-scaling' a bunch of BS.  You can't create the missing pixels.  Frankly, I'd prefer my X900A 4k set not do any upscaling and just show the proper 1080p footage as-is but in 2x2 blocks.  4k is a perfect square so 1080p with each pixel taking up a 2x2 area should look identical to a 1080p set.  It'll even have the same pixel density.  Trying to guess missing pixels would seem problematic to me.

 

I love my 65X900A set, but up-scaling has always been something that doesn't make sense to me.  One could argue if you had two differing shades of blues that you could interpolate the middle pixels for a smoother color... but on the flip side, if the true middle pixels were suppose to be a white pixel, you'd completely miss it.  So, why interpolate / upscale at all?  Am I missing something?  Seems like you'd want the true 1080p non-messed with and enjoy true 4k native.

 

Or is that what they're doing and when they say better upscaling, they just mean 'faster'?

 

I'm not an expert, but you have to upscale it, otherwise you would be looking at 1080 lines on a 4K screen. Is that what you want? :) A 1080p signal is 1080 horizontal lines, so without upscaling it it would look like crap on a 4K screen and make the 4K screen a moot point. The thing about 4K is that you don't see the pixel lines that are easily seen on a 2K set. That's part of the benefit, more pixels, less visible lines. What you might not want, or what might not be done well, is the interpolation that occurs while trying to fill in between the lines of regular 2K. In a 1080p blu-ray there is missing information. Its obviously not as if you were looking at the same thing in person. You don't notice the missing information that much because the lines are close together and you are far enough away from the TV. Ok, all of this seems obvious enough. You could simply take the information in each line of the 1080p signal and divide it between two lines of the 4K set, but what about the information missing between the lines of the 1080p signal? You could just leave it out but then you would end up with the same missing information you had in the 1080p signal. Why not try to fill it in using fancy algorithms and processing to make it look better on the 4K screen? Some do it better than others.

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post #9192 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 02:25 PM
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Originally Posted by RiED27880 View Post


I saw the new samsung 65" curved 4k tv next to the 2013 65X900A, and to me, the curve, although impressive at first, did not do anything to improve picture quality. As a matter of fact, the upscaling of the X900A was still better than the new 2014 Samsung with the same 1080p source material and similar settings. I was stunned. The X900B is supposed to have a better upscaling effect, so that would mean the samsung cannot compete with the Sony lineup this year.

 

The curve is definitely the dumbest idea I've seen come along since, ever. Unless you are in an IMAX theater sitting near the front, curvature of the screen isn't going to offer much effect to anyone watching. So to add curve to a home TV is just dumb. Ok, ok... so now I sound like the "4K is stupid" guys. No, big difference. I've got to say the picture looks amazing on the Sammy though. I've only seen it with 4K material though. I don't think the upscaling on the X9A leaves much to be desired, but that's just me.

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post #9193 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 02:28 PM
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The curve is definitely the dumbest idea I've seen come along since, ever. Unless you are in an IMAX theater sitting near the front, curvature of the screen isn't going to offer much effect to anyone watching. So to add curve to a home TV is just dumb. Ok, ok... so now I sound like the "4K is stupid" guys. No, big difference. I've got to say the picture looks amazing on the Sammy though. I've only seen it with 4K material though. I don't think the upscaling on the X9A leaves much to be desired, but that's just me.

The curve seemed like a gimmick to me. I'd rather have a wedge mounted on my wall than a curved screen. smile.gif
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post #9194 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 02:34 PM
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I'm not an expert, but you have to upscale it, otherwise you would be looking at 1080 lines on a 4K screen. Is that what you want? :) A 1080p signal is 1080 horizontal lines, so without upscaling it it would look like crap on a 4K screen and make the 4K screen a moot point. The thing about 4K is that you don't see the pixel lines that are easily seen on a 2K set. That's part of the benefit, more pixels, less visible lines. What you might not want, or what might not be done well, is the interpolation that occurs while trying to fill in between the lines of regular 2K. In a 1080p blu-ray there is missing information. Its obviously not as if you were looking at the same thing in person. You don't notice the missing information that much because the lines are close together and you are far enough away from the TV. Ok, all of this seems obvious enough. You could simply take the information in each line of the 1080p signal and divide it between two lines of the 4K set, but what about the information missing between the lines of the 1080p signal? You could just leave it out but then you would end up with the same missing information you had in the 1080p signal. Why not try to fill it in using fancy algorithms and processing to make it look better on the 4K screen? Some do it better than others.


I am not sure anyone can see the space between pixels on a 1080p set unless you have a 100 foot tv :)

 

I'm saying that if you took a 1920x1080 pixels and for each pixel which is 1x1 you made it 2x2 (1 pixel into 4 pixels), you would end up with a 4k image that should look identical to a 1920x1080 on a 4k set.  If you took those 4 pixels because they are smaller and draw a square around them and took that square to a 1080p TV (same size) you'd have one pixel that filled up that same area.

 

So, what I'm saying is, that's a simple way to 'upscale', but when people say, oh, this TV has better upscaling... that really doesn't mean squat, because you're trying to generate pixels that doesn't exist so while it could be a guess, there's no proof to say one is better than the other.  Frankly, I'd like to see the picture at 4k resolution just scaled up, no processing done.  This may not work for non-aspect ratio resolutions like a 720p to 4k, it's not perfect so there'd have to be some manipulation there.... but for the sake of this discussion, we can just reference 1080.

 

Does that make sense?  There's no fancy algorithm to make a 1080p resolution look better.  That's like the TV shows that shows a super pixelated face all of a sudden materialize into a super clear image because of technology... it doesn't work like that in the real world :)

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post #9195 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 02:43 PM
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If DVDs look better upscaled on 1080p, than Blu-rays will look better upscaled on 4k. I certainly notice the difference on mine.
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post #9196 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 02:43 PM
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I am not sure anyone can see the space between pixels on a 1080p set unless you have a 100 foot tv :)

 

I'm saying that if you took a 1920x1080 pixels and for each pixel which is 1x1 you made it 2x2 (1 pixel into 4 pixels), you would end up with a 4k image that should look identical to a 1920x1080 on a 4k set.  If you took those 4 pixels because they are smaller and draw a square around them and took that square to a 1080p TV (same size) you'd have one pixel that filled up that same area.

 

So, what I'm saying is, that's a simple way to 'upscale', but when people say, oh, this TV has better upscaling... that really doesn't mean squat, because you're trying to generate pixels that doesn't exist so while it could be a guess, there's no proof to say one is better than the other.  Frankly, I'd like to see the picture at 4k resolution just scaled up, no processing done.  This may not work for non-aspect ratio resolutions like a 720p to 4k, it's not perfect so there'd have to be some manipulation there.... but for the sake of this discussion, we can just reference 1080.

 

Does that make sense?  There's no fancy algorithm to make a 1080p resolution look better.  That's like the TV shows that shows a super pixelated face all of a sudden materialize into a super clear image because of technology... it doesn't work like that in the real world :)

 

well, I can see the lines, quite easily. I don't know about everyone else with 20/20 or better vision. :) We agree to disagree on every point you make.

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post #9197 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 02:47 PM
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The curve seemed like a gimmick to me. I'd rather have a wedge mounted on my wall than a curved screen. smile.gif

 

That's it man... a true gimmick! Not like some people call 3D a "gimmick" when they haven't even seen it.

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post #9198 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 02:47 PM
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The curve seemed like a gimmick to me. I'd rather have a wedge mounted on my wall than a curved screen. smile.gif

Theoretically, I like the idea of a curve screen because it will bring the side of the picture in a little closer. But unless you watching it within a narrow viewing degree angle then that advantage becomes a disadvantage. So practically speaking it would suck in a living room environment with people sitting everywhere.
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post #9199 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 02:49 PM
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well, I can see the lines, quite easily. I don't know about everyone else with 20/20 or better vision. :) We agree to disagree on every point you make.


Don't get me wrong, it's the BEST TV I've ever owned.  I just think the TV has better color formity and deeper blacks than other TV's which enhance the image.  However, I'll never believe just the resolution makes the image look better... makes no sense.  I think the X-Reality chip to enhance the colors makes a HUGE difference which is the reason I bought this TV over Samsung.

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Found what I think is the answer to my problem. It seems it was created when I updated my cable box. I had not tested ARC nor the X1 at the time of the installation. When I removed the HDMI cable from the cable box, everything worked again. After further digging, I found there is a "CEC" issue with the HDMI when using the cable box. I am looking into the home theater automation functions combined with an optical signal, or a CEC-less hdmi adapter for the COX cable box ( Cisco 9865HDC DVR). The adapter is a long lead time order so I will play with the optical audio signal first and disable ARC to see if that works. I am not sure how that will impact the X1 though if the CISCO CEC signal is still corrupting it. I believe it is also tied to the Bravia functionality. I will post after I learn more for those that may come across this.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1513955/samsung-arc-issues-with-new-cox-cable-box

So it turns out the CEC-less adapter did nothing for me. Same problems both with and without the adapter. Back to the drawing board. On the plus side, Sony assured me they are working on a software update solution for my audio issues with the X1 media player which are now compounded with the Cisco 9865HDC DVR.
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post #9201 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 02:50 PM
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Theoretically, I like the idea of a curve screen because it will bring the side of the picture in a little closer. But unless you watching it within a narrow viewing degree angle then that advantage becomes a disadvantage. So practically speaking it would suck in a living room environment with people sitting everywhere.

 

yea, that is a valid point. But it sure doesn't scale to more than a few people. Someone sitting to one side gets a distorted view, I would think. Again, if you like it more power to you :). 

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Anyone check this out? Looks interesting. I'm waiting for reviews of the Nuvola NP-1 to roll in before buying anything, or a 4K announcement for the Xbox one at E3.
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post #9203 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 02:54 PM
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Goo
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Originally Posted by webjeff View Post


Is it just me or is the whole concept of 'up-scaling' a bunch of BS.  You can't create the missing pixels.  Frankly, I'd prefer my X900A 4k set not do any upscaling and just show the proper 1080p footage as-is but in 2x2 blocks.  4k is a perfect square so 1080p with each pixel taking up a 2x2 area should look identical to a 1080p set.  It'll even have the same pixel density.  Trying to guess missing pixels would seem problematic to me.

I love my 65X900A set, but up-scaling has always been something that doesn't make sense to me.  One could argue if you had two differing shades of blues that you could interpolate the middle pixels for a smoother color... but on the flip side, if the true middle pixels were suppose to be a white pixel, you'd completely miss it.  So, why interpolate / upscale at all?  Am I missing something?  Seems like you'd want the true 1080p non-messed with and enjoy true 4k native.

Or is that what they're doing and when they say better upscaling, they just mean 'faster'?

Google or search this thread for x-reality pro 4k and you will find your answer for the upscaling solution for this set.
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post #9204 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 02:55 PM
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Don't get me wrong, it's the BEST TV I've ever owned.  I just think the TV has better color formity and deeper blacks than other TV's which enhance the image.  However, I'll never believe just the resolution makes the image look better... makes no sense.  I think the X-Reality chip to enhance the colors makes a HUGE difference which is the reason I bought this TV over Samsung.

 

Same here... best ever. And I didn't mean to imply its only the resolution, but it helps a lot :). If you look at the new Sharp's with the Q+ they look great, even only being 1080p sets, but they use "sub pixels" and are able to divide the pixel into different color elements, at least that's how I understand it so far. Looks pretty good to me, but I've only viewed it with their special in-store source material so, who knows what it would translate to with a regular BR. 

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post #9205 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 02:56 PM
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Originally Posted by sdMCM66 View Post

yea, that is a valid point. But it sure doesn't scale to more than a few people. Someone sitting to one side gets a distorted view, I would think. Again, if you like it more power to you smile.gif

I would like it if I could flatten it out again when there are more than 2 people watching it sitting close together. I guess that's where OLED would come in down the road?
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post #9206 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 02:58 PM
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Originally Posted by bruceames View Post


I would like it if I could flatten it out again when there are more than 2 people watching it sitting close together. I guess that's where OLED would come in down the road?

 

oh yea, on-the-fly curvature, lol... its coming, I'm sure its coming. 

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post #9207 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 03:00 PM
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Originally Posted by CJ4life View Post

Anyone check this out? Looks interesting. I'm waiting for reviews of the Nuvola NP-1 to roll in before buying anything, or a 4K announcement for the Xbox one at E3.

It looks very similar to the Tronsmart Vega S89 that Amazon also sells. The initial reviews talked of jittery video in the XBMC app but I beleive this was resolved with a firmware fix or root of the android box.

http://www.amazon.com/Tronsmart-Vega-S89-Android-Amlogic/dp/B00JGGK8II/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1401400591&sr=8-1&keywords=tronsmart+vega+s89
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post #9208 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 03:00 PM
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Originally Posted by bruceames View Post


I would like it if I could flatten it out again when there are more than 2 people watching it sitting close together. I guess that's where OLED would come in down the road?

I heard LG is working on this exact thing.  A TV that would curve and then bend back to normal

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post #9209 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 03:02 PM
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Originally Posted by CJ4life View Post

Anyone check this out? Looks interesting. I'm waiting for reviews of the Nuvola NP-1 to roll in before buying anything, or a 4K announcement for the Xbox one at E3.

Well I sent them an email 3 weeks ago and have not heard back. Makes it hard to put my money there.
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post #9210 of 12390 Old 05-29-2014, 03:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Mrorange303 View Post

the x900b seems to be king. The hu9000 is a very close 2nd. But I like the soe. The people who says the sony wins is because it doesn't do the soe. But I think I'm going to get the x900b. Unless it stays 1k more.

Oh, the X900A can do soap opera effect! Just put motionflow on Smooth.

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